Wednesday, September 7th 2011

MSI Calls Bluff on Gigabyte's PCIe Gen 3 Ready Claim

In August, Gigabyte made a claim that baffled at least MSI, that scores of its motherboards are Ready for Native PCIe Gen. 3. Along with the likes of ASRock, MSI was one of the first with motherboards featuring PCI-Express 3.0 slots, the company took the pains to educate buyers what PCI-E 3.0 is, and how to spot a motherboard that features it. MSI thinks that Gigabyte made a factual blunder bordering misinformation by claiming that as many as 40 of its motherboards are "Ready for Native PCIe Gen. 3." MSI decided to put its engineering and PR team to build a technically-sound presentation rebutting Gigabyte's claims.

More slides, details follow.

MSI begins by explaining that PCIe support isn't as easy as laying a wire between the CPU and the slot. It needs specifications-compliant lane switches and electrical components, and that you can't count on certain Gigabytes for future-proofing.

MSI did some PCI-Express electrical testing using a 22 nm Ivy Bridge processor sample.
MSI claims that apart from the G1.Sniper 2, none of Gigabyte's so-called "Ready for Native PCIe Gen. 3" motherboards are what the badge claims to be, and that the badge is extremely misleading to buyers. Time to refill the popcorn bowl.Source: MSI
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286 Comments on MSI Calls Bluff on Gigabyte's PCIe Gen 3 Ready Claim

#1
jpierce55
by: RejZoR
MSI or MicroStar International (they used to call them self like this in the past but lately they are just MSI) is a Taiwanese company.
LOL Microstar international..... I remember that..... good to know information.
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#2
[H]@RD5TUFF
Gigabyte has a history of misleading advertising like the video cards that said 1GB of "hyper memory" but came with only 512 mb, ect ect. Just another reason to look at other manufacturers.
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#3
Jstn7477
Anyone remember the Gigabyte G41 fiasco where the PCIe x16 slot was only wired with 4 lanes when the chipset was capable of a real x16 slot? If this story is really true, it's hilarious.
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#4
qubit
Overclocked quantum bit
I think adding a poll to this news post asking if we think Gigabyte is talking BS or not would go down really well. :rockout:

I'm voting for BS from Gigabyte, especially as they claim a whopping 40 mobos.
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#5
Millennium
Yeah good for MSI here. Last thing we need is misinformation from a 'trusted' brand like Gigabyte
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#6
LAN_deRf_HA
Reminds me of that time Gigabyte said the Asus epu chips don't do anything. Asus just turned around and sued them and they folded pretty easy. Wonder what they'll do here.
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#7
[H]@RD5TUFF
by: LAN_deRf_HA
Reminds me of that time Gigabyte said the Asus epu chips don't do anything. Asus just turned around and sued them and they folded pretty easy. Wonder what they'll do here.
Likely nothing.
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#10
ensabrenoir
not trying 2 start something

Ivory bridge sample that's confirmed to exist......Wonder if msi have a bulldozer sample :).....
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#11
Frick
Fishfaced Nincompoop
by: [H]@RD5TUFF
Gigabyte has a history of misleading advertising like the video cards that said 1GB of "hyper memory" but came with only 512 mb, ect ect. Just another reason to look at other manufacturers.
That was not Gigabyte, it was from Ati.
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#12
BrooksyX
Maybe those motherboards are Windows Vista ready too... :roll:
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#13
[H]@RD5TUFF
Will be interesting to see if Gigabyte is made to retract it's 3.0 claims.
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#14
TheLostSwede
by: [H]@RD5TUFF
Will be interesting to see if Gigabyte is made to retract it's 3.0 claims.
Interesting for whom? You?

No-one can prove 100% without a doubt that their motherboard as today can work with PCI Express 3.0 cards, as there are no cards. That's how simple it is. As for anything else, let's wait for an official statement from Gigabyte shall we, before we draw conclusions either which way.
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#15
[H]@RD5TUFF
by: TheLostSwede
Interesting for whom? You?

No-one can prove 100% without a doubt that their motherboard as today can work with PCI Express 3.0 cards, as there are no cards. That's how simple it is. As for anything else, let's wait for an official statement from Gigabyte shall we, before we draw conclusions either which way.
Do you honestly believe Gigabyte would say oh your right our bad .. .
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#16
ranom
MSI take a swipe at Gigabyte :laugh:

BTW, here in Japan, Gigabyte has released a series of "interesting" boards. Locally called the GA-Z68X-UD3H-B3/G3, GA-Z68MA-D2H-B3/G3, and GA-Z68MX-UD2H-B3/G3; global names are GA-Z68X-UD3H-B3 rev1.3, GA-Z68MA-D2H-B3 rev1.3, and GA-Z68MX-UD2H-B3 rev1.3; these boards claim to be Ivy/PCIe Gen3 compatible. hmm.... ;)
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#17
DannibusX
The issue really isn't whether PCIe 3.0 cards will work with the slots in existing Gigabyte boards, read the following news posting from Bta:
GIGABYTE TECHNOLOGY Co., Ltd, a leading manufacturer of motherboards, graphics cards and computing hardware solutions today announced their entire range of 6 series motherboards are ready to support the next generation Intel 22nm CPUs (LGA1155 Socket) as well as offer native support for PCI Express Gen. 3 technology, delivering maximum data bandwidth for future discrete graphics cards.

Wanting to provide maximum upgradeability to customers, GIGABYTE has enabled native support for PCI Express Gen. 3 across the entire range of GIGABYTE 6 series motherboards, including the recently launched G1.Sniper 2 motherboard, when paired with Intel's next generation 22nm CPUs. By installing the latest BIOS for their 6 series motherboards today, users can be assured they are ready to take advantage of all the performance enhancements tomorrow's technologies have to offer.
Gigabyte said that current line up will support PCIe 3.0 natively through a BIOS update, which is really hard to believe since there's a different in hardware when it comes to an upgraded socket. There will be performance degradation when using a 3.0 card in a 2.0 socket, mystical BIOS update be damned.
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#18
Steven B
Well i think what GIGABYTE meant, is that there is native support for PCI-E Gen 3. now MSI took the one board, the UD7 that GIGABYTE did NOT list on their list of PCI-E 3.0 capable boards and attacked it, but GB never said the UD& had PCI-E gen 3 capability.

Now on a board like the GD65 and UD4 there are 16 x pIC-E lanes. Now we all know that lanes that go through the PCI-E switches will be limited by the bandwidth of that switch. If the lanes don't go through the switch, in which 8 lanes don't on both the UD4 and GD65, those lanes directly connected to the first PCI-E 16x slots first 8x of lanes, can be PCI-E 3.0 capable, they are directly wired.

now the UD7 was not included on the GB list becuase all its lanes goto the NF200.

In theory BC of GIGABYTE's anouncement all LGA1155 boards with correctBIOS can support PCI-E 3.0 on those lanes direct from the CPU to the PCI-E lanes, which is usualy 8.

So MSI always copies GIGABYTE stuff, they totally copied them on USB extra power, down the advertising stuff. I doubt GB would just go out and blatently lie.
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#19
TheLostSwede
by: [H]@RD5TUFF
Do you honestly believe Gigabyte would say oh your right our bad .. .
They would, to me, but hey, you don't know me so ;)
I'll go down to their offices tomorrow and have a chat with them, just for you, ok?
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#20
buggalugs
by: TheLostSwede
Interesting for whom? You?

No-one can prove 100% without a doubt that their motherboard as today can work with PCI Express 3.0 cards, as there are no cards. That's how simple it is. As for anything else, let's wait for an official statement from Gigabyte shall we, before we draw conclusions either which way.
Its obvioulsy interesting for everybody involved with computers. It is being reported on Tech news sites.

There are motherboard hardware specs and requirements for PCI-E 3 so if Gigabyte doesnt meet the specs we have a right to ask questions....

by: Derek12
Do you have proofs of previous incidents like this or you simply is talking crap I can't find of my own. I trusted it since 2003 though maybe I will not more due of this (the incident, not your message)?
Apart from the video memory issue there is the UEFI bios issue from Gigabyte.

Gigabyte call it a UEFI bios when its not a real UEFI bios.

Gigabyte realized they made a big mistake on P67/Z68 boards by not including UEFI bios when other manufacturers did incude a real UEFI bios. So Gigabyte built a fake UEFI bios, nothing more than a glorified "easytune" windows software and called it "hybrid UEFI".

Its exactly the same issue with this PCI-E 3.0 issue. Gigabyte gets caught with their pants down when the competition has something better, then they just lie and try to make a workaround.

by: Steven B
I doubt GB would just go out and blatently lie.
Haha funny....
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#21
Steven B
i am waiting to see what GIGABYTE will say, as no id expect MSi to lie before GB ;) GB doesn't need to lie, if they state somthing THAT blatant, aimed at a group of users with higher level thinking abilities like enthusiasts, people are going to attack it, so it better stand up.

You believe MSI but not GIGABYTE. Why don't you take a look over at overclock.net. The thread in which GB made this announcment has a pretty long thread, goto the last two pages. See what MSI REP MSIALEX says, hes a MSI rep, he says exactly what i just said, and he said MSI products can support what Gb said too. butit seems some overpretentious MSI people got offended. BTW same thing as ASsrock Slide earlier saying that asrock has PCI-E 3.0 but GB doesn't, but GB has the capbility too just like everything one. Asrock said this before GB even made their encouncment.
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#22
Suhidu
MSI is totally lame at marketing. Geeze, stealing all Gigabyte's Durathunder3? Come up with your own campaign you hardcore 'investigators'! Pheh. All they do is just sit back and craft these amazing new features, and then poke holes in everyone else's marketing.

Good luck upgrading to those PCI-E 3.0 cards without Gigabyte's High ESD-Resistance iCs! Did I mention that Gigabyte is the FIRST(and only?) to have full traditional-BIOS support for PCI-E 3.0 cards?
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#23
MxPhenom 216
Corsair Fanboy
what about Asrock Extreme Gen3 boards? are those true PCI-e 3.0?
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#24
buggalugs
Haha I just posted about it on Gigabyte's own forum. I still have an account from my old Gigabyte socket 775 board from 4-5 years ago.

I asked Gigabyte to respond, If the thread doesnt get deleted i will post what they say.....lol
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#25
TheLostSwede
by: nvidiaintelftw
what about Asrock Extreme Gen3 boards? are those true PCI-e 3.0?
Some of them are, but according to MSI's reasoning, their high-end model doesn't, as it has an nForce 200 chip on it, yet ASRock is claiming PCI Express 3.0 support...
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