Monday, November 21st 2011

Noises About Radeon HD 7900 Series with XDR2 Memory Grow

As early as in September, we heard reports of AMD toying with Rambus XDR2 memory on its next generation of high-performance GPUs. Apart from our own community's response, that news met with a wall of skepticism as it was deficient in plausibility. New reports from Chinese websites have raised the topic again with fresh rumors that AMD will attempt to implement XDR2 on some of its next-generation ultra-high end products after all. XDR2, according to Rambus, can transport twice the amount of data per clock as GDDR5.

Apparently AMD and Rambus have had much more cordial relations with each other, than other companies the latter engaged in patent disputes with. In 2006, AMD settled outstanding disputes with Rambus by willing to pay licensing costs for certain technologies claimed by Rambus, turning a leaf in the relations between the two. What Chinese sources are suggesting now, is that AMD will design its high-end GPU (codename: "Tahiti") in a way that will let it support both GDDR5 and XDR2. Certain higher-end SKUs based on Tahiti will use XDR2, while the slightly more cost-effective SKUs will use GDDR5.

In related news, other sources told TechPowerUp that AMD could adopt a "top-to-bottom" strategy with the high-end portion of its next-generation of products. This means that AMD could launch the dual-GPU "New Zealand" graphics card first, followed by single-GPU SKUs.Source: Mydrivers
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64 Comments on Noises About Radeon HD 7900 Series with XDR2 Memory Grow

#1
mastrdrver
by: Casecutter
So what’s Rod Dhat Solution Marketing Manager for RAMBUS using? How do you know who is or who’s not making chips? Then why did AMD seemingly start branding Radeon memory that might have been Hyundai (Hynix)? Your entire dither presents the dumbest argument. You're saying a company like AMD can’t find somewhere/someone to make R&D samples and production? ...wow is your thinking that pathetic! :wtf:
AMD making rebranded memory is not the same as someone instantly making a new type of memory, verifying it, and then producing it. That takes months. Yet it's the fact that no one is sampling XDR2 memory and launch is in 2 months. It's not a question of if, but a realization of the impossible. If you want more reading go over to the S|A or Beyond 3D forums. The people who are in the industry always laugh when this rumor comes up since it is impossible.

If you want more reading see Digitimes. Yes it is old, but it shows how much Rambus pissed off the only people that can make their memory. Rambus makes nothing except IP.
Posted on Reply
#2
cadaveca
My name is Dave
GloFo is partnered with Rambus, FYI. GloFo gave them an award for some innovation of SoC designs:

http://www.rambus.com/in/news/press_releases/2011/110830.html

They(Rambus) are already using GloFo's 28nm-SLP process.

Wouldn't be hard to beleive that XDR2 would come out of GloFo, considering they are already working together on 28nm designs. And if the specs are true, it would be killer for AMD to have exclusive partnership rights to the design and manufacturing process of XDR2, leaving nVidia left with "older" technologies.
•Rambus, for its high-speed low-power next-generation memory technologies developed on GlobalFoundries’ 28nm-SLP technology.
http://semimd.com/blog/tag/rambus/

So there's your memory foundry producer, connected directly to AMD, even.
Posted on Reply
#3
MarcusTaz
by: cadaveca
GloFo is partnered with Rambus, FYI. GloFo gave them an award for some innovation of SoC designs:

http://www.rambus.com/in/news/press_releases/2011/110830.html

They(Rambus) are already using GloFo's 28nm-SLP process.

Wouldn't be hard to beleive that XDR2 would come out of GloFo, considering they are already working together on 28nm designs. And if the specs are true, it would be killer for AMD to have exclusive partnership rights to the design and manufacturing process of XDR2, leaving nVidia left with "older" technologies.

http://semimd.com/blog/tag/rambus/

So there's your memory foundry producer, connected directly to AMD, even.
Now that is very interesting news... :toast:

Ok now I am selling my XFX HD-695A-CNFC AMD Radeon HD 6950 2GB :D
Posted on Reply
#4
cadaveca
My name is Dave
I dunno that it's interesting, really. Just wanted to highlight tht these rumours didn't come out of nothing, and the comments that noone is making XDR2 might be unfounded. Fact fo the matter is that Rambus does already have a foundry partner in GloFo, and are already working with current lithography technologies.

That doesn't mean that this rumour has any merit to it at all...but the fact it persists is based on the truth that it is very very possible.

I wouldn't get rid of those cards just yet. We have word mobile parts are coming in December(not that that is anything new), and high performance desktop parts were always expected next spring. Still got the winter to deal with!
Posted on Reply
#5
Casecutter
by: mastrdrver
Yet it's the fact that no one is sampling XDR2 memory and launch is in 2 months
Well GloFlo is nobody, so I suppose we will wait and see...
Posted on Reply
#6
btarunr
Editor & Senior Moderator
Volumes are a non-issue. Rambus already has biggies like Elpida mass producing XDR chips for Playstation.
Posted on Reply
#7
mastrdrver
Anyone want to put money on this?

by: cadaveca
GloFo is partnered with Rambus, FYI. GloFo gave them an award for some innovation of SoC designs:

http://www.rambus.com/in/news/press_releases/2011/110830.html

They(Rambus) are already using GloFo's 28nm-SLP process.

Wouldn't be hard to beleive that XDR2 would come out of GloFo, considering they are already working together on 28nm designs. And if the specs are true, it would be killer for AMD to have exclusive partnership rights to the design and manufacturing process of XDR2, leaving nVidia left with "older" technologies.




http://semimd.com/blog/tag/rambus/

So there's your memory foundry producer, connected directly to AMD, even.
No one is sampling XDR2. How do you go from no one sampling to full swing production in 2 months? What does an agreement between GF and Rambus have to do with the fact of no XDR2 samples? Even that PR has nothing to do with XDR2 or sampling of such memory.

Not even considering that AMD is probably already been in full swing production on 79xx parts. Which means that they've already decided what memory they are going to be using for the parts.

by: btarunr
Volumes are a non-issue. Rambus already has biggies like Elpida mass producing XDR chips for Playstation.
XDR is not XDR2. I know your trying to point out that the volume capabilities are there. I'm just pointing out the obvious (to me at least). The fact of no XDR2 samples.
Posted on Reply
#8
cadaveca
My name is Dave
by: mastrdrver
Anyone want to put money on this?



No one is sampling XDR2. How do you go from no one sampling to full swing production in 2 months? What does an agreement between GF and Rambus have to do with the fact of no XDR2 samples? Even that PR has nothing to do with XDR2 or sampling of such memory.

Not even considering that AMD is probably already been in full swing production on 79xx parts. Which means that they've already decided what memory they are going to be using for the parts.



XDR is not XDR2. I know your trying to point out that the volume capabilities are there. I'm just pointing out the obvious (to me at least). The fact of no XDR2 samples.
I dunno, I read this as NOT XDR used in the PS3:
•Rambus, for its high-speed low-power next-generation memory technologies developed on GlobalFoundries’ 28nm-SLP technology.
You have no idea(nor do I for that matter) bout who is sampling what behind closed doors. Just like noone really knew I was going to be doing reviews for TPU, MONTHS before my first review was posted. A few people did, but the majority of the TPU membership had NO idea. Likewise, Rambus is working on SOMETHING using GLoFo's 28m-SLP process, and their designs must have worked, or they fixed an issue for GloFo, and hence the award theey received from GloFo. BTW, XDR is considered to be using a LOW SPEED serial bus.

All I can think is how everyone was so sure of BD release dates, that went, and then they were sure of the next...but nothing ever came of it, for months and months.

That said, of course this could be false. Hence the word "rumour" attached to it. I don't see why you are getting so worked up about it...

Myself, I cannot deny the possibility that GloFo has been producing XDR2 since August, 2 months ago.

Also, I do not expect the cards that will use this memory until the end of April, next year. That's 5 months out yet, and plenty of time for stuff to eb out, and sampled.

Just becuase you think(or have confirmed via a board partner) there are no samples, doesn't mean that there is none...just perhaps NDAs are so tight that noone is willing to talk about it.

It is Rambus, after all. If I was AMD, I'd want to keep it under wraps until I was confident that it was a "sure thing". And in this industry, nothing is a "sure thing" until it launches, and users can buy it. But that announcement from GloFo about some next-gen memory design on 28nm is confirmation enough that GloFo is producing samples of SOMETHING for Rambus.


As far as I am concerned, the FX-8150 is a myth, as is the boxed version that is supposed to come with a watercooler. I cannot buy either, so they don't exist. So I really do understand your opinion here. I just don't agree.


I don't think it's even likely, like you do not. But i cannot deny that it's possible. Show me EXACTLY what GloFo is produsing for Rambus, and I might be more skeptical.
Posted on Reply
#9
mastrdrver
by: cadaveca
I dunno, I read this as NOT XDR used in the PS3:



You have no idea(nor do I for that matter) bout who is sampling what behind closed doors. Just like noone really knew I was going to be doing reviews for TPU, MONTHS before my first review was posted. A few people did, but the majority of the TPU membership had NO idea. Likewise, Rambus is working on SOMETHING using GLoFo's 28m-SLP process, and their designs must have worked, or they fixed an issue for GloFo, and hence the award theey received from GloFo. BTW, XDR is considered to be using a LOW SPEED serial bus.

All I can think is how everyone was so sure of BD release dates, that went, and then they were sure of the next...but nothing ever came of it, for months and months.

That said, of course this could be false. Hence the word "rumour" attached to it. I don't see why you are getting so worked up about it...

Myself, I cannot deny the possibility that GloFo has been producing XDR2 since August, 2 months ago.

Also, I do not expect the cards that will use this memory until the end of April, next year. That's 5 months out yet, and plenty of time for stuff to eb out, and sampled.

Just becuase you think(or have confirmed via a board partner) there are no samples, doesn't mean that there is none...just perhaps NDAs are so tight that noone is willing to talk about it.

It is Rambus, after all. If I was AMD, I'd want to keep it under wraps until I was confident that it was a "sure thing". And in this industry, nothing is a "sure thing" until it launches, and users can buy it. But that announcement from GloFo about some next-gen memory design on 28nm is confirmation enough that GloFo is producing samples of SOMETHING for Rambus.


As far as I am concerned, the FX-8150 is a myth, as is the boxed version that is supposed to come with a watercooler. I cannot buy either, so they don't exist. So I really do understand your opinion here. I just don't agree.


I don't think it's even likely, like you do not. But i cannot deny that it's possible. Show me EXACTLY what GloFo is produsing for Rambus, and I might be more skeptical.
Your absolutely right I do not know anything about sampling XDR2. Though when everyone on the S|A and B3D forums is saying it is fake and the same ones have been right times before, I've got no reason to believe this XDR2 nonsense. Especially those who are in the industry on those forums and they are saying the same thing.
Posted on Reply
#10
cadaveca
My name is Dave
by: mastrdrver
Especially those who are in the industry on those forums and they are saying the same thing.
You mean the same people who said BD was going to be awesome, and that it was launching in September? :laugh:

I chose to beleive NOONE, and will wait for AMD to actually confirm before I beleive it's true, myself, but, as I said, it does seem possible.

And frankly, if someone in the industry comments on unreleased products, they don't know shit. NDAs ensure that those who talk about stuff are usually full of it. And you can guaranttee that the info stream from AMD on unreleased stuff is going to dry right up now that they have let go of some many people in the wake of the BD launch.

Then again, the same applies to this rumour. Personally, I think this all spawned from that award GloFo gave Rambus. Like, nearly everything usees ram, including cell phones and stuff, so Rambus could be pushing out nearly anything from GLoFo.

It just bugs me that noone knows what those products actually are, so I must remain willing to accept that it COULD be VGA ram. But I'm just as skeptical as you are...


I want to see AMD innovate. Perhaps using XDR2 could change things a bit.
Posted on Reply
#11
btarunr
Editor & Senior Moderator
by: mastrdrver
XDR is not XDR2. I know your trying to point out that the volume capabilities are there. I'm just pointing out the obvious (to me at least). The fact of no XDR2 samples.
Read up a little on XDR2. It's pin-compatible with XDR (so also bump-compatible on the dies), and achieving higher densities is just a fab-process function. Elpida and Samsung already have the fab-processes with which they make 2 Gb GDDR5 chips. For them to make XDR2 in high volumes is as simple as a specifications change.
Posted on Reply
#12
eidairaman1
Amd did innovate with Gddr 4 and 5 5 was very innovative cuz it could output more over a 256 bit bus vs the 512 bit bus.
by: cadaveca
You mean the same people who said BD was going to be awesome, and that it was launching in September? :laugh:
[B][/B]
I chose to beleive NOONE, and will wait for AMD to actually confirm before I beleive it's true, myself, but, as I said, it does seem possible.

And frankly, if someone in the industry comments on unreleased products, they don't know shit. NDAs ensure that those who talk about stuff are usually full of it. And you can guaranttee that the info stream from AMD on unreleased stuff is going to dry right up now that they have let go of some many people in the wake of the BD launch.

Then again, the same applies to this rumour. Personally, I think this all spawned from that award GloFo gave Rambus. Like, nearly everything usees ram, including cell phones and stuff, so Rambus could be pushing out nearly anything from GLoFo.

It just bugs me that noone knows what those products actually are, so I must remain willing to accept that it COULD be VGA ram. But I'm just as skeptical as you are...


I want to see AMD innovate. Perhaps using XDR2 could change things a bit.
Posted on Reply
#13
cadaveca
My name is Dave
by: eidairaman1
Amd did innovate with Gddr 4 and 5 5 was very innovative cuz it could output more over a 256 bit bus vs the 512 bit bus.
I agree, but I'd like to see them continue to innovate. And since they have innovated on the memroy front so often, it kinda makes sense for them to go with XDR2 if possible.
Posted on Reply
#14
mastrdrver
by: cadaveca
You mean the same people who said BD was going to be awesome, and that it was launching in September? :laugh:
No. They were saying that the September rumor for BD was wrong. They were saying it for a long time too.
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