Sunday, November 27th 2011

Bulldozer Beats Politicians As The Biggest Fail

On our front page, we placed a poll in mid-September, ahead of AMD FX Processor family launch (based on the "Bulldozer" architecture). Based on the most plausible specifications and the hype surrounding the products at the time, we had a hunch that neither Bulldozer nor Sandy Bridge-E will meet our readers' expectations. AMD FX Processor family turned out to be a Duke Nukem Forever, clogged in the pipeline for too long (since 2007, as a matter of fact), when it came out, it made a mockery of itself. It's barely faster than its previous generation.

Sandy Bridge-E promised to be a pin-up processor platform that's eons faster than its predecessor, its specs-sheets warranted its hype. As it turns out, although they're the fastest processors, they aren't much faster than previous-generation Westmere six-core chips at multi-threaded applications, and aren't much faster than Sandy Bridge LGA1155 Core i7 processors at gaming and serial loads. We set out to find out which would turn out to be a bigger "fail" (failure, in internet jargon). To stuff the poll up with more options, we experimented with the idea of placing a seemingly-unbeatable poll option "Our Politicians", just to see if either of the two could fail so hard, that politicians end up better. The myth that politicians always win at a failing contest is busted, at least in this case.

At the time of counting today, "Bulldozer" edged past "Our Politicians". The graph above shows the trend of voting chronologically. At the start of polling, people were evenly optimistic about both Bulldozer and Sandy Bridge-E. Politicians were off to a flying start, and although there were a few spikes, their votes per day figure was decreasing. Then by the 7th of October, votes began to increase for Bulldozer (around the time when unofficial benchmark results were doing rounds, reviewers had samples at hand). On 12th October (AMD FX launch day), Bulldozer got a Noah's flood of fail votes. People weren't expecting Bulldozer to be a Sandy Bridge-E killer, but they were at least expecting it to outperform Intel's LGA1155 platform. That was not to be. Despite not really bringing shock and awe to the table that its specifications Sandy Bridge-E managed to be the fastest processors money can buy. This ensured that Sandy Bridge-E didn't fare badly in our poll, few thought it was a fail. Sarah Michelle Gellar? Well, apparently people tolerate her provided they mute their TVs.

In before dragons and grammar tutors.
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93 Comments on Bulldozer Beats Politicians As The Biggest Fail

#1
Zubasa
Nothing even comes close to Chinese politicians..
Posted on Reply
#2
Yellow&Nerdy?
by: Zubasa
Nothing even comes close to Chinese politicians..
Second you on that one.
Posted on Reply
#3
AphexDreamer
Will their Bulldozer revision still be Socket AM3+? I would be pissed if it wasn't.

Also I think they do this crap on purpose. Probably get more sales.

I mean Phenom first had the TLB Bug (which I bought) and they later released phenoms that fixed that (so then I bought that) and now I buy the first iteration of Bulldozer (FX6100) mild improvement over my 965 but will of course be forced to buy their better performing version of FX (piledriver).

I guess I'm the sucker they are trying to suck in with this crap.

In my defense the 6100 was only $100 bucks I figure I'll keep it and sell my 965 for about the same and make my money back :/
Posted on Reply
#4
erocker
Apparently not too many people watched Sarah Michelle Gellar's new show.
Posted on Reply
#5
cadaveca
My name is Dave
by: erocker
Apparently not too many people watched Sarah Michelle Gellar's new show.
I'm guessing you have, which would be a far bigger fail than anything AMD and Intel could do.


:p
Posted on Reply
#6
erocker
by: cadaveca
I'm guessing you have, which would be a far bigger fail than anything AMD and Intel could do.


:p
Yeah, it's bad. I think the act of myself even watching it is pretty fail. Why did I do it? :(
Posted on Reply
#7
cadaveca
My name is Dave
by: erocker
I think the act of myself even watching it is pretty fail.
THis is EXACTLY what I was referring to you having failed at.:laugh: Oh well, just yet another fail.


:nutkick:

It's interesting to see the numbers, any way.
Posted on Reply
#8
Completely Bonkers
There is another corollary to all this: that x86 is asymptotically reaching its peak. You just cannot get better performance per clock under x86. It is as optimised as you can get it. The only way to improve performance now is via additional cores, higher clock or "new" instructions that aren't (really) x86 any more... but basically new op codes to address today's programming algorithms. Old programs will not run faster on the new CPUs.

There is only one thing that hasn't saturated yet: performance/power consumption. So let's see some big steps in this direction.

What a conundrum Intel must face: you know, the 5-10 year strategy. x86 cannot get better per core. Should they ditch x86 in the long term? That is an ugly question. Better get the punters to buy into n-core n>100 processors and design software and compilers to optimise across multiply cores etc. They must be lobbying Microsoft very hard that Windows 9 is "best" on 16 cores or something.

That's all that Intel (or x86) has got left. Increase cores and reduce power consumption.

Leaving a niche for ARM and a possible different strategy.
Posted on Reply
#9
15th Warlock
by: erocker
Apparently not too many people watched Sarah Michelle Gellar's new show.
Who's Sarah Michelle Gellar? :wtf: :nutkick:
Posted on Reply
#10
Steven B
im happy bulldozer won somthing
Posted on Reply
#11
Damn_Smooth
by: Steven B
im happy bulldozer won somthing
2 things. Don't forget the overclock world record.
Posted on Reply
#12
Easy Rhino
Linux Advocate
the only reason bulldozer is more fail than our politicians is because the amount of hype brought to you by sites like TPU. why does everyone cheer loudly for AMD? they are a terribly run company that since athlon X2 have not put out a decent chip to match intel. let's face it, they suck. intel ftw.
Posted on Reply
#13
Damn_Smooth
by: Easy Rhino
the only reason bulldozer is more fail than our politicians is because the amount of hype brought to you by sites like TPU. why does everyone cheer loudly for AMD? they are a terribly run company that since athlon X2 have not put out a decent chip to match intel. let's face it, they suck. intel ftw.
Can't argue that, but in my case, I was cheering for the underdog. That just didn't work out in my favor.
Posted on Reply
#14
Eva01Master
+1 to Easy Rhino. Intel FTW, AMD is just accumulating another fail for their failed book of failing failures.
Posted on Reply
#15
Easy Rhino
Linux Advocate
and this is coming from the guy who saved up for the athlon x2 3800+ . i knew the purchase of ati would ruin the company. so fail.
Posted on Reply
#16
cadaveca
My name is Dave
by: Easy Rhino
the only reason bulldozer is more fail than our politicians is because the amount of hype brought to you by sites like TPU.
None of that hype was brought to anyone via TPU. TPU never hyped BD, merely re-interated info from other tech sites. I cannot compare those sites to TPU, at all. All those other sites, clearly by reviews posted on BD and SB-E with ES processors on launch day, are far differnt than TPU. Note that TPU doesn't have any current CPU reviews.
why does everyone cheer loudly for AMD? they are a terribly run company that since athlon X2 have not put out a decent chip to match intel. let's face it, they suck. intel ftw.
Everyone has to hope that someone can face Intel. Yes, current AMD chips are far from the best performing, but it's a lack of real information that had everyone expecting more...and TPU was never the source of the erroneous info.

I couldn't call Intel the best option either, as all their current high-end products are broken. Both X79 chipsets and CPUs are not fully functional.

How is it Intel is winning? Performance? OK, I'll give you that, but again, they are asking $650 and $1250 for broken CPUs, and boards for those broken CPUs are $300+. That's winning?

:laugh:

by: Easy Rhino
and this is coming from the guy who saved up for the athlon x2 3800 . i knew the purchase of ati would ruin the company. so fail.
Buying ATI is the one thing keeping AMD afloat these days. With that post, it's clear you are just trolling. :shadedshu Thank you, come agian?
Posted on Reply
#17
Dj-ElectriC
ZOMG... if you'll excuse me, im gonna laugh myself to sleep

GG AMD... :laugh:
Posted on Reply
#18
Easy Rhino
Linux Advocate
by: cadaveca
None of that hype was brought to anyone via TPU. TPU never hyped BD, merely re-interated info from other tech sites. I cannot compare those sites to TPU, at all. All those other sites, clearly by reviews posted on BD and SB-E with ES processors on launch day, are far differnt than TPU. Note that TPU doesn't have any current CPU reviews.
lul wut? rewriting news that hypes a chip is the exact definition of hype. there were plenty of critical reviews of bulldozer before it came out and i dont believe any of those were rewritten on tpu :wtf: im not targeting the news division at tpu, im commenting on the forums as well. :rolleyes:
Everyone has to hope that someone can face Intel. Yes, current AMD chips are far from the best performing, but it's a lack of real information that had everyone expecting more...and TPU was never the source of the erroneous info.
reposting erroneous news stories from other sites is posting erroneous info. but again, my focus isnt on just news, but also the forums.
I couldn't call Intel the best option either, as all their current high-end products are broken. Both X79 chipsets and CPUs are not fully functional.

How is it Intel is winning? Performance? OK, I'll give you that, but again, they are asking $650 and $1250 for broken CPUs, and boards for those broken CPUs are $300+. That's winning?

:laugh:
thankfully i never mentioned how poor intel is at some things either. it also has nothing to do with what im talking about.
Buying ATI is the one thing keeping AMD afloat these days.
exactly, and it ruined AMD. what's your point?
With that post, it's clear you are just trolling. :shadedshu Thank you, come agian?
your ignorance does not make me a troll. :nutkick:
Posted on Reply
#19
Frick
Fishfaced Nincompoop
by: Easy Rhino

exactly, and it ruined AMD. what's your point?
If ATi keeps AMD upside, why were they ruined? I really don't understand what you're saying here.

And I still think AMD systems are worth it if you're on a tight budget and is a fairly uncomplicated user. My system was dirt cheap and is almost overkill for me.

And while it's true they have not competed directly with Intel for some while, their chips have not been garbage either. Tons of people here have had AMD setups because the price/performance was good.
Posted on Reply
#20
cadaveca
My name is Dave
by: Easy Rhino
im not targeting the news division at tpu, im commenting on the forums as well.
Actually, you said "sites like TPU", and didn't actually seem to include TPU, but thanks for clarifying. That's what makes you a troll.:laugh:



AMD is like Ford was...Not the best, but cheap enough that everyone can afford them. And they are by far, very successful at that, in such a way that their current products are even hard to come by in some instances. I still today, 6 weeks after the launch, cannot get an FX-8150 locally...not because they haven't arrived, but becuase they are in such high demand.:D That's the epitome of success.

by: Easy Rhino
exactly, and it ruined AMD. what's your point?
AMD is NOT in ruins. They are in the situation they are today, in a large way, because of Hector Ruiz. Sure, stock value is nto what it used to be, but such is the price of success...sometimes you need to make sacrifices to get that success. AMD either had to invest in ATI, or R&D for GPUS. choice was pretty easy, IMHO.
Posted on Reply
#21
Easy Rhino
Linux Advocate
by: Frick
If ATi keeps AMD upside, why were they ruined? I really don't understand what you're saying here.

And I still think AMD systems are worth it if you're on a tight budget and is a fairly uncomplicated user. My system was dirt cheap and is almost overkill for me.

And while it's true they have not competed directly with Intel for some while, their chips have not been garbage either. Tons of people here have had AMD setups because the price/performance was good.
see below

by: cadaveca
Actually, you said "sites like TPU", and didn't actually seem to include TPU, but thanks for clarifying. That's what makes you a troll.:laugh:



AMD is like Ford was...Not the best, but cheap enough that everyone can afford them. And they are by far, very successful at that, in such a way that their current products are even hard to come by in some instances. I still today, 6 weeks after the launch, cannot get an FX-8150 locally...not because they haven't arrived, but becuase they are in such high demand.:D That's the epitome of success.

AMD is NOT in ruins. They are in the situation they are today, in a large way, becuase of Hector Ruiz.
i judge success by profit. you make a great product then it will sell. AMD makes fine chips, but they can't make much profit because they are a terribly run company. they became terrible when they bought ATI. sure, AMD is still afloat because of their GPU sales, but the quality of their CPUs went way down. it isn't the fault of the engineers it is the fault of poor management.
Posted on Reply
#22
cadaveca
My name is Dave
by: Easy Rhino
it isn't the fault of the engineers it is the fault of poor management.
I agree, but to me, all of those people are gone, IMHO. Those individuals where the failure, not the company itself. At least they are making changes in an attempt to "fix" things. I like to place blame directly on the source. ;)
Posted on Reply
#23
AphexDreamer
I'm happy with my FX6100 (especially at the price tag of $100 bucks).

I have 6 cores at 4.5Ghz with 1.45 volts.

Compared to my Phenom 965 which was quad core at 4.0ghz with 1.475 volts maxed out.

Not the greatest improvement and not worthy of a medal but with headroom for higher clocks I am satisfied. Oh and 95 Watt Max TDP
Posted on Reply
#24
Easy Rhino
Linux Advocate
by: cadaveca
I agree, but to me, all of those people are gone, IMHO. Those individuals where the failure, not the company itself. At least they are making changes in an attempt to "fix" things. I like to place blame directly on the source. ;)
perhaps, but poor management practices seem to stick around longer than the poor managers that put them into practice. i hope we see a significant turn around in the coming years by AMD or I see a split in their future.
Posted on Reply
#25
cadaveca
My name is Dave
by: Easy Rhino
perhaps, but poor management practices seem to stick around longer than the poor managers that put them into practice. i hope we see a significant turn around in the coming years by AMD or I see a split in their future.
Yeah, for sure. But I feel that nVidia is in a more precarious position than AMD is. The current talk of ARM and Windows is the one thing that might save nVidia. Nvidia working with ARM designs is probably a big part of the reason there is such a push for those designs, even, and probably why we keep hearing about them. For nVidia to succeed...ARM needs to be recognized by consumers.


AMD bought ATi, as the integration of CPU and GPU into the same silicon was inevitable. If they had not made the move when they did, current FM1 chips wouldn't be as good as they are now. Those chips...are fantastic. But there's no real marketing of the FM1 platform, because board partner profits seem low within that platform.


The "percieved" failure of AMD isn't a failure at all..but merely the tough time between transitioning the company's focus from being a CPU-focused brand, to a homogenous computing brand. Of course the CPU side of things is going to suffer...that's what needs to make the greatest changes. That fact that this is ignored quite often is shocking, to say the least.


Although BD in the desktop space seem like a bad product, it's actually far more exciting than most think; it only seems bad because consumers(enthusiast sites) perceive AMD as a CPU company..which they are not.

I mean, I've said time and agian that nVidia is NOT a hardware comany...that they are a software company, that just happens to make some hardware too. Of course, I got that from nVidia's CEO making a speech...


Likewise, AMD is not a CPU company. AMD's only failure is educating their consumers on that change, as nVidia has failed to distingish themselves as a software-focused company.


I don't see why that's a big deal...or why it makes Intel better than AMD. They aren't even in direct competition with each other. Marketing would like you to think so, but truly, each has their own separate markets, and each excels in meeting that markets needs.
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