Sunday, November 27th 2011

Bulldozer Beats Politicians As The Biggest Fail

On our front page, we placed a poll in mid-September, ahead of AMD FX Processor family launch (based on the "Bulldozer" architecture). Based on the most plausible specifications and the hype surrounding the products at the time, we had a hunch that neither Bulldozer nor Sandy Bridge-E will meet our readers' expectations. AMD FX Processor family turned out to be a Duke Nukem Forever, clogged in the pipeline for too long (since 2007, as a matter of fact), when it came out, it made a mockery of itself. It's barely faster than its previous generation.

Sandy Bridge-E promised to be a pin-up processor platform that's eons faster than its predecessor, its specs-sheets warranted its hype. As it turns out, although they're the fastest processors, they aren't much faster than previous-generation Westmere six-core chips at multi-threaded applications, and aren't much faster than Sandy Bridge LGA1155 Core i7 processors at gaming and serial loads. We set out to find out which would turn out to be a bigger "fail" (failure, in internet jargon). To stuff the poll up with more options, we experimented with the idea of placing a seemingly-unbeatable poll option "Our Politicians", just to see if either of the two could fail so hard, that politicians end up better. The myth that politicians always win at a failing contest is busted, at least in this case.

At the time of counting today, "Bulldozer" edged past "Our Politicians". The graph above shows the trend of voting chronologically. At the start of polling, people were evenly optimistic about both Bulldozer and Sandy Bridge-E. Politicians were off to a flying start, and although there were a few spikes, their votes per day figure was decreasing. Then by the 7th of October, votes began to increase for Bulldozer (around the time when unofficial benchmark results were doing rounds, reviewers had samples at hand). On 12th October (AMD FX launch day), Bulldozer got a Noah's flood of fail votes. People weren't expecting Bulldozer to be a Sandy Bridge-E killer, but they were at least expecting it to outperform Intel's LGA1155 platform. That was not to be. Despite not really bringing shock and awe to the table that its specifications Sandy Bridge-E managed to be the fastest processors money can buy. This ensured that Sandy Bridge-E didn't fare badly in our poll, few thought it was a fail. Sarah Michelle Gellar? Well, apparently people tolerate her provided they mute their TVs.

In before dragons and grammar tutors.
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93 Comments on Bulldozer Beats Politicians As The Biggest Fail

#1
Frederik S
Staff
AMD should look on the bright side:
Bulldozer finally won something!!

:)
Posted on Reply
#3
xenocide
by: erek
with the proper compiler, the BD is upto 30% faster than it's stock situation @ http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=open64_50_bulldozer
IIt got a 30% boost in 2/3 tests in SciMark alone, and in most other programs didn't break a 5% gain. I see no reason to get excited and claim BD is just poorly optimized when from the get-go it was mostly poorly DESIGNED

by: AphexDreamer
I'm happy with my FX6100 (especially at the price tag of $100 bucks).

I have 6 cores at 4.5Ghz with 1.45 volts.

Compared to my Phenom 965 which was quad core at 4.0ghz with 1.475 volts maxed out.
Nobody felt obligated to point this out to you, but that's not really true. You have 6 Modules, across 3 Cores. You can only move 1 thread at a time through each CORE, but at the same time have 1 thread at a time in each Module. Basically, you have a tri-core with hyper-threading deluxe edition. On heavily threaded tasks you should see a performance gain, but very few games use more than 4 threads, so odds are the Phenom II would perform better at the same clock than that FX given it's greater per-thread performance. Of course on things like Encoding the FX will definitely do better.
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#4
Recus
by: cadaveca
Yeah, for sure. But I feel that nVidia is in a more precarious position than AMD is. The current talk of ARM and Windows is the one thing that might save nVidia. Nvidia working with ARM designs is probably a big part of the reason there is such a push for those designs, even, and probably why we keep hearing about them. For nVidia to succeed...ARM needs to be recognized by consumers.


AMD bought ATi, as the integration of CPU and GPU into the same silicon was inevitable. If they had not made the move when they did, current FM1 chips wouldn't be as good as they are now. Those chips...are fantastic. But there's no real marketing of the FM1 platform, because board partner profits seem low within that platform.


The "percieved" failure of AMD isn't a failure at all..but merely the tough time between transitioning the company's focus from being a CPU-focused brand, to a homogenous computing brand. Of course the CPU side of things is going to suffer...that's what needs to make the greatest changes. That fact that this is ignored quite often is shocking, to say the least.


Although BD in the desktop space seem like a bad product, it's actually far more exciting than most think; it only seems bad because consumers(enthusiast sites) perceive AMD as a CPU company..which they are not.

I mean, I've said time and agian that nVidia is NOT a hardware comany...that they are a software company, that just happens to make some hardware too. Of course, I got that from nVidia's CEO making a speech...


Likewise, AMD is not a CPU company. AMD's only failure is educating their consumers on that change, as nVidia has failed to distingish themselves as a software-focused company.


I don't see why that's a big deal...or why it makes Intel better than AMD. They aren't even in direct competition with each other. Marketing would like you to think so, but truly, each has their own separate markets, and each excels in meeting that markets needs.
Desperate fanboy nonsenses. AMD failed and you can't admit facts without mentioning Nvidia?
Posted on Reply
#5
Fx
by: Recus
Desperate fanboy nonsenses. AMD failed and you can't admit facts without mentioning Nvidia?
smh, so many Intel fanboys spew nonsense and for what reason?

ok, so Intel is doing great. they have great cpus and good SSDs and are making a lot of money...

but who the hell are you to say that AMD fails when they are a widely recognized industry leader in many markets. some of their products perform the best in their respective market

just because they havent had the fastest cpu for years doesnt constitute failure... that is just one product. the problem lies in your head because you have attached AMD as soley a cpu company

using your logic I could say that Intel is an epic failure because they have NEVER been able to create jack shit for graphics!
Posted on Reply
#6
W1zzard
by: Fx
using your logic I could say that Intel is an epic failure because they have NEVER been able to create jack shit for graphics!
intel is selling more graphics than anyone else on the planet, and they make more money with it than all the remaining "players" combined
Posted on Reply
#7
Recus
by: Fx
they are a widely recognized industry leader in many markets. some of their products perform the best in their respective market
just because they havethnt had the fastest cpu for years doesnt constitute failure... at is just one product. the problem lies in your head because you have attached AMD as soley a cpu company
So AMD isn't CPU company?
using your logic I could say that Intel is an epic failure because they have NEVER been able to create jack shit for graphics!
Maybe because Intel is CPU company?

by: cadaveca
Yes, I am an ATi fanboy. Have stated that many times. But ATi doesn't exist any more.


If you look between the lines, I am insinuating that nVidia is the main force behind the push to ARM, and all the chatter about it. As a major player in the market with no CPU, they stand to benfit the most from ARM getting used in Windows.

Of course, admitting FACTS is a good thing...mention of nVidia is bad? We have but 3 major silicon players...Intel, AMD, and nVidia. Very few others make silicon that is used in nearly every PC, except those three, so yes, it's hard to talk about CPU/GPU designs without mentioning nVidia.

Why is that a bad thing? I don't get it. I like to talk about everyone that may have some affect in things like this...ignoring such a large part of the industry seems foolish, as nVidia does weigh in on this subject, quite specifically so, when talking about CPU designs.

I mean, you can say I am biased all you like...I will never deny that. But because I am very open with my bias, it's not an issue...you simply need to consider that bias when reading my comments. I'm not some emotion-less machine that has no personal feelings, and to deny those feelings is asinine.
Well, now I understood. :toast:
Posted on Reply
#8
cadaveca
My name is Dave
by: Recus
Desperate fanboy nonsenses. AMD failed and you can't admit facts without mentioning Nvidia?
Yes, I am an ATi fanboy. Have stated that many times. But ATi doesn't exist any more.


If you look between the lines, I am insinuating that nVidia is the main force behind the push to ARM, and all the chatter about it. As a major player in the market with no CPU, they stand to benfit the most from ARM getting used in Windows.


Of course, admitting FACTS is a good thing...mention of nVidia is bad? We have but 3 major silicon players...Intel, AMD, and nVidia. Very few others make silicon that is used in nearly every PC, except those three, so yes, it's hard to talk about CPU/GPU designs without mentioning nVidia.

Why is that a bad thing? I don't get it. I like to talk about everyone that may have some affect in things like this...ignoring such a large part of the industry seems foolish, as nVidia does weigh in on this subject, quite specifically so, when talking about CPU designs.

I mean, you can say I am biased all you like...I will never deny that. But because I am very open with my bias, it's not an issue...you simply need to consider that bias when reading my comments. I'm not some emotion-less machine that has no personal feelings, and to deny those feelings is asinine.


by: W1zzard
intel is selling more graphics than anyone else on the planet, and they make more money with it than all the remaining "players" combined
Intel basically owns the entire industry. they are THE major force in nearly every market they have products in, and nearly everyone else marches to the beat of their drum.

by: Recus
So AMD isn't CPU company?
Not 100%, no. They also make GPUs and chipsets. It's a weird mix not seen elsewhere in the same ratios, and kinda explains why they are having issues. They need to switch focus.
Posted on Reply
#9
3volvedcombat
by: Recus
http://s4.postimage.org/1gtp3vup0/grin.gif



So AMD isn't CPU company?



Maybe because Intel is CPU company?
idk this, you are really trolling sometimes :slap:

AMD merged with ATI sometimes back, there offices and CEO's manage both video cards and processors. They release platforms via graphics, and processors, and chipset and code-name them.

There not considered to be only a CPU company. Other then the entire bulldozer architecture low performance and disappointment, everything else they have released has been great sense 07-08. People are still running llano CPU's. amd apu's were also a good release for there side.

Intel is also not just a cpu company either, they manufacture Motherboards, CPU's, SSD's. They fail in there own aspects, their greedy, real greedy sometimes. They have never released anything with price in consideration, that being said, the competition is usually slower by minimal percent. Not talking Pentium or value CPU's, a genuine high end model out priced compared to the competition which performs with 90+% of there product.
Posted on Reply
#10
Fx
by: W1zzard
intel is selling more graphics than anyone else on the planet, and they make more money with it than all the remaining "players" combined
I can assure you that their graphics arent being sold because of their merit

it quite simply is because they are bundled in a product that uses their own cpu
Posted on Reply
#11
Frick
Fishfaced Nincompoop
by: Fx
I can assure you that their graphics arent being sold because of their merit

it quite simply is because they are bundled in a product that uses their own cpu
And for most users that is perfect.
Posted on Reply
#12
Fx
by: Frick
And for most users that is perfect.
yes, it is- but so is AMD's solutions for those same users

one of AMD's problems is that Intel has far greater mindshare
Posted on Reply
#13
3volvedcombat
by: Fx
yes, it is- but so is AMD's solutions for those same users

one of AMD's problems is that Intel has far greater mindshare
Ill tell you this, when I was working at my local tech shop in my valley.
My boss would tell me and I would notice that people are really all about the name.

He would not stock much AMD product simply because the people did not approve of the name, tons of customers would always head to "Intel" which we stocked in store much more often basically because of the name.

Intel really does have more mind share, and the more commercials and advertising released, the more AMD needs to push to compete with that.

Intel sounds better to the average ipod smart person then AMD does, still to this day.

But with AMD on the console game, and on Mac's there eventually might be some leveling in quality and appeal to the norm of customers.
Posted on Reply
#14
ensabrenoir
by: 3volvedcombat
Ill tell you this, when I was working at my local tech shop in my valley.
My boss would tell me and I would notice that people are really all about the name.

He would not stock much AMD product simply because the people did not approve of the name, tons of customers would always head to "Intel" which we stocked in store much more often basically because of the name.

Intel really does have more mind share, and the more commercials and advertising released, the more AMD needs to push to compete with that.

Intel sounds better to the average ipod smart person then AMD does, still to this day.

But with AMD on the console game, and on Mac's there eventually might be some leveling in quality and appeal to the norm of customers.
You know......I've never seen an amd comercial.......ever. is it just me or they never made one.
Posted on Reply
#15
AsRock
TPU addict
Even if every AMD bulldozer chip blow up on use it would not beat Politicians BS.. Anyone who thinks other wise must live in the middle of no were.
Posted on Reply
#16
etayorius
Just give me a damn PhenomII for AM3 with 8 cores on 28nm Clocked to 4.5ghz and i am happy as hell, keep that Bulldozer shit away from my wallet.
Posted on Reply
#17
Thefumigator
I can forgive AMD for failing occasionally. Maybe their latest BD offerings weren't up to the expectations but AMD still has a good portafolio of products, beginning with Sempron 140 all the way up to a Phenom X6.

I can't forgive Intel for failing, not even once, they've got everything to make things right from the beginning, huge resources, great engineering team, marketing dominance, etc. Still they may fail, they did with the SB chipset bug, but they fixed it on time. Still don't know why they don't put bigger efforts on the GPU side, but I can conclude they don't care/don't need, or they try but they just aren't good at it, despite latest improvements over here and there.
Posted on Reply
#18
ensabrenoir
by: Thefumigator
I can forgive AMD for failing occasionally. Maybe their latest BD offerings weren't up to the expectations but AMD still has a good portafolio of products, beginning with Sempron 140 all the way up to a Phenom X6.

I can't forgive Intel for failing, not even once, they've got everything to make things right from the beginning, huge resources, great engineering team, marketing dominance, etc. Still they may fail, they did with the SB chipset bug, but they fixed it on time. Still don't know why they don't put bigger efforts on the GPU side, but I can conclude they don't care/don't need, or they try but they just aren't good at it, despite latest improvements over here and there.
Yes gpu wise intel. Sorta kinda stink...but they're working on it compute gpus showing some promise.....I think nvdia + intel = awesome squared
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