Sunday, August 18th 2013

HWBot No Longer Accepts Record Submissions from Windows 8

HWBot announced that it no longer accepts benchmark record submissions from PCs running Windows 8. It discovered that the way Windows 8 handles real-time clock (RTC), compromises the veracity of benchmark results. HWBot announced that is looking into possible solutions for the problem, and till such a time, it won't accept benchmark result submissions from Windows 8 PCs. This decision could affect leaderboards and records set using Windows 8 benches, and could greatly stunt adoption of the operating system among the professional overclocking community. A statement by HWBot reads;
As the result of weekend-time research, the HWBOT staff has decided to invalidate all benchmark records established with the Windows8 operating system. Due to severe validity problems with the Windows8 real time clock ("RTC"), benchmarks results achieved with Windows8 cannot be trusted. The main problem lies with the RTC being affected when over- or underclocking under the operating system. The operating system uses the RTC as reference clock, and benchmarks use it to reference (benchmark) time.
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81 Comments on HWBot No Longer Accepts Record Submissions from Windows 8

#1
Nabarun
by: Mathragh
What does this have to do with,,.. anything here? =D
Think.
Posted on Reply
#2
Mathragh
by: Nabarun
Think.
You mean that the only way people can justify buying high-end hardware is by making high-scoring posts on HWBot, I know.

Imho however, you're quite wrong:)

Not that I've ever made posts on HWbot, and prolly my hardware won't even be classified as high end, but there are sooo many reasons to buy high end stuff, HWbot is just for hobbyists.
Posted on Reply
#3
Nabarun
Yeah, grapes are only for birds ;) Besides, like Assimilator said, it's not just about benchmarks or hwbot.
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#4
Mathragh
by: Nabarun
Yeah, grapes are only for birds ;) Besides, like Assimilator said, it's not just about benchmarks or hwbot.
Ah if you mean the win8 part of the problem, then yeah, I totally agree. Stuff like this shouldn't happen if its avoidable.
Posted on Reply
#5
BrainCruser
The windows 8 timers and clocks is a part of what has changed moving from windows 7 to windows 8.
The clock is now set so it groups the interrupts together, a part of the battery saving strategy.
Both android and IOS do that.

As for the windows 8, most things have changed for the worse, not better. Except for the improvements of windows explorer and task manager everything else is downhill.

The metro interface is useless by itself, missing even the most basic necessities for a working OS, It doesn't even have a file explorer ffs.
Posted on Reply
#6
Fourstaff
by: Assimilator

I'm sure we will see a fix for this next Patch Tuesday, if not sooner, as an accurate RTC is critical to many applications working correctly, not just benchmarks.
I am quite sure the clock is accurate on stock speeds, but goes haywire when overclocked.
Posted on Reply
#7
Roph
by: remixedcat
I do like the improvements in the UI actually.
  • The file transfer dialog finally makes sense with the speed graph
  • The Task manager is improved greatly
  • Built-In ISO mounting/burning
  • Hyper-v
  • Improved explorer UI. The ribbon is so much easier to do a lot of file ops on
  • Very fast boot

  • TeraCopy
  • Prio
  • WinCDEmu & ImgBurn / CDBurnerXP
  • Not sure about this one, hardware virtualisation is fine for me on Win7 with VirtualBox
  • QT TabBar
  • SSD :laugh:
Posted on Reply
#8
zsolt_93
by: Roph
  • TeraCopy
  • Prio
  • WinCDEmu & ImgBurn / CDBurnerXP
  • Not sure about this one, hardware virtualisation is fine for me on Win7 with VirtualBox
  • QT TabBar
  • SSD :laugh:

So you install 6 programs just to have what the OS comes incorporated with. Second thought, i never trusted these 3rd party explorer customizations as i only had crashes with them. If you hate the metro interface you can make it 7 like with a single program instead of making win7 8 like with 6 and still missing out on the performance optimizations. A few "months" ago enthusiasts still used xp for benches and now there is a fuss that 8 cant be used for that. The age of overclocking seems to be over with companies limiting down options in both software and hardware. Its only AMD pushing in the race of higher clocks. The majority of users wont be affected and those 1000 who are affected mostly run on 7 stripped from useless things anyways.
However i would like a Microsoft response to the situation as well as some proof that AMD is also affected by this, its not just Haswell/Ivy energy optimizations acting up with this new RTC.
Posted on Reply
#9
Fourstaff
by: Roph
  • TeraCopy
  • Prio
  • WinCDEmu & ImgBurn / CDBurnerXP
  • Not sure about this one, hardware virtualisation is fine for me on Win7 with VirtualBox
  • QT TabBar
  • SSD :laugh:

-> Built in is a lot more convenient and less prone to conflicts
-> with SSD Win8 boots even faster
Posted on Reply
#10
Nabarun
Just a thought...

It takes hours to install a typical windows, drivers, software, apps, customization, configuring (3rd party of course) security (antivirus, firewall, HIPS, sandbox, etc)...

A typical Ubuntu (even Solaris 11)) can be run from the CD itself. And when installed, it's pretty much inclusive of everything. And takes less resource, MUCH better security. Definitely better for everyday tasks, and now even gaming - Steam.
Posted on Reply
#11
marsey99
love all the people saying who cares, funny how they are also not on hwbot....
Posted on Reply
#12
Fourstaff
by: Nabarun
Just a thought...

It takes hours to install a typical windows, drivers, software, apps, customization, configuring (3rd party of course) security (antivirus, firewall, HIPS, sandbox, etc)...

A typical Ubuntu (even Solaris 11)) can be run from the CD itself. And when installed, it's pretty much inclusive of everything. And takes less resource, MUCH better security. Definitely better for everyday tasks, and now even gaming - Steam.
I installed my current 3570K a few days ago, managed to get everything inside (including drivers and common apps) under an hour, and that is with a crappy USB stick installing into a 5400rpm drive god knows how old. Not sure where what point you are trying to make.
Posted on Reply
#13
Frick
Fishfaced Nincompoop
by: Nabarun
Just a thought...

It takes hours to install a typical windows, drivers, software, apps, customization, configuring (3rd party of course) security (antivirus, firewall, HIPS, sandbox, etc)...

A typical Ubuntu (even Solaris 11)) can be run from the CD itself. And when installed, it's pretty much inclusive of everything. And takes less resource, MUCH better security. Definitely better for everyday tasks, and now even gaming - Steam.
How the hell do you do things? Install from a USB stick and you're flying in under 30 minutes. 3rd party programs take time (especially if you're a professional/power user), but that is no different in Linux. It probably takes longer as you have to deal with more or less clunky packet managers and you are likely to have to do things on your own, update the packet indexes and some programs will require you to compile by your self. Not to mention if you happen to have a WLAN-adapter or other hardware that needs proprietary drivers that only partly exists for your distro.

It's not even much more secure these days, unless you're counting security through obscurity.
Posted on Reply
#14
Nabarun
To be honest, my rig is a bit old. But having installed dozens of different operating systems hundreds of times over for the last decade, I have yet to see a windows version which comes packed with even a fraction of what linux does in a cd. Unless you're talking about some super-slipstreamed image in a ~64GB superfast usb stick, I don't know how to do all that in 30 min :(
Posted on Reply
#15
Solidstate89
by: Nabarun
Just a thought...

It takes hours to install a typical windows, drivers, software, apps, customization, configuring (3rd party of course) security (antivirus, firewall, HIPS, sandbox, etc)...

A typical Ubuntu (even Solaris 11)) can be run from the CD itself. And when installed, it's pretty much inclusive of everything. And takes less resource, MUCH better security. Definitely better for everyday tasks, and now even gaming - Steam.
Your thought sucks. Unbuntu isn't any faster to set up for a power user than Windows is. You still have to install all of your third party applications (hence, why they're called third party), you have to customize them to your liking, set all of the OS options just how you like it. Oh, and LOL at it being "better" for gaming. What crack pipe have you been smoking?
Posted on Reply
#16
Frick
Fishfaced Nincompoop
by: Nabarun
To be honest, my rig is a bit old. But having installed dozens of different operating systems hundreds of times over for the last decade, I have yet to see a windows version which comes packed with even a fraction of what linux does in a cd. Unless you're talking about some super-slipstreamed image in a ~64GB superfast usb stick, I don't know how to do all that in 30 min :(
That debends on what you need, but for me it's Windows -> AV -> Drivers -> Firefox -> Some PDF reader (does that come included in Win8 BTW?) -> media codecs. Adding Office 2007 might bump it up a bit, but I can use the computer in the meantime. Obviously if you need IDE's, virtual machines, sandboxes, various servers (all of which require configuration) and have 100 games in Steam you have to install it'll take hours no matter the OS.
Posted on Reply
#17
Mathragh
by: Frick
(does that come included in Win8 BTW?)
Only a metro(modern UI) app for reading PDF's, which it defaults to when you dont install the reader yourself.

Works fine, has support for most things a non-poweruser would need like printing, but its obviously still a metro(modern UI) app, so fullscreen-ish and minimalistic.
Posted on Reply
#18
Nabarun
by: Solidstate89
Your thought sucks. Unbuntu isn't any faster to set up for a power user than Windows is. You still have to install all of your third party applications (hence, why they're called third party), you have to customize them to your liking, set all of the OS options just how you like it. Oh, and LOL at it being "better" for gaming. What crack pipe have you been smoking?
Of course it takes time to fully customize any os. What I am saying is that most linux distros come packed with drivers and apps better than any windows ever has. And about gaming - I said it's getting there...
Posted on Reply
#19
d1nky
windows8 seems to affect overclockability and reduces scores on some tests like 3d11 physics etc.

the majority of people that bench use win7 anyway as it can be stripped down to near nothing and you can boot/bench on overclocks you wouldn't be able too on win8.


the problem is only for dx11 apps where fps gets calculated differently.

I bet over time there will have to be a transfer or change to this, but its a good step of hwbot banning the platform atm
Posted on Reply
#20
Fourstaff
by: Nabarun
most linux distros come packed with drivers and apps better than any windows ever has
My experience tells me otherwise, but then again I don't use Linux as my main computer (and certainly not the hardcore versions, only touched ubuntu).
Posted on Reply
#21
Frick
Fishfaced Nincompoop
by: Nabarun
Of course it takes time to fully customize any os. What I am saying is that most linux distros come packed with drivers and apps better than any windows ever has. And about gaming - I said it's getting there...
Historically it's been the opposite, and these days Linux is more hit and miss in my experience. Generally it works "fine", but not as fine as in Windows. The program bit can be true, it's all about which distro you pick.
Posted on Reply
#22
Nabarun
by: Fourstaff
My experience tells me otherwise, but then again I don't use Linux as my main computer (and certainly not the hardcore versions, only touched ubuntu).
Try the latest CentOS DVD.
Posted on Reply
#23
Solidstate89
by: Nabarun
Of course it takes time to fully customize any os. What I am saying is that most linux distros come packed with drivers and apps better than any windows ever has. And about gaming - I said it's getting there...
It really doesn't. I'll give you default driver support, but I prefer Windows' method of downloading them dynamically instead of having support for ALL of them ALL of the time.

But it doesn't come packed with any more applications. It comes pre-installed with all of the same basic software utilities as Windows - just different.
Posted on Reply
#24
Nabarun
by: Frick
Historically it's been the opposite, and these days Linux is more hit and miss in my experience. Generally it works "fine", but not as fine as in Windows. The program bit can be true, it's all about which distro you pick.
I think Linux works better than windows in most things. There's room for improvement, though. Gaming and multimedia is where windows is ahead. But that's changing, albeit slowly, because of the sheer number of distros and hw manufacturers' inability to provide drivers.
Posted on Reply
#25
AthlonX2
HyperVtXâ„¢
by: Nabarun
Of course it takes time to fully customize any os. What I am saying is that most linux distros come packed with drivers and apps better than any windows ever has. And about gaming - I said it's getting there...
Im sure Microsoft would love to pack Windows with apps,but everytime they do manage to sneak one in they get sued for forcing it upon users.:shadedshu
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