Tuesday, March 4th 2014

AMD Chases Crucial $279 Price Point with Radeon R9 280

AMD's Radeon R9 200 series appears to have come a full circle with the company launching the Radeon R9 280, to capture the crucial US $279.99 price point, going against NVIDIA's GeForce GTX 760. The R9 280 isn't too different from the Radeon HD 7950 from the previous generation, featuring higher clock speeds, and PowerTune with boost. Based on the 28 nm "Tahiti" silicon, the R9 280 features 1,792 Graphics CoreNext stream processors, 112 TMUs, 32 ROPs, and a 384-bit wide GDDR5 memory interface, holding 3 GB of memory. The card features clock speeds of 827 MHz core, 933 MHz boost, and 5.00 GHz memory. The R9 280 is rated with the same 250W average board power as the R9 280X. AMD add-in board (AIB) partners have launched custom-design boards, including ones that feature factory overclocked speeds.
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40 Comments on AMD Chases Crucial $279 Price Point with Radeon R9 280

#1
Dj-ElectriC
I cannot remember a time in my life where in-shelf hardware (especially an enthusiast's) had no progress in 28 months (technology and price wise)

Disgraceful.
Posted on Reply
#2
marsey99
by: Dj-ElectriC
I cannot remember a time in my life where in-shelf hardware (especially an enthusaiest's) had no progress in 28 months (technology and price wise)

Disgraceful.
8800gt
8800gts
9600gt
9800gt
9800gtx
9800gtx+
gtx250

1 core, 3 generations of cards.

nothing new.

at least this has only been rebranded once.

stick around long enough and you will see it happen again too.
Posted on Reply
#3
FX-GMC
by: marsey99
8800gt
8800gts
9600gt
9800gt
9800gtx
9800gtx+
gtx250

1 core, 3 generations of cards.

nothing new.

at least this has only been rebranded once.

stick around long enough and you will see it happen again too.
Mobile GCN has had 2 rebrands now.

7970m
8970m
R9 290m
Posted on Reply
#4
Ed_1
Yes, wait till they get to 20nm or below, will be waiting even longer then ,smaller you go tougher it is .
GPU are complicated chips .
Posted on Reply
#5
xorbe
The 760 has been as cheap as $199, and typically $249. How is $279/250W going to compete with a 170W card.
Posted on Reply
#6
Sempron Guy
I wish they made a tweak on the power consumption.
Posted on Reply
#7
Deadlyraver
I can't wait to be able to get this. My future build will be happy with it.
Posted on Reply
#8
marsey99
by: FX-GMC
Mobile GCN has had 2 rebrands now.

7970m
8970m
R9 290m
well yea, but they always have been, i could add half a dozen more mobile cores which were also based on the g92 core to that list you quoted too but as we are not talking about mobile gpu i did not see the point.

still not sure on it now either....
Posted on Reply
#9
JDG1980
by: xorbe
The 760 has been as cheap as $199, and typically $249. How is $279/250W going to compete with a 170W card.
It'll compete because if it really does sell for $279 (it won't - more like $350+), miners will be lining up around the block to shove as many as they can in their shopping carts.
Posted on Reply
#10
JDG1980
by: Deadlyraver
I can't wait to be able to get this. My future build will be happy with it.
If you live in the US, expect to pay at least $50 over MSRP.
Posted on Reply
#11
Dj-ElectriC
by: marsey99
8800gt
8800gts
9600gt
9800gt
9800gtx
9800gtx+
gtx250

1 core, 3 generations of cards.

nothing new.

at least this has only been rebranded once.

stick around long enough and you will see it happen again too.
Yeah... you didn't got me. At all.

Prices have dramatically changed, you could buy an HD5850 by the time 8800GT was only 2 years old for the same launch MSRP

You mentioned 9600GT there, it's like mentioning the GTX 660 Ti and GTX 680 has the same core.


Again, read it carefully,
"I cannot remember a time in my life where in-shelf hardware (especially an enthusiast's) had no progress in 28 months (technology and price wise)"
Posted on Reply
#12
Slomo4shO
by: Dj-ElectriC
Yeah... you didn't got me. At all.

Prices have dramatically changed, you could buy an HD5850 by the time 8800GT was only 2 years old for the same launch MSRP
Umm... last I checked, the HD 7950 originally launched for $449...
Posted on Reply
#13
Dj-ElectriC
It didn't take a long time for the HD 7950 to drop to a sub 300$ price tag. That happened, about a year ago.

A year later, wa'ddayou know, The same card is being rebranded for 280$.

That's just sad. That's all.
Posted on Reply
#14
MGF Derp
The sad part is that pre R series launch the 7950 could be had for as low as $200 new. Now it comes out at base $280 what?? At least the re-branded 7970 relaunched at a price point below what it was selling for pre R series launch.
Posted on Reply
#15
FX-GMC
by: marsey99
well yea, but they always have been, i could add half a dozen more mobile cores which were also based on the g92 core to that list you quoted too but as we are not talking about mobile gpu i did not see the point.

still not sure on it now either....
And the point of your post was? I was adding examples of stagnated technology going through rebrands with no change in price.
Posted on Reply
#16
Casecutter
Nice that TSMC still gets a few chips from the wafers that don't meet the full-fledge Tahiti spec. It seems to take a while to get a bin of geldings together.

As to the segment movement, it’s been so stretched-out to realize the node-shrink, at this point I’d almost say we might see Nvidia go again with a Maxwell on 28Nm in this mid-range market. Nvidia is just darn fortunate AMD is overwhelmed by the mining influx, cause I’d say they’d have a hard time selling GK104’s much lower. Just like the GK106 that gave the impression Nvidia didn’t find it lucrative at much below $150; I don’t think Nvidia could be viable on a GTX760 much below $220. Fortunately for Nvidia they don’t need to test those waters… If mining had not turn the market on its head what type of battle might be actually playing out right now?

If TSMC doesn’t start verbalizing they will be providing excellent commercial viability on 20Nm by mid-summer, I might say Nvidia could launching another Maxwell on 28Nm to blow this $200-300 segment open. Nvidia wants some of the Litecoin money, and as Hash/watt is so great with Maxwell they’re at a tipping point. Wait around for worthwhileness of 20Nm, which really only brings real significance in the high-end enthusiast parts. Especially when neither (Nvidia/AMD) want a repeat of TSMC ramp-up like the 28Nm again. If Nvidia could deliver a Maxwell that bests a GTX760 on a ≤ 220 mm² die, 130W, and hash that provides what this R9 280 provides, I’d say Nvidia has to do it.
Posted on Reply
#17
Casecutter
by: xorbe
The 760 has been as cheap as $199, and typically $249. How is $279/250W going to compete with a 170W card.
I can't say I’ve seen a GXT760 any point of late below $210 (for any meaningful time), at best is like $229 –AR.

Someone is mistaken... the TPU database shows the 7950 Boost as a 200W card, can't see those clocks kicking it up that much more. In W1zzard June 25th review of the reference GTX760 was bested 8% perf/watt by a standard 7950 by, while the GTX760 MSI Gaming was able to match the standard 7950.

The question is can AMD be viable on a 352mm die any more than Nvidia on 294mm? The thing is AMD can sell them at a whole new profit schedule, as the OEM’s are clamoring for stuff to sell. So I’d say the chance you see any of these in other than in the USA where the Litecoin is still making every AMD price “stupid crazy” is nil.
Posted on Reply
#18
GLD
Yea! Thanks to the cyber miners, this will be a $450 to $500 card when the retailers get them for sale. BOOH!
Posted on Reply
#19
marsey99
by: FX-GMC
And the point of your post was? I was adding examples of stagnated technology going through rebrands with no change in price.
mobile parts and desktop parts have the same price?

i dont even......

triC the 88gts was 220, the 98gtx was 240 the 98gtx+ was 240 and the 250 was 180 in gbp at launch on the shelves. those prices went up at times with demand too.

that was across 2 and a bit years too. but they was also sold as the top core cards for 2 years series. at least amd have knocked it down the range and released a new core at the top of the tree this time.

but to play devils advocate why would amd need to when the 7k cards had the 600s beat once they fixed the drivers?

much like nvidia was able to sit on the same card while ati took 2 goes at it with the 3k and 4k cards.

everything goes in cycles, just need to look back long enough to see them.
Posted on Reply
#20
FX-GMC
by: marsey99
mobile parts and desktop parts have the same price?

i dont even......

triC the 88gts was 220, the 98gtx was 240 the 98gtx+ was 240 and the 250 was 180 in gbp at launch on the shelves. those prices went up at times with demand too.

that was across 2 and a bit years too. but they was also sold as the top core cards for 2 years series. at least amd have knocked it down the range and released a new core at the top of the tree this time.

but to play devils advocate why would amd need to when the 7k cards had the 600s beat once they fixed the drivers?

much like nvidia was able to sit on the same card while ati took 2 goes at it with the 3k and 4k cards.

everything goes in cycles, just need to look back long enough to see them.
PLEASE tell me where I say mobile and desktop parts have the same price. I'll wait.... Oh you can't, because I didn't say it.

Laptops with a R9 290m are not any cheaper than they were the chips were called 7970m. Do you understand? I don't think I can dumb it down anymore for you. :shadedshu:

I don't even.....
Posted on Reply
#21
Casecutter
Just have to say this will again hardly matter to "gamers" it's a drip in a dry desert... And where the R6 265 that was supposed to be in the channel as of March?
Posted on Reply
#22
marsey99
by: FX-GMC
PLEASE tell me where I say mobile and desktop parts have the same price. I'll wait.... Oh you can't, because I didn't say it.

Laptops with a R9 290m are not any cheaper than they were the chips were called 7970m. Do you understand? I don't think I can dumb it down anymore for you. :shadedshu:

I don't even.....
by: FX-GMC
And the point of your post was? I was adding examples of stagnated technology going through rebrands with no change in price.
you was adding mobile parts to a list of desktop parts are using price as the justification?

if you was using it to illustrate the stagnation of the mobile market at times when the desktop cards are too then it is like pointing out the sky is blue and rain is wet.

of course they are, one follows the other...don't worry about dumbing it down, you started dumb enough.
Posted on Reply
#23
FX-GMC
by: marsey99
you was adding mobile parts to a list of desktop parts are using price as the justification?

if you was using it to illustrate the stagnation of the mobile market at times when the desktop cards are too then it is like pointing out the sky is blue and rain is wet.

of course they are, one follows the other...don't worry about dumbing it down, you started dumb enough.
I'm glad you've shown your true colors. I was simply trying to add to your point, but all you can do is be an asshole. Good job.
Posted on Reply
#24
RCoon
Gaming Moderator
by: Casecutter
Just have to say this will again hardly matter to "gamers" it's a drip in a dry desert
Pretty much this. How many enthusiasts give a damn about AMD chasing some obscure price point that they see as some kind of sweet spot? Most if not all are either only looking at high end hardware (Your 780, 780ti, 290 and 290X), or they already have 7970's, 7950's and 680's, which are essentially what all this crap is. Everyone else will buy the super low end cards for HTPC systems, or the best price/performance cards available within their budget range, which for some reason seems to be the 760 atm (this is just an observation, I see a lot of people recommending these as mid range cards for those that can't quite reach the high end area).

This is nothing that hasn't happened before, and most enthusiasts won't ever buy them anyway. There is no doubt better cards at better price points.
Posted on Reply
#25
alwayssts
by: Casecutter

If TSMC doesn’t start verbalizing they will be providing excellent commercial viability on 20Nm by mid-summer, I might say Nvidia could launching another Maxwell on 28Nm to blow this $200-300 segment open. Nvidia wants some of the Litecoin money, and as Hash/watt is so great with Maxwell they’re at a tipping point. Wait around for worthwhileness of 20Nm, which really only brings real significance in the high-end enthusiast parts. Especially when neither (Nvidia/AMD) want a repeat of TSMC ramp-up like the 28Nm again. If Nvidia could deliver a Maxwell that bests a GTX760 on a ≤ 220 mm² die, 130W, and hash that provides what this R9 280 provides, I’d say Nvidia has to do it.
Except all indications seem to point to late q3 to q4, regardless of what tsmc says. Be that a year from the launch of Hawaii, six months or so from this onslaught of refresh parts, the fact amd publicly stated they were taping out chips this quarter, that nvidia said the rest of maxwell was coming later this year, and that the public cost per transistor maps (that has been floating around for years) all pretty much point to exactly that. To be literal to their respective histories on the ramp/price-per-xtor it would suggest late q3 for amd and late q4 for nvidia, but both may end up around the same time.

On top of that, what you're asking for doesn't make sense. Maxwell is clearly based around 6smm and 2mb cache blocks. 750ti is essentially half of what a 8800gt was in a lower market...1 less smm released earlier on a larger process to compensate for the power increase (20% in power from logic + whatever clockspeed increases 20nm gives with such more logic in the same power envelope; probably around 1200mhz to 750ti's ~1150 for a complete difference of around 20-25%) while simultaneously working as class-leading <75w part. What you're asking for is essentially a part that is less than 2x gm107, which really doesn't make sense on 28nm short of something really weird like a low-clocked 9smm part with 24 ROPs/3mb cache on a 192-bit bus, which I doubt we see.

On the flipside, what do you expect of a higher-up part on 28nm? If you're expecting die savings compared to gk104, I think you will be sadly mistaken. The arch again is catered towards the higher logic use of 20nm (ex: the extra cache) while using less power for similar to slightly higher core clocks (rather than scaling to higher clocks with more voltage and less logic like most processes before it) and conceivably smaller/slower mem controllers to keep power down, which will become more-so apparent as they move to larger designs. In short, a 12smm part (the only one that makes sense versus gk104) would be faster per clock than gk104, probably larger (depending on cache + more units vs mem controller size offset), but proportionally use less power because of design efficiency/slower memory speed/bus. While I suppose it's possible they could keep such a design under 225w on 28nm, and it would be good for us, it would probably be bad for nvidia's bottom line (a wholly new design for what amounts to a small improvement).

That all said, when it comes to this 280...the price is indeed a shame compared to old product prices, but also reflective of the situation: the yields are good and the cost savings are already passed on to 280x (at least at msrp). The price difference is pretty much directly proportional to real avg shader perf per clock and memory speed differences....meaning at least these will probably clock decently and similar to 280x (as opposed to 7950 which was power/clock limited) so it should be able to wiggle a decent spot between 760 and 770 if priced accordingly.
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