RavenasThis sums up your ignorance, and I won't continue to argue with someone who pushes false ideas and believes what he/she wants to believe. Lol I would love to take some pictures for you of side by side TVs, but I just don't think that would do you justice.

In reality all you are arguing is opinion.

:laugh::laugh:

you *still* haven't shown that anything I have said is wrong.. and then you accuse ME of only citing opinion :laugh:

Truly pathetic :laugh:

As I said, your reading comprehension skills are appalling. Read this slowly. I've even put extra spaces between the lines for you to comprehend the words.

I am not saying there is no difference.

I *am* saying that:

for an AVERAGE consumer (i.e. not you, me or anyone else "tecchie" on this forum)

on an average size TV (around 40 inches)

at an AVERAGE distance of 10-15 feet

the difference is not significant.

As the guy before you said - joe schmo can't tell the difference. And joe schmo is the one who outnumbers us all hundreds to one.

And of course, one massive piece of irony being that you agreed with the guy who said EXACTLY THE SAME AS ME.
His words:

sure joe schmo can't tell

and

the people that say it looks no better probably sit 15ft back from there 40" 1st gen LCD sets that only do 720P nothing will look any different on those

ZOMG ISNT THIS EXACTLY WHAT I HAVE BEEN SAYING ALL ALONG??!?!

DavidelmoConsumers do NOT care about capacity.. it isn't a selling point by itself.

Consumers do care about capacity when it comes to the future of burning music and video on blu-rays. Capacity is a key issue of DVD-9 and Blu-Ray blanks.

I really don't know what makes you people believe that consumers don't care about capacity.

Davidelmo:laugh::laugh:

you *still* haven't shown that anything I have said is wrong.. and then you accuse ME of only citing opinion :laugh:

Truly pathetic :laugh:

As I said, your reading comprehension skills are appalling. Read this slowly. I've even put extra spaces between the lines for you to comprehend the words.

I am not saying there is no difference.

I *am* saying that:

for an AVERAGE consumer (i.e. not you, me or anyone else "tecchie" on this forum)

on an average size TV (around 40 inches)

at an AVERAGE distance of 10-15 feet

the difference is not significant.

As the guy before you said - joe schmo can't tell the difference. And joe schmo is the one who outnumbers us all hundreds to one.

And of course, one massive piece of irony being that you agreed with the guy who said EXACTLY THE SAME AS ME.
His words:

and


ZOMG ISNT THIS EXACTLY WHAT I HAVE BEEN SAYING ALL ALONG??!?!

Joe Shomo can tell the difference. That's why my parents and grandparents and one of my aunt/uncles has HDTV, it's a matter of time. You simply expect things to happen over night.

Like I said before I'm not going to argue with you because it would be like arguing with a brick wall.

RavenasConsumers do care about capacity when it comes to the future of burning music and video on blu-rays. Capacity is a key issue of DVD-9 and Blu-Ray blanks.

I really don't know what makes you people believe that consumers don't care about capacity.

So you've now changed from add-ons for the 360, to HD movies and now onto burning movies onto bluray?

Where do you want to take this argument next?

This thread was about an add-on for the 360 - which would be for watching movies only. Not games. Not burning music or video.

Irrelevant. I'm not arguing against BR as a format - only as a 360 addon.

RavenasJoe Shomo can tell the difference. That's why my parents and grandparents and one of my aunt/uncles has HDTV, it's a matter of time. You simply expect things to happen over night.

Like I said before I'm not going to argue with you because it would be like arguing with a brick wall.

Yet you counter my opinion with.... your opinion

:rolleyes:

Convenient tactic - say i haven't done research, then when I provide evidence, you call it opinion then refuse to listen to everything else.

DavidelmoSo you've now changed from add-ons for the 360, to HD movies and now onto burning movies onto bluray?

Where do you want to take this argument next?

This thread was about an add-on for the 360 - which would be for watching movies only. Not games. Not burning music or video.

Irrelevant. I'm not arguing against BR as a format - only as a 360 addon.

I brought the subject up simply because people started putting others down for caring about storage capacity. Easily relevant to the subject at hand, especially if those blank discs were given data that could be directly played through the 360 addon.

aren't most ps3 games using blu ray and are way bigger in size then standard ps2 dvds?

Davidelmo:laugh::laugh:

you *still* haven't shown that anything I have said is wrong.. and then you accuse ME of only citing opinion :laugh:

Truly pathetic :laugh:

As I said, your reading comprehension skills are appalling. Read this slowly. I've even put extra spaces between the lines for you to comprehend the words.

I am not saying there is no difference.

I *am* saying that:

for an AVERAGE consumer (i.e. not you, me or anyone else "tecchie" on this forum)

on an average size TV (around 40 inches)

at an AVERAGE distance of 10-15 feet

the difference is not significant.

As the guy before you said - joe schmo can't tell the difference. And joe schmo is the one who outnumbers us all hundreds to one.

And of course, one massive piece of irony being that you agreed with the guy who said EXACTLY THE SAME AS ME.
His words:

cdawallsure joe schmo can't tell

and

cdawallthe people that say it looks no better probably sit 15ft back from there 40" 1st gen LCD sets that only do 720P :roll: nothing will look any different on those

ZOMG ISNT THIS EXACTLY WHAT I HAVE BEEN SAYING ALL ALONG??!?!

i wasn't arguing with you?

DavidelmoYet you counter my opinion with.... your opinion

:rolleyes:

Convenient tactic - say i haven't done research, then when I provide evidence, you call it opinion then refuse to listen to everything else.

It is your opinion, simply because to me you (just an assumption) you don't own a 1080p quality HDTV nor a blu-ray player...Of course that's just assuming. I could be wrong.

panchomanaren't most ps3 games using blu ray and are way bigger in size then standard ps2 dvds?

Yes, a current gen game such as MGS4 is said to take up 50GB of space on one dual layer blu-ray disc.

RavenasJoe Shomo can tell the difference. That's why my parents and grandparents and one of my aunt/uncles has HDTV, it's a matter of time. You simply expect things to happen over night.

Like I said before I'm not going to argue with you because it would be like arguing with a brick wall.

And as you conveniently ignored before, the guy you agreed with actually agrees with me!

the people that say it looks no better probably sit 15ft back from there 40" 1st gen LCD sets that only do 720P nothing will look any different on those

Average TV size (from Nov 07):
hdtvorg.co.uk/news/articles/2007112001.htm
= between 32 and 37 inches

Let's be generous and say it is now 40 inches.

And the picture I posted earlier agrees with me:

The original site it came from:
www.hdtvuk.tv/2006/12/ideal_viewing_d.html

Based on the resolving ability of the human eye (with 20/20 vision it is possible to resolve 1/60th of a degree of an arc), it is possible to estimate when the differences between resolutions will become apparent.

Also features on several audio/video forums, computer forums and an On an HDTV buying guide: schoolofhdtv.com/index.php?/HDTV/Tutorials/HDTV-Buying-Guide

Guess it's all just opinion, eh? :roll:

cdawalli wasn't arguing with you?

I know you're not! You would have known I wasn't arguing with you either, if you'd read what i wrote!

However, the other guy is, yet he agreed with you when you said exactly the same thing I did.

DavidelmoI know you're not! You would have known I wasn't arguing with you either, if you'd read what i wrote!

However, the other guy is, yet he agreed with you when you said exactly the same thing I did.

haha yea i saw that it made me laugh

RavenasI brought the subject up simply because people started putting others down for caring about storage capacity. Easily relevant to the subject at hand, especially if those blank discs were given data that could be directly played through the 360 addon.

Never going to happen.

Look, MS wouldn't let the GTAIV developers make a hard drive install option because not all 360 owners have hard drives.

They sure as hell aren't going to require you to have an add-on Bluray drive. What would be the point in releasing a game for Bluray when only a handful of people would be able to play it?

guys just a word of caution, its great to have an intellectual and heated debate.. but lets not make this personal and lets be receptive and respective towards facts and other people's opinions and thoughts.

cdawallhaha yea i saw that it made me laugh

:toast:

Funny now I'm getting words put in my mouth. Not everything CDA wall said was in your terms or in agreement with you. I was agreeing with the fact that there is a difference between 1080p and 1080i although many will argue this point to hells end.

The average joe can tell the difference if they were actually presented with the correct information.

EDIT: The problem with the average joe is they are shopping at best-buy/wal-mart and the people telling them about the product (at least the majority) don't know their facts. They then spread false information to the consumer.

RavenasFunny now I'm getting words put in my mouth. Not everything CDA wall said was in your terms or in agreement with you. I was agreeing with the fact that there is a difference between 1080p and 1080i although many will argue this point to hells end.

The average joe can tell the difference if they were actually presented with the correct information.

Okay that's fair enough, but I'd argue that if the difference is clear then you shouldn't need to give someone the correct information in the first place.

If you have to actually point out "look at the pixels", "look at how you can see this edge is smoother" etc, then I wouldn't count that as a clear and obvious difference.

As TVs get bigger then Bluray probably will increase in popularity. My only point (going back to my first 1-2 posts in this thread) was that bluray isn't exactly taking off at rocket speed. Therefore MS aren't in any desperate hurry to jump on the bandwagon. That, and the fact that they should focus more on their hardware reliability and on bringing more quality games to the console.

There's nothing more retarded than being a fanboy of ANYTHING. Competition is GOOD. If PS3 went away tomorrow, microsoft would have 100% share of the next gen games market (not counting the Wii because it isn't getting "net gen" games as such - I mean GTAIV, Mass Effect, MGS4 etc)

If 360 went away tomorrow, Sony would have full control. That isn't good for anybody, so as far as I'm concerned Sony and MS can battle each other as much as they want because in the end it's a win-win for all of us.

DavidelmoAre you imagining things? Where did anyone say that?

people around here...

No, you don't. You care about what you get on the disk - i.e. better textures, higher quality video etc. Would it matter if somebody released a 1 Mb disk with incredible compression and could hold 50hrs of HD video? Consumers do NOT care about capacity.. it isn't a selling point by itself.

so now you know what I care and don't care about? guess what? I'm not the "average consumer", OK. I can actully make rational buying decisions...

Nobody goes, "oh wow, this new bluray device has discs which store 50Gb... I MUST have one of those!!"

someone who uses alot of hard drive space, and needs to back up will find using 1 or 2 blu-ray disks way more conveinent than 10dvd's

And guess what? That description represents almost all people who have a TV.
You even admit it yourself - "sure joe schmo can't tell"
Guess what - joe schmo *IS* the average consumer. You can laugh all you want, but joe schmo is the one whose buying habits will force the market.

you could be my marketing teacher :rolleyes:

DavidelmoOkay that's fair enough, but I'd argue that if the difference is clear then you shouldn't need to give someone the correct information in the first place.

If you have to actually point out "look at the pixels", "look at how you can see this edge is smoother" etc, then I wouldn't count that as a clear and obvious difference.

As TVs get bigger then Bluray probably will increase in popularity. My only point (going back to my first 1-2 posts in this thread) was that bluray isn't exactly taking off at rocket speed. Therefore MS aren't in any desperate hurry to jump on the bandwagon. That, and the fact that they should focus more on their hardware reliability and on bringing more quality games to the console.

There's nothing more retarded than being a fanboy of ANYTHING. Competition is GOOD. If PS3 went away tomorrow, microsoft would have 100% share of the next gen games market (not counting the Wii because it isn't getting "net gen" games as such - I mean GTAIV, Mass Effect, MGS4 etc)

If 360 went away tomorrow, Sony would have full control. That isn't good for anybody, so as far as I'm concerned Sony and MS can battle each other as much as they want because in the end it's a win-win for all of us.

I AGREE WITH THIS. However, where do you stand on the HDDVD player add on?

HP_dudemanso now you know what I care and don't care about? guess what? I'm not the "average consumer", OK. I can actully make rational buying decisions...

Fair enough, but unfortunately microsoft aren't going to adopt a format to appease a small percentage of the population while possibly alienaing a vast majority of others.

someone who uses alot of hard drive space, and needs to back up will find using 1 or 2 blu-ray disks way more conveinent than 10dvd's

I agree (and didn't ever disagree), but that has nothing to do with an Xbox 360 addon. Capacity serves no benefit in itself for a 360 add on.

i was figuring this would be all about blu ray, not just limited to the xbox360..

sorry if any offence was taken...

RavenasI AGREE WITH THIS. However, where do you stand on the HDDVD player add on?

again... "meh" mostly

Didn't think it was a great idea, although it *was* cheap.

Like I said, I'd rather just play games on my games console :ohwell:

Davidelmoagain... "meh" mostly

Didn't think it was a great idea, although it *was* cheap.

Like I said, I'd rather just play games on my games console :ohwell:

Well I actually think you have a smart idea here. I think, and this is just opinion, that Sony should make a PS3 without a Blu-Ray player just to cater to your market. That's just my opinion.

I will say that when I bought my PS3 it wasn't for HD because at the time I didn't have a HDTV (now I do recently got a good government internship). So in a way, owning a Blu-Ray player influenced my HD decision. The main reason I bought my PS3 is because it was less proprietary than the previous Xbox I owned (and I'm not trying to be a fanboy here).

HP_dudemani was figuring this would be all about blu ray, not just limited to the xbox360..

sorry if any offence was taken...

lol, none at all