Tuesday, November 18th 2008

AMD Pits Dragon Against Spider, Expects Significant Performance Gains

"Spider" is the codename for a high-end desktop platform by AMD, which came to light late last year. It consisted of an AMD Phenom series processor, an AMD 790FX-based motherboard, and Radeon HD 3800-series graphics card(s). AMD would be offering a new high-end gaming platform based on its products, called "Dragon". It consists of a Phenom II processor, running on an AMD 790-series motherboard, and Radeon HD 4800-series graphics card(s). Expreview sourced a company-confidential side which illustrates the company's expectations from the platform, in terms of performance increments over its predecessor.

With office and productivity applications, AMD slates a 20~40% performance increment. The trend stays with multimedia applications. The gaming performance is where the money lies, with increments up to 280%. Again, take into account that the Dragon testbed is using a Radeon HD 4800 accelerator. 20~40% seems a significant figure, nonetheless.

Source: Expreview
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46 Comments on AMD Pits Dragon Against Spider, Expects Significant Performance Gains

#1
[I.R.A]_FBi
yummy, too bad this dish isnt for me
Posted on Reply
#2
niko084
Now that would be nice, but I'll wait for real benchs :)
Posted on Reply
#3
ShadowFold
I am dieing to hear some prices AMD. I already know its gonna be awesome :p
Posted on Reply
#4
DaMulta
My stars went supernova
HMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM

HMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm


They didn't say what games.
Posted on Reply
#5
btarunr
Editor & Senior Moderator
by: DaMulta
They didn't say what games.
Look at the x-axis. Crysis is in the list too.
Posted on Reply
#6
ShadowFold
by: DaMulta
HMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM

HMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm


They didn't say what games.
Says Call of Juarez, Company of Heroes, Lost Planet, Quake 4, Crysis and 3dmark(which isn't a game lol)
Posted on Reply
#7
DaMulta
My stars went supernova
Ok I'm sleepy.......


Hmmmm again.

I have heard rumors of this being THE CHIP way back, way back.

Hmmmmm again.
Posted on Reply
#8
DaMulta
My stars went supernova
See the NDA stamp. I wonder who leaked that, or has AMD released it yet?
Posted on Reply
#9

by: DaMulta
Ok I'm sleepy.......
LOL, you have been up to much watching i7 threads :laugh:
Posted on Edit | Reply
#10
Exavier
might build a phenom backup rig..hmm..
Posted on Reply
#11

by: Exavier
might build a phenom backup rig..hmm..
ahem .. ehh ... ehh. phenom II .. .. ehh ... cough cough ...
Posted on Edit | Reply
#13
btarunr
Editor & Senior Moderator
This platform gets there in those gaming performance charts all thanks to the Radeon HD 4800, it's still not established what Agena vs. Deneb in games is. The comparison becomes apparent in the productivity and multimedia charts, where the significance of the Radeon HD 4800 is lesser.
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#14
DaMulta
My stars went supernova
by: btarunr
This platform gets there in those gaming performance charts all thanks to the Radeon HD 4800, it's still not established what Agena vs. Deneb in games is. The comparison becomes apparent in the productivity and multimedia charts, where the significance of the Radeon HD 4800 is lesser.
They could be testing 8 GPUs on a dragon.

4 x2 cards.

790FX-based=4PCI-E slots.
Posted on Reply
#15
btarunr
Editor & Senior Moderator
That's impossible as of now. The drivers cannot make >4 ATI GPUs work in tandem, although you can install 4 R700 cards on one machine.
Posted on Reply
#16
DaMulta
My stars went supernova
by: btarunr
That's impossible as of now.
Why?

Why?


I guarantee you in the driver lab they have a button to turn it on with.

I bet 4 x2 cards will only work right( slow on other chipsets) on the AMD chipset, because they will know how to tune that right now.
Posted on Reply
#17
DaMulta
My stars went supernova
Then they get to work on drivers for the next cards that will have 4 GPU more or less per card.
Posted on Reply
#18
btarunr
Editor & Senior Moderator
by: DaMulta
Why?
It might not be as easy as we think. Creating mini-queues of 8 (!) frames to go in succession (in AFR) could be a very painful task, at least it would make the scene stutter to unpleasant levels. Making 4 HD 3870 cards do CFX itself gives you an idea how bad the problem of micro-stuttering is. It might not be as easy as replacing a "4" with an "8" somewhere in the drivers' source code.
Posted on Reply
#19
DaMulta
My stars went supernova
Chuck has said(on the INQ) they could of done it on day one with the 3870x2 cards.

When CF was made they used to run like 30 or so x800 cards for airforce flight simulators.


You know they are combining cores, and ATi always likes to keep ahead. Like moving to netframe works wayyyyy back.


I have talked with the driver guys, and more or less a lot of issues are political. Or a way to sell products. This was a few years ago, but it is the same people today.
When the 2900XT was released(that pic you seen me in)they were flashing 2900XT to run at 900Mhz stock, and they would all be stable. CRAZY



Saving the card of 8 GPU in CF would be a good card to hold on too.
Posted on Reply
#20
newbielives
The fact they are stating how they are beating themselves instead of how they are beating Intel's i7 could be a bad sign
Posted on Reply
#21
WarEagleAU
Bird of Prey
Looks like it may be somewhat living up to its hype. Benches dont tell everything but Im really liking the Denebs and dont mind waiting on them to come out.
Posted on Reply
#22
KBD
by: newbielives
The fact they are stating how they are beating themselves instead of how they are beating Intel's i7 could be a bad sign
i think you are missing the point, they are showing how much better the new platform is going to be compared to the old one. Corei7 was also compared to C2Q to show what improvent it has over the latter, this is perfectly normal. if 20-40% is in fact true its a good sign for AMD. Who knows Deneb may hold its own against C2Q.
Posted on Reply
#23
mdm-adph
by: newbielives
The fact they are stating how they are beating themselves instead of how they are beating Intel's i7 could be a bad sign
Not if the price is right. :D

I really have no problem with Intel chips being faster, as long as I can still get a good deal from AMD.
Posted on Reply
#24
DaMulta
My stars went supernova
by: newbielives
The fact they are stating how they are beating themselves instead of how they are beating Intel's i7 could be a bad sign
They could also not care what intel is doing. AMD is selling on electricity use.



One thing that we are overlooking at is this is just one piece of the NDA doc.

How long has the 790FX been out?


Here is a 4x4 working board that runs Phenom

AMD’s FASN8 (first AMD silicon next-gen 8-core)

With 4 x2 cards.

It would be a 8x8 system.


http://xtreview.com/addcomment-id-3362-view-ASUS-L1a64-WS.html
Here is the motherboard ASUS L1a64 WS, based on AMD RD790.

ASUS L1a64 WS
]http://xtreview.com/images/ASUS%20L1a64%20WS.jpg
This motherboard is equipped with two processor socket ( socket F+ ) for the installation of the promising four core processors phenom FX. Furthermore, there are four slots PCI express x16 (connected to the system bus PCI express x8), intended for four video card AMD. As it is expected, three video card will work in the regime triple crossfire and the fourth video card will be occupied by physical effects acceleration .

The future AMD chipset is characterized by a comparatively low heat emission. There is no high end cooling on the motherboard ASUS L1a64 WS .
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AMD_700_chipset_series
790FX

* Codenamed RD790, final name revealed to be "AMD 790FX chipset" [10]
* Dual-socket (Quad FX, Dual Socket Direct Connect (DSDC) Architecture) or single AMD processor configuration
* Maximum four physical PCI-E x16 slots and discrete PCI-E x4 slot [11], the chipset provides a total of 42 lanes solely in the Northbridge
* HyperTransport 3.0 with support for HTX slots [11] and PCI Express 2.0
* ATI CrossFire X
* AutoXpress
* AMD OverDrive
* Energy efficient Northbridge design
o 65 nm CMOS fabrication process manufactured by TSMC
* Extreme overclocking, reported to have achieved about 420 MHz bus for overclocking an Athlon 64 FX-62 processor [12], from originally 200 MHz.
* Optional discrete chipset cache memory of at least 16 KB to reduce the latencies and increase the bandwidth [11]
* Supports Dual Gigabit Ethernet, and teaming option [11]
* Reference board codenamed "Wahoo" [13] for dual-processor system reference design board with three physical PCI-E x16 slots, and "HammerHead" for single-socket system reference design board with four physical PCI-E x16 slots, also notable was the reference boards includes two ATA ports and only four SATA 3.0 Gbit/s ports (as being paired with SB600 southbridge).
* Will pair with SB750 southbridge with support up to six SATA ports and enhanced Phenom processors overclocking via ACC functionality, and will later support Socket AM3 with DDR3 SDRAM support in the first quarter of 2009.
* Enthusiast discrete multi-graphics segment
So who knows but AMD The Dragon could be a new revamped AM3 790FX dual CPU board, and would be out maybe around the time of skull trail.

8x8 would be very very sweet, and very very powerful.
Posted on Reply
#25
KBD
damulta, do you think 4x2 cards will be bottlenecked by the Phenom, even if its 2 Phenoms?
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