Making Crossfire Work and Optimization

[Dr. Spankenstein]

This thread was created to serve multiple functions:


1.)Create a “one-stop-shop” for all information/links/support for individuals having issues enabling Crossfire.

2.)Outline the specific steps required to correctly install Crossfire hardware/software.


3.)Provide documented proof that Crossfire does indeed work within Crysis (in XP & Vista).


None of these discoveries can be claimed as my own. This is merely a compendium of information that has been widely available for some time. It seems (from the sheer number of people having issues enabling Crossfire) that these discoveries were either ignored as false information or were not implemented correctly by the user.

What follows are the steps for receiving those extra frames for which you paid a premium. Ready? Let’s go!

Starting with the basics, make sure that your motherboard is Crossfire capable. Check to see if your chipset drivers are up to date.
Another consideration is the particular chipset you are running. This will determine the bandwidth (number of lanes) of your PCI-E slots.

Common layouts are as follows:

16x + 4x Example chipsets: 690 & 790, P935 & P35

8x + 8x Example chipsets: 480X & 790GX, 975X

16x + 16x Example chipsets: 580X & 790FX, X38 & X48

With the exception of the newest chipsets that provide 16x + 16x PCI-e, it is has been shown that when you pair the latest generation of ATI cards with Intel chipsets that 8x + 8x is preferable to 16x + 4x. Example of 975X vs. P35 with 2900 (http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=2990). The disparity in performance appears to grow when you move to the 3800 series.

A current version of DirectX (http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?FamilyId=2DA43D38-DB71-4C1B-BC6A-9B6652CD92A3&displaylang=en) never hurts either.

*Vista Users: UPDATE*

I wanted this thread to be a resource, so I'm adding what seem to be essential Hotfixes for Crossfire.

Two are available for download:

KB940105 (http://support.microsoft.com/kb/940105)-Pertains to Virtual Address space/Memory usages.

KB936710 (http://support.microsoft.com/kb/936710)-For Multi-GPU scenarios.

The third is available only by submitting a "Request Form".

KB945149 (http://support.microsoft.com/kb/945149)-Addresses how the DMA (Direct Memory Acess) packet schedules work to the LDA (Linked Display Adapter).


Plus check and see if you have Performance and Reliability updates KB938194 & KB938979 (http://www.mydigitallife.info/2007/08/14/download-kb938194-and-kb938979-vista-updates-with-no-wga-validation/)




On to the goods… the first point of reference was the ParkOz (http://translate.google.com/translate?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.parkoz.com%2Fzboard%2 Fview.php%3Fid%3Dtech_ati%26page%3D1%26sn1%3D%26di vpage%3D1%26sn%3Doff%26ss%3Don%26sc%3Doff%26select _arrange%3Dheadnum%26desc%3Dasc%26no%3D983&langpair=ko%7Cen&hl=en&ie=UTF-8) . This is my culmination of their findings. (Vista users can replace Steps 7 & 8 with a plain boot and power down. Vista will install the driver on the second card automatically.

1.) Start by removing the drivers first with the ATI Uninstall Utility via the Add/Remove Programs of the Control Panel.
2.) Then uninstall the current Display Adapter(s) via the Device Manager.
3.) Power down and remove second card (if applicable).
4.) Boot into “Safe Mode” and use Driver Cleaner Pro to remove misc. drivers & registry entries. Follow up by using “Search” in the “All Files and Folders” with “ATI” as the search criteria for “All or part of the file name”. This will help clear any stragglers.
5.) Boot normally and install Catalyst flavor of choice.
6.) Power down and install second card (do not install Crossfire bridge at this point!).
7.) Boot and CANCEL out of Hadware Installation Wizard.
8.) Find second card in Device Manager (the Display Adapter with the yellow triangle) and right-click to “Update driver”. Use specific location and browse to original Catalyst install folder. (Normally C:/ATI/SUPPORT/8. xxxxxxx.xxx/DRIVER/(select folder based on current OS). This should install the driver on second card.
9.) Power down and install Crossfire bridge.
10.) Copy the folder provided at the bottom of this post into your Crysis directory: Electronic Arts>Crytek>Crysis>Game and replace/overwrite everything.(Make a backup of your original, just in case!) It is just the entire "Config" folder from the Crysis SP Demo. Use you own copy if you feel more comfortable.
11.) (Tech)Power up, open Catalyst Control Center to “Enable Crossfire” and ENJOY!

11 easy steps to smooth gaming!







Now for the results. All Benches were run at the same settings (High) on a patched retail version of Crysis. Crysis Hotfix drivers (http://support.ati.com/ics/support/default.asp?deptID=894&task=knowledge&questionID=30533)in XP and Catalyst 8.1 (http://game.amd.com/us-en/drivers_catalyst.aspx) in Vista. Crysis Benchmark Tool (http://downloads.guru3d.com/download.php?det=1791) by MadBoris.

In XP:

Single card & Crossfire@ 1280x1024, 1650x1080, 1980x1200


http://img.techpowerup.org/080131/SingleCFPatchXP.png


Average increase in XP:
34% @ 1280x1024
41% @ 1650xz1080
50% @ 1920x1200


In Vista:
DX9
Single card @ 1280x1024, 1650x1080, 1980x1200


http://img.techpowerup.org/080131/SinglePatchDX9.png



DX10
Single card @ 1280x1024, 1650x1080, 1980x1200


http://img.techpowerup.org/080131/SinglePatchDX10.png


Crossfire in DX10 & DX9@ 1280x1024, 1650x1080, 1980x1200


http://img.techpowerup.org/080131/CFPatchDX10DX9.png


Average increase in Vista:
DX9
46% @ 1280x1024
49% @ 1650x1080
55% @ 1920x1200

DX10
9% @ 1280x1024
6% @ 1650x1080
6% @ 1920x1200


This worked out to an average increase of 41.6% in XP, 50% in Vista (DX9) and 7% (DX10)!


What surprised me the most was the actual improvement in Vista DX9! There was an annoying amount of flickering in both DX9 and DX10 when running the benchmark in Vista that was attributed to Catalyst A.I.. Apparently the A.I. Is not very adept a approximating textures and LODs within Crysis. The good news is that, contrary to popular belief, I was able to disable Catalyst A.I. when running Vista and Crossfire still worked (and looked great to boot.) There is a performance hit that comes with this change.

So when I hear that Crossfire doesn’t work in Crysis (Vista), in part they are right but there is no "magic" involed to get it up and running. It does seem that the DX10 path gives Crossfire the fits, but part of me wonders if it isn’t a DX10/ATI thing instead of a Crysis issue.

The question has been raised about the 3870X2, my thought is that since the Crossfire is always enabled, this will not be solvable by the end-user. So everyone should band together and demand that ATI get Crossfire to work correctly!


Now, go get your Crossfire on!

[trog100]

nicely done dude.. but u seem to be saying the crossfire crysis problem is down to not doing the ati driver install and crossfire enabling correctly..

forgive me if i have missed something.. your article is very indepth and does take a wee bit of digesting..

this is the recent 3870 x 2 review that kinda highlights the possible crysis/CF probelms.. for me..

http://arstechnica.com/reviews/hardware/ati-3870x2-review.ars/3

there does seem to be a disparity between dx 9 and dx 10 settings quite clearly shown..

now assuming the guy doing the testing has some vague idea of what he is doing.. things dont add up.. and he could not find a reasonable explanation for the strange results he got..

out of curiosity has anyone tired renaming the executable.. ???

u have crossfire working.. but there are many "experts" out there who dont have it working..

i know for an abosolute fact it didnt work for me.. i only ran XP with DX 9 at medium/high settings and it was six weeks back.. things might to have changed.. or thngs have changed at least for some.. but quite clearly not for all..

i cant put it down to not installing the cat drivers or enabling C/F properly.. if this was the case there would be crossfire problems elsewhere not simply in crysis..

then we have wizzards own 3870 x 2 review which shows a small increase for the crossfire 3870 x 2 in crysis.. the small increase matches what would be seen from the higher 825 core clock of the x 2 card compared with the single cards 777 core clock.. it does show C/F isnt working in crysis..

http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/HIS/HD_3870_X2/7.html

i am still wondering.. ???

trog

[Dr. Spankenstein]

This is exactly what I've been saying all along. It's all down to the installation! To owners dismay, it is not how it is documented by ATI. Heck, short of their little demonstration video, I don't really see any documentation by ATI of "How to correctly install Crossfire", they merely list the parts neccessary. Boo...hiss!

I did comment at the end as to why I believe it won't work on the 3870X2. As far as I know, there is not way to disable the internal Crossfire connection in order to use the above instructions. Nor should owners of this card have to require this. I think ATI is dropping the ball on this one, BIG TIME!! Not just in regards to the 3870X2, but for Crossfire on this latest generation of cards (HD series).

I am of the belief that Crossfire can be enabled in two ways (correctly and incorrectly), but the results of the incorrect method are dissappointing. That is why so many have become discouraged.

out of curiosity has anyone tired renaming the executable.. ???

Oh, you mean to bypass the "TWIWMTBP" bug?!?:p Don't know, maybe someone could try. I'm fried...

Hopefully this thread can bring all the issues and solutions to light! Positive contribution is all it takes!

[trog100]

i did install both my cards separately using the "windows" way.. i never had problems making C/F work.. it does work.. i must admit to not trying very hard to make it work in crysis.. back then it was simply excepted that it didnt work and i had no reason to think otherwise..

now.. for reasons as yet still unknown.. drivers.. patch how its installed who knows.. its seem to "kinda" work..

ati could have tweaked the vista dx 10 drivers and not the dx 9 ones for example..

shame i dont have two cards any more it cuts me off from experimenting..

trog

[Dr. Spankenstein]

They are still making them....;)

I think everyone should expect this stuff to work "out-of-the-box"! Especially if they advertise these options as an advantage over other competitors!!

As stated above, maybe if we all create an overwhelming pile of evidence some pressure can come to bear on ATI' sdriver team to remedy this situation, like PRONTO!!

[DanishDevil]

They really should work out-of-the box. I'll have two 3870s on hand this weekend, so I'll see what I can do with your methods here Spankenstein. By the way, how the hell did you come up with Dr. Spankenstein? Sounds like a good porno name ;)

[trog100]

nah i did my own evaluation and decided that everything all in crossfire wasnt for me..

i bought a none crossfire board on this basis.. the abit pro ip35.. i did think about the 3870 x 2 when i made this decision.. C/F in one slot so to speak..

i can only run 1680 x 1050 and at that resolution the one card does okay.. it uses less power and generates less heat.. i was (possibly still am) hoping the x 2 would prompt some better driver/games results.. it will probably be my next upgrade..

not just yet thow..

trog

[Lazzer408]

Dr. Spankenstein? Sounds like a good porno name ;)

Oh no you didn't! Spankenstein was a gay porno from the 70s! :roll:

(Google)

[Dr. Spankenstein]

C'mon kiddies, can we stay focused here!?!:shadedshu

Take that to "General Nonsense" and start you own thread: "WTF kinda name is XXXXXX?".

It would be nice to keep this thread as a resource, mmmmkay?


Now that I look, there doesn't seem to be much interest in this thread. Must be because everyone now believes that Crossfire DOESN'T work.:mad:

[simaomacaco]

C'mon kiddies, can we stay focused here!?!:shadedshu

Take that to "General Nonsense" and start you own thread: "WTF kinda name is XXXXXX?".

It would be nice to keep this thread as a resource, mmmmkay?


Now that I look, there doesn't seem to be much interest in this thread. Must be because everyone now believes that Crossfire DOESN'T work.:mad:

where did u get the crysis benchmark tool? i am going to try again tomorrow and log what happens. I thk it works fr me.. just not very well in crysis.. but other games are betterr sure

[Dr. Spankenstein]

Whoops! Sorry!

Here (http://downloads.guru3d.com/download.php?det=1791) it is. :toast:

Please post any questions/findings when you get them!

[DanishDevil]

Whoops! Sorry!

Here (http://downloads.guru3d.com/download.php?det=1791) it is. :toast:

Please post any questions/findings when you get them!

Thanks man. I'll see if I can get Crysis to work with a 3870 CF as well by following your instructions. Followed by some benchies.

Speaking of the Crysis Benchmark Tool, what others should I use? I've got ATiTool, 3dMark06, and The Fur Benchmark. Is there one for CoD4 or Bioshock?

Oops. Forgot Aquamark.

[Dr. Spankenstein]

*UPDATE*

WAIT! I just realized I forgot an important step that was outlined in the ParkOz set-up.

Install Crysis SP Demo.
Backup the Folder of Crysis SP Demon\\Game\\Config.
uninstall Demo.
install the Retail Version of Crysis.
Overwrite the backuped folder to the installed Dir.
run ConSole window and Type r_MultiGPU and Press Enter key.
0 means CrossFire off, 1 means on, 2 is auto

I will upload the SP Demo config folder so noone has to re-download the demo. I just overwrote the file, I didn't have to do a fresh install before replacing the folder.

The console part is just to check or manually activate CF in Crysis.

Sorry all! This will make all the difference!!

[DanishDevil]

Oh snap! I totally didn't even click that link before.

How long does that process take exactly? It looks really difficult to read if you don't know Korean, and kinda turns me off to that process. Is there a better English walkthrough of that process or could you simplify it for me??? Pretty please??? :respect:

[Dr. Spankenstein]

It's the same as the first post, just finish with the step I updated and you should be good.

From start to finish, like 15-20min. Well worth the effort.

Unfortunately, I work until 11pm, so I won't be able to U/L the folder till later, sorry!

[trog100]

*UPDATE*

WAIT! I just realized I forgot an important step that was outlined in the ParkOz set-up.

Install Crysis SP Demo.
Backup the Folder of Crysis SP Demon\\Game\\Config.
uninstall Demo.
install the Retail Version of Crysis.
Overwrite the backuped folder to the installed Dir.
run ConSole window and Type r_MultiGPU and Press Enter key.
0 means CrossFire off, 1 means on, 2 is auto

I will upload the SP Demo config folder so noone has to re-download the demo. I just overwrote the file, I didn't have to do a fresh install before replacing the folder.

The console part is just to check or manually activate CF in Crysis.

Sorry all! This will make all the difference!!

ahhh now that is the secret i was expecting u to come up with.. the one the chinese dudes figured out..

all a bit odd thow.. sounds like it might have worked in the demo but has been disabled in the real game.. a bit like fear.. better fps in the demo than the real game.. rename the executable and get the better fps back..

trog

[Dr. Spankenstein]

ahhh now that is the secret i was expecting u to come up with.. the one the chinese dudes figured out..

yessssss, ancient chinese secret. (Anyone old enough to remember that Calgon Commercial?):laugh: (FWIW, Koreans actually! Love that kimchee, bul kogi, chop chae, kkaenip...YUM!)

all a bit odd thow.. sounds like it might have worked in the demo but has been disabled in the real game.. a bit like fear.. better fps in the demo than the real game.. rename the executable and get the better fps back..

trog

You said it! TWIWMTBP in action!!!

Workarounds, workarounds....:banghead:

[Dr. Spankenstein]

Critical steps and file updated!

For those that had tried before, this will work now!

[simaomacaco]

Some preliminary results.. crossfire does seem to be giving a performance benefit especially (>55% improved) at the 1900x1200 resolution in DX9.

Single card DX9
Run #1- DX9 1280x1024 AA=No AA, 64 bit test, Quality: High ~~ Overall Average FPS: 31.415
Run #2- DX9 1900x1200 AA=No AA, 64 bit test, Quality: High ~~ Overall Average FPS: 20.51
Run #3- DX9 2560x1600 AA=No AA, 64 bit test, Quality: High ~~ Overall Average FPS: 11.87

Crossfire enabled DX9
Run #1- DX9 1280x1024 AA=No AA, 64 bit test, Quality: High ~~ Overall Average FPS: 39.1
Run #2- DX9 1900x1200 AA=No AA, 64 bit test, Quality: High ~~ Overall Average FPS: 32.815
Run #3- DX9 2560x1600 AA=No AA, 64 bit test, Quality: High ~~ Overall Average FPS: 16.415

I am going to repeat the process in DX10 when i get a chance too. I might drop the 2560x1600 mode as this would just be a total disaster i feel.

[simaomacaco]

Oh ya! these are all with the Calgon crysis SP demo method

[imperialreign]

so . . . I'm just curious here -

what are the differences between the workaround method outlined above, and an install of Crysis then patched with 1.1? I thought 1.1 supposedly broguth multiGPU support for both xFire and SLI.


Anyhow, if I feel up to later it I might go through those steps and see if there's any difference with my setup. As of now, though, I know Crossfire works with all other applications; but, in Crysis with the 1.1 patch, I only saw maybe 1FPS increase, but I swear I saw a noticeable reduction in IQ, also :confused:

[trog100]

if the C/F option worked in the demo then got turned off in the real game there is a reason for it..

the mystery.. what was that reason.. ????

trog

[imperialreign]

if the C/F option worked in the demo then got turned off in the real game there is a reason for it..

the mystery.. what was that reason.. ????

trog

and the Crysis 1.1 patch brought questionable Crossfire support

it all seems a little fishy

[trog100]

and the Crysis 1.1 patch brought questionable Crossfire support

it all seems a little fishy

it seems very fishy.. he he

trog

[simaomacaco]

xx

[simaomacaco]

-------DX9--------
Single card
Run #1- DX9 1280x1024 AA=No AA, 64 bit test, Quality: High ~~ Overall Average FPS: 31.415
Run #2- DX9 1900x1200 AA=No AA, 64 bit test, Quality: High ~~ Overall Average FPS: 20.51
Run #3- DX9 2560x1600 AA=No AA, 64 bit test, Quality: High ~~ Overall Average FPS: 11.87

Crossfire enabled DX9
Run #1- DX9 1280x1024 AA=No AA, 64 bit test, Quality: High ~~ Overall Average FPS: 39.1
Run #2- DX9 1900x1200 AA=No AA, 64 bit test, Quality: High ~~ Overall Average FPS: 32.815
Run #3- DX9 2560x1600 AA=No AA, 64 bit test, Quality: High ~~ Overall Average FPS: 16.415

-------DX10--------
Single card DX 10
Run #1- DX10 1280x1024 AA=No AA, 64 bit test, Quality: High ~~ Overall Average FPS: 22.68
Run #2- DX10 1900x1200 AA=No AA, 64 bit test, Quality: High ~~ Overall Average FPS: 15.125
Run #3- DX10 2560x2048 AA=No AA, 64 bit test, Quality: High ~~ Overall Average FPS: 5.49

Crossfire enabled DX10
Run #1- DX10 1280x1024 AA=No AA, 64 bit test, Quality: High ~~ Overall Average FPS: 22.68
Run #2- DX10 1900x1200 AA=No AA, 64 bit test, Quality: High ~~ Overall Average FPS: 15.125
Run #3- DX10 2560x2048 AA=No AA, 64 bit test, Quality: High ~~ Overall Average FPS: 5.49

crossfire enabled DX10 - non calgon with crysis 1.1
Run #1- DX10 1280x1024 AA=No AA, 64 bit test, Quality: High ~~ Overall Average FPS: 22.49
Run #2- DX10 1900x1200 AA=No AA, 64 bit test, Quality: High ~~ Overall Average FPS: 15.565

Single card DX10 - 3870PCE GPU at Over Clocked 840Mhz
Run #1- DX10 1280x1024 AA=No AA, 64 bit test, Quality: High ~~ Overall Average FPS: 25.535
Run #2- DX10 1900x1200 AA=No AA, 64 bit test, Quality: High ~~ Overall Average FPS: 17.075

[trog100]

so it seems to work in dx 9 but not 10.. or is that vista still on high.. aint dx 10 very high..??

trog

[simaomacaco]

i kept all the settings the same in the benchmark tool Trog.. so DX10 was on high

[Dr. Spankenstein]

^^I think that helps emphasize the differences. In Vista, you can play via the DX9 or DX10 path. The "Very High" settings are only "selectable" while running DX10, but as others have found, you can load custom Cvars to approximate "Very High", but it really isn't quite the same.

@ simaomacaco, Thank you so much for your results! Hopefully it will be encouraging for others. Would you be so kind as to give the Specs you are running these tests at? (ie. CPU, CPU speed, card speeds. I'm surprised you aren't seeing any benefit in DX10....

Are you in Vista only or do you dual-boot? (and no, that's not "prison lingo"!:p)

[simaomacaco]

System spec.. a bit better than average i would guess but i win at online poker :)

vista x64 pro single boot
E6600 at stock 2.4
Asaka EVO 120 cpu cooler
2*3870 PCE 8x each PCIe
Intel XBX 975
4gb pc5300
PCIe soundblaster at 4x
800gb+300gb hdd
30" dell (sweeet)
Blu-ray DVD writer
800w PSU

[Dr. Spankenstein]

Hmmm, must be the 64 bit Vista choking the works on the DX10 tip....

or, not to insult your intelligence (I mean you do have a 3870 CF on a D975XBX board!;)), but have you bothered to install the latest DirectX (http://www.gamesforwindows.com/en-US/AboutGFW/Pages/directx10-a.aspx)? :o


And which drivers did you end up using? You might need to experiment. I know 7.11/7.12 supported Vista 64, don't know about the Crysis Hotfix or 8.1....

EUREKA!

Check this ATi 8.1 Hotfix (http://support.ati.com/ics/support/default.asp?deptID=894&task=knowledge&questionID=31625)! Look half-way down the page.

"This hotfix resolves the following issues:


Fix for problems with DirectX and Radeon AGP Graphics cards.
Crysis: DirectX 10 Performance optimizations using Crossfire "

Tada! Glad to see they recognise that Crossfire need some help! Keep up the good work ATi!

[simaomacaco]

Some more numbers

I installed the 8.451.4.0 ATI hotfix x.x.4 = vista64 and i noticed that cf works a bit better:

Single card
Run #1- DX9 1280x1024 AA=No AA, 64 bit test, Quality: High ~~ Overall Average FPS: 31.415
Run #2- DX9 1900x1200 AA=No AA, 64 bit test, Quality: High ~~ Overall Average FPS: 20.51
Run #3- DX9 2560x1600 AA=No AA, 64 bit test, Quality: High ~~ Overall Average FPS: 11.87

Crossfire enabled DX9
Run #1- DX9 1280x1024 AA=No AA, 64 bit test, Quality: High ~~ Overall Average FPS: 39.1
Run #2- DX9 1900x1200 AA=No AA, 64 bit test, Quality: High ~~ Overall Average FPS: 32.815
Run #3- DX9 2560x1600 AA=No AA, 64 bit test, Quality: High ~~ Overall Average FPS: 16.415

Single card DX 10
Run #1- DX10 1280x1024 AA=No AA, 64 bit test, Quality: High ~~ Overall Average FPS: 22.68
Run #2- DX10 1900x1200 AA=No AA, 64 bit test, Quality: High ~~ Overall Average FPS: 15.125
Run #3- DX10 2560x2048 AA=No AA, 64 bit test, Quality: High ~~ Overall Average FPS: 5.49

Crossfire enabled DX10
Run #1- DX10 1280x1024 AA=No AA, 64 bit test, Quality: High ~~ Overall Average FPS: 22.68
Run #2- DX10 1900x1200 AA=No AA, 64 bit test, Quality: High ~~ Overall Average FPS: 15.125
Run #3- DX10 2560x2048 AA=No AA, 64 bit test, Quality: High ~~ Overall Average FPS: 5.49

crossfire enabled DX10 - non calgon with crysis 1.118
Run #1- DX10 1280x1024 AA=No AA, 64 bit test, Quality: High ~~ Overall Average FPS: 22.49
Run #2- DX10 1900x1200 AA=No AA, 64 bit test, Quality: High ~~ Overall Average FPS: 15.565

Single card 3870PCE GPU at Over Clocked 840Mhz
Run #1- DX10 1280x1024 AA=No AA, 64 bit test, Quality: High ~~ Overall Average FPS: 25.535
Run #2- DX10 1900x1200 AA=No AA, 64 bit test, Quality: High ~~ Overall Average FPS: 17.075

crossfire DX10 - 8.451.4.0 ATI hotfix
Run #1- DX10 1280x1024 AA=No AA, 64 bit test, Quality: High ~~ Overall Average FPS: 23.7 +4.5% increase
Run #2- DX10 1680x1050 AA=No AA, 64 bit test, Quality: High ~~ Overall Average FPS: 18.61 +22% increase
Run #3- DX10 1900x1200 AA=No AA, 64 bit test, Quality: High ~~ Overall Average FPS: 15.49 +2.5% increase
Run #4- DX10 2560x1600 AA=No AA, 64 bit test, Quality: High ~~ Overall Average FPS: 8.46 +54% increase

Note that CF really makes a diff at the v high resolution.

[BullGod]

Oh no you didn't! Spankenstein was a gay porno from the 70s! :roll:

(Google)

:laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh:

:wtf:

[Dr. Spankenstein]

*Vista Users: UPDATE*

I wanted this thread to be a resource, so I'm adding what seem to be essential Hotfixes for Crossfire.

Two are available for download:

KB940105 (http://support.microsoft.com/kb/940105)-Pertains to Virtual Address space/Memory usages.

KB936710 (http://support.microsoft.com/kb/936710)-For Multi-GPU scenarios.

The third is available only by submitting a "Request Form".

KB945149 (http://support.microsoft.com/kb/945149)-Addresses how the DMA (Direct Memory Acess) packet schedules work to the LDA (Linked Display Adapter).


Plus check and see if you have Performance and Reliability updates KB938194 & KB938979 (http://www.mydigitallife.info/2007/08/14/download-kb938194-and-kb938979-vista-updates-with-no-wga-validation/)

Waiting on more confirmations than simaomacaco & myself....:confused:

[piebobs71]

do we need 2 of the little connector cables? i hadn't found any data on where to put the cable/s until yesterday, i seen a small instructional video showing a crossfire setup with 2 of the connectors i only have 1 on just now will i gain anything from having both on? i have another one, i got a connector with each card i bought but you would think a little more info in the boxes or on the cds with the cards would be better.

http://ati.amd.com/technology/crossfire/howitworksdemo.html

[imperialreign]

do we need 2 of the little connector cables? i hadn't found any data on where to put the cable/s until yesterday, i seen a small instructional video showing a crossfire setup with 2 of the connectors i only have 1 on just now will i gain anything from having both on? i have another one, i got a connector with each card i bought but you would think a little more info in the boxes or on the cds with the cards would be better.

http://ati.amd.com/technology/crossfire/howitworksdemo.html


if you're talking about the bridge connectors that attach directly to the side of the card (and not the back of the slot), you don't need both, but, they'll perform much better with both bridges. Both brdiges allows for better communication between the two cards, whereas with only one, IIRC, they'll partially communicate across the SYS BUS - I might be wrong, though - but I recommend using both.

[piebobs71]

thanks imperialreign,ive installed second bridge cable.

@Dr. Spankenstein number 2 of your crossfire install guide says

2.) Then uninstall the current Display Adapter(s) via the Device Manager.

do you mean the vga ones windows uses? while there are no other drivers on.(is this maybe why im having the issue with things onmy desktop magically duplicating themselves?)

(Vista users can replace Steps 7 & 8 with a plain boot and power down. Vista will install the driver on the second card automatically.

my xp install found the second card automatically i didnt need to find the drivers dir.

[Dr. Spankenstein]

thanks imperialreign,ive installed second bridge cable.

@Dr. Spankenstein number 2 of your crossfire install guide says

2.) Then uninstall the current Display Adapter(s) via the Device Manager.

do you mean the vga ones windows uses? while there are no other drivers on.(is this maybe why im having the issue with things onmy desktop magically duplicating themselves?)

Yes, correct on both counts. Even after your uninstall the drivers, you must uninstall the display adapters via the Device Manager or you will see results just as you described and will not be recieving the "full" benefit of this technique.

I have also seen this happen with the Cat 8.2 drivers. Try either the Crysis Hotifx drivers or the 7.12 drivers until I can verify if the 8.1/8.2 are advantageous to use.

(Vista users can replace Steps 7 & 8 with a plain boot and power down. Vista will install the driver on the second card automatically.

my xp install found the second card automatically i didnt need to find the drivers dir.

Again, this is a symptom of not completely removing all traces of the software and hardware. Follow the steps and use the above reccommended drivers, you should be surprised!

[piebobs71]

this is gonna sound really lame but i cant get my pc to boot in safe mode lol i press f8 but all i get is a little pop up window asking me which device i want to boot from no option for safe mode ,is it f8 for safe mode with asus mobo's ive been through the manual and cant find anything about it.


ok got it ,once that little popup thing happens you press esc then f8 and it worked found some things while searching all files folders that im not sure are ati even tho they have ati in the name can anyone confirm.

[Dr. Spankenstein]

Yes they are, but they shouldn't be a problem. They are in a "backup" folder.

[piebobs71]

just the same as last time it auto found the second card but this time its showing both cards as 3870 and both on the same monitor.before it showed 1 as 3870 and 1 as 3800 series 1 on my lg204ws and 1 on default monitor.altho its still showing me as having 2 monitors in device manager and the file duplicating thing is still happening.this is really starting to bug me now.

[Fitseries3]

anyone know why my graphics "flash" in crysis?

[Dr. Spankenstein]

just the same as last time it auto found the second card but this time its showing both cards as 3870 and both on the same monitor.before it showed 1 as 3870 and 1 as 3800 series 1 on my lg204ws and 1 on default monitor.altho its still showing me as having 2 monitors in device manager and the file duplicating thing is still happening.this is really starting to bug me now.


Just a couple of questions:

I'm thinking that you might have to delete those files you were questioning earlier. Seems they are loading up when the OS discovers the new card.

Are you trying with the Crysis Hotfix drivers, 7.12, 8.1, or 8.2? Try the Hotfix drivers, if you haven't already.

@ fitseries

I had this for a while, then I had added some hotfixes and it went away. Check the KBs listed in Post# 31 & 34 and see if you have those. If not, give them a try. You can always uninstall later.

[asb2106]

Dr. S, you are the man!

Well I got my rig all built, went to install crossfire, and it wouldnt work. I have a very elaborate water setup, making it hard to pull out a card......

I was able to work it out, got it working!! although my computer did JUST locked up on me :( oh crap :(

Well either way, your instructions worked, so thanks!

BTW, I think its really lame that its so tough to get crossfire working. You would think ATI would have this worked out better than this.

Dr S, you are the man!!

EDIT***

HELP! So, I got it to work, was running 3dmark, locked up, restarted and now crossfire is off and it doesnt recognize the second card! WTF is going on??? Anyone able to help>?????? Please????

[CrackerJack]

Dr. S, you are the man!

Well I got my rig all built, went to install crossfire, and it wouldnt work. I have a very elaborate water setup, making it hard to pull out a card......

I was able to work it out, got it working!! although my computer did JUST locked up on me :( oh crap :(

Well either way, your instructions worked, so thanks!

BTW, I think its really lame that its so tough to get crossfire working. You would think ATI would have this worked out better than this.

Dr S, you are the man!!

EDIT***

HELP! So, I got it to work, was running 3dmark, locked up, restarted and now crossfire is off and it doesnt recognize the second card! WTF is going on??? Anyone able to help>?????? Please????


you can't see crossfire in 3dmark or CCC? I heard people were having to install the 3dmark patch when they installed a updated ATI drivers, I would try that. Which windows are you running?

[Dr. Spankenstein]

@asb2106,

Thanks. Glad you found this usefull!

Sounds like the drivers got borked when the crash happened. Run ATI uninstaller, Clean in Safe Mode w/Driver Cleaner Pro (do two runs with all the ATI selections listed) then start from the top.

Have you determined what the cause of the crash? Trying to bite off too much at once, eh?;)

Post back your success!

[asb2106]

@asb2106,

Thanks. Glad you found this usefull!

Sounds like the drivers got borked when the crash happened. Run ATI uninstaller, Clean in Safe Mode w/Driver Cleaner Pro (do two runs with all the ATI selections listed) then start from the top.

Have you determined what the cause of the crash? Trying to bite off too much at once, eh?;)

Post back your success!

I think the crash was actually from overheating on one of the cards. My first attempt at the water, I ran both cards in a parellel water loop and it wasnt getting the flow it needed, So i re did the water last night and got this!
http://img.techpowerup.org/080330/21551089.jpg
Its been working great now, I have done a few restarts and played with the settings to get the best I can for right now. But Im pretty happy with it!

[asb2106]

you can't see crossfire in 3dmark or CCC? I heard people were having to install the 3dmark patch when they installed a updated ATI drivers, I would try that. Which windows are you running?

XP, I got it running now, it was weird, if the ribbons are on, it recognizes as one card.

What I did, because my water setup was so tight I could not take out just one card. So I removed the ribbons, wiped all traces of drivers, restarted, installed 8.2, restarted making sure it seen both cards(device manager - seen both on its own) shutdown, add ribbons, boot and go in CCC then enable xfire, works great!

[Dr. Spankenstein]

Can't argue with results like that!! Great score! That's good for 3rd place overall in the '06 thread!

Nice clock on that Quad, BTW!

You seemed to have found the same "barrier" at 877MHz for CF like I did. Trying to determine how to get beyond that one. Will post back if I find anything....

[asb2106]

Can't argue with results like that!! Great score! That's good for 3rd place overall in the '06 thread!

Nice clock on that Quad, BTW!

You seemed to have found the same "barrier" at 877MHz for CF like I did. Trying to determine how to get beyond that one. Will post back if I find anything....

that would be awesome! I sure did hit that "barrier" myself, highly annoying! Ahh well, I really cannot complain about 21k 3dmarks.

I can however complain about how hot my Northbridge is getting on the rampage!

I left the computer on over night running seti at the clocks, and I worked the voltages down as low as i could get them stable CPU 1.54, NB 1.33 and my NB still runs at like 68 - 71 C!!! I really didnt want to have to WC the NB on this, that would require me to have to find something to cool the SB then too!

I love this board, clocks great, hell, for fun I got my q6600 at 4.4 stable, the temps were almost 78C on the cores though, so I had to back off. Right now Im at 4ghz at 1.54 and the cores are running around 63C @ 100%

[Dr. Spankenstein]

I hear ya on the PITA switching to alternate cooling for these X38 boards. Can't just remove one, ya gotta expose them all then find something elegant to cool them with.

Making me rethink my w/c setup. I may just put the CPU and NB on water and use a Noctua on the SB with a tiny (80mm) fan. Then I could do a second loop for the cards! I'm itching to buy my first EK product since everyone else dropped the ball on the HD 38XX series.

Your NB voltage seems pretty tame. Shoot me a PM with your BIOS settings, there may be another way to squeeze some more performance for less volts.

[asb2106]

I hear ya on the PITA switching to alternate cooling for these X38 boards. Can't just remove one, ya gotta expose them all then find something elegant to cool them with.

Making me rethink my w/c setup. I may just put the CPU and NB on water and use a Noctua on the SB with a tiny (80mm) fan. Then I could do a second loop for the cards! I'm itching to buy my first EK product since everyone else dropped the ball on the HD 38XX series.

Your NB voltage seems pretty tame. Shoot me a PM with your BIOS settings, there may be another way to squeeze some more performance for less volts.

ive seemed to have gotten it under control, its running now at 1.38 and 46C, I also have a fan blowing right on it. I plan on getting the corsair ram cooling fans and attaching a 60MM on the side to blow on the NB. I think that should keep me running good!

I will still shoot you over my BIOS shots, I would love for you to look into that for me. I seem to be alittle overwhelmed with the settings of the x48!

[asb2106]

Wow, I expected much worse! crossfire 3870 @ 864/1250!
http://img.techpowerup.org/080401/Untitled.jpg

[erocker]

Has anyone gotten Cat 8.3's to work with crossfire under XP yet?

[asb2106]

Has anyone gotten Cat 8.3's to work with crossfire under XP yet?

Not in XP, it runs great in Vista though!

[erocker]

Installing 8.3's or the 8.3 hotfix (8.4's) over 8.2's certainly does not work at all. As a matter of fact it works exactly the same as doing a fresh install of either.:shadedshu

[Dr. Spankenstein]

@asb2106,

Lookin' good! and w/16xAF! Yummy!

@erocker,

No luck here. I did an install over 8.2. No CF love...

p.s. there is a 8.3 hotfix? Man, I'm out of the loop.:o

[erocker]

@asb2106,

Lookin' good! and w/16xAF! Yummy!

@erocker,

No luck here. I did an install over 8.2. No CF love...

Sent you a PM;) This is a very important thread, thank you Dr.:toast:

[erocker]

Title changed, and the thread is stickied. May all Crossfire users be enlightened by this wonderful, helpful thread.:)

[Dr. Spankenstein]

Love the new title! Thanks for that!

Woo hoo! Meh first sticky!

Much appreciated! Can't wait to provide more troubleshooting and results to this thread!

[asb2106]

Congrats Dr.!!

I will say, crossfire is SO MUCH easier to get working in vista. I literally installed vista, installed 8.3, and it worked. No problems, no pulling cards, nothing.

This thread was a big help to my efforts in XP so thank you very much, and you deserve the sticky on this one!

After more testing I have settled on Crysis running 1920x1200 all high with a few on very high DX10. I get 38FPS. That is playable for me and it makes crysis great fun! Much better than playin it with my 1950pro(14x9, medium, ~25FPS)

[erocker]

So, I have learned that swapping cards (even if they are identical) is a bad idea. I swapped cards and my system became unstable. Turned off computer, swapped them back. Bad idea! Now, there was now option for crossfire in CCC and card #2 was locked in at 99% GPU! A quick reinstall of CCC (8.2's btw) the Dr. Spankenstien way, solved all my problems! Thank you doctor!:toast:

*Oh I also learned that if you like saving power, to have Crossfire enabled. This allows powerplay to downclock both cards while not in use. :)

[Dr. Spankenstein]

Coolness! I should include your post and my experience I posted in the 3D06 discussion thread in a new "Troubleshooting" section!

[piebobs71]

ive finally got my crossfire setup running but one thing i was wondering about is,with me using one card which comes out of the box slightly faster clocked should i or would it be better to flash the bios so they are both the same(same value as lower clocked one) or would that not make that much difference? just installed 8.4's without taking cards out or removing crossfire bridges and all is working fine and nearly the same 3dmark06 score.

[Dr. Spankenstein]

Thanks for your experience. It seems to parallel many other's in regards to Cat's 8.3 & 8.4, they automatically install with both cards in place and CF bridges connected.

Regarding your slightly mismatched clocks, it seems like more risk than reward to flash. Why not just setup a Profile in CCC to load each time you start playing a game/benchmark (which is really the only time you need to have both cards breathing fire!) You'll save some electricity and some wear & tear on you precious cards.

You shouldn't have a problem anyway. That's why they let you change each card's clocks independently in the Overdrive tab.

Just enjoy them!

[erocker]

So with the 8.4's has anyone done an install with everything already connected? I did it and it actually worked with no decrease in performance! Though I've heard others having problems...

[Dr. Spankenstein]

Personally, I have not tried the 8.4 drivers as of yet. But I will (in the name of science...)

The feeling I'm getting is that these problems are comming from not removing every trace of the old install (by that I mean either 8.2, 8.3 or 8.4). There is a completely different way that these install as compared to everything before (anything pre-8.2).

Now clearing all the bunk is easier SAID than DONE. A quick method I found to be effective to combat the ".DLL from Hell" as I like to call it (because you could never delete it) was to install an old Cat version (7.12 comes to mind...) then do an uninstall as per usual (ATI Uninstall Utility, reboot to Safe Mode, Run Driver Cleaner Pro twice, do a search for "ATI" and delete any stragglers). Then you're clear.

I still don't like these new drivers because of the way they act during installation. For single card users and Vista folks, they're great.

[erocker]

I'm telling ya man, just uninstall those old drivers, keep your cards in, bridges connected, restart and install 8.4's for XP. It's amazing, it actually works, and you get about a 250pt bump!

[Dr. Spankenstein]

Oh I believe you!

I was responding to your comment about "problems". fitseries3's thread comes to mind "Can't install CCC", a perfect example of how frustrating this new Cats can get.

That's all. Heck, I'm running 8.3 on a single card for testing currently. That's the one I got this with:
http://img.techpowerup.org/080419/Best%20single.png

[asb2106]

I'm telling ya man, just uninstall those old drivers, keep your cards in, bridges connected, restart and install 8.4's for XP. It's amazing, it actually works, and you get about a 250pt bump!

It worked great for me, but I didnt really see a point increase at all

[piebobs71]

Regarding your slightly mismatched clocks, it seems like more risk than reward to flash. Why not just setup a Profile in CCC to load each time you start playing a game/benchmark (which is really the only time you need to have both cards breathing fire!) You'll save some electricity and some wear & tear on you precious cards.



im not 100% sure how to set up a profile in ccc never tried it before

[Dr. Spankenstein]

From Tweakguides.com -ATI Catalyst Tweak Guide (http://www.tweakguides.com/ATICAT_1.html). :toast:

Profiles



If you want to use different graphics card settings in different circumstances, the profiles option might come in very handy. Click the Profiles button and select 'Profiles Manager' to bring up the Profiles Manager. You can save all your current Control Center settings under as many profiles as you like by entering a profile name in the box under 'Enter or select a profile name', and then click the Save button. However you can choose which particular settings are saved in the profile, and how they can be applied.



Composition: Under this tab you can select the particular Control Center settings to save for the current profile. If you click the small 'All Catalyst Control Center Settings' button all possible Control Center settings will be saved for the current profile. If you want to ignore certain settings, such as VPU Recover or Video Overlay settings for the current profile, click on the 'the following settings' button, and then you can double-click on the name of your graphics card (if you have only one display, select the first entry) and underneath it you can tick/untick the specific setting areas to add/remove.



Activation: Under this tab you can set the methods by which the profile can be activated (i.e the settings in the profile will be put into effect). There are four possible ways in which a profile can be activated:

System Tray Menu - If you use the ATI Catalyst Control Center System Tray tool then if this option is ticked you can use it to quickly access and activate your profiles.



Hotkey Assignments - If you use the ATI Hotkeys function of the Control Center, then you tick this option to assign hotkeys to activate a profile. You must then select a Hotkey Modifier key, and enter a particular key in the 'Enter a Hotkeys selection' box. This is the key combination which will activate this profile.



Profiles Menu - This item should usually be ticked, as it allows you to access profiles and activate them using the drop-down menu next to the Profiles button in the ATI Control Center. Your profiles will be listed by name under the 'Activate Profile' item of the Profiles drop-down menu.



Desktop Shortcut - This is a very useful way of activating profiles, particularly profiles which apply to particular games or applications. If this option is ticked, when you save a profile this places a special ATI shortcut on your Windows Desktop, which when launched will activate the particular profile associated with it. See the Application tab description below for more details of how to use this feature to create and use different profiles for each game.

Applications: Under this tab you can associate a particular application or game with the profile. You can do this by putting a tick in the 'opens the following application, file or shortcut' box, and then inserting the full path and name of a executable or shortcut using the Browse button. I recommend you select the path to a shortcut, as the Control Center has some issues with launching certain executables properly (e.g Doom3.exe). Unfortunately this method doesn't mean that whenever you run that application or shortcut that the drivers will automatically detect this and run the appropriate profile. That would be extremely useful, but that's not what this does. The closest you can get to that sort of ease-of-use is to tick the 'Desktop Shortcut' option under the Activation tab, then save your profile. You will now find a shortcut on your desktop which, when launched, will start the application or game you've assigned to the profile, and implement all the profile's settings.
(This is the method I suggested earlier.)


One last thing I can recommend in regards to profiles is that you should ideally save your regular "everyday" Control Center settings under a profile with a name like Default or Normal. That way you won't lose them. For more useful game profiles which are automatically detected and used when a game is launched, use ATI Tray Tools instead - see the Advanced Tweaking section for details.

[piebobs71]

cheers will have a look

[grunt_408]

Hey spanks I have just recently aquired another X1950 pro card to run in crossfire mode. Before installing the new card I uninstalled the old drivers booted to safe mode ran driver cleaner shut the pc down installed the extra card (with two crossfire bridges) I then installed 8.4 CATS. I have been reading through the Ati Cat tweak guide and came across where it says CAT A.I needs to be enabled for crossfire. I have to disable it for my games to run with crossfire? wtf Would it be worth re installing the drivers using your method?

[trog100]

which means your games wont run with crossfire.. disabling the ai just means one card gets used.. it seems to be the ai that controls things..

my crossfire is a piece of sh-t in XP and i dont mind saying so.. f-cking useless.. it dosnt work.. its f-cked.. u name it i think its a total waste of space..

just my humble opinion.. he he he

pretty much all of my later games simply run worse with it on than they do without it.. crysis sees a gain so does the 3dmarks.. but everything else shows a loss.. what f-cking good is that.. he he

am i pissed off.. u could say so.. he he

vent over..

trog

ps.. when i say crysis shows a gain i tell a lie.. with the cat 8.3 and 8.4s it dosnt work.. it does however show a gain with the cat 8.2s..

[trog100]

my second go at proving something here.. my other thread produced zilch...

does crossfire work in XP with later games.. does it give a performance increase or a performance loss..

i need some examples from other people who use XP...

no later game works for me with crossfire.. every single one shows a degrade..

a list of games that show a degrade for me..

world in conflict..

witcher..

conflict denied opps..

vegas 2..

all the 3marks work as they should and scale okay with crossfire.. no later games work..

can anybody post some examples of later XP games.. frame rates from one card or two please.. i need to know if its just my system or not.. have ati given up on dx9 XP... ????

please no "it works for me".. some actual examples XP are needed.. three year old games dont count..

trog

[grunt_408]

I still get crossfire working with A.I disabled its very strange I gain 10 marks in 3d mark 06 with it on standard but can only play games with it off. I think its time to get VIsta. lol I will re install drivers the Spankenstien way and see how it goes.

[Dr. Spankenstein]

@ trog100,

Soon I will download demos of some of the games you mentioned and try some things.

@ craigleberry,

Care to mention which Cats you're using? I notice a major performance drop when A.I. is disabled.

[CrackerJack]

my second go at proving something here.. my other thread produced zilch...

does crossfire work in XP with later games.. does it give a performance increase or a performance loss..

i need some examples from other people who use XP...

no later game works for me with crossfire.. every single one shows a degrade..

a list of games that show a degrade for me..

world in conflict..

witcher..

conflict denied opps..

vegas 2..

all the 3marks work as they should and scale okay with crossfire.. no later games work..

can anybody post some examples of later XP games.. frame rates from one card or two please.. i need to know if its just my system or not.. have ati given up on dx9 XP... ????

please no "it works for me".. some actual examples XP are needed.. three year old games dont count..

trog

i couldn't even get vegas 2 to work with crossfire. the first time it work then after that, it crash or restart :banghead:

[erocker]

I haven't had any problems that I notice. I always have crossfire enabled. I will deffinitely get some FPS numbers for you.;)

[grunt_408]

I did post that I am using 8.4 Cats. mmmmmrrrrgff I think it may be worth flogging the two cards off in egay and buying one 3870 hhhhmmmm I might give it a go.

[CY:G]

So if A.I. Setting are off, Vista wont use my crossfireX setup, that explains why i didn't gain any FPS on games with Crossfire enabled, cant wait to get home and try it

[trog100]

So if A.I. Setting are off, Vista wont use my crossfireX setup, that explains why i didn't gain any FPS on games with Crossfire enabled, cant wait to get home and try it

seems that way... its the ai that tell extra cards to come in.. it also disables any single game specific tweaks the driver might have.. renaming some of the executables plays odd tricks as well..

take these three examples..

just one card CF dissabled

http://www.cavecom.com/pics/ncfwic.jpg

two cards CF enabled

http://www.cavecom.com/pics/cfwic.jpg

CF enabled but ai off.. only one card runs..

http://www.cavecom.com/pics/noaicfwic.jpg

notice 1 and 3 are similar but not the same.. its a world in conflict in game benchmark..

trog

[grunt_408]

Ah Crossfire enabled with A.I works to run 3d mark 06 but cant run games with A.I on standard or advanced has to set to off for games to run.
I used the method posted in here to install the drivers Heck I even swapped the cards around to make sur. Still the same problem. Although I can now play UT3 with A.I on standard.
Cannot play COD4 demo with A.I enabled. I cant play BF2 with A.I enabled either. This blows

[trog100]

Ah Crossfire enabled with A.I works to run 3d mark 06 but cant run games with A.I on standard or advanced has to set to off for games to run.
I used the method posted in here to install the drivers Heck I even swapped the cards around to make sur. Still the same problem. Although I can now play UT3 with A.I on standard.
Cannot play COD4 demo with A.I enabled. I cant play BF2 with A.I enabled either. This blows

to me if the 3dmarks work it shows the drivers are installed okay.. it seem C/F dosnt do much for u thow..

most of the games i have tried run but not as good with two cards as with one card.. i also get a screen full of hash or a screenshot of the last game i ran when the game first tries to load.. for me the 8.2 cats work the best but still dont work properly..

some more XP CF results are needed from other guys.. so far anything that shows CF working in XP hasnt shown up.. apart from the 3dmarks..

trog

[grunt_408]

The splash screen in bf2 is all crappy but once loaded into a map it works fine wtf. Looks good too It must be working I guess its just drivers or my chipset?

[piebobs71]

i havnt tried with one card yet but im playing rainbow 6 vegas 2,rfactor and pes8 just now all run really good with crossfire enabled and ai on standard

using 8.4 cats installed with both cards in and bridges on

[trog100]

can u do some runs with CF enabled and disabled use fraps to compare frame rates.. ???

trog

ps.. edit.. i just did a vagas 2 test useing fraps on the game save i am now on.. with CF disabled i get between 80 and 120 fps... with it enabled i get between 40 and 60 fps.. pretty much a halving of frame rates.. he he he

the game still seems playable cos its not exactly stressing anything but CF aint supposed to be a frame rate halving device is it.. aint it sposed to increase em.. he he he

witcher shows a slight performance loss with CF enabled..

[Dr. Spankenstein]

^^I'm DLing Witcher (Demo), WiC (Demo) and Conflic DO (Demo) right now. Will do some quick tests and post up.

[asb2106]

WOW, FRAPs has some cool stuff there, I wish I would have had that when I was testing my 3870vs9600GT. Ahh well, I can use it for my xfire now :)

[trog100]

the other thing i am noticing is the "stutter" this kinda makes the frame rates seem lower than what fraps says they are.. when fraps tells me i am getting 25 fps in dirt for example it looks to me more like 15.. dirt being a real example of CF killing performance.. is fraps reading a higher frame rate then what i am getting with CF enabled i wonder or is the "stutter" something different..

trog

[Dr. Spankenstein]

Could anyone (but trog100, expecially) give me some framerates you are getting with a single card for The Witcher, World in Conflict and Conflict: Denied Ops. Please include: res you are running and clock speed on card.

Thanks!

[trog100]

Could anyone (but trog100, expecially) give me some framerates you are getting with a single card for The Witcher, World in Conflict and Conflict: Denied Ops. Please include: res you are running and clock speed on card.

Thanks!

my world in conflict is up above.. witcher varies depending on the scene.. outside big distance scenes about 50 fps up tp 120 for a city scene..

conflict denied ops.. around 60 or 70 again depending on the scene..

dirt gives around 40 fps with one card.. very smooth..

i run 1680 x 1050 with the settings pretty high..

all the above games play nicely with one card.. my 3870 is running at 837/1250.. all suffer when CF is enabled..

its hard to give exact fps without a fixed benchmark..

one thing to note.. the settings in all these later games make a far greater difference than the resolution used.. i dont see much difference between 1400 x 900 or 1680 x 1050 with the same settings.. for example i get 128 fps in crysis at 1680 x 1050 at low settings..

crysys isnt the machine killer its made out to be.. it just has some "settings" that are machine killers.. turn them down and it will play on a very low end machine.. even my laptop.. as did world in conflict..

trog

[Dr. Spankenstein]

Guys, believe it or not...I may have this issure sorted out!

The only proof I have so far is these screens for WiC and The Witcher:

http://img.techpowerup.org/080424/WiC CF Test.png

*Witcher screenie not uploading*


Now grated, my WiC score is'nt much better, but consider that my card is clocked @ 863 each and CPU @ 3.6GHz. So there world be more performance in there. Plus ther has NEVER been a situation where CF has increased MIN FPS, in fact is usually gets worse. But AVERAGE will generally show a marked improvement along with MAX.

I noticed a marked improvement in framerates with Coflict: DO as well, I just don't know how to show you.

Here's the deal... you HAVE to rename your .exe to something with a known CF profile. Some common ones are Oblivion, CoD2SP, FEAR, AFRFriendlyD3D. Then you must set CAT A.I. to Advanced. This lets the driver know that you want to override the default rendering mode and will force AFR (based on the above mentioned profiles).

But I want some more confirmation from people.

So if ANYONE is having issues with a game not giving you the expected increase from CF and you are sure that you CF setup is working (via 3DM06 or another game), try this technique.

I am in total agreement that all this should "just work", but we are painfully aware that it does not. This simple work-around has been around for ages and still works.

[FR@NK]

Here's the deal... you HAVE to rename your .exe to something with a known CF profile. Some common ones are Oblivion, CoD2SP, FEAR, AFRFriendlyD3D. Then you must set CAT A.I. to Advanced. This lets the driver know that you want to override the default rendering mode and will force AFR (based on the above mentioned profiles).

But I want some more confirmation from people.



I'll test this as soon as i find my wic disk and get it installed.

[erocker]

Totally trying this out when I get home man! :toast:

[asb2106]

Oh thats sweet!

Good idea Dr., I have to ask, what made you think of doing this??

[Dr. Spankenstein]

Besides listening to trog100 bag on Crossfire constantly...:rolleyes:

No reason whatsoever.

Unfortunately, I also just discovered the other part of the equation. In an attempt to run the same card clocks as trog100 (and try to bump my CPU to 3.7) I had to Unlock my Overdrive tab in CCC. Big mistake!

See I have my cards flashed to run at 875 by default, so I didn't need to unlock Overdrive. I was OCing my single card with Riva. Crossfire needed to be OCed via CCC.

So....you'll have to do a fresh install of CCC AND run at the "default" 3D speeds for your card. So either flash to a higher speed or run whatever "stock" is for your particular card. Usually in the range of 777 to 850.

Sorry.

[t_ski]

Here's the deal... you HAVE to rename your .exe to something with a known CF profile. Some common ones are Oblivion, CoD2SP, FEAR, AFRFriendlyD3D. Then you must set CAT A.I. to Advanced. This lets the driver know that you want to override the default rendering mode and will force AFR (based on the above mentioned profiles).

Any profile at all, or should this be a profile for a game based on the same or similar engine?

[Dr. Spankenstein]

The only ones that need to be specific are OpenGL based games. Otherwise we are just using D3D based games, so any of the above will work.

Each one will give slightly differing performance, so if you interested in maximizing your framerate you'll want to experiment with many.

I'll compile a list of known CF profiled games soon.

[asb2106]

Besides listening to trog100 bag on Crossfire constantly...:rolleyes:

No reason whatsoever.

Unfortunately, I also just discovered the other part of the equation. In an attempt to run the same card clocks as trog100 (and try to bump my CPU to 3.7) I had to Unlock my Overdrive tab in CCC. Big mistake!

See I have my cards flashed to run at 875 by default, so I didn't need to unlock Overdrive. I was OCing my single card with Riva. Crossfire needed to be OCed via CCC.

So....you'll have to do a fresh install of CCC AND run at the "default" 3D speeds for your card. So either flash to a higher speed or run whatever "stock" is for your particular card. Usually in the range of 777 to 850.

Sorry.

Im confused, why was it a mistake to unlock the cards in overdrive??

Does it disable something or what??

[Dr. Spankenstein]

In a way, it does. That's why it gives you a prompt before you unlock it. Plus there is no way to re-lock it if you click on the lock icon. I'm not sure exactly WHAT it does, it is just proven that it hiners some of the properties of CF.

So to recap: Unlock Overdrive=BAD!!

[asb2106]

In a way, it does. That's why it gives you a prompt before you unlock it. Plus there is no way to re-lock it if you click on the lock icon. I'm not sure exactly WHAT it does, it is just proven that it hiners some of the properties of CF.

So to recap: Unlock Overdrive=BAD!!

oh crap, I did not know that.

Well Im gonna find a stable OC for my cards soon, then Im gonna make a new bios and flash the cards to that speed. Im gonna wait till I get my water cooling all done though, Im thinking 965 core. I have been playing TF2 at 965 core at 1.39 volts. I might be able to drop the volts, but who knows. I want to make sure its stable before I make any changes though :)

WOW AGAIN. I knew unlocking it messed with it a bit, but I didnt think it actually funked up perfromance!!

[Dr. Spankenstein]

Although this is a total PITA, it is the only way to get the performance you paid for in ALL games.

Enjoy!

[trog100]

In a way, it does. That's why it gives you a prompt before you unlock it. Plus there is no way to re-lock it if you click on the lock icon. I'm not sure exactly WHAT it does, it is just proven that it hiners some of the properties of CF.

So to recap: Unlock Overdrive=BAD!!

unless u can back this up doc i aint gonna believe it.. says he having major CF problems..:) one thing thow a really clean driver install puts the lock back.. i have seen it come back many times..

trog

[Dr. Spankenstein]

Thanks http://img.techpowerup.org/080424/Captain Obvious.jpg

Probably the reason I stated:


Unfortunately, I also just discovered the other part of the equation. In an attempt to run the same card clocks as trog100 (and try to bump my CPU to 3.7) I had to Unlock my Overdrive tab in CCC. Big mistake!

So....you'll have to do a fresh install of CCC AND run at the "default" 3D speeds for your card. So either flash to a higher speed or run whatever "stock" is for your particular card. Usually in the range of 777 to 850.

Sorry.

It works. Just humor me and try it.:D

[trog100]

Guys, believe it or not...I may have this issure sorted out!

The only proof I have so far is these screens for WiC and The Witcher:

http://img.techpowerup.org/080424/WiC CF Test.png

*Witcher screenie not uploading*


Now grated, my WiC score is'nt much better, but consider that my card is clocked @ 863 each and CPU @ 3.6GHz. So there world be more performance in there. Plus ther has NEVER been a situation where CF has increased MIN FPS, in fact is usually gets worse. But AVERAGE will generally show a marked improvement along with MAX.

I noticed a marked improvement in framerates with Coflict: DO as well, I just don't know how to show you.

Here's the deal... you HAVE to rename your .exe to something with a known CF profile. Some common ones are Oblivion, CoD2SP, FEAR, AFRFriendlyD3D. Then you must set CAT A.I. to Advanced. This lets the driver know that you want to override the default rendering mode and will force AFR (based on the above mentioned profiles).

But I want some more confirmation from people.

So if ANYONE is having issues with a game not giving you the expected increase from CF and you are sure that you CF setup is working (via 3DM06 or another game), try this technique.

I am in total agreement that all this should "just work", but we are painfully aware that it does not. This simple work-around has been around for ages and still works.

i aint seeing anything that makes sense here doc.. a big increase in maximum.. no increase in the average and a similar minimum.. so where does all that apparent huge maximum increase go if it dosnt increase the average..

u now throw in some other known only to u factor that unlocking the overdrive messes up crossfire.. whats the plot dude..??

as for all this renaming executables to make things work.. come on.. is crossfire really that bad.. is it really such a crock of shit.. or have u lost the plot completely..

this all started off with making C/F work in crysis.. one game.. having to mess about with all games really dont make sense..

trog

[Dr. Spankenstein]

I stated directly underneath the screenshot that: 1) my cards were clocked slower than yours. 2) my CPU was clocked slower than yours.

It only stands to reason that if my specs were matched to yours, everything would be boosted.

Your aggressive stance towards CF has made you start using selective vison. You pick apart the things that have already been explained and you ignore the things that can help. I also made the statement that repeats your sentiment that this all should "just work". But we've all had enough experience in life to realise that this isn't the case in many MANY situations. You just choose to focus your hate at CF.

Believe it or don't. My place isn't to convince trog100 that CF works (albeit with more effort than is necessary), mine is only to report MY findings in MY thread.

[trog100]

dude its u that are useing selective vision.. your card is clocked faster than mine.. mine is at 837... yours 863..

your maximim goes up to 134 from my 94.. your minimum stays about the same so does your average..

do your maths.. u must be getting a far greater percentage of lows for the highs not to speed up the average.. this is not a performance increase.. just a rearrangement of how the average is made up and not for the better either..

u are also wrong in claiming CF dosnt help the lows as being the norm.. bullsh-t..

take fear a three year old game we all know works in crossfire XP.. i have just run the fear in game bench..

CF disabled..

minimum.. 45

average.. 105

maximum.. 195

CF enabled..

minimum.. 90

average.. 168

maximum.. 493

a nice across the board gain.. crossfire quite clearly work in XP with fear...

the problem here is u are antagonistic to my claims about XP crossfire.. its a total crock of shit in essence.. it works where it dosnt need to work with ancient games like fear and doom 3 but messes up newer games where it actually needs to work and might be of some use..

i am open to suggestions that it might be my system but my fear and 3dmark results kinda go against that.. so what does that leave.. so far it still leaves XP crossfire looking like a crock of useless crap...

as for your idea of the executable rename.. i just tried that with world in conflict.. u are kind of on the right track except for one big thing.. feeding in optimizations for an old game that does work aint gonna work with a new game that dosnt.. the optimizations are game specific..

renaming wic.exe to fear.exe does make a difference but it makes things worse not better.. the average drops to 37 fps.. pretty obvious when u stop and think about it..

i know u like to think CF can be made to work but so far it aint looking good for CF in XP..

i am still waiting for someone to post simple CF and none CF comparative results.. yours have simply muddied the water..

or do.. as i am strongly beginning to believe folks just run a 3dmark go gee wow whiz and see what they want to see.. he he

i am now wondering just how ati get away with selling the world such rubbish.. please someone prove me wrong..

trog

ps.. mine is only to report my finding in a crossfire thread started by u.. its now a public thread isnt it.. or are only dr loving sycophants allowed to join in the discussion..

its time u grew up dude.. no offense intended..

[Dr. Spankenstein]

I've already asked before: Tell me the res and settings you want me to run. Tell me which game. Tell me what you would like to see for proof.

Seems we are arguing different sides of the same battle. I think you're waiting for me to say: "Cf is f'ed!" and IT IS from the standpoint of it requiring the end-user to jump through hoops to get there.
But it can work. That is the point you refuse to conceed.

These personal attacks contribute NOTHING to this thread. Please try to refrain.

[trog100]

dude it dosnt work for me.. not in XP it dosnt.. i see reviews that appear to show CF working.. they dont have to mess with things it just seems to work.. at least with some games it does.. but they are all in dx10 vista..

now this is a fact.. for me CF is a total waste of space in XP.. i run XP and really dont want to change to vista.. but long term it might affect my card buying and operating system decisions..

all i need to know is am i the odd case or is what i am seeing the general rule for XP crossfire users.... it should be simple enough to find out.. odd why it isnt..

it dosnt matter exact resolutions all i need to know is does crossfire give some performance increase in recent games with dx9 XP or dosnt it..

post your world in conflict bench with CF enabled and CF disabled.. the same applies to anybody with CF in XP.. all it needs is to run fraps load the game any recent game dont move and look at the frame rates.. does CF make them better or as in my case make them worse..

have ati stopped bothering optimizing for dx9 as seems the case.. or is it just my system that for some reason is showing poor results.. i accept it could be..

lets not beat about the bush.. should an XP user bother with CF for instance or is ati XP driver support dead.. we do all buy CF to play newer games not to get 300 fps in four year old ones..

its the fact it works in all the ancient games but none of the newer ones that makes me wonder.. or am i the only one that runs more than 2006 to see how well CF works.. it does seem this way..

trog

[erocker]

I play BF2, BF2132, UT3, Crysis, FFoW, TF2 all with crossfire enabled in XP with AA and AF on and I do not have problems.

[FR@NK]

take fear a three year old game we all know works in crossfire XP.. i have just run the fear in game bench..

a nice across the board gain.. crossfire quite clearly work in XP with fear...its a total crock of shit in essence.. it works where it dosnt need to work with ancient games like fear and doom 3 but messes up newer games where it actually needs to work and might be of some use..

Trog you are 100% right, out of the box crossfire isnt gunna work perfectly for most of the new games. ATI needs to add more crossfire options to CCC kinda like nvidia has done. They take too long optimizing crossfire profiles that are added to newer drivers. Its crazy to think that I have to rename the exe to "AFRFriendlyD3D" to get AFR mode to work.



Seems we are arguing different sides of the same battle. I think you're waiting for me to say: "Cf is f'ed!" and IT IS from the standpoint of it requiring the end-user to jump through hoops to get there.
But it can work. That is the point you refuse to conceed.

Yea CF does work....I just wish ATI would help us jump through afew hoops. I guess they need to add an asterisk after they "Crossfire Ready"




Crossfire Ready*

*for 3Dmark and some older games you probably dont play any more.

[Dr. Spankenstein]

Here is Single card @ 863, CPU @ 3.6:
http://img.techpowerup.org/080424/WiC Single.png

CF as posted before same specs:
http://img.techpowerup.org/080424/WiC%20CF%20Test.png

I think anyone looking at this can come to the conclusion that CF can work in this game.
It's just a matter if you want to go throught the motions. I'll do it for a 26% increase!

trog100, it also "works" in The Witcher and Conflict: DO. There was no demo of Vegas 2 to try. So I would venture to say it could work for you too, you just don't seem interested in the proceedure to get you there. With that stance, yes CF is a waste. It's not going to work "out of the box" for 98% of people, but then again, I don't think we represent a very typical cross section of Joe Six-Pack computer users.

To everyone, it's your's for the taking but you'll have to meet Crossfire halfway until ATi gets it together. I'm not holding my breath so I dig up work-arounds.:D

[trog100]

there does seem to be gain from your post dr.. but now u must tell me exactly what u did to get one..

what exactly are these "motions".. and if i go thru these "motions" will i see a similar gain.. ???

just to check.. both runs were done in XP.. one with CF enabled and one with it disabled.. also what cats are u useing.. ??

erocker.. would u care to say what your CF gains are.. have u compared CF on with CF off.. ???

my problem with this CF woks for me stuff is one card works for me.. i dont really need CF as yet.. but i aint happy it dosnt seem to work as it should do.. a decrease in performance aint exactly why i have two cards and a bigger leccy bill.. even with one switched off all the time it consumes power..

just take note i am getting similar lows and averages dr with one card as u are with two.. and one card clocked lower.. this could be settings.. what were yours dr out of curiosity..

it would also be interesting to know what are your results without magic tricks.. ??

i am very interested in the procedure dr.. or at least the ones i havnt tried.. and contrary to what u seem to think (and suggest) i really would like to get CF to work in XP..

u do seem to agree that without your special procedures it dosnt work as it should..

my main point here isnt that i need CF.. i dont.. but if it really is a crock of XP shit i recon the world including "joe soap" should be made aware of it..

if ati have given up on dx9 CF i can see why.. none of the current games need it except crysis ati do seem to have tweaked dx9 crysis or at least tried to.. future games that might need it will probably be dx10.. all the reviewers seem to have moved to vista dx10 with CF and SLI reviews..

the thing that bothers me the most is that all post 8.2 cats have gotten worse in XP not better.. the small gain i see with the 8.2s in crysis has turned into splotchy colour blocks with the 8.3s and 8.4s..

trog

[erocker]

Trog, I don't mean to interrupt, but this thread is for helping people to get Crossfire to work. I believe the reasons Dr. Spankenstien created this thread, was to help "Joe Soap" who realizes that Crossfire has problems and is looking for help, nothing more. This thread really isn't about the reasons why we choose to have crossfire systems. Thanks.:toast:

[trog100]

Trog, I don't mean to interrupt, but this thread is for helping people to get Crossfire to work. I believe the reasons Dr. Spankenstien created this thread, was to help "Joe Soap" who realizes that Crossfire has problems and is looking for help, nothing more. This thread really isn't about the reasons why we choose to have crossfire systems. Thanks.:toast:

he he he.. i ask for a few simple examples erocker.. just to see if the problems i am getting are common problems.. so far i havnt been helped in my search for crossfire knowledge in the slightest..

this is crossfire help thread isnt it.. or have i missed something.. ??

i did start my own thread but got exactly zilch.. this thread started off with CF in crysis and how to make it work.. what its about now i am beginning to wonder.. :)

trog

[grunt_408]

Here is a screenie for yas wtf this is with c/f enabled only started doing this today???
http://i224.photobucket.com/albums/dd145/Craigleberry/crossfireenabled.jpg
this is the same if i run 3d mark or any other game.
Does it with crossfire dissabled also

[Dr. Spankenstein]

he he he.. i ask for a few simple examples erocker.. just to see if the problems i am getting are common problems..

Yessir, they are common problems that can be remedied by utilizing the steps I thanklessly provided in the last two pages.

so far i havnt been helped in my search for crossfire knowledge in the slightest..

That is just untrue. A statment like that just shows how dismissive you've been regarding everything I have been providing.

this is crossfire help thread isnt it.. or have i missed something.. ??

Think you answered your own question there...:rolleyes:

i did start my own thread but got exactly zilch..

Maybe that has something to do with your attitude.

this thread started off with CF in crysis and how to make it work.. what its about now i am beginning to wonder.. :)

trog

Apparently, you feel it's become your personal toilet. I assure you, it has not.

Move along and don't forget to flush!:slap:

[grunt_408]

http://i224.photobucket.com/albums/dd145/Craigleberry/crossfireenabled.jpg

I cant get tpu image uploader to work

http://img168.imageshack.us/img168/717/crossfireenabledfl5.th.png (http://img168.imageshack.us/my.php?image=crossfireenabledfl5.png)

[erocker]

http://i224.photobucket.com/albums/dd145/Craigleberry/crossfireenabled.jpg

I cant get tpu image uploader to work

http://img168.imageshack.us/img168/717/crossfireenabledfl5.th.png (http://img168.imageshack.us/my.php?image=crossfireenabledfl5.png)

It seems like your card isn't producing any textures. I would suggest doing an uninstall/reinstall of your display drivers.

[erocker]

Here's how to get three cards in Crossfire to work. (Vista only)

Have the bridges in this position:
http://img.techpowerup.org/080426/tf2.jpg http://img.techpowerup.org/080426/xtri.jpg
Using Catalyst 8.4's. Uninstalled all previous drivers, shut machine down and installed the cards and bridges. Installed 8.4's, restarted and all worked well.:)

[Dr. Spankenstein]

That, my friend, is impressive!

[trog100]

That, my friend, is impressive!

i recon u are full of it dude.. :roll: :roll:

the dr loves the dr and and so does someone else.. :D

i wont bother u again.. :toast:

trog

[grunt_408]

I did a re install of the lot. I formated the hdd and install windows from scratch. Still Crossfire not kicking in!!!! I hate these cards

[erocker]

I did a re install of the lot. I formated the hdd and install windows from scratch. Still Crossfire not kicking in!!!! I hate these cards

I think you either have a bad card or a bad crossfire bridge. Have you tried testing each card individually?

[gtoforce]

dudes
can a board with ATI Xpress 3200 Chipset run Crossfire X?
mine is ASUS A8R32-MVP Deluxe
in ATI site, it says it can, what more im crossfiring my X1950PRO on CAT 8.4 which says enable crossfire X
but can it do say, 3850 or 3870 in CF-X?
i dont wanna upgrade cuz im lazy to change my fx-60
plus, fx-60 can still play the latest games at ease
but i want dx 10.1 for future proofing and some people in my country are selling 3870XT 512mb at USD160 each (in my country its RM512)
what do u think?

[cdawall]

silly quetion why are 4 cards showing up on the CCC popup only 2 in CCC but 4 here?

http://img.techpowerup.org/080427/untitled727.png

[erocker]

One for each display output.

[cdawall]

One for each display output.

ahh makes sense oh BTW i finally got xfire working :D idk how and honestly i dont card but it does woot

[cdawall]

and its gone again :shadedshu

[Dr. Spankenstein]

Are you OCing the cards at all? though CCC?

[cdawall]

tried with and without still locks

[piebobs71]

ive noticed with my crossfire setup using two different speed cards that if i reboot and the fan on the powercolor extreme spins at 100% crossfire doesnt work ,reboot again and fan back to normal crossfire works.one of the reasons i was thinking of bios flashing the faster card to the slower cards speed but it only does it rarely so will probably just leave it for now.

[asb2106]

ok guys, this could be a stupid question, but I was hoping you could help......

I made some room on the desk for another monitor, and I have a 17" LCD Im not using, so I figured I would throw it in the mix.

I have not even attempted it, as it will probably turn out easy,

but to get 3 displays working on a crossfire setup, do I have to disable crossfire? From what I have seen if you xfire the cards the second cards output becomes unusable? Am I wrong?

[CY:G]

ok guys, this could be a stupid question, but I was hoping you could help......

I made some room on the desk for another monitor, and I have a 17" LCD Im not using, so I figured I would throw it in the mix.

I have not even attempted it, as it will probably turn out easy,

but to get 3 displays working on a crossfire setup, do I have to disable crossfire? From what I have seen if you xfire the cards the second cards output becomes unusable? Am I wrong?

You are not wrong, i have 3 monitors as well and if i activate Xfire the monitor on the second video card turns itself off..., its no biggie really, i just close all those apps running on that monitor -> enable crossfire -> game -> disable crossfire....

It is a hassle, but you get used to it.

[cdawall]

you could just set up 2 profiles and switch between the 2 ;)

[CY:G]

you could just set up 2 profiles and switch between the 2 ;)

Yeah i have to play with the profiles, right now im doing everything manually...

[cdawall]

anyone know why xfire would randomly enable/disable itself?

[asb2106]

cool !

Honestly, I rarely game anymore :(

I spend most of my time on a computer doing speadsheets(damn office work!) or ripping media, or other things around the computer.

Thanks guys

[asb2106]

anyone know why xfire would randomly enable/disable itself?

mine does that from time to time after a cold boot, its odd

[grunt_408]

ive noticed with my crossfire setup using two different speed cards that if i reboot and the fan on the powercolor extreme spins at 100% crossfire doesnt work ,reboot again and fan back to normal crossfire works.one of the reasons i was thinking of bios flashing the faster card to the slower cards speed but it only does it rarely so will probably just leave it for now.

I have noticed my sapphire spinning @100 percent a couple times and my powercolour idling away. especially when I boot up and before I got the powercolour I dont think the sapphire had ever been to 100 percent. I think the problem is with the Bios.
My crossfire works. Most games I get screen corruption while the game is loading up eg. the spalsh screen and welcome screen in bf2 but once loaded into a map its fine. wtf??? Disabling Cat A.I fixes the problem. It could be a faulty crossfire bridge I will have to try swapping them around with another one to find out.

[Wonderloaf]

Hi guys,

Firstly an apoligy as i'm a noob to xfire!

I've just installed a second hd2900xt on my asus board and i can't seem to get xfire to work? Two cards show in device manager, but i can only see one in catalyst? Of the one i can see, it only shows me one card? I've put the cards in correctly and installed both of the x fire bridges...

Am i doing something wrong? I've enabled xfire in catalyst but still no joy?

Any help would be most welcome!

Paul

[t_ski]

If both cards are configured for CrossFire, and the box for "Enable CrossFire" is checked in CCC, it should only show the one card in CCC. If it shows more than one card, it usually means CrossFire isn't working.

Did you run some benchmarks to see if there was a score difference? IIRC, there's a Shader (?) test in 3DM06 that should show an increase from one card to two cards, even if by some chance the CPU wasn't strong enough to push both cards.

[Wonderloaf]

Hi mate,

Thanks for the reply!

I tried to run 3d mark 06, but it simply won't workfor me? As soon as i run the program i get an error saying OpenAL32.dll is not found.

Game wise i notice no difference in either crysis or cod 4?

Paul

[erocker]

Try using GPU-Z?

[Wonderloaf]

Hi!

Just tried cpuz, shows both cards, but says xfire is disabled? However its enabled in catalyst?

One card is running bus interface PCI-E x16 @ 16
other is PCI-E x16 @ 4

All other settings are the same?

Again sorry for being a total NOOOOB!!!


Cheers,

Paul

[Dr. Spankenstein]

Hi mate,

Thanks for the reply!

I tried to run 3d mark 06, but it simply won't workfor me? As soon as i run the program i get an error saying OpenAL32.dll is not found.

Game wise i notice no difference in either crysis or cod 4?

Paul


There is an installation that occurs during the Futurmark 3DMark06 for OpenAL. You most likely chose not to install not knowing that it was critical for 3DM to run.

Install again.

[cdawall]

ok i just had xfire up and running just fine (required stock clocks to work) but now nothing i have rebooted shut down and powered back and still no xfire....this is very annoying im on cats 8.4 in XP 32 think i should try cat 8.2?

[grunt_408]

Hi!

Just tried cpuz, shows both cards, but says xfire is disabled? However its enabled in catalyst?

One card is running bus interface PCI-E x16 @ 16
other is PCI-E x16 @ 4

All other settings are the same?

Again sorry for being a total NOOOOB!!!


Cheers,

Paul

You must have a p35 chipset?
I have my crossfire working on my p35 it took a bit to get it going (with help from Dr Spankenstien) GPU-z will not tell you if crossfire is working or not.

[erocker]

ok i just had xfire up and running just fine (required stock clocks to work) but now nothing i have rebooted shut down and powered back and still no xfire....this is very annoying im on cats 8.4 in XP 32 think i should try cat 8.2?

The 8.4's should work. I would uninstall the drivers and before you reboot, delete the ATi folder on your system drive (default), then go into your Windows folder and find the temp and prefetch folders and delete everything. (If you have disk indexing off, there might not be anything in the prefetch folder). Shut down. Install one card, start-up, install catalyst. Then shut down and install the other card, start-up and XP will basically install the driver for the second card, give it a minute or so... Shut down, install bridges, start up, and go into CCC, enable crossfire and you should be good.:) Everyone having problems with crossfire should try this method as it works for me with XP and Vista with good success. Another thing is, if you decide for some reason to swap cards from one slot to the other, or just decide to use one card, reinstall your drivers. :toast:

[Dr. Spankenstein]

The man speaks from experience!

Preach on, brother!

[cdawall]

The 8.4's should work. I would uninstall the drivers and before you reboot, delete the ATi folder on your system drive (default), then go into your Windows folder and find the temp and prefetch folders and delete everything. (If you have disk indexing off, there might not be anything in the prefetch folder). Shut down. Install one card, start-up, install catalyst. Then shut down and install the other card, start-up and XP will basically install the driver for the second card, give it a minute or so... Shut down, install bridges, start up, and go into CCC, enable crossfire and you should be good.:) Everyone having problems with crossfire should try this method as it works for me with XP and Vista with good success. Another thing is, if you decide for some reason to swap cards from one slot to the other, or just decide to use one card, reinstall your drivers. :toast:

will try it this afternoon

[Wonderloaf]

The 8.4's should work. I would uninstall the drivers and before you reboot, delete the ATi folder on your system drive (default), then go into your Windows folder and find the temp and prefetch folders and delete everything. (If you have disk indexing off, there might not be anything in the prefetch folder). Shut down. Install one card, start-up, install catalyst. Then shut down and install the other card, start-up and XP will basically install the driver for the second card, give it a minute or so... Shut down, install bridges, start up, and go into CCC, enable crossfire and you should be good.:) Everyone having problems with crossfire should try this method as it works for me with XP and Vista with good success. Another thing is, if you decide for some reason to swap cards from one slot to the other, or just decide to use one card, reinstall your drivers. :toast:

Tried this just now and still no crossfire? Time for this PC to take a try out my window lol :banghead:

Paul

[erocker]

Tried this just now and still no crossfire? Time for this PC to take a try out my window lol :banghead:

Paul

Don't go that far yet!:laugh: The things that come to mind are, bad crossfire bridge(s), bad card, chipset drivers not up to date or something is missing, other drivers not up to date or missing, perhaps a setting in your motherboard's bios for dual gfx cards, DX9/10 not up to date. I don't know what motherboard or OS you are using. Fill out your system specs in the User Control Panel. :toast:

[asb2106]

Don't go that far yet!:laugh: The things that come to mind are, bad crossfire bridge(s), bad card, chipset drivers not up to date or something is missing, other drivers not up to date or missing, perhaps a setting in your motherboard's bios for dual gfx cards, DX9/10 not up to date. I don't know what motherboard or OS you are using. Fill out your system specs in the User Control Panel. :toast:

Im guessing its a setting in bios

the P35s that I have worked on have a setting for dual cards. Those were gigabyte mobos, that could be it!

It was called crosstalk or something like that

[Wonderloaf]

Don't go that far yet!:laugh: The things that come to mind are, bad crossfire bridge(s), bad card, chipset drivers not up to date or something is missing, other drivers not up to date or missing, perhaps a setting in your motherboard's bios for dual gfx cards, DX9/10 not up to date. I don't know what motherboard or OS you are using. Fill out your system specs in the User Control Panel. :toast:

Filled out my spec!

Could the fact that my processor is not fully supported by ASUS yet have anything to do with crossfire not working?

I've tested both cards and they seem fine? I take it a simple continuity test on the bridge pins will prove if they are working or not?

Thanks

Paul:rockout:

[erocker]

Did you look, or are there any settings in the bios to enable two cards?

[Wonderloaf]

I couldn't see any settings to enable both cards, there is nothing in the mobo user manual either, its shows crossfire to be pretty much plug and play (plug and pray in my case!:P)

[erocker]

Can you post of screenshot of cpu-z, gpu-z, and CCC? PrintScreen>Paint>save as .jpg>upload it with TPU's free image hosting, the copy and paste the url to your post. If you don't know how to do that already.:)

[cdawall]

still a no go for me as well....

xfire works off a cold boot though its weird

[Wonderloaf]

Heres a few shots of what you asked for, it doesn't mean that much to me lol

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v128/rsnutter/1-1.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v128/rsnutter/3.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v128/rsnutter/2.jpg

Is that enough info?

Paul

[cdawall]

it doesn't see your second card is the card plugged into the PSU with the 6 pin connector?

[erocker]

Does it give you any messages under diagnostics in CCC? Try insterting the driver disk that came with your motherboards with both cards in. The mobo's may be missing the drivers necessary for both cards to work.

[Wonderloaf]

The primary card has both 8pin and 6 pin connected. The slave card has two 6 pins connected as my psu doesn't have another 8 pin spare...

[Wonderloaf]

Does it give you any messages under diagnostics?

Diagnostics is just blank mate?

[cdawall]

does device manager see it?

[erocker]

The primary card has both 8pin and 6 pin connected. The slave card has two 6 pins connected as my psu doesn't have another 8 pin spare...

Might want to try pulling the extra two pins out of the master, just so everything is "even", though I doubt it's the problem.

[Wonderloaf]

does device manager see it?


Shows two in device manager

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v128/rsnutter/4.jpg

[Wonderloaf]

Might want to try pulling the extra two pins out of the master, just so everything is "even", though I doubt it's the problem.


I'll give that a bash now!:toast:

[erocker]

You are missing a driver in "other devices", could be the pci-e bridge driver keeping crossfire from working. Did you "unlock" overdrive? Once unlocked you should be able to see both cards via the second drop down menu.

[Wonderloaf]

Just unlocked overdrive, i can now see both cards in the pull down menu!

Missing driver was "ATI T200 Unified AVStream Driver" whatever that is!

Paul

[cdawall]

i got mine working!!!

[Wonderloaf]

I'm very jealous lol, Well done chum!!

[cdawall]

I'm very jealous lol, Well done chum!!

it not working was my fault i didn't clean off my old NV drivers and those were causing issues

now all i need are coolers for them 770/1044 is making them run into the 80s which is a little warm for my taste

[t_ski]

Listen to me (I said this before) - If CrossFire is enabled, only one card will show up in CCC. Also, if the cards are working right, the Diagnostics section will be blank. If you look at GPU-z, the bottom left shows the GPU. If you click the down arrow on the right side of the box, two GPU's will be listed. (GPU-z can only display the info for one card at a time).

My guess is that your CrossFire is configured right. Just because it only shows one GPU in CCC doesn't mean it's not working. Do some benchmarks and see if there is a difference from one card to two. If you still have problems, I would say that your CPU is just not fast enough to really push both cards.

[BATOFF]

I run a 3870X2 and a 3870 in Crossfire using Cats 8.4 I know Crossfire works because when I run dual montiors, I have 3 instances of GPU-Z on the second screen as I game on the Primary. I can see in each of the sensor tab in GPU-Z the gpu load, temps and fan speed of each gpu. The 3870X2 and the 3870. Load is spread quite evenly between the 3 gpu's.

[Dr. Spankenstein]

@ cdawall,

Great news! Glad you got that worked out!

I can't recall how many times leftover drivers have bunged-up a perfectly good system. Now go post some scores!!!


@ Wonderloaf,

Update please? Where are you at with things?

@ BATOFF,

Welcome! Now....

Where are YOUR scores, man?!? We could use someone with specs like yours posting in the 3DM06 and Vantage compilations!!!

[Wonderloaf]

Hi guys,

Sorry been away playing with old RS fords the last few days, i'll try and get a benchmark for you later on tonight!

Thanks again for the help!


Paul

[cdawall]

@ cdawall,

Great news! Glad you got that worked out!

I can't recall how many times leftover drivers have bunged-up a perfectly good system. Now go post some scores!!!


@ Wonderloaf,

Update please? Where are you at with things?

@ BATOFF,

Welcome! Now....

Where are YOUR scores, man?!? We could use someone with specs like yours posting in the 3DM06 and Vantage compilations!!!

http://forums.techpowerup.com/showthread.php?t=58359

there all in there

[Dr. Spankenstein]

I just took a read through. Great Stuff!!!

Very insightful thread, keep it up!

[Wonderloaf]

Hi guys, still can't get 3d mark 06 to work, so i tried the trial version of 3d mark vantage these are the results :-

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v128/rsnutter/5.jpg

What are your opinions?

Paul

[t_ski]

Looking at the 3DVantage thread here:

http://forums.techpowerup.com/showthread.php?t=58927

The scores for dual ATI cards are:

ATi Scores - Multi-Card Setup's

1. T_ski - HIS HD3870 X2 Xfire @ 825/901 - P11321 - Q6600 @ 3599Mhz
2. Dr.Spankenstein - HIS HD3870 Xfire @ 958/1242 - P7748 - E8500 @ 3990Mhz
3. kinicker - GeCube HD3870 Xfire @ 777/1126 - P5791 - A64 X2 6000+ @ 3405Mhz

#2 & 3 are closest to your setup, but obviously your CPU speed is much lower. If you look at the difference in kinicker's CPU speed and score compared to your CPU speed and score, they are fairly close. Your CPU is about 12% slower, and so is your score.

[Wonderloaf]

My cards are both running at standard clock settings and my (cpu q9300) is not fully supported by my asus mobo yet (mean overclocking makes the system unstable), will the cpu support have a drastic effect on crossfire?

I'm sorry to sound silly but do you think my crossfire is working based on the 3d mark score? I've noticed no differnce in cod4 or crysis with the crossfire setup?

Thanks once more for the help!

Paul

[t_ski]

It's hard to say exactly without a before and after score If you are willing to do a little work, try disabling CrossFire in CCC, then power down the system and remove the second card. Then run the test again and see what, if any, the score difference is.

BTW, I just remembered there was a hotfix for 3DM06 that was required for 2900's and up. I even had to apply it for my X2's in Vista. Perhaps that's why your 3DM06 won't run.

[krist2]

Hello, just wantet to share one of my findings.
I got a second HD3870 some days ago, and I couldn't get CF to work properly. It worked sometimes, but most of the time it didn't. And I couldn't find a system to it.
Then I googled and found a forum post where someone had uninstalled quicktime/Itunes, and got CF to work nicely. I tried this, but not with much hope.
But, lo and behold, it worked great. And for the last 3 days CF has worked for me without problems.

Hope this will help some off you :D

[erocker]

Very good to know krist2!:toast:

[erocker]

Hi guys, still can't get 3d mark 06 to work, so i tried the trial version of 3d mark vantage these are the results :-

What are your opinions?

Paul

This is the hotfix. http://downloads.guru3d.com/download.php?det=1761

[Wonderloaf]

I tried the hotfix, but still no joy with '06

I haven't had a chance to try a benchmark with just one card, we actually have sun in Ireland for once:twitch::twitch:, so i've been out making the most of that lol.

I'll try to get a single card benchmark done soon.

Cheers,

Paul

[Dr. Spankenstein]

So answer me this, does it even load or is it crashing?

By all enjoy the day! I thought I saw a bright column of light to the Northeast, must have been the sunlight reflecting off all you pale Irish folk!

j/k

[Wonderloaf]

I'm burnt as a burnt thing :P

3dm06 doesn't load at all, i still get the same error as before.

[trog100]

I'm burnt as a burnt thing :P

3dm06 doesn't load at all, i still get the same error as before.

its the dll in the windows/system32/futuremark folder that needs deleting to make 2006.. 2005 and 2003 run.. i cant remember the exactly name of it.. but there are two in there one needs removing..

trog

ps... its the Direcpll.dll

[t_ski]

I that doesn't work, try this:

Q35 Why does the system hang when I run "3DMarks" by my HD2900XT card.
A. This can be solved by adding a -nosysteminfo switch. For example, if you are running 3Dmark06, please try the following:

- Right click the 3DMark06 Icon in the Desktop
- Select Properties > ShortCut
- In the Target Field, add a space and then - nosysteminfo
- Click OK.

3DMark will then run without problem. In the future, 3DMark will have an update to solve this.

http://www.hisdigital.com/html/faq.htm

[Dr. Spankenstein]

What t_ski posted should work. If not, go the the Futuremark folder in X:/Windows/System 32/Futuremark/MSC and change the name (or delete) the Direcpll.dll.

That should sort you out.

Aloe vera is VERY good for basting your burnt, pasty flesh! ;)

[Wonderloaf]

Hi guys,

Firstly i like to say thanks for all the replys, you are possibly the most helpful group of people i've ever come across! :toast::toast:

Still no joy with 3dm'06. My Futuremark folder is located in "sysWOW64" and deleting Direcpll.dll does not help. Neither does adding the additional part into the shortcut.:banghead:

I've given up on crossfire, time to sell both cards and by one better one that works lol :nutkick: Nothing is ever easy for me :cry:

Paul

[Lopsku]

Heya folks! Just upgraded my whole system exluding the HDDs yesterday and iam having major issues with my 2 HD 3870s. Iam not exatly sure if this is a crossfire problem, while it is the top suspect but anyway..
my current system is:

athlon xp64 x2 5600+
4GB kingston's DDR2/800mhz ram
Asrock ALiveXFire-eSATA2 R3.0 (480x chipset)
2x sapphire's (new?) 1 slot 3870s

my problem is that the cards are REALLY underperforming. Running crysis everything on high with 0xAA at 1280x1024 only gives me an average FPS of ~20 in-game. The benchmark thing gives me about 23 FPS. Considering the low resolution i think iam right in saying it should get quite a lot more. And when i enable crossfire the framerates stay the same, so obviously something is wrong but i dont have the slightest idea what at this point.

Iam pretty sure crossfire itself is working becouse iam able to choose it from CCC and GPU-z tells me its enabled too. Also i can see both cards in device manager and GPU-z. CCC only shows me 1 card whether xfire is enabled or not. I've tried reinstalling the drivers while having the Xfire bridges disconnectec, havent tried the 1card at a time way, yet.
I will try the 1card at a time way tomorrow since its getting late but if you guys have any ideas/could redirect me to someplace else that might have the answer i would greatly apreciate it.

Thanks

[trog100]

run a 3dmark.. 2006 is the most common.. note the difference between CF enabled and disabled.. u should see a difference in the score..

most things dont work with CF.. its a driver problem.. the 3dmarks do.. crysis shows a small gain for me.. not a lot thow..

your 3dmark gain wont be very great (your amd cpu will hold the score back) but it will be there is CF is working..

in truth for me CF with my XP system is a waste of space.. it shows a gain where i dont need it with four year old games and a gain in 2006.. but in pretty much every other later game i have its useless.. frame rates are less with it enabled than disabled..

the mileage for others might differ but i know what mine is.. f-cking useless.. :laugh:

trog

ps.. i think u will find your CF is working.. just not quite doing what u expected it to..

[Lopsku]

ps.. i think u will find your CF is working.. just not quite doing what u expected it to..

I guess you could say that is exactly the problem iam having but like i said, even on one card the frame rates are way too pathetic. I seriously doubt my CPU alone would be able to put the FPS down by ~20 as it isn't that slow.

i ran 3dmark06 as you asked but had some problems submitting the scores so didnt get a chance to see them. By looking at the frame rates i would say it was pretty hard to determine whether the C/F was working properly or not as i didnt see any noticable increase there either. 1-3fps difference compared to the single card run is hardly the amount i should be getting right?

Ill post some Screenshots later on if necessary.

edit:
Ok got some 3dmark06 results now:
http://koti.mbnet.fi/looperi/results.JPG

So as expected crossfire is working but like i said the performance is.. unacceptable.

[Lopsku]

Nevermind! Turns out it has something to do with my ram rather than the GPUs.

[imperialreign]

first off, I'd like to mention that the most recent beta of ATI Tray Tools allows Crossfire control - there is no longer any need to have CCC load/run at all anymore. Works great with my dual 1950 PROs. Most recent beta can be found here: http://cid-a50350ea7a969f0c.skydrive.live.com/self.aspx/Public/attsetup.exe

now on to my issue . . . if anyone has any thoughts . . .

running STALKER, every now and then I completely lose a GPU, noticeable when the FPS drop through the floor. If you alt+tab out, and then back into the game, everything is back to normal, and sometimes running the console command vid_restart will reset things as well. it also seems to do this more in only a couple of areas in the game, and not everywhere.

I at first thought it might be driver related, so I rolled back to 8.2 from 8.4, and the didn't affect it at all. So I reinstalled 8.4 . . . I thought perhaps it could be due to defragmented files, so I ran PerfectDisk, plus cleaned and defragged the WIN registry . . . no affect (although the game loads a little quicker now :p).

I'm thinking it might be something to do with how the game is coded, but not sure; anyone have any ideas?

[trog100]

I guess you could say that is exactly the problem iam having but like i said, even on one card the frame rates are way too pathetic. I seriously doubt my CPU alone would be able to put the FPS down by ~20 as it isn't that slow.

i ran 3dmark06 as you asked but had some problems submitting the scores so didnt get a chance to see them. By looking at the frame rates i would say it was pretty hard to determine whether the C/F was working properly or not as i didnt see any noticable increase there either. 1-3fps difference compared to the single card run is hardly the amount i should be getting right?

Ill post some Screenshots later on if necessary.

edit:
Ok got some 3dmark06 results now:
http://koti.mbnet.fi/looperi/results.JPG

So as expected crossfire is working but like i said the performance is.. unacceptable.

an example of my earlier amd system for u.. 6000+ cpu at 3.350 ghz.. one overclocked 850/1250.. 3870 card.. msi 790..16 x 16 pci-e 2 mobo.. 4 gigs of system ram.. 2006 score 11000... one card not too bad..

the same system with CF scored 13000... two cards not very good.. your amd system is gonna be way down on the one i quote and your gain wont be as much..

your scores aint far out i dont think.. CF is a waste of space.. it really wont do what u expect it to.. he he

now if u put the resolution up in 2006 u will see a better gain from CF.. but only if the game (or bench) uses both cards properly.. few do.. the lightsmark one dosnt.. the furbench one dosnt in fact its only the 3dmarks that do show any gain.. the software has to be coded to use both gpus.. sadly most of it still isnt.. the same applies to multi cpus..

all the happy bunnies use overclocked intel cpus and get their kick from seeing a higher 3dmark score.. the rest they take for granted..

both ati and nvidia make bloody sure things work in the 3dmarks.. shame they dont put the same effort into what most of us buy grafix cards for.. games..

i got rid of my first CF second card months back.. then i went intel and (like a prat) got another second card just for the higher 2006 score..

but my general CF results are totally disappointing i am just glad i didnt fork out for a 3870 x 2 card.. he he

CF with my intel cpu at 4.5 ghz boosts my 2006 score from 13000 to 17000..

i am happy with how one 3870 goes but two... a (gaming) waste of space.. energy.. and another 512 megs of my 32 bit system memory.. i now see 3 gig as opposed to 3.5 gig.. he he

i can well undertsand why so many folks think their CF isnt working.. the truth is that most of the time it dosnt.. in fact its that bad that people think they must be doing something wrong.. they aint it really is crap.. he he

three or four cards is even more of a joke..

trog

[Lopsku]

Well so far your right on atleast one thing: crossfire is a rather big disappointment, atleast at this point. If this indeed is all the performance these cards can put out then what can i say except that i feel a bit ripped off.

Just doesnt add up that a friend of mine with the same CPU can score higher on 3dmark with a single 8800gt and gets 15fps more on crysis even though he has 2gb less memory :/

[tkpenalty]

Multi GPU technologies these days need something better than a 6000+ Clocked at 3.36Ghz to be fully utilised; maybe a Q6600 @ 3.6Ghz would make a difference. It seems that none of the AMD CPUs are able to make full use of their spider platform's graphics potential...

Lopsku, a poor CPU choice would be to blame.

[Lopsku]

Sounds fair enough after comparing the results other people have gotten. Well guess ill upgrade it next month or so :P

[Lopsku]

ya you were right it is indeed the prosessor thats holding em back. What i did notice though was that my current BIOS version didnt support this exact model of 5600+. So after updating the bios i ran 3dmark again with crossfire on and got this:
http://koti.mbnet.fi/looperi/newscore.JPG

So a 1,5k increase from just updating the bios to support the CPU correctly. Crysis got a nice FPS boost as well so now i can live with this processor for a while. Will try some overclocking once i get a better cooling solution for my PC :)

[CrackerJack]

http://koti.mbnet.fi/looperi/newscore.JPG

What are your specs?

[trog100]

Sounds fair enough after comparing the results other people have gotten. Well guess ill upgrade it next month or so :P

its not the cpu that holds general CF performance back.. its lack of proper driver/game support..

if all one cares about is a high 2006 default score a way overclocked intel cpu is needed.. no amd cpu is fast enough to give high default 2006 scores..

but default 2006 scores really aint what CF should be bloody well about.. dont blame the cpu for poor CF performance in general cos it only applies to one silly thing.. default low resolution (cpu limited cos it dosnt stress the grafix card enough) 2006 scores.. repeat.. default low resolution 2006 benchmark scores..

so statements like CF is held back by lower power cpus are bollocks.. CF is held back pretty much universally by poor software/driver support..

the fastest cpu on the planet wont help CF performance at gaming resolutions and settings.. only proper software support will do that.. and it just aint there..

if and only if all u care about is a higher default 2006 score a faster intel cpu will help.. but it wont help in the slightest with any game.. lets just get things in perspective..

a faster cpu will not.. repeat will not.. help your crysis CF frame rates in the slightest.. it will help one thing and only one thing.. 3dmark scores..

CF is.. as yet.. a bag of nails.. :mad:

trog

ps... just for interest.. at 800 x 600 resolution lowest settings CF with my intel cpu at 4 gig scores 187 frames per second with the gpu bench in crysis.. one card 187 fps.. exactly the same 187 fps with CF.. its what happens when the card isnt stressed enough.. even in crysis..

however at real gaming settings my amd at 3.35 gig pulled the same frame rates in crysis as my current intel system does.. in real life gaming amd is just as good as intel.. and in crysis ati CF wont give as many fps as a fast single nvidia card does.. the power is there but the game simply dsont use it.. its an nvidia coded game.. "how its meant to be played".. ???

[cdawall]

http://service.futuremark.com/compare?3dm06=6687880

that look right cards are @ 700/900 cpu @ 3.2ghz

[Lopsku]

a faster cpu will not.. repeat will not.. help your crysis CF frame rates in the slightest.. it will help one thing and only one thing.. 3dmark scores..



i beg to differ, there obviously is atleast some sort of limit as to how far the CPU will help the FPS with CF or not, i haven't bothered to try with it disabled as i dont really care about single card scores now that i found the reason they were lacking performance.

what other explanation would there be for my "mysterious" fps increase after updating the bios to support the correct processor model? Note that the bios update was only to rewrite the CPU code so the performance couldn't have come from anywhere else.

Just basing this on my personal experience and nothing else.

[trog100]

i beg to differ, there obviously is atleast some sort of limit as to how far the CPU will help the FPS with CF or not, i haven't bothered to try with it disabled as i dont really care about single card scores now that i found the reason they were lacking performance.

what other explanation would there be for my "mysterious" fps increase after updating the bios to support the correct processor model? Note that the bios update was only to rewrite the CPU code so the performance couldn't have come from anywhere else.

Just basing this on my personal experience and nothing else.

what limits fame rates can be the grafix card or it can be the cpu.. at normal gaming frame rates with graphically intensive games its the grafix card..

however if the setting and resolution is lowered enough the frame rates will go up till in the end the cpu eventually limits things.. low frame rates will not be a problem in this instance.. where low frame rates are the problem (crysis) its the grafix card holding things back not the cpu..

your bios "mysterious" is just that a "mysterious".. weird things happen.. i am simply stating basic facts.. u wanna doubt what i say (beg to differ) thats entirely up to u.. :)

fact.. a faster intell cpu will help your 3dmark scores but it wont do anything meaningful for your crysis playing experience..

trog

ps.. what the CF gain now in 2006 or dont u wanna know.. he he he

[imperialreign]

TBH, in regards to the mysterious increase after a BIOS update -

I think it has more to do with better BUS negotiation with the new BIOS. IMO, the SYS BUS has more of a direct impact on CF performance than the CPU does, but we tend to overlook that as we OC a CPU, we're also OCing the BUS itself . . . usually. Not saying that a CPU doesn't have some impact, as it still does, just not that big of an extent.


From what I've seen and experienced with my somewhat outdated pair, is their performance in game is more dependant on how well the game itself is coded. Sure, I've found that the driver version comes into play, but with the exception of CAT 8.3, I haven't had any performance issues with a new CAT release. Some games are just coded horribly for multi GPU support, and with most, it's usually an afterthought that's implimented with a patch - and, I'm sorry, but to impliment multi-GPU support properly with a patch means that the devs goofed during initial development.

IMO, multi-GPU support in a game should be coded during development, not patched in or tacked on last minute. Perhaps in the next year or two we'll start seeing more games developed this way, but right now it still remains to be seen, for the most part.

[RobRedbeard]

Excellent guide. One note though.. This extreme uninstall scenerio, boot to safe mode (?users should never have to do that for anything) should only be done if someone is having problems. To put it frankly, I didn't. It's hard to know what causes this sort of non-plug-and-play install to be necessary, but it is not at all necessary for all users, or even most. There's a lot of us for whom Crossfire always worked fine, only we rarely fill up forums with posts of "Easy install!" We're just busy rock'n out in TF2.

How did I install? I opened my case. Put the card in. Connected the bridge. Turned on the computer. After a detect of the card, I had to reboot once. That was it. Nothing didn't work right. I plugged -- it played -- I fragged with much better FPS. Vista 64-bit.

My FPS in UT3 went from 40-70 to 65-150, after Crysis was updated (v1.2) I got great scalability in it too: 1680x1050 Medium was silky playable. Assassin's Creed worked fine with a name change to the Call of Juarez exe.

To test this, I also did the uber clean procedure. Wow, what a pain in the neck, but if you have a problem, that should fix it. For me, the results seemed the same, though. My properly working (out of the box) Crossfire still worked properly, but no better. So, I would say, plug your card in, try it out that way, and if it doesn't work like it should, you've got one of the mystery configurations that are confusing the Catalyst driver and should do this super-clean procedure.

Rob

[CrackerJack]

My FPS in UT3 went from 40-70 to 65-150, after Crysis was updated (v1.2)

Rob

WOW :eek: 65-150fps :eek:

[RobRedbeard]

CrackerJack (I love those, it sucks that I can't find them here in China.. Next time I'm home I should pick some up..) I can't tell if your WOW is high or low. You're clearly more pro than me, so I assume my FPS are low?

Rob

[t_ski]

No, for Crysis that's damn good.

[CrackerJack]

CrackerJack (I love those, it sucks that I can't find them here in China.. Next time I'm home I should pick some up..) I can't tell if your WOW is high or low. You're clearly more pro than me, so I assume my FPS are low?

Rob

no no no that's really good. The last time i check i was getting around 50fp in UT3 with single card, at only 1280x1024 And only 20-30fps in crysis :rockout:

[RobRedbeard]

Okay. Those numbers are based on memory from back before I was overclocking the cards. Now, one of my cards is in the loving care of Sapphire, who promises to make it live again (no I didn't fry it overclocking).

So, I just fired up UT3 with one card. It is currently clocked at 860 MHz and 1306 Mhz with a Thermaltake DuOrb VGA cooler installed. UT3 is v1.2 and I'm opening a Deathmatch on Sentinel with 6 bots set on adept. My resolution is 1680x1050x60Hz and UT3 settings are maxed out. Smooth FPS, mouse, and vert sync are disabled. CCC settings for 3d are everything set to "use application settings (I hate AA)" except mipmap which is set to Quality and Cat AI which is set to advanced.

I am now getting 70-120 FPS in this setting with this one card.

PS I'm running the Cat 8.49 beta driver, I have but haven't installed the 8.5 driver yet. Also, UT3 is really CPU hungry and I also have a BFG Ageia PhysX card in the system and a pretty kick'n CPU.

[slyoteboy]

:mad: Got to step 8 , went to device manager and would not show the second card. Any help would be greatly appreciated , thank you.

Vista Home 64bit
GA-MA790X-DS4
2 HIS Radeon HD2600XT pcie16 cards
Catalyst 8.5

[CrackerJack]

:mad: Got to step 8 , went to device manager and would not show the second card. Any help would be greatly appreciated , thank you.

Vista Home 64bit
GA-MA790X-DS4
2 HIS Radeon HD2600XT pcie16 cards
Catalyst 8.5

make sure the card is in slot and the power is connect good.


oh by the way, don't ever get phemon with that board!!!

[slyoteboy]

I went to check for the power , these boards dont have external power sockets? do they get it thru the motherboard? I even switched the top to the bottom and the bottom to the top , still not picking it up. Oh and it does have phenom 9500 :( my bros computer

[CrackerJack]

I went to check for the power , these boards dont have external power sockets? do they get it thru the motherboard? I even switched the top to the bottom and the bottom to the top , still not picking it up. Oh and it does have phenom 9500

your card will get power from the psu. the 2600 should have a 6-pin on each card. if this isn't what your talking about. then sorry. i'm sick

[slyoteboy]

No I cant find the 6 pin on either card.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814161174

[CrackerJack]

No I cant find the 6 pin on either card.

ok this is wierd.

which card do you have? one has a external power. but's it's not 6-pin. it's a molex :wtf:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814161207
or
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814161174

[CrackerJack]

No I cant find the 6 pin on either card.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814161174

well atleast we are on the same page :laugh:

which card are using as primary? top or bottom?

[slyoteboy]

lol. How do you set primary? I have the display hooked into the one on top.

[CrackerJack]

lol. How do you set primary? I have the display hooked into the one on top.

the primary on that board is the bottom. the one closest to the pci slots. you can run it on top. well suppose too, mine would work one day then it wouldn't work the next.

[slyoteboy]

I just tried hooking the display up to both dvi ports on the bottom , nothing.

[slyoteboy]

pulled the top card out , it works on the bottom now

[CrackerJack]

pulled the top card out , it works on the bottom now

you have to change it in bios. change it to PEG1

when you take one out it's gonna auto set either lane.

[slyoteboy]

Ok , now it picked it up as a new vid card.

[CrackerJack]

Ok , now it picked it up as a new vid card.

ok, you still just have that one in? right

[slyoteboy]

Ok now showing two video cards , just powered down put bridges on , wish me luck :)

[CrackerJack]

Ok now showing two video cards , just powered down put bridges on , wish me luck :)

you'll find then, glad to help :toast:


remember to hit the thanks buttom, good luck

[cdawall]

Ok now showing two video cards , just powered down put bridges on , wish me luck :)

don't use 2 bridges it causes issues in xfire ;)

[slyoteboy]

God damnit. Im not out of the storm yet. Ok so display plugged into bottom card , no bridge I can get into windows and see two video cards. I hook bridges up , bottom card wont display. have to go to top card display port , then i can get into windows , but it only shows one video card , and no crossfire option in CCC. Any more ideas?

[slyoteboy]

wait wait , so DO NOT use 2 bridge cables? And when I get into windows and crossfire is working will it : shows two vid cards or one in device manager , and 2. give me crossfire choice in CCC

[CrackerJack]

wait wait , so DO NOT use 2 bridge cables? And when I get into windows and crossfire is working will it : shows two vid cards or one in device manager , and 2. give me crossfire choice in CCC

i don't know about the bridges on the 2600 cards. did you change it in bios?

bios>advance features> init> PEG1

Then connect the DVI to the bottom card

[slyoteboy]

alright let me try that , and does the bridge go a certain way or is it universal

[slyoteboy]

Ok , PEG1 setting , bottom card , bridge installed , will not display anything. Same setting Top card , goes into windows but no Xfire , or other videocard in device manager.

[CrackerJack]

Ok , PEG1 setting , bottom card , bridge installed , will not display anything. Same setting Top card , goes into windows but no Xfire , or other videocard in device manager.

the DS4 sometime will take a few seconds or a even up to a min to show a post screen. so try the bottom one again witht second in, without bridges.

[slyoteboy]

Ok both cards in , no bridges , bottom one , PEG1 setting gets me into windows , viewing 2 video cards in device manager.

[CrackerJack]

Ok both cards in , no bridges , bottom one , PEG1 setting gets me into windows , viewing 2 video cards in device manager.

ok, open ccc, do you see the crossfire tab?

[slyoteboy]

yes i can see the xfire tab , but it says no bridge connect , but yea i can see it.

[CrackerJack]

yes i can see the xfire tab , but it says no bridge connect , but yea i can see it.

ok shutoff, connect the them and boot up

[slyoteboy]

ok , do the bridges go a certain way , one end is JA1 the other is JA2

[slyoteboy]

ok I booted it , been going about 2 minutes no display

[slyoteboy]

ati card , never again :(

[CrackerJack]

ati card , never again :(

something isn't right!

[slyoteboy]

any ideas? INIT settings? What about going in bridgeless , uninstalling vid card drivers and reinstalling just drivers?

[CrackerJack]

if you can do it with out the bridges, then go for it.