Who'll be the better president?

[farlex85]

i have a friend who is rich and has had to pay a MILLION dollars in taxes one year and to think he should pay more is absurd. this man got there from working harder then most of us can even imagine working.

That can be a good sign of a psychological disorder, although "disorder" could be viewed as relative. Your friend must be quite wealthy to pay that much for taxes, and although I may not believe it is entirely fair to tax him more, I think it's more unfair that some are doomed to have not shelter nor food, or even if they do no doctor, when there is plenty for all. Therefore, I feel more sympathy for those have nothing than for those who have much, and thus are made to give a littler more. He can whine all he wants about paying more, I very much doubt I'll care. But that's just me.

 

[ckoons1]

yes, some people do make that kind of $$$ and yes they do pay these kind of taxes. look i am getting this information straight from the horses mouth. whether you belive me or not is irrelevant but it is none the less TRUE. i would not insult my friends integrity by asking for a tax return to show you. that is absurd but what i have told you is indeed the truth. i can't help it if you can't accept it.it is not his job to work his arse off for someone else.

 

[mdm-adph]

yes, some people do make that kind of $$$ and yes they do pay these kind of taxes. look i am getting this information straight from the horses mouth. whether you belive me or not is irrelevant but it is none the less TRUE. i would not insult my friends integrity by asking for a tax return to show you. that is absurd but what i have told you is indeed the truth. i can't help it if you can't accept it.

No, you got it wrong...

Whether or not it's true, an example using your friend is irrelevant, without proof.

Understand?

Let me tell you a story:

I have a "friend" who makes millions but pays virtually no taxes. How do they do it? They adopt children and house them in their residence for huge tax breaks (yes -- people actually do this), and they make huge donations of old crap and claim it on their tax forms.

However, I don't expect you to believe one bit of this, since I'm not giving any proof, nor will you insult me by not believing one bit of it.

 

[WhiteLotus]

have to say it:

your "friend" paid a MILLION $ in tax? either you pay that much as well or he is a member of the family, because there is no chance that a millionaire would mix with an average joe.

 

[ckoons1]

giving you a real life situation is not irrelevant but reality. i can't help it you don't believe me but for you to think i would go to a friend and ask for a tax return to prove to people in this forum is absurd. this is just a discussion and will not have any impact on the outcome of this election.
gotta go.have a good evening.

 

[ckoons1]

i am his trainer and yes he mixes with average Joes everyday. they are just people like everyone else.
www.clifkoons.tripod.com

have to say it:

your "friend" paid a MILLION $ in tax? either you pay that much as well or he is a member of the family, because there is no chance that a millionaire would mix with an average joe.

 

[jtleon]

Moving out of the US.....LOL

disadvan) the richer might say "sod this, i'm moving to x country where they wont tax me"

Move where? A desert island? and what about the cost of that move? or the cost of employing necessary security forces to protect the relocated wealth? As far as I know, the U.S. is the lowest taxed civilized location for wealth - taxes are higher in all other developed countries.

Wealth protection is very expensive!

jtleon

 

[mdm-adph]

Move where? A desert island?

You mean like Aruba? One of the greatest tax havens on the face of the Earth? That kinda desert island?

 

[niko084]

have to say it:

your "friend" paid a MILLION $ in tax? either you pay that much as well or he is a member of the family, because there is no chance that a millionaire would mix with an average joe.

I definitely wouldn't say that... Considering I have lunch with numerous millionaires fairly often and not just for business, play golf, go sailing, party with them... I make eh 45k'ish a year, one of these guys happens to make somewhere around the 1.5-2 million a year mark.

It's more common that the millionaire doesn't want to mix with the average joe because the average joe isn't too intelligent and can't hold a conversation with them for more than 5 minutes without being lost of making an *** of themselves by acting the wrong way in the wrong situation. It's about fitting into a group.

And while some of the rich do not pay any taxes, others keep things honest and do pay. I know guys that make around 600k, that could apply and get food stamps.... I also know people that make around the same and pay normal taxes and donate more than 50% of their yearly income to various funds just because that's the way they are.

 

[mdm-adph]

i am his trainer and yes he mixes with average Joes everyday. they are just people like everyone else.
www.clifkoons.tripod.com

That's not true at all. Weightlifters are not people like everyone else. They're big beefy men with oily muscles. Or Governors of California.

By the way -- you should be very, very careful about posting personal information about yourself, especially in a forum of technologically-minded people (if this truly is you).

 

[mdm-adph]

I definitely wouldn't say that... Considering I have lunch with numerous millionaires fairly often and not just for business, play golf, go sailing, party with them... I make eh 45k'ish a year, one of these guys happens to make somewhere around the 1.5-2 million a year mark.

It's more common that the millionaire doesn't want to mix with the average joe because the average joe isn't too intelligent and can't hold a conversation with them for more than 5 minutes without being lost of making an *** of themselves by acting the wrong way in the wrong situation. It's about fitting into a group.

Oh those poor stupid average Joe's who can't hold a decent conversation. How nice of them to have such noble individuals like you thinking of them from time to time. :shadedshu

By the way, you sound kinda like a douche when you claim to consort with millionaires on the Internet.

Everyone does that here -- everyone on the internet is a millionaire, or knows millionaires, and has a beautiful wife and lots of fancy cars.

Everyone is a lawyer, or a doctor, or knows karate, or is in the SAS or Navy Seals.

 

[ckoons1]

this is my business.open to the public.i would like to believe i can trust my fellow computer buddies.

 

[niko084]

That's not true at all. Weightlifters are not people like everyone else. They're big beefy men with oily muscles. Or Governors of California.

By the way -- you should be very, very careful about posting personal information about yourself, especially in a forum of technologically-minded people (if this truly is you).

Uh, huh... That makes a lot of sense... What makes a weightlifter so different besides their hobby then? I guess being I play hockey I'm not like anyone else then either....

 

[jtleon]

Check ur Facts: Clinton had uncommon intelligence

Intellect has little to do with being a great leader. The most intelligent people are recluse. In fact, I'd argue a genius in any form of politics is a bad thing. They read into things too much and have difficulty communicating with the masses. That's why a genius has yet to hold a public office.

Do you know the meaning of a Rhodes Scholar, sir? Bill Clinton was one - and he became U.S. President for two terms - how quickly we forget!

jtleon

 

[mdm-adph]

Uh, huh... That makes a lot of sense... What makes a weightlifter so different besides their hobby then? I guess being I play hockey I'm not like anyone else then either....

You hear that "whooshing" sound way, way above your head? I think that was the sound of you missing the joke.

 

[farlex85]

It's more common that the millionaire doesn't want to mix with the average joe because the average joe isn't too intelligent and can't hold a conversation with them for more than 5 minutes without being lost of making an *** of themselves by acting the wrong way in the wrong situation. It's about fitting into a group.

It's not a matter of intelligence, interests perhaps. Again, there are many forms of intelligence, some of the "smartest" (by the common definition of the word) people won't be the wealthiest, some b/c that may not be very important to them, and b/c their passions lie w/ not so well-paying pursuits. It would be incredibly foolish to assume most wealthy people so intelligent a middle-income individual can't converse w/ them. It would be equally as foolish to assume the average joe is completely uncouth. You yourself I would imagine should take your own described situation as an example. I've met plenty of rich fools, albeit perhaps more poor ones (although everyone excels in some school of thought, some just more profitable than others).

 

[jtleon]

You mean like Aruba? One of the greatest tax havens on the face of the Earth? That kinda desert island?

Hmm.....So you think there is no property taxes in Aruba....I wonder who donated all those wonderful paved roads throughout the island??? Oh my...they couldn't be the result of taxation eh?

http://maps.google.com/maps?q=Aruba...um=1&sa=X&oi=geocode_result&resnum=1&ct=title

LOL
jtleon

BTW...taxes are inversely proportional to population....think about it!

 

[niko084]

It's not a matter of intelligence, interests perhaps. Again, there are many forms of intelligence, some of the "smartest" (by the common definition of the word) people won't be the wealthiest, some b/c that may not be very important to them, and b/c their passions lie w/ not so well-paying pursuits. It would be incredibly foolish to assume most wealthy people so intelligent a middle-income individual can't converse w/ them. It would be equally as foolish to assume the average joe is completely uncouth. You yourself I would imagine should take your own described situation as an example. I've met plenty of rich fools, albeit perhaps more poor ones (although everyone excels in some school of thought, some just more profitable than others).

Perfectly agreed... It's more of a most the time these types of people come from a different world, they go about life a different way, mannerisms are different etc. Not saying that they are all more intelligent or anything because that's very much so not the case..

by the way, you sound kinda like a douche when you claim to consort with millionaires on the Internet.

Because consorting with a millionaire is some big deal?
It's not hard to meet them when you deal in investment properties, run a business and walk the right crowds. I do a lot of work with a lot of people, if it makes you feel any better I also consort with meth addicts, drunks and high school dropouts, in my free time.

I was simply making a point that the world doesn't work that way....

 

[ckoons1]

people are people

 

[Tatty_Two]

It doesn't if the peasants idolize the rich, which pretty much describes America.

And Tatty, I got one for you, too (from an earlier discussion):

I like George Orwell, but would he feel the same way if he knew how many innocent people may have been killed as a result of those weapons.......but maybe he didnt care.

 

[Tatty_Two]

No, robinhood stole from the government, a government that taxed people into poverty...

No he stole from the rich, there was NO Government then, he stole from anyone who had riches, not exclusively those in power, however those particular people in power, abused their power so he saw it as an entitlement to take back what belonged to the people.....bottom line....agree with it or not, he was more popular with the majority!

 

[niko084]

I like George Orwell, but would he feel the same way if he knew how many innocent people may have been killed as a result of those weapons.......but maybe he didnt care.

It's a classic case of people making statements in a different time.

Another classic thing I like to say..

An old man with white hair said it, it must be true...

I make that joke religiously simply because I find it incredibly stupid that we always resort back to statements and things done many years ago and act accordingly, now learning from your past is one thing, but what about evolution and moving forward, some people literally hold themselves back from progression.

 

[niko084]

No he stole from the rich, there was NO Government then, he stole from anyone who had riches, not exclusively those in power, however those particular people in power, abused their power so he saw it as an entitlement to take back what belonged to the people.....bottom line....agree with it or not, he was more popular with the majority!

At that point in time, the rich were the government for the most part, just a different type.
But yes you are correct.

 

[Tatty_Two]

See what I meant, Tatty? :shadedshu

I do Now I also thought Jesus insisted his disciples give away all their more worldly belongings to those more needy I think thats more or less "spreading the wealth"

 

[Tatty_Two]

i have a friend who is rich and has had to pay a MILLION dollars in taxes one year and to think he should pay more is absurd. this man got there from working harder then most of us can even imagine working.

We have a tax system over here for personal taxation, I'll leave you to do the £ to $ conversion at around $1.90 > £1.......I only mention this because I dont know the personal taxation system in the US..........I'll trey not to bore you I promise!

1. Every Adult in the land gets a personal tax allowance, to keep it simple I just use general figures, that allowance is say £5000, noone pays tax on that first £5000.
2. The next £10,000 is taxed at just 10%.
3. Anything over £10,000 and upto £40,000 (still rounding figures here) is taxed at 20%.
4. Any income over £40,000 is taxed at 40%, thats is just 40% of the amount OVER the £40,000 not the whole amount.

It actually works quite well here and generally is considered "fair" by the majority, not sure how it compares to you system. I suppose you could call me fortunate (or unfortunate depending which way you look at it ) I do pay tax at 40%, I am lucky enough to have a pretty high paid job and also receive a BIG pension from my 27 years in the Armed Forces, I suppose I am one of those in the top 25% of income earners and therefore one of those people Big John refered to as "working hard and being punished by my success"......but hey, I dont feel punished, I am actually pretty happy and at the same time, have quite a bit of money as well! I pay for the privalege of a totally free Health service etc etc, would I like to pay less?.....yes of course I would but not at the cost of those things I now take for granted in life.

Now why do you suppose that it can work pretty well for millions of people and yet some are so resistent to it? i dont know the answer hence the question.