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Time travel

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Light is affected by the Sun, it just travels too fast to be pulled in. But the path of the light particle is slightly bent as it passes the Sun.



There won't be any "surrounding light", but yeah; the black hole will "suck in" any light that gets too close.


This is true as well, light does get bent around stars. This infact was used by Albert Einstein to prove his Theory of Relativity.

Well yea but you know what I mean...
 
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Dark energy accounts for 73% of the mass-energy in the universe according to our current estimates. By appear, do you mean that dark matter/energy are converted into real matter/energy and switch back again?



I don't know if "popping" is the right term, but that makes sense.

Dark matter is real matter, the dark matter in the universe has nothing to do with the spontaneous creation/destruction of matter/energy, i was just replying to an earlier post that was asking if there was a link between dark matter and all this.

It's only called dark matter because we can't see it with any kind of telescopes, it neither emits, reflects nor absorbs any kind of observable radiation. invisible matter would be a more descriptive term.
 
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wahdangun

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Hawking radiation doesn't "escape", because it never entered the black hole in the first place. According to Wikipedia,


(Sorry for the long quote, but I think it makes the reason for the radiation fairly clear)



Light cannot escape if it passes beyond the event horizon, yes. Everything with mass bends the "fabric" of spacetime, which is why the Earth spins around the Sun and doesn't fly off into space.

so its mean particle actually never leave event horizon? Its quite make sense since beyond event horizon the time simply stop,

btw what is negative energy? Can you explain it? Is it can canceling each other?
 

BinaryMage

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Dark matter is real matter, the dark matter in the universe has nothing to do with the spontaneous creation/destruction of matter/energy, i was just replying to an earlier post that was asking if there was a link between dark matter and all this.

It's only called dark matter because we can't see it with any kind of telescopes, it neither emits, reflects nor absorbs any kind of observable radiation. invisible matter would be a more descriptive term.

Okay, I apparently misinterpreted your post. Thanks for clarifying. Yeah, I guess spontaneous creation is neccessary, the universe cannot have existed forever.

so its mean particle actually never leave event horizon? Its quite make sense since beyond event horizon the time simply stop,

btw what is negative energy? Can you explain it? Is it can canceling each other?

I think what he was talking about is so-called exotic matter. Antimatter and antienergy are forms of exotic matter, and yes, antienergy/negative energy and antimatter/negative matter would have a negative energy and mass respectively. Just remember that negative is a mathematical term, not a physical one. And also, yes, they would essentially cancel each other out.
 
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wahdangun

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Light is affected by the Sun, it just travels too fast to be pulled in. But the path of the light particle is slightly bent as it passes the Sun.



There won't be any "surrounding light", but yeah; the black hole will "suck in" any light that gets too close.

yes it can have surrounding light in black hole, even the scientist right now talking a possibility that a live can exist in event horizon because of that surrounding light.

btw isn't gravity is some form of energy? Maybe because its immense of gravity blackhole starting creating particle, and thats why blackhole can fade away
 

BinaryMage

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yes it can have surrounding light in black hole, even the scientist right now talking a possibility that a live can exist in event horizon because of that surrounding light.

btw isn't gravity is some form of energy? Maybe because its immense of gravity blackhole starting creating particle, and thats why blackhole can fade away

I know light can surround a black hole, I'm just talking about within the event horizon. The whole reason we can "see" black holes is because of the absence of light. I don't know how light could exist in the event horizon; whatever you're talking about sounds quite interesting. Gravity is a force, but some scientists believe that there is a "gravitational particle" that causes gravity.
 
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wahdangun

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Okay, I apparently misinterpreted your post. Thanks for clarifying. Yeah, I guess spontaneous creation is neccessary, the universe cannot have existed forever.



I think what he was talking about is so-called exotic matter. Antimatter and antienergy are forms of exotic matter, and yes, antienergy/negative energy and antimatter/negative matter would have a negative energy and mass respectively. Just remember that negative is a mathematical term, not a physical one. And also, yes, they would essentially cancel each other out.

btw beside blackhole is there anywhere else that negative energy exist ? Because I'm not really believe it. I mean if the negative energy and energy collide they must form another thing, its not simply gone
 

Kreij

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I believe that times travel is impossible.
There is only one moment of time in existance, and that is right now.
Our perceptions of the past are stored in our memories, but that "time" no longer exists.
Our ability to imagine the future is no different that our ability to imagine anything else, and that time has yet to exist.

To attempt to travel to somewhere non-existant is but an imaginary pipe-dream, IMO.
 

BinaryMage

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btw beside blackhole is there anywhere else that negative energy exist ? Because I'm not really believe it. I mean if the negative energy and energy collide they must form another thing, its not simply gone

Mathematically, I think it is "simply gone", as you put it. I'm not sure, though, this is beyond my level of astrophysical knowledge.

I believe that times travel is impossible.
There is only one moment of time in existance, and that is right now.
Our perceptions of the past are stored in our memories, but that "time" no longer exists.
Our ability to imagine the future is no different that our ability to imagine anything else, and that time has yet to exist.

To attempt to travel to somewhere non-existant is but an imaginary pipe-dream, IMO.

Time and our perception of it are different things, I think, though I suppose you could argue that they are one and the same. Time travel may well be impossible, but if it is, then this thread is pointless. :)
 
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wahdangun

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I know light can surround a black hole, I'm just talking about within the event horizon. The whole reason we can "see" black holes is because of the absence of light. I don't know how light could exist in the event horizon; whatever you're talking about sounds quite interesting. Gravity is a force, but some scientists believe that there is a "gravitational particle" that causes gravity.

ups sorry maybe not in the exact event horizon but we wouldn't know it because the light can't escape from it, maybe blackhole isn't pitch black after all, maybe its the brightest place in the universe.
if gravity is not energy then how we get our electricity from(i mean powerplan from dam, not nuke or coal)?

I think gravity is created from electron than spin in atom, because i have read some book that gosht particle can't be effected by gravity and just go trough our body
 

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Discussions of theoretical topics, even highly improbable ones, are never pointless.
They may not ever result in anything, but they make us think.
That in itself is of value.
 

2DividedbyZero

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this thread became very very popular over the next 6 months, thousands of replies, but i have traveled back to tell you the TPU community decided to agree on the fact that time travel is not remotely possible.




 

Kreij

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2/0 travelled back in time to try to undo the infraction he got 14 days from now.
Don't let him fool you.

On topic :
I would love to travel into the future to see the possibilities or consenquences of what we are doing, even if they were not certain and even if I could not remember them on return.
I guess that comes from reading tons of Sci-Fi since I was old enough to read.
 

BinaryMage

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Discussions of theoretical topics, even highly improbable ones, are never pointless.
They may not ever result in anything, but they make us think.
That in itself is of value.

Point taken. I still think time travel may well exist, though.

this thread became very very popular over the next 6 months, thousands of replies, but i have traveled back to tell you the TPU community decided to agree on the fact that time travel is not remotely possible.

Alas, you have now created a paradox, because I have made this post in response to yours, which has changed the future, and now you will likely cease to exist, along with everyone else.

I would love to travel into the future to see the possibilities or consenquences of what we are doing, even if they were not certain and even if I could not remember them on return.
I guess that comes from reading tons of Sci-Fi since I was old enough to read.

That would be wonderful. Myself, I want to see what the human race can accomplish once we finally get over our current stage, and really begin exploring and bettering ourselves. Same on the science fiction. :)
 
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wahdangun

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I believe that times travel is impossible.
There is only one moment of time in existance, and that is right now.
Our perceptions of the past are stored in our memories, but that "time" no longer exists.
Our ability to imagine the future is no different that our ability to imagine anything else, and that time has yet to exist.

To attempt to travel to somewhere non-existant is but an imaginary pipe-dream, IMO.

haha kreji, I have read what do you read too, you even copy paste it, but still if time was not 4th dimension then why we can travel to the future? Isn't that some short of movement in time? And i believe if the time was not the 4th dimension them there simply no time different at all in the universe
 
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Proof that you can slow or speed up time (in relative terms):

I don't beleive it is possible to go back in time... but who really knows?

Getting off the topic of military vs. Nasa budget, the whole GPS system is designed around the thoery of relativity (it really IS true):

" To achieve this level of precision, the clock ticks from the GPS satellites must be known to an accuracy of 20-30 nanoseconds. However, because the satellites are constantly moving relative to observers on the Earth, effects predicted by the Special and General theories of Relativity must be taken into account to achieve the desired 20-30 nanosecond accuracy.

Because an observer on the ground sees the satellites in motion relative to them, Special Relativity predicts that we should see their clocks ticking more slowly (see the Special Relativity lecture). Special Relativity predicts that the on-board atomic clocks on the satellites should fall behind clocks on the ground by about 7 microseconds per day because of the slower ticking rate due to the time dilation effect of their relative motion.

Further, the satellites are in orbits high above the Earth, where the curvature of spacetime due to the Earth's mass is less than it is at the Earth's surface. A prediction of General Relativity is that clocks closer to a massive object will seem to tick more slowly than those located further away (see the Black Holes lecture). As such, when viewed from the surface of the Earth, the clocks on the satellites appear to be ticking faster than identical clocks on the ground. A calculation using General Relativity predicts that the clocks in each GPS satellite should get ahead of ground-based clocks by 45 microseconds per day.

The combination of these two relativitic effects means that the clocks on-board each satellite should tick faster than identical clocks on the ground by about 38 microseconds per day (45-7=38)! This sounds small, but the high-precision required of the GPS system requires nanosecond accuracy, and 38 microseconds is 38,000 nanoseconds. If these effects were not properly taken into account, a navigational fix based on the GPS constellation would be false after only 2 minutes, and errors in global positions would continue to accumulate at a rate of about 10 kilometers each day! The whole system would be utterly worthless for navigation in a very short time. This kind of accumulated error is akin to measuring my location while standing on my front porch in Columbus, Ohio one day, and then making the same measurement a week later and having my GPS receiver tell me that my porch and I are currently about 5000 meters in the air somewhere over Detroit. ..."

http://www.astronomy.ohio-state.edu/~pogge/Ast162/Unit5/gps.html
 
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I do not believe in time travel.. I believe in being able to "see" things that happened in the past based on the speed of light, but not going back in time. Just cause u can see something doesn't mean you can interact with it.. Although based on einsteins curvature of space theory which im pretty sure is proven as fact by now. It would actually be very possible to cut thru space and end up where you started before you even left.. But would that be only visible or actually physically real in all ways? That's the big question imo.

The same can be said for moving at faster than light, as when you approach the speed of light time slows down. But the universe doesn't care about time.. If time travel was possible, don't you think we'd of met a time traveler by now? Maybe traveling thru time in such a way causes a paradox, where your actually in another dimension, exactly the same as the dimension your currently occupying.. So many questions, so few answers..lol

This is true as well, light does get bent around stars. This infact was used by Albert Einstein to prove his Theory of Relativity.

Well yea but you know what I mean...

This is called lensing:

http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl...a=X&ei=2ajFTZ2JI-f30gHhzvyzCA&ved=0CB4Q9QEwAQ

See those curved beams of light? that's the distortion affect caused by gravity of massive objects if I remember correctly.
 
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BinaryMage

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I do not believe in time travel.. I believe in being able to "see" things that happened in the past based on the speed of light, but not going back in time. Just cause u can see something doesn't mean you can interact with it.. Although based on einsteins curvature of space theory which im pretty sure is proven as fact by now. It would actually be very possible to cut thru space and end up where you started before you even left.. But would that be only visible or actually physically real in all ways? That's the big question imo.
the same can be said for moving at faster than light, as when you approach the speed of light time slows down. But the universe doesn't care about time.. If time travel was possible, don't you think we'd of met a time traveler by now? Maybe traveling thru time in such a way causes a paradox, where your actually in another dimension, exactly the same as the dimension your currently occupying.. So many questions, so few answers..lol

Well, if we could travel faster than light, we could certainly see into the past by going far away from Earth and looking back, where the light we were receiving would be from Earth before we left.
 

Kreij

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haha kreji, I have read what do you read too, you even copy paste it, but still if time was not 4th dimension then why we can travel to the future? Isn't that some short of movement in time? And i believe if the time was not the 4th dimension them there simply no time different at all in the universe

I don't know what you've read, but I didn't copy and paste anything. That's just my ramblings.

I agree with you last statement. There is no time difference in the universe. There is only now.
 

BinaryMage

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I don't know what you've read, but I didn't copy and paste anything. That's just my ramblings.

I agree with you last statement. There is no time difference in the universe. There is only now.

But now cannot exist in any other form than an idea, because it can never be "now", in the sense that by the time you have though about it, it is now a different "now". (Sorry for the confusing explanation)
 
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I don't know what you've read, but I didn't copy and paste anything. That's just my ramblings.

I agree with you last statement. There is no time difference in the universe. There is only now.

There is no difference in time in the universe I believe as well, but there is a difference in place which can be perceived as a difference in time. We've all heard the analogy if you take a piece of paper and fold it. Then punch a hold thru it and travel thru that hole, u end up in the next place faster. But that's a gravitational trick used by creating a hugely dense object similar to a black hole. Which of course is currently inescapable. So how people intend on using something that dense to punch thru space, when it would tear you apart atom by atom is beyond me.. and the rest of the world at this point..lol
 
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wahdangun

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I do not believe in time travel.. I believe in being able to "see" things that happened in the past based on the speed of light, but not going back in time. Just cause u can see something doesn't mean you can interact with it.. Although based on einsteins curvature of space theory which im pretty sure is proven as fact by now. It would actually be very possible to cut thru space and end up where you started before you even left.. But would that be only visible or actually physically real in all ways? That's the big question imo.

The same can be said for moving at faster than light, as when you approach the speed of light time slows down. But the universe doesn't care about time.. If time travel was possible, don't you think we'd of met a time traveler by now? Maybe traveling thru time in such a way causes a paradox, where your actually in another dimension, exactly the same as the dimension your currently occupying.. So many questions, so few answers..lol



This is called lensing:

http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl...a=X&ei=2ajFTZ2JI-f30gHhzvyzCA&ved=0CB4Q9QEwAQ

See those curved beams of light? that's the distortion affect caused by gravity of massive objects if I remember correctly.

we can already back in time, but its not our past lol. If you see trough telescope and aim it to star you basically see to the past,

we can't travel faster than light, because when we reach speed of light the time simply stop, so even tough the journey can span for thousand years we won't notice it, it will just a blink of eye when we reach our destination
 
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wahdangun

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I don't know what you've read, but I didn't copy and paste anything. That's just my ramblings.

I agree with you last statement. There is no time difference in the universe. There is only now.

haha its interesting, because its same to what you said earlier, its said that time is not 4th dimension and its only exist in our math equation.

But there is time difference in our universe, even our gps satelite is in different time than us. Or in the blackhole
 

Kreij

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If you travel at the speed of light, or greater, time does not stop. Time never stops.
You are simply moving to a point in the universe that the light from a particular event has not reached yet.
Could make for nice viewing, though.
 
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Just because you can't travel faster than light doesn't mean you can't get somewhere before light does.. Look at the photon for example. It is always entangled in the opposite state as it's partner but it is never in the same location. You could have one of the entangled pair here and one on the other side of the universe but they will always react at the same "time"..
Now that's science.. No telling why yet, but it just is..
 
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