560 TI 2GB vs 7850.. what specs won't tell you.

[RigRebel]

In my experience I have always found AMD to either perform really well in a game or not perform well for what it is expected to perform like.
While nVidia generally seems to run well in all games.

Hmmm that's a thought, I do know that they have been reported slower on DX9 for the 7000 series and lower tessallations than Nvidia on average so that would affect older games and new ones with heavy tessallations.

Well, one reason it is that in my country amd have better price vs performance than intel/nvidia low/middle segment, and for hardware of high performance segment I have no money(like i7, ...)...but I wish to have, so everyday learn something new...

I don't understand the recent belief in performance/cost for AMD. Sure back in the day, an AMD K7-Thunderbird was well worth it over an Pentium 4 because it performed 20% faster; but, now a days I really don't think that applies anymore with intels multi-core solutions because Intels per core performance is WAY better than AMD's. AMD is just making larger hyperthreading pipes. That's great for servers but near usless for gaming. Also, Look at the i3-2100 vs the AMD II X4 960T (same price)... the i3 scores slightly higher and only 2 cores. I think a lot of people confuse # of cores with performance but that's not entirely correct. Intel is much strong per core. And also, who need more than 2-3 cores for gaming because 99% of the games out there currently do not use more than 2 cores? Also, I loved my AMD K7, Duron and even old K5 nickel plated chip... but since multicores, INtel owns IMO.

You mentioned heat problems because the heatsink was rough. It's a diamond card. They like don't even try ever. Not a brand to buy.

Well to be fair, I learned that the heat sink, which was the problem, is actually an AMD reference heatsink and it's the same on the PowerColor Card that looks identical> Now, I personally think PowerColor is junk but Diamond had a decent name in the past... like 8-10 years ago. Someone must have bought the name.

...and avoid diamond unless you like the risk of a possible rough heatsink or something worse...

I will now lol, But again as said above they are actually AMD reference design heatsinks from what OPs have said.

PS. I am not an AMD hater, I honestly gave the 7850 a try and was looking for good performance and will pat AMD on the back for it's Overclocking though! that was aweome! On catalyst and overall chop it just fell short. But, so did the 560 TI just more on heat than anything else.

Something as ambiguous as this would probably be more of an issue of driver development and optimization of a game for a certain architecture. Personally, I don't experience any stuttering with the nvidia 330m with moderate settings or a single 5850 in D3 maxed out. Silly comparison IMO.

How was it silly ? The original question asked by OP was whether Nvidia cards were smoother than AMD and I had an exact match comparisson that showed Nvidia was smoother. I didn't plan on reviewing them, it turned out that way from use lol. These cards were intended for personal use and both cards I picked where in the same exact price range with near similar stats baring that the 560 TI is older. I purchased the 560 TI 2GB took it back because it sounded like a jet engine at 74*C with stock clocks then paid $10.00 more for the 7850. Right now they are the best competitors at that price point unless you jump up to the 448 core. The comparison was real world based on what I planned to use and it just so happens it answered his question exactly for that comparison. I didn't think having exact facts he was looking for was silly dispite the cause... sure the cause may be drivers but the facts are still the facts... the Nvidia proved smoother in an exact comparisson.

Ps My 8800GTS has absolutely NO chop/SHutter at 1680x1050 max settings no AA... is't only 30fps but it still doesn't shutter. I Bought my EVGA 8800GTS never used in the box from a co-worker for $75.00 in 2009 ...So maybe it is driver but I don't care about that... I just paid close to $300.00 for a choppy cards. If Nvida's 660 Ti acts the same way I'll be saying the same about it.


PS thanks to all the posters for their input and keeping friendly!

 

[Nordic]

Well to be fair, I learned that the heat sink, which was the problem, is actually an AMD reference heatsink and it's the same on the PowerColor Card that looks identical> Now, I personally think PowerColor is junk but Diamond had a decent name in the past... like 8-10 years ago. Someone must have bought the name.



I will now lol, But again as said above they are actually AMD reference design heatsinks from what OPs have said.

I can't get a source of this... it was on the bitcoin forums somewhere. This guy purchased a diamond 7970. It had terrible terrible like 90c temps at stock. So he figured the heatsink (amd reference) must not of been factory installed well enough. It wasn't that it wasn't installed well enough, the heatsink copper base was not machined right. It was seriously rough. So he lapped it and got the same temps as all the other amd reference cards he has that weren't from diamond. This and this alone is why I have a thing against diamond. Had nothing to do with amd's reference cooler which is good enough for clocks.

Is this at all similar to your diamond card that you tested?

 

[RigRebel]

I can't get a source of this... it was on the bitcoin forums somewhere. This guy purchased a diamond 7970. It had terrible terrible like 90c temps at stock. So he figured the heatsink (amd reference) must not of been factory installed well enough. It wasn't that it wasn't installed well enough, the heatsink copper base was not machined right. It was seriously rough. So he lapped it and got the same temps as all the other amd reference cards he has that weren't from diamond. This and this alone is why I have a thing against diamond. Had nothing to do with amd's reference cooler which is good enough for clocks.

Is this at all similar to your diamond card that you tested?

Awsome post for 1 reason, It confirms I'm glad I didn't lap mine lolz.... yeah mine was machined horribly aslo. Mine was installed well and actually had high grade silverite thermal compound. The problem was that the cooper base on the heat sink looked like a finger print. I thought you saw the link. This is my heat sink in the picture http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/showthread.php?t=167140
Not mine as in same model, mine as in that's my kitchen counter lol

PS. I did call Diamond about it and the agent gave me the "well that's the first we've heard about it" and "I'll send an email to upper managment". I didn't hear back but didn't give all my information because was still sending the card back and he eluded that me removing the heatsink to discover the problem could void my warranty. So ya... Diamond gets the thumbs down!

 

[Nordic]

In the guy I mentioned got a perfectly fine 7970, he just had to put some work into it.
No I did not see that link or those pictures. That does oddly resemble a fingerprint.

 

[RigRebel]

In the guy I mentioned got a perfectly fine 7970, he just had to put some work into it.
No I did not see that link or those pictures. That does oddly resemble a fingerprint.

Yea, if you read that thread you'll see was somewhat itching to put the work into it too but I was back in forth about lapping it. I've lapped before but it came down to 1. Worried about that small ledge and no body reported doing it yet and 2. it was barely 3 days old when I discovered it and just didn't want to risk it or voiding warranty. 3. Eh I originally wanted the 660 TI when it comes out anyways just got antsy.

 

[eidairaman1]

7850 is a sleeper actually

 

[CaptainFailcon]

Get the 560
better drivers better game support and 2GB of vram will make battlefield 3 happy

 

[Desert Eagle]

Get the 560
better drivers better game support and 2GB of vram will make battlefield 3 happy

Normally I would gice you +1 internets for that recommendation but the GTX 660 Ti is just around the corner. Wait for it.

 

[Desert Eagle]

I wonder, why none of the "Big" Members has written any comment to this

ch

They only teach us what we don't know when we piss them off. It's a well known fact.

 

[SIGSEGV]

i dont really know what's the purpose of this thread? ranting on the specific amd cards vendor or what.. hello world, is there anybody out there who has sapphire, asus, gigabyte, xfx, msi, his HD7800 or HD7900 series card had a problem like op said?

 

[Nordic]

i dont really know what's the purpose of this thread? ranting on the specific amd cards vendor or what.. hello world, is there anybody out there who has sapphire, asus, gigabyte, xfx, msi, his HD7800 or HD7900 series card had a problem like op said?

The original purpose was comparing amd vs nvidea. His results were that nvidea was better. I think it was the bad heatsink from diamond that made nvidea look better myself. So that is why the thread veered towards bad vendor.

 

[baggpipes]

So you tested using only diablo III? Seems like you would want to get your corvette and lexus on different tracks to test.....

 

[RigRebel]

So you tested using only diablo III? Seems like you would want to get your corvette and lexus on different tracks to test.....

Yeah I would have loved to put them on The Secret World, direct X11, tessallations, good AA options, MMO, full rendering, etc etc. In fact, that was a main game reason to purchase the cards and it would have been a good test but the game launch got pushed back and the video cards had to go back before cut off so negatory on the tracks to test. I was caught up in a lot too. Testing 3 cards in 1-2 weeks, work and trying to play through D III launch and TSW betas left me short of breath. Infact had to skip a beta weekend . I Could have loaded older games but none that would tells us much.

Normally I would gice you +1 internets for that recommendation but the GTX 660 Ti is just around the corner. Wait for it.

Resounding : AGREED

7850 is a sleeper actually

On overclocking couldn't agree with you more, but at what cost ? $$$ Aftermarket heatsink, voiding warranty, loosing CF space ?

 

[eidairaman1]

Yeah I would have loved to put them on The Secret World, direct X11, tessallations, good AA options, MMO, full rendering, etc etc. In fact, that was a main game reason to purchase the cards and it would have been a good test but the game launch got pushed back and the video cards had to go back before cut off so negatory on the tracks to test. I was caught up in a lot too. Testing 3 cards in 1-2 weeks, work and trying to play through D III launch and TSW betas left me short of breath. Infact had to skip a beta weekend . I Could have loaded older games but none that would tells us much.



Resounding : AGREED




On overclocking couldn't agree with you more, but at what cost ? $$$ Aftermarket heatsink, voiding warranty, loosing CF space ?

Dude If a card went bad with an aftermarket heatsink I just put the original one back on before RMA, You dont have to say you modified the card or anything just state your having issues or it just up and died, they dont ask further questions.

I did that for a Radeon 9700 Pro that I accidently Killed.

Also Spacing for Motherboards is mainly 2 slotted so you can have 2 dual slot cards. only beef is tri slot cards. IIRC the 7800 series is only standard crossfire and not tri or Quadfire...

Also words like "around the corner" is not very reassuring, specific dates that they are in Retail and etail are.

Ill just say look at your performance numbers and pricing. power draw is another factor but if your gonna overclock it makes it a minute point.

 

[Xzibit]

I was on a EVGA 560 TI 1GB and got a Diamond 7870 2GB 1ghz edition to try out.

Having had
EVGA GTX 260
EVGA GTX 460 SC
EVGA GTX 560 TI
* Yes i like EVGA

Yes, the drivers are simplier with Nvidia cards but one thing I didnt like was the Heavy gradient look. If you ever used Adobe Photoshop and applied that it was just horrid to look at. The only way to get rid of it was to apply x4 MSAA or higher and you still had the subtle glaze overlay to deal with in 3D. The gradient look was annoying since you cant adjust to minimize it in 2D so its always there.

That was the first thing I noticed once i installed the AMD card. No gradient or glazed over lay in 2D or 3D.
Its not all perfect so far but that was a HUGE differance i noticed right off the bat.

 

[RigRebel]

Dude If a card went bad with an aftermarket heatsink I just put the original one back on before RMA, You dont have to say you modified the card or anything just state your having issues or it just up and died, they dont ask further questions.

I did that for a Radeon 9700 Pro that I accidently Killed.

Also Spacing for Motherboards is mainly 2 slotted so you can have 2 dual slot cards. only beef is tri slot cards. IIRC the 7800 series is only standard crossfire and not tri or Quadfire...

Also words like "around the corner" is not very reassuring, specific dates that they are in Retail and etail are.

Ill just say look at your performance numbers and pricing. power draw is another factor but if your gonna overclock it makes it a minute point.

Dude … It wasn't an aftermarket heat-sink it was stock. I never put an aftermarket heat sink on that card that was the stock heat sink with the problems and I'm not paying close to $300.00 for that garbbage. If Diamond is getting ATI reference heat-sinks machined that badly and putting them out for the public to use then they need to flog the person who made that piece of crap decision on the head with mouse and keyboard and close up shop... that's f-ing ridiculous that they would try to pass that garbagge off as a "quality" video card. I'm not modding crap to handle their poor ass quality. It's just as easy for me to hand that piece of crap back to them and say "i'll take my money back have a nice day" Which is exactly what I did AFTER I let them know of the issue and got the "well I'll send an email to managment" reply from the helpdesk worker and then never heard back ... so eh not my problem and I'm sure as heck not going to lap a 2week old prodcut (at the time) void the warranty and possibly have more issues just because of their crappy ass $8.00 an hour labor workmanship... screw that. They can pawn that junk on some other sucker.

 

[eidairaman1]

well just return the card