Questions about Grandmars X1650Pro AGP

[LCsquare]

Hi all,

Sorry for my poor english.

I just brought the new display card: Grandmars X1650Pro AGP. Here are some related informations:

Chip: RV530LE
Core: 600MHz
Mem: 300MHz (DDR 600MHz)

And my system:

CPU: P4 1.8GHz (OC @ 2.4GHz)
RAM: 768MB PC3200 DDR-RAM (256 + 512)
MB: PCChips MD935DLU (SiS650GX + SiS962L, AGP4X max. supported)

1. I found the AGP bridge is only surrounded by some rubber stickers (or some "heat-releasing" material), but not the chip (die) itself. During runing 3dmark05, I found it is burning hot ... will it burn ?

2. When I use ATITools 0.26 to check the chipset information, I get: RV530LE (0x716C), is this means my card is really X1650Pro ??

3. When I check the card information in the following website: http://www.gpureview.com/Radeon-X1650-Pro-AGP-card-458.html#, I found that the card memory mentioned in this website is 700MHz (1400MHz DDR). When I checked my card with ATITool 0.26, the memory speed is only 300MHz (600MHz DDR), what happen to my card?? Is my card is a remarked one??

Thanks for answering.

 

[HookeyStreet]

1) Im sure it wont burn.

2) I think that RV530 is the correct core for your card.

3) gpureview is sometimes 'inaccurate' as it doesnt state variations of specific cards (ie 7900GS, 7900GS OC, 7900GS ExTreme etc) so I wouldnt worry too much. What speed did the site/store that you purchased the card from state as the memory speed?

 

[LCsquare]

Thanks for your answering.

1. Since my computer case is a barebone, so I am afraid the area is not enough for the card to conduct the heat away ... This card is really hot

2. That is OK, thanks!

3. I also do not know the actual speed. But when I searched in google, I found a Hong Kong website mentioned the speed of the PCI-E version of my card.

(This webiste is in chinese, but I just realized what it mentioned about X1650Pro specification)

http://www.hkgolden.com/articles/article.asp?id=1558

So ... it is so confusing ...

Thanks for your answer.

 

[LCsquare]

Thanks for your answering.

1. Since my computer case is a barebone, so I am afraid the area is not enough for the card to conduct the heat away ... This card is really hot

2. That is OK, thanks!

3. I also do not know the actual speed. But when I searched in google, I found a Hong Kong website mentioned the speed of the PCI-E version of my card.

(This webiste is in chinese, but I just realized what it mentioned about X1650Pro specification)

http://www.hkgolden.com/articles/article.asp?id=1558

So ... it is so confusing ...

Thanks for your answer.

Also I found this in Sapphire homepage:

http://www.sapphiretech.com/us/products/products_overview.php?gpid=162&grp=3

 

[LCsquare]

bump

But ... nobody knows why ?

Thanks.

 

[Zubasa]

bump

But ... nobody knows why ?

Thanks.

You should ask around before getting a Grandmars dude:shadedshu
I hate them for the fact that they like to cut down on some components on their cards to make them cheaper...
The X1650Pro = X1600XT and the core should be RV530XT(600Mhz) and it should get DDR3 1400 (700Mhz)
So, your card looks like a remarked X1600Pro instead of an XT...
The X1600Pro is the one that suppose to have RV530LE...

 

[LCsquare]

Thanks Zubasa.

As I know there are 2 models of X1650Pro, which is RV570 (new) and RV530 (old). Does my model is the old one?

Also my card is an AGP version. And I found that there are some company use DDR2 (arround 300MHz to 400MHz / 600MHz to 800MHz DDR) and some use GDDR3 (arround 700MHz / 1.4GHz DDR). And here are some information:

GeCube:
http://www.gecube.com/products-detail.php?prod_cat_pid=9&prod_cat_id=169&prod_id=64542

Diamond Multimedia:
http://www.diamondmm.com/X1650AGP256.php

Sapphire:
http://www.sapphiretech.com/us/products/products_overview.php?gpid=162&grp=2

HIS:
http://www.hisdigital.com/html/product_ov.php?id=256&view=yes

As you can see there are so many different combinations of "X1650Pro AGP", I am so confusing about these models. And I decided to send a mail to Grandmars support, with my questions. Hope they will answer me.

Thanks.

 

[Zubasa]

Thanks Zubasa.

As I know there are 2 models of X1650Pro, which is RV570 (new) and RV530 (old). Does my model is the old one?

Also my card is an AGP version. And I found that there are some company use DDR2 (arround 300MHz to 400MHz / 600MHz to 800MHz DDR) and some use GDDR3 (arround 700MHz / 1.4GHz DDR). And here are some information:

GeCube:
http://www.gecube.com/products-detail.php?prod_cat_pid=9&prod_cat_id=169&prod_id=64542

Diamond Multimedia:
http://www.diamondmm.com/X1650AGP256.php

Sapphire:
http://www.sapphiretech.com/us/products/products_overview.php?gpid=162&grp=2

HIS:
http://www.hisdigital.com/html/product_ov.php?id=256&view=yes

As you can see there are so many different combinations of "X1650Pro AGP", I am so confusing about these models. And I decided to send a mail to Grandmars support, with my questions. Hope they will answer me.

Thanks.

The X1650Pro cannot not be RV570:shadedshu
The TRUE X1650Pro IS a X1600XT remarked and it has RV530XT(600Mhz) and 690Mhz(DDR3 1380) at standard.
The X1600Pro is the one with RV530LE(500MHz) and 400Mhz(DDR2 800).
Manufacturers put DDR2 on X1650Pro to make them cheaper so they sell better

The X1650Pro is nothing compare to the XT, they are basically unrelated cards.
The X1650XT is indeed has RV570 with 4 pipes disabled.

You should use the Sapphire as reference since they always follow ATi reference design and specs.
And AGP version doesn't mean they have lower specs, in fact the Sapphire X1950Pro AGP has higher specs (512MB DDR3) than the normal PCI-E edition.

The way cards are named in the low-range is very confusing, that is why I never buy one of those cards.

 

[LCsquare]

Thanks.

But my card is RV530LE (parsed by ATITools 0.26), what does this mean? Is it still a X1650Pro ?

And how could you explain the URL I quoted? There are so many different combination between core and memory ...

I also found the following: http://bbs.zdnet.com.cn/thread-44273-1-1.html, which is talking about the 'name changing' of ATI.

So confuse ..

But I also found the following:

http://www.gpureview.com/Radeon-X1650-XT-AGP-card-473.html
http://www.gpureview.com/Radeon-X1650-Pro-AGP-card-458.html
http://www.gpureview.com/radeon-x1600-pro-agp-card-369.html

Crazy ...

May be I really need to make a phone call / E-mail to Grandmars ...

(Internet just provide so many informations that I cannot pick up what I want ... )

 

[Zubasa]

Thanks.

But my card is RV530LE (parsed by ATITools 0.26), what does this mean? Is it still a X1650Pro ?

And how could you explain the URL I quoted? There are so many different combination between core and memory ...

I also found the following: http://bbs.zdnet.com.cn/thread-44273-1-1.html, which is talking about the 'name changing' of ATI.

So confuse ..

But I also found the following:

http://www.gpureview.com/Radeon-X1650-XT-AGP-card-473.html
http://www.gpureview.com/Radeon-X1650-Pro-AGP-card-458.html
http://www.gpureview.com/radeon-x1600-pro-agp-card-369.html

Crazy ...

May be I really need to make a phone call / E-mail to Grandmars ...

(Internet just provide so many informations that I cannot pick up what I want ... )

On the first link, even that guy gets confused
On the top of that page, he said X1600Pro = X1300XT and X1600XT = X1650Pro
But then on the bottom he said X1600Pro = X1650Pro (So that link is basically BS)

I think you get confused between the X1650Pro and the X1650XT.
X1650Pro = X1600XT:
http://www.gpureview.com/show_cards.php?card1=440&card2=458
X1300XT = X1600Pro:
http://www.gpureview.com/show_cards.php?card1=350&card2=448

When you put X1650XT and the X1650Pro side by side, you will see they have different chip.
http://www.gpureview.com/show_cards.php?card1=472&card2=447

 

[LCsquare]

But I do not think that guy get confused:

>> On the top of that page, he said X1600Pro = X1300XT ...

Yes, he is correct as he mentioned X1600Pro is renamed to X1300XT, but then AMD (ATI) soon rename this "X1300XT (X1600Pro)" to X1650 ... then this "X1650 (X1600Pro => X1300XT)" is used a RV530 core. (Last paragraph)

>> ... and X1600XT = X1650Pro

Yes this also correct, in last paragraph.

For the link you quoted: http://www.gpureview.com/show_cards.php?card1=440&card2=458

you can find that both X1650Pro and X1650XT are RV530 core (but what is the difference between RV530 and RV530LE?) ... with a memory frequency about 700MHz (1400MHz DDR) ...

so .... I am so frustrated ...

 

[Zubasa]

But I do not think that guy get confused:

>> On the top of that page, he said X1600Pro = X1300XT ...

Yes, he is correct as he mentioned X1600Pro is renamed to X1300XT, but then AMD (ATI) soon rename this "X1300XT (X1600Pro)" to X1650 ... then this "X1650 (X1600Pro => X1300XT)" is used a RV530 core. (Last paragraph)

>> ... and X1600XT = X1650Pro

Yes this also correct, in last paragraph.

For the link you quoted: http://www.gpureview.com/show_cards.php?card1=440&card2=458

you can find that both X1650Pro and X1650XT are RV530 core (but what is the difference between RV530 and RV530LE?) ... with a memory frequency about 700MHz (1400MHz DDR) ...

so .... I am so frustrated ...

IS X1600XT and X1650Pro has RV530, get this right please
All of these are RV530, basically the same chip.
But within the RV530, there are different grades.
Before the Chips are release they are tested and graded.
Something like this:
RV530XT = first grade (X1600XT)
RV530Pro = second grade (X1600Pro)
RV530LE = third grade
The difference between these chips are the quality, the XT being the best which can run at top speed.
The LE being the least which can run at lower speed to maintain normal temperature.

My X1950Pro has RV570XT(575Mhz) core which means it is the top dog with in the line of RV570.
The X1950GT being lower grade has RV570LE(500Mhz) core.
I personally has a X1600Pro and I can tell you that it has RV530Pro.

 

[LCsquare]

Ok, I understand now.

Also I found this link: http://www.hkepc.com/bbs/hwdb.php?tid=693471&tp=radoenx1650xt-his&rid=693473

This should be clearer.

So you sure my card is a remarked one (X1600Pro remarked as X1650Pro)? If so, I need to phone to Grandmars and argue with them.

But I still has some questions:

1. RV530 LE is X1650Pro ?

2. Is my X1650Pro used DDR2 ram (slower) instead of GDDR3 (faster) ? Since GDDR3 can operate at about 700MHz (1400MHz DDR) , but DDR2 can only operate at 400MHz (800MHz DDR).

3. What should I told Grandmars to prove I brought a remarked product ? Or ... all the problem I raised is not a serious problem ??

Thanks.

 

[Zubasa]

Ok, I understand now.

Also I found this link: http://www.hkepc.com/bbs/hwdb.php?tid=693471&tp=radoenx1650xt-his&rid=693473

This should be clearer.

So you sure my card is a remarked one (X1600Pro remarked as X1650Pro)? If so, I need to phone to Grandmars and argue with them.

But I still has some questions:

1. RV530 LE is X1650Pro ?

2. Is my X1650Pro used DDR2 ram (slower) instead of GDDR3 (faster) ? Since GDDR3 can operate at about 700MHz (1400MHz DDR) , but DDR2 can only operate at 400MHz (800MHz DDR).

3. What should I told Grandmars to prove I brought a remarked product ? Or ... all the problem I raised is not a serious problem ??

Thanks.

Personally I never had a card with RV530LE, it can even be a X1300XT:shadedshu
First of all, does it say the card is DDR2 any where on the box?

 

[LCsquare]

May be I will upload several photos about my card when I am at home.

(Now I am in office ... )

Please wait and comment about it. Thanks for your time.

 

[Zubasa]

May be I will upload several photos about my card when I am at home.

(Now I am in office ... )

Please wait and comment about it. Thanks for your time.

For the core, it is hard to argue with them since RV530LE is still a fully functional core
It is fine as long as it is not overheating at XT speed (600Mhz).
But for the memory you can kill Grandmars for it.

Next time when you buy a card you should go for the ones ATi listed.
https://support.ati.com/ics/support/default.asp?deptID=894&task=knowledge&folderID=588
Click on the first link and you will see.

 

[LCsquare]

But if Grandmars said that they only use DDR2 in this X1650Pro AGP model, what can I do ?

They can argue for "this is our marketing strategy", and I can say nothing ...

What should I do when I am arguing with Grandmars ? Quote the ATI specifications?

 

[Zubasa]

But if Grandmars said that they only use DDR2 in this X1650Pro AGP model, what can I do ?

They can argue for "this is our marketing strategy", and I can say nothing ...

What should I do when I am arguing with Grandmars ? Quote the ATI specifications?

Did they print any specs of he card on the box?
If they do you cannot argue, since you didn't read what you suppose to....
But if they did not, you can try and argue with them and get a refund.

I never considered the Grandmars, since I saw a bunch of them with popped caps....(I know the shop owner and he show me)

 

[LCsquare]

I just re-read all specs and words printed on both the box and card and manual ...

I also noticed the RAM chip model used on this card ...



My board really operate in DDR2 RAMs ... with Max. 400MHz speed (so I do not know why my card default under-clock the memory speed)



But I am not able to overclock the RAM to its default value by using ATITool 0.26 (400MHz, since I have found the ram chip model: Hynix HY5PS561621A FP-25, which is operate in 2.5ns = 400MHz)

Also the option "ATI overdrive" in Catalyst Control Center also disappeared. Then I used ATI Tray Tool to check this card and noticed that "Overdrive supported = NO"

Shxt ... seems I create all problems and blow down them all

 

[Zubasa]

I just re-read all specs and words printed on both the box and card and manual ...

I also noticed the RAM chip model used on this card ...



My board really operate in DDR2 RAMs ... with Max. 400MHz speed (so I do not know why my card default under-clock the memory speed)



But I am not able to overclock the RAM to its default value by using ATITool 0.26 (400MHz, since I have found the ram chip model: Hynix HY5PS561621A FP-25, which is operate in 2.5ns = 400MHz)

Also the option "ATI overdrive" in Catalyst Control Center also disappeared. Then I used ATI Tray Tool to check this card and noticed that "Overdrive supported = NO"

Shxt ... seems I create all problems and blow down them all

So in your system specs you should change it to Grandmars X1650Pro since it is custom
That card you have will likely to performance worst than my X1600Pro...
Erm, how much did you paid for that sucker?

 

[Grings]

whats grandpa got, an x1950??

 

[HookeyStreet]

whats grandpa got, an x1950??

LMFAO.......

 

[LCsquare]

LMFAO.......

anyway I do not know why ATITool cannot "overclock" this card (back to memory 400MHz).

Now I am using ATI Tray Tool .... seems more resources consuming ... But I still can "overclock" my card. It is faster than before ... but ...

 

[LCsquare]

So in your system specs you should change it to Grandmars X1650Pro since it is custom
That card you have will likely to performance worst than my X1600Pro...
Erm, how much did you paid for that sucker?

My specs. ? I have already changed to "Grandmars ATI X1650Pro DDR2 AGP" ... is this not correct ?

I used HKD$840 to by this ... but I know that if mine is a GDDR3 one, the price should > HKD$900, right ?

Thanks.

 

[LCsquare]

So in your system specs you should change it to Grandmars X1650Pro since it is custom
That card you have will likely to performance worst than my X1600Pro...
Erm, how much did you paid for that sucker?

One more thing, my card "Graphics Chipset" shown in ATI Catalyst Control Center is "X1650 Series" instead of my desired "X1650Pro" ...

Is this also a problem that my card is not a real X1650Pro ?