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temps fans push pull who would have guessed ?

cadaveca

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if you want to be overclocking that far. Should really consider some sort of phase or LN2 cooling. Id like to see your validation of a 5ghz Haswell chip too.

4670K. 5 GHz not uncommon as it is with 4770K, if not using AVX.


Watercooling is about water volume, flow rate, rad dissipation, ambient temps, and airflow. Coolant in most loops does not increase temp very much, as it takes substantial heat to increase 1 MOL of water 1 C. Adding more rad merely increases dissipation, but if water at the outlet of your first rad is already at ambient, then addition of more rads will not net any temperature improvement. If water temps at rad outlet is higher than ambient, more rad will help, but the question as to how much, remains in question, since there are many other variables in this equation.
 
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4670K. 5 GHz not uncommon as it is with 4770K, if not using AVX.


Watercooling is about water volume, flow rate, rad dissipation, ambient temps, and airflow. Coolant in most loops does not increase temp very much, as it takes substantial heat to increase 1 MOL of water 1 C. Adding more rad merely increases dissipation, but if water at the outlet of your first rad is already at ambient, then addition of more rads will not net any temperature improvement. If water temps at rad outlet is higher than ambient, more rad will help, but the question as to how much, remains in question, since there are many other variables in this equation.

I don't think a single rad would be able to dissipate enough heat to make the water temp ambient?! especially if overclocked and stressed for longer amounts of time.

may be worth buying some water temp sensors and have them at each point to gauge all this

btw that depends on many factors like said ^^
 

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4670K. 5 GHz not uncommon as it is with 4770K, if not using AVX.


Watercooling is about water volume, flow rate, rad dissipation, ambient temps, and airflow. Coolant in most loops does not increase temp very much, as it takes substantial heat to increase 1 MOL of water 1 C. Adding more rad merely increases dissipation, but if water at the outlet of your first rad is already at ambient, then addition of more rads will not net any temperature improvement. If water temps at rad outlet is higher than ambient, more rad will help, but the question as to how much, remains in question, since there are many other variables in this equation.

Also doesn't it depend on the amount of water, as to how much it heats up. Because I know that smaller amount of water volume will heat up easier then with more.

what is a possible way to test if the water out of the rad 1 is ambient? That's what should be done right, before getting another radiator?
 
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all this time I didn't realise, martinslab does all this in his testing!


http://martinsliquidlab.org/2012/04/09/hardware-labs-gtx-360-radiator/4/

maybe someone that knows or has contact with this reviewer could ask for a multi rad test or be given a simple answer
 
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ok, thanks
Im trying to push a WATER overclock... its personal and I trust you see that its like a clas sweight for a boxer or a car, you race F1's against F1's... etc... thanlks .. Im awaiting plugs, if they come today Ill post numbers today... great thate you care enough to post..
cheers
 
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my point is adding the Scythe fans added no help whatsoever..AND I do realize its about static presure, just they don't publish those numbers... Ill switch over to my more restrictive rad, a GTX xtreme 360, similar to the SG-1 but optimized for greater fan metrics(pressure). I did read up on Martins testing.. but really, are you saying you would not expect a change, even a few degrees? Its not the rad dude, its the fans... the Deltas so dominate the equation...
Im pulling and switching rads as the next step, and buying three more Deltas, too bad the deal I had went away, price jumped up...

Note that when I changed from the Scythe to the Deltas I had a big drop..better fan more static pressure.... I am not totally sold on the idea of six fans in push pull.... does anyone have some actual data? from there own system.. I was not and am not angry, its the limitation of the medium, More like I was lampooning myself and posting something which surprised me....

i have 3 radiators in one loop all push pull in this order - Res - 320 rad - cpu - 240 rad - mobo full cover - 120 rad - 5870gpu - 5850gpu

i have it all controlled by an mcube Tbalancer Bigng per individual radiator side and can easily switch fans on and off.
push pull gains 1-3 degrees off max load and mine are set to shut off below load temps because simply more fans are noisier regardless of speed but more fans cool better at max load and high rpm so do both.

and more rads in a multi block rig makes sense to me but just on one block dont bother , save that money add loads and get an insta grin machine, helia chiller 250 watts aprox 300uk notes 350-500 us dollar:D:rockout:
 
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yep, again I
ALREADY have two rads, just awaiting the plugs.. did not come today..
and Im not at ambient.. closer to 90C.. so adding more rads and keeping flow above 1gpm will net big gains.. stop tripping over what Im cooling... it could be anything...
In this case its a cpu..
 
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Temperature of your cpu is not what you tells you if can gain something by adding radiators or fans, if temperature of water in loop is already close to ambient temperature then you can not make it any cooler no matter how fast fans you use
 
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Temperature of your cpu is not what you tells you if can gain something by adding radiators or fans, if temperature of water in loop is already close to ambient temperature then you can not make it any cooler no matter how fast fans you use

Ive looked at about 3 diiferent graphs from martinsliquidlab and the water is never at ambient, its usually about 10*c higher and a 360 radiator only drops a couple degrees from water temps.

so im believing if a loop consists of more dissipation then water temp will be close to ambient and block temps lower.

plus water hasn't got an amazing conductivity, but only compared to air.
 
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ok.. why are we talking about AMBIENT?
LET IT GO!!!
Im way way above Ambient in high OC, and in OC I wioll see the ambient air pushed by fans throug ha rad cool the liquid, which is NOT at AMBIENT lower... add a rad.. cool the fluid, its that simple.... IF
You can remain at a good cooling flow above 1gpm and get reasonable fans...
Really Im not sure what this is about?
Maybe a this really is more complicated...
Went to get barbs as sender was unable to send in timely fashion, so barbs installed in RAD # 2...also will be upgrading pump... ..
will be re building loop and posting amazing lower numbers soon..
"Get ready , get set, Glow"
 
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So, what it is the temperature of water in your loop ?
 
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It varies based on the OC.. anyway Ill be posting temps probably on Sat...
 
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Let's say that your cpu is pushing 150 W, looking at the table posted earlier in thread you can see that even fans running at 2171 rpm can cool water down to 5 C over ambient at that load, with 3300 rpm fans you are probably already at 2- 3 C over ambient and as said there is no way to cool water below ambient with fans. So no matter how much more radiators or fans you will add to loop most you can hope to gain is about 3 C.
 
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You are confusing fan rpm with the bigger picture
Fan rpm was relevant in that application
If my coolant is 50 C over ambient and I run it through a rad, the rad will push the equation towards ambient... Forget fan speeds and all the details and look at the theory
Now in practice as I OC higher and higher speeds I increase temps by adding power. These t,ps stop me fom OC , simple. There is a pont you fail as temps go too high, I maxed out at 99 100 then CPU throttled
I lowered the OC and am cooler and stable ...
I will add a fan and maybe upgrade pump, the added rad will give me greater heat dissipation.
The only eye it possibly could not is if it over laded the pump.
So, lets take away the pump from the equation, and lets say fluid fow is constant...
If this is true then adding surface area to the fluid and blowing cool air on it will lower temps.
There is no thermal wall, thus larger rad systems outperform similar quality smaller... This should not be contended. So, when my 360 becomes a 720 with good fans and fow rates I will dissipate more heat allowing higher OC.
 
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You do understand that the fans and radiators in loop are cooling the water in loop, not cpu directly. If the water in loop is now 3 C over ambient temperature at max load then the most you can hope to gain is 3 C better cpu temperatures.
 
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You do understand that the fans and radiators in loop are cooling the water in loop, not cpu directly. If the water in loop is now 3 C over ambient temperature at max load then the most you can hope to gain is 3 C better cpu temperatures.

youd need about 3x 360 rads to make the water 3*c above ambient from 200w of heat based on those graphs.
 
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youd need about 3x 360 rads to make the water 3*c above ambient from 200w of heat based on those graphs.

I don't know how you came to those numbers, I just use C/W value from table. If GTX360 performs in a linear fashion up to 3300 rpm then at that speed it dissipates about 425 W @ 10 C water delta = 0.0233 C/W. 200 W * 0.0233 = 4.66 C over ambient. But if cpu only outputs 150 W which seems more realistic for an i5 then it's only 3.5 C over ambient.
 
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Fans?
Ok
The OC'ed CPU feeds energy heat into blck from here the heat is transferred into the moving fluid.
Why are we talking ambient ? Ambient 17 C. Loop temps 77c in our example.
Each rad and fan set have different rpm which dissipate certain heat, let's put fans way for now.
If you continue to expand cooling through use of radiator the limit is pressure and pump first and second is difference from Ambient to fluid level in terms of thermal state or heat.
If you add rads and maintain pressure.. Pump ... You will continue to lower system temp s heat is led into air.
 
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Note my cooling loop is a separate powered loop, not powered by main system psu.
 
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Fans?
Ok
The OC'ed CPU feeds energy heat into blck from here the heat is transferred into the moving fluid.
Why are we talking ambient ? Ambient 17 C. Loop temps 77c in our example.
Each rad and fan set have different rpm which dissipate certain heat, let's put fans way for now.
If you continue to expand cooling through use of radiator the limit is pressure and pump first and second is difference from Ambient to fluid level in terms of thermal state or heat.
If you add rads and maintain pressure.. Pump ... You will continue to lower system temp s heat is led into air.

Ok, so when you put your hand on radiator you get burn marks. By the way some water cooling pumps stop working if water temperature exceeds 60 C
 
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I don't know how you came to those numbers, I just use C/W value from table. If GTX360 performs in a linear fashion up to 3300 rpm then at that speed it dissipates about 425 W @ 10 C water delta = 0.0233 C/W. 200 W * 0.0233 = 4.66 C over ambient. But if cpu only outputs 150 W which seems more realistic for an i5 then it's only 3.5 C over ambient.

I meant more wattage sorry, gpu cpu etc maybe 300-500w of heat

I don't think anyones using 3300rpm fans and still at 2000rpm that 360 rad doesn't get water temp closer to ambient or lower DT
 
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60C
What?
And the rad does not get hot, it's surrounded by cool air and perhaps you just want to argue?
So not sure what your point is?
 
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what he was saying the water in the loop will never get to 60*c (you said 77*c) because water doesn't conduct heat on a 1:1 ratio.

if it did then the radiator would be burning hot and most loop components can only withstand upto 60*c before breaking.
 
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Right
So I understand the fluid is cooler than system temp....I don't know what the fluid temp is, time for an inline sensor.
 
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