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How a dead GFX Card is made alive professionally

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the GPU can itself die, sure...
The question is will you be alive when it happens!?

I mean... Will you live long enough to see it happen!? :rolleyes:
 
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Interesting, never knew this is why BGA is called Ball Grid Array. Also never seen the equipment used to make or repair them. And I didn't know this type of connection was that failure prone. One would assume one perk of BGA besides value would be a solid connection.

Which brings me to my next points and questions.

1. Is it really that cost effective if they can fail like this and it takes that amount of labor to fix them?

2. Is it really worth it for the consumer if they have zero control over it's longevity and have to wait for one to be serviced and hope that if it does go bad, it's still under warranty? You say this is done a lot on RMA, so that doesn't sound good for BGA.

3. How can mere dust degrade joints that are already soldered?

4. Why are BGA chips not given some kind of simple dust sealer around the edge of the chip between chip and board if dust can damage them so easily? Such degradation begs the question whether this type of soldering is even very solid.

I have to say, I am SO turned off by BGA after seeing this. I'd MUCH rather have a socket connection with pins and lever. I'm talking of course about Intel coming out with BGA CPUs on CPU/MB combos soon. I guess all GPUs are BGA though, and you're either lucky, or not. Between this option and your mention of card replacement being very expensive, I can see why a lot of GPU manufacturers since the recession have tried to weasel out of RMAs, and why they often offer refurbs or returns vs new cards. This is a reminder how important it is to buy from a manufacturer that backs their product well.
 
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Well if dust can go in so can air, so maybe a simple can with air pressure could have done the trick before this is needed.
 
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Well if dust can go in so can air, so maybe a simple can with air pressure could have done the trick before this is needed.

That method won't help with oxidation.
 
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Well if dust can go in so can air, so maybe a simple can with air pressure could have done the trick before this is needed.
I would cringe to think of what would happen trying to force it out of a tiny .1mm space with air, esp canned air. In that small a space with that many solder joints, you'd most likely be getting most of the dust just jamming up against a lot of joints harder instead of working it's way out. And I don't think canned air is even high enough pressure anyway.

I'd rather see them just apply some simple sealer around the edge of the chip, whether it be a thin strip of thermal tape or whatever. You would think that would be WAY cheaper and effective enough, vs this lengthy and labor intense repair method.
That method won't help with oxidation.
But as Rakesh said, dust is 1/3 of the factors creating that oxidization, along with moisture and heat. Could not the dust and the moisture be prevented by sealing the edge of the chip with a micro thin strip of thermal tape?

It just seems silly to have to go through THAT much labor over mere dust and moisture if it can be controlled fairly easily.
 
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CAPSLOCKSTUCK

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Very interesting. Thankyou for taking the time and effort.
I should imagine that in the hands of a skilled technician the process is viable. You could probably do quite a few in a day.

Any idea how long each gpu takes to complete ?
 

hat

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Interesting, never knew this is why BGA is called Ball Grid Array. Also never seen the equipment used to make or repair them. And I didn't know this type of connection was that failure prone. One would assume one perk of BGA besides value would be a solid connection.

Which brings me to my next points and questions.

1. Is it really that cost effective if they can fail like this and it takes that amount of labor to fix them?

2. Is it really worth it for the consumer if they have zero control over it's longevity and have to wait for one to be serviced and hope that if it does go bad, it's still under warranty? You say this is done a lot on RMA, so that doesn't sound good for BGA.

3. How can mere dust degrade joints that are already soldered?

4. Why are BGA chips not given some kind of simple dust sealer around the edge of the chip between chip and board if dust can damage them so easily? Such degradation begs the question whether this type of soldering is even very solid.

I have to say, I am SO turned off by BGA after seeing this. I'd MUCH rather have a socket connection with pins and lever. I'm talking of course about Intel coming out with BGA CPUs on CPU/MB combos soon. I guess all GPUs are BGA though, and you're either lucky, or not. Between this option and your mention of card replacement being very expensive, I can see why a lot of GPU manufacturers since the recession have tried to weasel out of RMAs, and why they often offer refurbs or returns vs new cards. This is a reminder how important it is to buy from a manufacturer that backs their product well.

Well, BGA is (probably) cheaper to manufacture then separate LGA/PGA compatible boards and chips, and it prevents damage to the system in any usual way (shipping, bad packaging, dropped the CPU/something in the socket and messed up the pins). I've gotten Intel boards with the pins messed up and I've gotten a CPU or two with pins bent, and bent CPU pins myself (put bare CPU by itself in a box with other stuff, pins got bent a bit). Though, straightening CPU pins a little is usually simple and easy to do. LGA systems are far harder to work with trying to fix bent pins, but generally don't get bent as easily either, but seem far more fragile, although I suppose the force applied on the pins is rather insignificant spread over many hundreds of points, like people who lay on needles.

Downside is if the board fails, or the chip fails, you got to replace the whole thing. Now you're tossing out a good chip just because it's permanently stuck to a bad board. Or upgrading... now you need a new board and CPU just because you want to upgrade the CPU, but it's stuck to the board forever.

I'd imagine it's good for manufacturers, most consumers don't care, but it irks enthusiasts like us who like to swap hardware around a lot, OC and that sort of thing.

Sidenote: IIRC the new Intel BGA systems are supposedly only for low power embedded solutions like we already have anyway. For mainstream systems, HEDT, servers and that sort of thing I think they're using the current LGA system.
 

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Thanks for sharing.

I would cringe to think of what would happen trying to force it out of a tiny .1mm space with air, esp canned air. In that small a space with that many solder joints, you'd most likely be getting most of the dust just jamming up against a lot of joints harder instead of working it's way out. And I don't think canned air is even high enough pressure anyway.

I'd rather see them just apply some simple sealer around the edge of the chip, whether it be a thin strip of thermal tape or whatever. You would think that would be WAY cheaper and effective enough, vs this lengthy and labor intense repair method.But as Rakesh said, dust is 1/3 of the factors creating that oxidization, along with moisture and heat. Could not the dust and the moisture be prevented by sealing the edge of the chip with a micro thin strip of thermal tape?

It just seems silly to have to go through THAT much labor over mere dust and moisture if it can be controlled fairly easily.


If they used sealer i would of thought it would trap heat which again i would of thought would all so be bad too.
 
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If they used sealer i would of thought it would trap heat which again i would of thought would all so be bad too.
It's a chip/MB connection. Socket type connections don't even have the .1mm space these have. The heat off these chips is primarily dealt with by the HS and backplate. It's cheap, lazy construction IMO. The ironic thing is, it also causes them wasted RMA time and labor.
 

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No not agreed. Many cards are repaired like this when RMAed. Giving a new card is way too expensive.

Cl gave me a bnib sc. @fullinfusion got a bnib msi 290x gamer after several 290s he got from them were problematic.

I agree that FCPGA should be used like how caps were mounted then. BGA gets too hot and fails.
 
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What I'd like to know is how the hell did they make those solder balls?
 

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