Thermal Paste

GoFigureItOut · Jun 16, 2015

It's about time to apply a new layer of thermal paste. I wondering which thermal paste offers better cooling potential, Arctic Silver 5 or Antec Nano Diamond?

Also, looking on BestBuy website on Thermal Paste, there's seem to be a whole lot more than I know about such as: Arctic Sliver High-density polysynthetic silver ($15.75), Innovation Cooling IC Diamond ($6.39), Insignia Thermal compound ($10.99), and Cooler Master ($5.99); so do it really matter which kind to use? I know using ceramic is always a no-no!

Ebo · Jun 16, 2015

It dosent really matter, the difference between the best compounds is only 1-3 degrees cencius.

Ive used IC Diamond for a number of years and its a good compound. Now I use Prolimatech PK-3 thats just a bit better.

Jetster · Jun 16, 2015

Ceramic paste is fine. Nothing wrong with it. All the pastes you mention are fine. There is 84 threads about this subject. Any name brand is okay

http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/search/6624844/?q=Thermal+pastes&o=date

GoFigureItOut · Jun 16, 2015

Jetster said:
Ceramic paste is fine. Nothing wrong with it. All the pastes you mention are fine. There is 84 threads about this subject. Any name brand is okay

http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/search/6624844/?q=Thermal+pastes&o=date

Oops, I didn't realize there were so many threads about TIM. Doesn't Ceramic dries up? I've seen it on older Pentium 4's before

Jetster · Jun 16, 2015

They all do eventually

What is more important is the method and surface conditions

R-T-B · Jun 16, 2015

Jetster said:
They all do eventually

Arctic Cooling MX-2 lasts a hell of a long time though... doesn't perform the best or take any number one spots (still pretty darn good though) but I use it for client builds because that stuff lasts a decade if you let it. My clients also aren't the kind of people who like frequent maintenance visits, sadly. My wallet would like it if they were.

mroofie · Jun 16, 2015

Jetster said:
Ceramic paste is fine. Nothing wrong with it. All the pastes you mention are fine. There is 84 threads about this subject. Any name brand is okay

http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/search/6624844/?q=Thermal+pastes&o=date

The Next Week its going to be 168

FreedomEclipse · Jun 16, 2015

I recommend the PK-3 or MX-4, Ive used both. MX-4 is the best bang for buck.

rtwjunkie · Jun 16, 2015

GoFigureItOut said:
Oops, I didn't realize there were so many threads about TIM. Doesn't Ceramic dries up? I've seen it on older Pentium 4's before

It doesn't matter if it dries up, truly. As long as you formed a good bond that filled in all the variations in the two surfaces, and the cooler bond isn't broken, you can leave it indefinately.

Bill_Bright · Jun 16, 2015

GoFigureItOut said:
It's about time to apply a new layer of thermal paste

Why?

The only reason to apply a new layer of TIM is if the cured bond with the old TIM has been broken. Otherwise, TIM does not wear out, go bad or stop working and will easily last 10 to 15 years or longer. Even if it dries the solid materials left behind will continue to occupy the space preventing insulating air from getting in there. And pushing insulating air out of the microscopic pits and valleys in the mating surfaces is what TIM is all about.

You actually risk greater damage through mishandling, ESD, improper cleaning and improper application of new TIM than you do by just leaving things alone.

I see rtwjunkie beat me to it, but I will leave what I said about drying out to reiterate it.

You only need to replace TIM if you pull the heatsink for some reason, or if the computer bounced off the floor and the bond broke through "abusive" handling or transport. Note because coolers, especially aftermarket coolers "hang" off a motherboard in tower PCs, it is recommended you remove them when transporting, or if you are moving it yourself, ensure the PC is always laid down on the side so the cooler sits flat on top of the motherboard during transport.

If the bond is broken, then it is critical to thoroughly clean the mating surfaces. And never reuse TIM.

peche · Jun 16, 2015

well, I'm new using arctic cooling mx TIM, now is on my delidded chip on my gaming build temps are awesome,

Arctic Cooling MX4: I'm using arctic cooling mx4, 20G tube that I got from a TPU friend, this compound rocks I was waiting to use it, have seen several reviews of it outperforming several brands and models, pretty easy to apply despite its texture, pretty bold one,

Arctic Silver 5, it tends to dry a little bit faster compared to silicone based ones, I have used it for more than 5 years, doing repastes every 1 and a half year or 2, pretty hard to apply ir correctly at least for me, recommended to apply a thin layer on CPU cooler, Tinting the Heatsink or cooler, take a watch:

http://www.arcticsilver.com/pdf/appmeth/int/vl/intel_app_method_vertical_line_v1.1.pdf

the thing that I hate about this paste:

Break-In Period by Thermal Compound:

Arctic Silver 5: Break-in period: 200 hours (Break-in period will occur during normal use.) Temps will drop several degrees over the break-in period measured with a thermal diode in the hottest part of the CPU core.

Céramique: Break-in period: 25 hours (Break-in period will occur during normal use.) Temps will drop several degrees over the break-in period measured with a thermal diode in the hottest part of the CPU core.

Arctic Alumina: Break-in period: 36 hours (Break-in period will occur during normal use.) Temps will drop several degrees over the break-in period measured with a thermal diode in the hottest part of the CPU core.

Matrix: Break-in period: 300 hours (Break-in period will occur during normal use.) Temps will drop several degrees over the break-in period measured with a thermal diode in the hottest part of the CPU core.

Coolermaster Ice Fusion, the cheap alternative to my customers, pretty decent, lasts pretty much despite being silicone one, and also the most important part easy to apply, comes with a applicator blade for easy spread, budgetish source, 40G source, pretty cheap and also lasts pretty much on the flask…

Jetster said:
They all do eventually

What is more important is the method and surface conditions

this ... completely on the point !!
clean old past always, be sure that old paste is gone prior to appply a new layer of fresh paste, arctic clean recommended on well, isopropyl alcohol, both cooler and CPU IHS must be cleaned,

R-T-B said:
Arctic Cooling MX-2 lasts a hell of a long time though... doesn't perform the best or take any number one spots (still pretty darn good though) but I use it for client builds because that stuff lasts a decade if you let it. My clients also aren't the kind of people who like frequent maintenance visits, sadly. My wallet would like it if they were.

that’s why I have 3 pastes on my stock for customers, the most used … cheap alternative, coolermaster ice fusion, I have used it on several builds since I got the flask, on all of them still working as the first day!

and also i thing everyone would like to have enthusiasts clients, that come more often for computer check outs!

Bill_Bright · Jun 16, 2015

It is still important to remember that it is the case's responsibility to provide a sufficient supply of cool air flowing through the case. If you really need the extra 3 - 5°C the best TIM provides to keep your system stable or from shutting down, then you really need to look at your case cooling. I am assuming, of course, you don't have a thick layer of heat trapping dust blanketing the interior of your computer, and your ambient (room) temperature isn't 95°F.

As for curing/break-in times, again, if you really need those extra degrees, you should look at case cooling. Note too, especially for those with 200 - 300 hour curing times, you can speed that process up with more frequent heat/cool cycles. Nevertheless, you should still have good temps immediately. It should not be necessary to wait for the curing to complete to achieve acceptable temps. If your temps are too high from the start, you applied it wrong, did not properly secure the heatsink, the fan is not working correctly, or case cooling is insufficient. Or, you have pushed the clock speeds too high for the cooling capacities of the HSF assembly and case.

The gains you achieve through the curing/break-in process should be considered as bonuses and not necessary for safe and stable operation.

MrGenius · Jun 16, 2015

I like this stuff.

Bill_Bright · Jun 16, 2015

The shelf life of 1 year in syringe from date of manufacture is bogus. It is like the use by date you find on boxes of salt. Salt is a rock.

If the syringe has been opened, then the unused TIM may dry out. But that just affects its spreadability, not its thermal transfer properties. I have tubes of TIM that are several years old and still work just fine.

Easy Rhino · Jun 16, 2015

Don't buy IC Diamond. The owner is a real dweeb.

MrGenius · Jun 16, 2015

Bill_Bright said:
The shelf life of 1 year in syringe from date of manufacture is bogus. It is like the use by date you find on boxes of salt. Salt is a rock.

If the syringe has been opened, then the unused TIM may dry out. But that just affects its spreadability, not its thermal transfer properties. I have tubes of TIM that are several years old and still work just fine.

Yeah, I'm pretty sure you're right about that. I've have a ~1 year old syringe half full that's still perfectly usable(no noticeable difference in consistency). Just used some last week, still works as good as it ever did. I do keep the cap on it though(duh...who wouldn't?). And I have no idea when the actual D.O.M. was. For all I know it was sitting on their shelf for a couple years before they sent it to me. They just want me to buy a new one every year, so they can keep their pockets lined with my cash. Not gonna happen.

Bill_Bright · Jun 16, 2015

Yeah, I have some open tubes I've had for years too. You may have to knead them a bit to mix it up but as long as it spreads smoothly with no hard chunks, you are fine. And yeah, replace the cap tightly when done.

peche · Jun 16, 2015

Bill_Bright said:
As for curing/break-in times, again, if you really need those extra degrees, you should look at case cooling. Note too, especially for those with 200 - 300 hour curing times, you can speed that process up with more frequent heat/cool cycles. Nevertheless, you should still have good temps immediately. It should not be necessary to wait for the curing to complete to achieve acceptable temps. If your temps are too high from the start, you applied it wrong, did not properly secure the heatsink, the fan is not working correctly, or case cooling is insufficient. Or, you have pushed the clock speeds too high for the cooling capacities of the HSF assembly and case.

The gains you achieve through the curing/break-in process should be considered as bonuses and not necessary for safe and stable operation

tell that o arctic silver enterprises...

Bill_Bright · Jun 16, 2015

peche said:
tell that o arctic silver enterprises...

Yeah, I know. But keep in mind, it is their marketing weenies that write that stuff and marketing weenies, in terms of honesty, are right up there with shysters, insurance companies and politicians!

peche · Jun 16, 2015

Bill_Bright said:
Yeah, I know. But keep in mind, it is their marketing weenies that write that stuff and marketing weenies, in terms of honesty, are right up there with shysters, insurance companies and politicians!

with all your deserved respect… I trust more arctic silver statements than yours, why? because I have done several repaste operations with several computers, most of them using the same paste, and I have noticed a difference, also improvement over the old applied paste,

in this specific case, I hate arctic silver 5, but I had to used it for a long time cause it was all I had, done several repastes, different methods, noticing several differences between them … so that’s why my friend I will still replacing my paste despite you claim is not necessary,

Regards,

Bill_Bright · Jun 17, 2015

Well, you can certainly do that but I again say if you need those few degrees difference, then your case cooling is lacking, not your TIM. Either that or the TIM was not applied right in the first place, or the cured bond was broken allowing insulation air in between the mating surfaces.

micropage7 · Jun 17, 2015

i use ultra cheap paste with small grain or small dabs method, so far it works pretty good
so it doesnt too matter as long as the rest of your cooling system is good (like airflow, good contact area, pasting method)

R-T-B · Jun 17, 2015

Bill_Bright said:
The shelf life of 1 year in syringe from date of manufacture is bogus. It is like the use by date you find on boxes of salt. Salt is a rock.

If the syringe has been opened, then the unused TIM may dry out. But that just affects its spreadability, not its thermal transfer properties. I have tubes of TIM that are several years old and still work just fine.

I once opened a tube of Corning brand thermal paste that came with an intel heatsink (yeah, didn't know they made thermal paste either) that was 2 years expired. Aparently they meant it, as the thermal paste had no liquid left and was pure powder in the tube...

Of course, that stuff should never be used even within the expiration date...

GoFigureItOut · Jun 17, 2015

Bill_Bright said:
Why?

The only reason to apply a new layer of TIM is if the cured bond with the old TIM has been broken. Otherwise, TIM does not wear out, go bad or stop working and will easily last 10 to 15 years or longer. Even if it dries the solid materials left behind will continue to occupy the space preventing insulating air from getting in there. And pushing insulating air out of the microscopic pits and valleys in the mating surfaces is what TIM is all about.

You actually risk greater damage through mishandling, ESD, improper cleaning and improper application of new TIM than you do by just leaving things alone.

I see rtwjunkie beat me to it, but I will leave what I said about drying out to reiterate it.

You only need to replace TIM if you pull the heatsink for some reason, or if the computer bounced off the floor and the bond broke through "abusive" handling or transport. Note because coolers, especially aftermarket coolers "hang" off a motherboard in tower PCs, it is recommended you remove them when transporting, or if you are moving it yourself, ensure the PC is always laid down on the side so the cooler sits flat on top of the motherboard during transport.

If the bond is broken, then it is critical to thoroughly clean the mating surfaces. And never reuse TIM.

Temps have been rising quite dramatically! In fact, I cannot use my CPU at it's fullest (3.0ghz). I'm using an out-dated AMD X2 6400+ under the normal load @ 3.0ghz, temps will be around 60c

peche · Jun 17, 2015

Bill_Bright said:
Well, you can certainly do that but I again say if you need those few degrees difference, then your case cooling is lacking, not your TIM. Either that or the TIM was not applied right in the first place, or the cured bond was broken allowing insulation air in between the mating surfaces.

false!

how could you explain, a computer that was sat on the same sp0t, the same fan setup on it, also the computer that I use every day, and you said and declare that lack of airflow, c'mon dude, let's be a little more mature, every single crap in this world goes worn out and will need to be replaced, even thermal paste… it gots completely dry sometimes, when this happens anything can break the bond because is mostly dust or powder, even small vibrations on the computer can break that bond or cure,

I'm completely understanding what is made for thermalpaste … and I completely understand that application method is another extreme important point, but also re-application of fresh layers of paste are necessary, because nothing lasts forever…

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Thermal Paste

GoFigureItOut

Ebo

Jetster

GoFigureItOut

Jetster

R-T-B

mroofie

FreedomEclipse

~Technological Technocrat~

rtwjunkie

PC Gaming Enthusiast

Bill_Bright

peche

Thermaltake fanboy

Bill_Bright

MrGenius

Bill_Bright

Easy Rhino

Linux Advocate

MrGenius

Bill_Bright

peche

Thermaltake fanboy

Bill_Bright

peche

Thermaltake fanboy

Bill_Bright

micropage7

R-T-B

GoFigureItOut

peche

Thermaltake fanboy

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