GTX 970 or R9 390 for 1440p ???

[GhostRyder]

http://support.amd.com/en-us/download/desktop/previous?os=windows

According to AMD themselves:

15.7.1 on 7/29/15(Which was just a bug fix for 15.7, the latest an now almost 3 months old)
15.7 on 7/8/15
14.12 on 12/9/14(That's 7 months between drivers!)
14.9 on 9/29/14(That's 3 months between drivers!)
14.4 on 4/15/14(That's 5 months between drivers!)
13.12 on 1/14/14(Thats 3 months between drivers!)

No, I'm not joking.

AMD's track record over the past several years has been terrible.

They might have recently gotten slightly better by unofficially releasing betas, but even those are spread out, and they only did it because tech news sites started reporting how bad their driver support was.

When a new AAA title comes out, nVidia has a game ready driver out the same day, maybe the next day.

Rarely a peep from AMD, your just stuck using the old drivers hoping the game runs smoothly and there aren't any game breaking driver issues.

There is no getting around the fact that AMD has terrible driver support for their cards.

First of all, those are just the WHQL certified, they have drivers out pretty regularly and that certification means nothing...

Second, the only major point to drivers when it comes to games are multi-card profiles and bug fixes. NVidia tends to release what they call a "Game-Ready" driver every time they make a profile or some quick fix versus AMD who releases things in bulk more times than naught (Unless there is an urgent bug fix or big game coming out). I don't like my laptop screeching about a GeForce driver every other day that only adds an SLI profile. AMD's driver support has been just fine for years without major issue and has been updated more than enough to keep up with game releases.

MSI 390 is generally a good overclocker as well (not that 390 is really great in overclocking realm).

Depends what you define as a good overclocker in the end. Nvidia has some fantastic overclocking this round but the gains from going almost 500mhz are not that big especially when you see cards from the other sides competing in the overclocking front with just 100-200mhz.

 

[yogurt_21]

no way to push up your budget to a good deal on a 980 range and avoid this problem entirely? Were I you that's what I'd be doing...

 

[Kanan]

no way to push up your budget to a good deal on a 980 range and avoid this problem entirely? Were I you that's what I'd be doing...

The 980 isn't a really good price/performance card. Rather would I go all the way up to an 980 Ti or at least a Fury Tri-X - but I'd never buy a 980, it's barely better than a 300$ GTX 970 or 780 Ti.
That said, The next option would be the 390X, after that the Fury Tri-X and then a 980Ti - just ignore the 980 it's not worth it.

@Cartman:
You're a cheap AMD-hater / Nvidia-fanboy your trashtalk is nonsense because you ignored the Beta-drivers - but I'm sure that was intended, because you just want to troll or boost your ego with your shit talk.

AMD-Beta drivers are almost the same as their normal ones - I used them for years and never had any problems. And they come regularly. And on the other side, lots of new drivers don't mean it's good - it means a lot must be done. This isn't always good. So, it's not for AMD to release a driver every day, it actually could be an good thing. This is another perspective. Things are relative.

 

[rtwjunkie]

The 980 isn't a really good price/performance card. Rather would I go all the way up to an 980 Ti or at least a Fury Tri-X - but I'd never buy a 980, it's barely better than a 300$ GTX 970 or 780 Ti.
That said, The next option would be the 390X, after that the Fury Tri-X and then a 980Ti - just ignore the 980 it's not worth it.

@Cartman:
You're a cheap AMD-hater / Nvidia-fanboy your trashtalk is nonsense because you ignored the Beta-drivers - but I'm sure that was intended, because you just want to troll or boost your ego with your shit talk.

AMD-Beta drivers are almost the same as their normal ones - I used them for years and never had any problems. And they come regularly. And on the other side, lots of new drivers don't mean it's good - it means a lot must be done. This isn't always good. So, it's not for AMD to release a driver every day, it actually could be an good thing. This is another perspective. Things are relative.

Actually, you're only partly correct. The 980 is not a good value. However its performance is ALOT more than "barely better" than a 970. Its performance is quite a bit more than a 970.

As someone who has both cards, I can actually say that.

However, in gameplay you are not likely to notice...only if you are actually watching framerates.

 

[ne6togadno]

@OP
if you dont want to oc (i think i saw you said you dont want to, but i cant find the post atm) get gigabyte wf. if you manage to save about 400$ get 390x.
my 290x is cold and very quite card. the only time i've seen it above 70 C (72 C) was during gpuz render test. in games it doesnt brake 65-68 C (even in witcher 3)

 

[GreiverBlade]

Actually, you're only partly correct. The 980 is not a good value. However its performance is ALOT more than "barely better" than a 970. Its performance is quite a bit more than a 970.

As someone who has both cards, I can actually say that.

However, in gameplay you are not likely to notice...only if you are actually watching framerates.

annnd i totally agree ...

i might add not a good value unless you get it in a huge bargain .... that or a giveaway... if it didn't happen to me i would still rock my 290

 

[vega22]

You are forgetting one thing. The price range of the 970 is in the category where MOST (not all, I know) of the buyers are people who replace their card every two years. We're at over a year from release now. By this time next year (2 years after release), I predict we will have only a dozen, no more than a score of DX12 games, with most allowing play at DX11 as well.

By the time there are enough DX12 games for your dire prediction to need to be dealt with, the owners will mostly have upgraded.

people will have no choice but to upgrade, they will feel some value from the card because of that time scale for sure. but their options will be upgrade or miss out on things their mates are getting.

at the same time people who spent around the same money on amd cards will still be playing fine. maybe even gaining performance from the switch to dx12 as amd built their cards for it.

we all know what the 970 is, and what is in its future.

it should of been the next 8800gt, but nvidia do not want people being able to sit on 1 card for a number of years, they want you to feel the need to upgrade every other year.

great way to do business if you can find enough fools to believe you :/

 

[GLD]

The 390's use some juice. Mine does at least. My rig with a Sapphire 2G 7850 vanilla used ~275w running 3DMark Firestrike, pulling 42xx points. My rig now with a Sapphire 8G R9 390 OC uses ~475w while running 3DMark Firestrike, pulling 78xx points. The 390 is a good card, it's just bottlenecked in my rig.

 

[yogurt_21]

The 980 has a full speed full 4GB memory, is around 15% faster than the 970 at 1440P, has no coil whine, and deals and refurbs/deals on new can be had for the mid 400's US. So your value summary is incorrect or ignoring known issues.

As for the comparison to the 390X the 980 is 6dbA quieter, around 2-5% faster at 1440P, uses half the peak wattage (184 v 370 on the 390X), is ~22C cooler at load, and can be had for only 50-80$ more.

I get the performance per dollar issue between it and the 970, 15% more performance for 40-50% more price. But to me losing coil whine, getting full 64 ROPs and full speed 4GB memory would be worth it. Not to mention at 1440P 15% can mean the difference between playable and not. Or at least playable at good aa/af levels and playable with aa/af off, impacting the final product you're presented with.

 

[Kanan]

I concur to you partly - you correctly acknowledge its only slightly faster (around 15-25% depending on custom cards compared - I ignore ref cards), but then you continue to praise relative things such as coil whine and "full speed memory and 64 rops". The first thing (coil whine) is depending on the custom card, so this is only a partly truth - both, 970 and 980 could be bad, and BOTH could be good. The speed of the memory and 64 rops aren't further important, the speed difference still is only 15-25% - not enough to warrant a high price of over 500€ for a decent custom card. The 980 was without alternative before the 980 Ti was introduced, it was simply the highest card, therefore the price was justified, because "THE" highend card deserves to have a price premium. But now? For 500€ I'd never buy it, I get a Fury Tri-X for 545€, it's faster and with DX12 even more so and I have a good chance of enabling some shaders on it, making it even better. Basically, before I'd buy that, I'd buy a 290X, 780 Ti, 390, 390X or Fury Tri-X ... or I'd save some money and get the best, the 980 Ti. But I'd never buy a 970 or 980, both aren't the best at their pricepoints (anymore).

PS. Noise is depending on custom model again - and wattage isn't that important to waste lots of money on it. A 390X is about as fast as a 980 and has double the ram. The 290X is almost half the price and is a bit slower or faster, depending on the game. Basically you've put a lot of relative arguments, that don't stand to the truth. Nvidia has a strong point: it's the 980 Ti. The rest? I'd get AMD, because it scales better in DX12 and is on ~equal speed now. This is nothing new, it was like that a lot of times (GTX 580 vs 6970, 780 Ti vs 290X). Nvidia wins the best GPU price with the 980 Ti again, but at the lower price points they basically suck a bit. That said, the GTX 700 gen was better balanced - you had 780 Ti, 780 and 770 - now you have the best, or a card that is 40% slower, the 980. It's a great fall. Bad that there is no 980 Pro (with ~2300 shaders activated like the 780) - but good for AMD.

 

[rtwjunkie]

@Kanan, truth is, we really don't know what scales better than what yet in DX12. Too few benchmarks, no real games yet (the one out was AMD assisted in development, and is basically a nenchmark to measure cpu calls).

As to the 980, i and others have already said monetarily it's a bad deal, and yes, there are a few cards that beat it. Still doesn't make it not desirable for some.

That's what is great, we can all like and be happy with different things.

 

[Kanan]

@Kanan, truth is, we really don't know what scales better than what yet in DX12. Too few benchmarks, no real games yet (the one out was AMD assisted in development, and is basically a nenchmark to measure cpu calls).

As to the 980, i and others have already said monetarily it's a bad deal, and yes, there are a few cards that beat it. Still doesn't make it not desirable for some.

That's what is great, we can all like and be happy with different things.

Your statement is already old.
http://www.pcgameshardware.de/DirectX-12-Software-255525/Specials/Spiele-Benchmark-1172196/
Is that a AMD game too? I guess all DX12-games will be AMD games... and thats not even a joke, the architecture simply is more suited to it and/or gains more from it than Maxwell. Maybe even Kepler gains more from DX12 than Maxwell.

That's what is great, we can all like and be happy with different things.

We don't talk about toys or barbies here. We talk hardware. All that really matters here are numbers, science, proof. So, sorry if I talk "bad" about your hardware, but I don't care much about feelings here.

 

[rtwjunkie]

Your statement is already old.
http://www.pcgameshardware.de/DirectX-12-Software-255525/Specials/Spiele-Benchmark-1172196/
Is that a AMD game too? I guess all DX12-games will be AMD games... and thats not even a joke, the architecture simply is more suited to it and/or gains more from it than Maxwell. Maybe even Kepler gains more from DX12 than Maxwell.


We don't talk about toys or barbies here. We talk hardware. All that really matters here are numbers, science, proof. So, sorry if I talk "bad" about your hardware, but I don't care much about feelings here.

Not hurting my feelings one bit. Im way too old for immature games like yours. Fanboyism is for young people who don't know what really matters in the world.

What I'm telling you is it's going to be awhile till we know what truly is better than what in DX12. It's called a TREND. A handful is not indicative and doesn't show what is prevalent among DX12 games IN GENERAL. Hard data from multiple sources does that.

And numbers are not all that matters. Know why? It's not a competition. What matters is what hardware people are happy with. That's why so many types and varieties exist...we're not all the same, and choice is personal.

 

[Kanan]

It's rather immature to call me immature because I made a joke. It shows your not that "mature" as you think you are. Mature is when you are old and can always chill down and be easy on things. Clearly not what you're doing here.

This thread is about the now. The "trend" as you call it, directs based on this DX12 bench to AMD, so if I were to decide, or talk, about the now, my opinion is what you can read above. What you say, all in all, is right though. But decisions are made on the present, and predicted future, all what I try to do is just work with the data I have, some general experience and some informations I've collected.

And numbers are not all that matters. Know why? It's not a competition. What matters is what hardware people are happy with. That's why so many types and varieties exist...we're not all the same, and choice is personal.

Again, it was a joke, but only partly. What I say is true too. People tend to be too emotional about hardware sometimes, being fanboyish after a while and tend to see the things as they wanna see them. My opinion was just a contrast to that. And I don't care about brand btw. - so if you called me a fanboy, get your informations straight next time. Thats TriFire Radeon "Evergreen" on the pic, I had GF 256, GF 3 Ti, GF 7800GT/7900GT, 8600GT, GTX260 216 BE and now a GTX 780 Ti. So probably I care less of brands than everyone else here.

 

[rtwjunkie]

We don't talk about toys or barbies here. We talk hardware. All that really matters here are numbers, science, proof. So, sorry if I talk "bad" about your hardware, but I don't care much about feelings here.

Sorry, but that was not a joke. You are now trying to diminish what you said in that paragraph that was clearly disparaging. By your assumption that my feelings were hurt, it also clearly showed an allegience to a brand, because you belittled choice insisting numbers are all that matters.

So no, I saw no joking at all in your statement. What I see now is you SAYING it was a joke. This is common nervous behavior amongst people that realize they just stepped in shit by saying the wrong thing. It's minimalization, and lack of personal responsibility for one's actions.

Fiinally, on the subject of which is better, I am on record in the other very similarly-named thread saying the R9 390 would be the better card.

http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/threads/high-end-build-gtx970-vs-r9-390.216645/#post-3355404

 

[Kanan]

lot of bla

No, that is just your interpretation of things, nothing more. It was a joke and I don't care at all if you believe me. And your superiorority-arrogance based on your silly assumption that you are more mature than me is just that - silly.
It's easy to counter you, I don't need any "diminishing of words" or "minimalization" on my part. Partly you already do that yourself with your philosophically limited sight of the world, based on "age" and other superficial things that aren't really important.
And btw. your behaviour is common for a old man, thinking he is superior, just because he is old - that silly and easily foreseeable behaviour doesn't make me nervous at all. It's too common to do that. And sorry that I indeed hurt your feelings - just make it more obvious every time you post and argue against it. Okay.

Still, brand is not important, what matters is performance and reliability. DX12, the facts that can be seen right now, AMD has an edge. AMD cards are rather future built and NV is more based on the now - you can easily see that on R9 290X which was built on Mantle and DX12 in mind, and NV, just doing a brand new architecture maximized for DX11 and concentrating to do a new architecture (Pascal) for DX12. Also having hardware Asynch Compute (and I dont buy it that its "deactivated" in Maxwell - it just isn't there, basically this is a marketing strategy of NV) is a good thing and improves performance, compared to GeForce cards. I don't say what AMD does is better, basically they live in the future and NV lives more in the now, philosophically. For someone buying a new card every 1-2 years NV is better - for someone keeping an card longer than that, I'd say AMD is better. It depends. But based on DX12 I'd say AMD is better situated right now, because they clearly invested in it, not NV. NV just followed. The benchmarks just cover that.

And finally: your behaviour is fanboyish not mine. Basically you defend your GTX 980 all the time, and all your arguments are NV-biased, while me is sporting a GTX 780 Ti and is speaking good of AMD cards and partly NV cards like Kepler. Just to set the facts straight, you can't see.

 

[rtwjunkie]

Lol, youve been here how long? When is this "all the time?" Had you actually been a part of this site since before August, you'd know it's new, and therefore can't "always" be defending it. You'd also know what card I had for a long time prior. It's a hunk of metal and plastic. There's no emotion there. And I constantly talk positively about AMD. Check for yourself.

Double LOL, you still haven't hurt my feelings. Someone in my line of work learns not to take things personally. I'm also well practiced at the behaviors of people...there is a commonality to all. For insrance, when people say "relax, it was just a joke" is one of the most common minimalizations of what was done. Are you aware that 90% of a joke is based on what a person really feels and means?

As you'd notice, if you had gone to the link of the similar thread I provided, I too think the 390 is better for 1440p. I only made an initial correction the other day on your statement the 980 is barely better than a 970, because that is the statement of someone who can recite facts, but has no personal experience. If you had, you'd know the actual performance is more impressive compared to 970 than what numbers show.

On your assertion that current gen AMD MAY be more ready for DX12 than Maxwells and Keplers, you are probably correct. There is not enough of a trend in benchmarks prove this yet though, and a fair and learned person would recognize it's too early to call a winner in DX12 benchmarks for either side.

However Nvidia have admitted they have made the best dx11 cards they can, which tends to prove your statement correctly for the current gens. With their R&D budget they can afford to be like that. They know, as I have asserted many times on this forum that by the time enough DX12 games are out to matter, then Pascal will be out. That actually does sound like great planning, and excellent business sense.

 

[Kanan]

Lol, youve been here how long? When is this "all the time? Had you actually been a part of this site since before August, you'd know it's new, and therefore can't "always" be defending it. It's a hunk of metal and plastic. There's no emotion there.

It's not important how long I'am here, I base my things on the things you write down here and now. I never used the word "always" in connection to defending anything. Stay to the facts. Don't imagine things if you're out of arguments.
And just because you say there is no emotion, it's not true. Actually there is, but you don't want to admit it. Absolutely sure of that, though. I'm experienced in these things too.

Double LOL, you still haven't hurt my feelings. Someone in my line of work learns not to take things personally. I'm also well practiced the behaviors of people...there is a commonality to all. For insrance, whwn people say "relax, it was just a joke" is one of the most commone minimalizations of what was done. Are you aware that 90% of a joke is based on what a person really feels and means?

I didn't hurt your feelings, so thats why you react just like a person that has hurt feelings, okay. I'll say it again: just try and try, it won't get any better. Obvious that you are offended, that's why you attacked me in the first place, me being immature etc. It's immature to being emotional and don't admit it, being hurt and don't admit it. You are old? But then, you aren't that mature you think I'd say. Actually you act like a grown child. This is not intended as a attack on you, just what I see. It's not bad to be childish, at least sometimes. I'm childish myself at times. But I can admit it, can you?
And yeah, I'am aware that jokes are based on the truth. Still it was a joke, meaning you don't have to get offended by it, or take it 100% serious - but you did it anyway. That's the problem. Important is, HOW you say things, not what you say. I mean I can go to a person and criticize fairly, or I can attack. I can do a joke about things with a little critique in it, or I can drive it totaly serious. Its always good to be friendly, whether critizizing or not, that's what I mean. And jokes should be accepted as jokes, I mean if you don't then you don't like my humour or don't understand it, but I'm no liar when I say it was a joke.

As you'd notice, if you had gone to the link of the similar thread I provided, I too think the 390 is better for 1440p. I only made an initial correction the other day on your statwmwnt the 980 is barely better than a 970, because that is the statwment of someobe who can recite facts, but has no personal experience. If you had, you'd know the actual performance is more impressive cimpared to 970 than whT numbers show.

And I thanked your post and accepted that - did you see me anywhere argueing against that again? No. So, yes, I accept that a 980 is clearly faster (about 15-25% which I wrote earlier too). But its price/performance is still not the best.

On your assertion that current gen AMD MAY be more ready for DX12 than Maxwells and Keplers, you are probably correct. There is bot enough of a trend in benchmarks prove this yet.

Of course, it's not proven, not proven enough at least. But I'm pretty sure to be right on this point. Still, it's just my well experienced opinion, nothing more, yes.

However Nvidia have admitted they have made the best dx11 cards they can, which twnds to prove your statement correctly. With their R&D budget they can afford to be like that. They know, as I have asserted many times on this forum that by the time enough DX12 ganes are out to matter, then Pascal will be out. That actually does sound like great planning, and excellent business sense.

Yes, to that I concur completely. All in all, I like both companys. AMD for their hardware innovations like HBM, Asynch Compute, new API (and forcing Microsoft to do DX12, or do it faster at least) etc. and NV for their great software/hardware implementations like Physx, TXAA, MFAA, greatly optimized architectures with good energy improvements. But I'm no fanboy of either company. I had a lot of GeForce cards as stated before, then I had Radeon for about 6 years now and back to GeForce once again.

 

[rtwjunkie]

Basically you defend your GTX 980 all the time, and all your arguments are NV-biased,

Actually, yes, you did say i was always defending a hunk of metal by saying "all the time". See? Those are your words. You got offended because I asked how long you've been here. There was a purpose to that. It was to point out you make an assumption about what my GPU is/has been. By extension, had you been here, you wouldn't have made a presumptive statement like that.

And really, it's all good! You have not angered me or offended me. I, by the nature of my work, point out behavior which is not friendly or cordial or which can cause hard feelings. What I am is brutally honest, which can offend others sometimes as it.obviously did you, because remember you first said I was offended.

For the record, I did not say you were immature. I described immature GAMES like yours. It's a subtle difference which misunderstandings in language can cause. It's pointing out behavior of a person, not describing the person.

I wish you a good night. It's time to be with the family.

 

[Kanan]

Actually, yes, you did say i was always defending a hunk of metal by saying "all the time". See? Those are your words. You got offended because I asked how long you've been here. There was a purpose to that. It was to point out you make an assumption about what my GPU is/has been. By extension, had you been here, you wouldn't have made a presumptive statement like that.

Yes those are my words, but they are true - because it's just based on the here and now. I stay with my opinion on that matter. Why do you always think I'm offended? Do you take a perverse pleasure in seeing emotions in people, that you don't have or act you don't have, so you can see yourself as superior? Seems to me likely. But you are not. I'm still sure you were offended. Me, no, not really. It was more like "fun" to me - everything, that is.

And really, it's all good! You have not angered me or offended me. I, by the nature of my work, point out behavior which is not friendly or cordial or which can cause hard feelings. What I am is brutally honest, which can offend others sometimes as it.obviously did you, because remember you first said I was offended.

Yes I said you were offended, and you use that to think I was, but I'm not. But still you defend yourself too much - as a more or less fact based on my experience, if people defend too much, the opposite is true. So yes, you were angered. At least a bit. But you don't have to admit that, okay with me. I accept, that you want to uphold your imagined superiority over basically everyone else, I guess - based on your work etc. I think that is very true.

For the record, I did not say you were immature. I described immature GAMES like yours. It's a subtle difference which misunderstandings in language can cause. It's pointing out behavior of a person, not describing the person.

I wish you a good night. It's time to be with the family.

It's a difference, but not by much. Still it was a attack on my person, you can start a poll on that, if you want. 99% of persons would have taken that as an insult. So don't try - using your words - minimizing it down. It is what it is. Good night. At least we have an agreement on NV vs. AMD things.

 

[johnspack]

As a 970 owner, I'd say go 980ti for 1440. I love my strix, runs all my games maxxed out at about 51c tops because I like to set my fans high, but gives me better boost, so why not. My 7 case fans are also loud, so I never hear the card anyways. Most everything runs at 100+ fps, but there are cases, especially on a few select games where I hit 4gbs ram usage, that it stutters bad. I feel it's pretty dam top of the line for 1080, but 1440 probably not.

 

[the54thvoid]

Yes those are my words, but they are true - because it's just based on the here and now. I stay with my opinion on that matter. Why do you always think I'm offended? Do you take a perverse pleasure in seeing emotions in people, that you don't have or act you don't have, so you can see yourself as superior? Seems to me likely. But you are not. I'm still sure you were offended. Me, no, not really. It was more like "fun" to me - everything, that is.


Yes I said you were offended, and you use that to think I was, but I'm not. But still you defend yourself too much - as a more or less fact based on my experience, if people defend too much, the opposite is true. So yes, you were angered. At least a bit. But you don't have to admit that, okay with me. I accept, that you want to uphold your imagined superiority over basically everyone else, I guess - based on your work etc. I think that is very true.


It's a difference, but not by much. Still it was a attack on my person, you can start a poll on that, if you want. 99% of persons would have taken that as an insult. So don't try - using your words - minimizing it down. It is what it is. Good night. At least we have an agreement on NV vs. AMD things.

Is English your first language? I've been reading @rtwjunkie's replies to you and you seem to be misunderstanding him.
This in turn is causing a circular argument where his words are being used in the same arguments you are writing.
He at no point inferred superiority, his post about age was to distance himself from certain behaviours.
Likewise, I think perhaps there is a great misunderstanding of what you are posting. I know that my written word is often misunderstood emotionally where meaning is attached where none was meant.
Let's rest your discussion and get back on topic.

 

[rtwjunkie]

Let's rest your discussion and get back on topic.

Excellent suggestion! Thanks.

 

[Aquinus]

What @the54thvoid said. @rtwjunkie has already stated that given the options that the 390 is probably going to be a better option given the price. Not exactly sure why this argument is even here since the 980 isn't an option because if it were, so would the 390x. The 970 and 390 are similar in price which is why the OP was asking. @Kanan don't try to bait people into an argument. Not only do I not like it, the moderators don't tend to like it either and name calling is unacceptable and doesn't reflect mature behavior. Not to mention that @rtwjunkie tends to be a pretty nice guy until you start talking down to him.

Either way, I'm pretty sure the common consensus is that the 390 is probably going to last longer thanks to what it has under the hood whereas the 970 very well might not last as long because of the fewer ROPS, TMUs, and memory but makes up for it with clocks.

People tend to forget this and I'll remind them now, the 390 has 160 TMUs. The 970 has 104 TMUs. With that said, what card do you think is going to handle more and higher resolution textures better? Not just that but more textured polygons even without higher resolution textures. Then remember that the 390 has 8GB of VRAM on it. I'll concede that AMD doesn't do the anti-aliasing thing well but, but there are a lot of things GCN does very well. So depending on the game and how it was developed, either the 970 or 390 would be a good option.

As for DX12, I reserve judgement for when games are actually released and using it before I make any determinations on how much AMD cards really will benefit from it. I'm sure it depends on the engine and features being utilized.

 

[jormungand]

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127874&cm_re=r9_390-_-14-127-874-_-Product

$329 less $20 MIR >>>> $309.99

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00ZGF0UAE/?tag=tec06d-20

$320 less $20 >>>>$299.99

what do you think ???? or i drive to tigerdirect and grab it for this price + taxes
http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=9777412&CatId=11972
anyway i can wait a little longer.....