Phenom - is it good?

[kid41212003]

I will stick with Kei's posts. He did make alot sense, and I understood his posts.

 

[Viscarious]

I will stick with Kei's posts. He did make alot sense, and I understood his posts.

Speaking of sense. Oops, you cant edit that now that I quoted it, huh?

 

[kid41212003]

I'm waiting for the results from someone that can becnhmark a Phenom @ 2.4GHz or 2.7GHz with 3dmark cpu tests, so I can compare what is really different between Phenom on AM2 and AM2+ mobo. I don't really care if this pointless, I don't care what you think about 3DMark, or about WoW or the online social itself, you're hitting yourself on the head.
I'm glad that you are happy with your System, that it do what you wanted it to, and fullfil your needs. But You do not understand my posts and going out off the road.
Saying Futuremark are pointless, and insulting directly to me. I'm not here to insult you. You posts are not helpful to me. This is the last time I will answer any of your posts.

 

[blueskynis]

WoW

....looks like my thread has just been hijacked :shadedshu

Can someone say something about my first post?

Well, I'm going to the thread Kei pointed me to for some reading (good reading)...

 

[btarunr]

Mine is on its way

Multi-threaded games do benefit from Phenom, some benches did give these chips an edge over dual-core chips.

 

[blueskynis]

Mine is on its way

Multi-threaded games do benefit from Phenom, some benches did give these chips an edge over dual-core chips.

Hi,

Thats nice to hear
I'm just curious, what motherboard do you have? Tell us when you get it

 

[ShogoXT]

The phenoms are better priced lower performance quads at the moment, but since dual core CPUs tend to be a better bang for the buck, I tend to recommend the Intel Core 2 Duo, maybe the E7200 or E8400 atm.

EDIT: the Q6600 is nice, but id like it if the new 45nm ones were cheaper.

 

[btarunr]

Hi,

Thats nice to hear
I'm just curious, what motherboard do you have? Tell us when you get it

ASUS M3A. It's using the 0805 BIOS.

 

[nanohead]

Oh god. 3Dmark points dont mean shit. If you made a PC for any reason, its for gaming, am I right? What the hell difference does it make if you have 22k 3dmark score and suck ass at all your games.

Gods are made through gaming, not 3Dmarks.

I love you right now. Funniest freakin thing I've read in a while..... and TRUE

 

[btarunr]

Oh god. 3Dmark points dont mean shit. If you made a PC for any reason, its for gaming, am I right? What the hell difference does it make if you have 22k 3dmark score and suck ass at all your games.

Gods are made through gaming, not 3Dmarks.

Once again, you're confusing gaming PC with enthusiast PC. Enthusiast PCs are purely for performance supremacy, gaming takes a back seat. Performance supremacy is all that counts. Hence benchmark, OC competitions are held (just like gaming competitions). Think of it like this: people buy Porsche 911, Lamborghini Diablo, etc. being rich automobile enthusiasts, but at the same time needn't be racers.

The enthusiasts I know (in this forum), like Wile E, DaMulta, etc. use their rigs for benchmarks primarily, that's why they shell out 1000s of dollars on strong CPUs, cards, etc. gaming takes a back seat. I think DaMulta's junior sometimes plays PEGI 5+ games on his Dad's tri-SLI rig

 

[Exceededgoku]

I'm quite a big AMD fanboy but I haven't bought Phenom yet and I haven't bought a quad core yet because I don't want another intel. I'll be honest I'm probably stupid in being soo biased but I think I'll hold my reservation until Deneb/790FX combo is benched against Nehalem/X58 combo .

 

[btarunr]

I'm quite a big AMD fanboy but I haven't bought Phenom yet and I haven't bought a quad core yet because I don't want another intel. I'll be honest I'm probably stupid in being soo biased but I think I'll hold my reservation until Deneb/790FX combo is benched against Nehalem/X58 combo .

Nehalem/X58 already won. Buy it. Deneb at best could challenge a Yorkfield (upto Q9550) in pure performance.

 

[blueskynis]

I'm quite a big AMD fanboy but I haven't bought Phenom yet and I haven't bought a quad core yet because I don't want another intel. I'll be honest I'm probably stupid in being soo biased but I think I'll hold my reservation until Deneb/790FX combo is benched against Nehalem/X58 combo .

Yes, I do also think it's now better to wait a little until some better, power efficient and overclocking friendly boards emerge which will exploit full power of Phenoms.

 

[blueskynis]

Unfortunately, it looks like motherboard manufacturers think there is no need to implement such a (power savings) feature, even for marketing purposes. Also, I blame AMD for not pushing this spec through their influence in computer industry. They should made some marketing hype about this specs and everyone should know about it. For Intel platform you can see marketing for this same thing on almost every IT site. They are now pushing 16 phases for Intel, and the best I have seen for AMD are older motherboards with 8 phases?!

 

[HAL7000]

Nehalem/X58 already won. Buy it. Deneb at best could challenge a Yorkfield (upto Q9550) in pure performance.

can you share the bench test(s) that supports this statement? I would like to review it myself.

 

[HAL7000]

The only Deneb bench I found was this one...not sure if it is real?
http://www.expreview.com/news/hard/2008-08-01/1217578981d9645.html

 

[blueskynis]

There was somewhere a SuperPI Deneb benchmark result, and I can remember it wasn't very high...not sure though.

 

[blueskynis]

Fortunately, ASRock isn't the only one with PSI spec enabled boards:

From: http://www.lostcircuits.com/discus/showthread.php?t=420&page=5

You mean the X58 Extreme MBs being showed off?

They aren't true 16-phase as we commonly understand, nope. I can't recall any MB more than 12-phase at most ATM.

I found more MBs supporting AM2+ PSI Spec. Although slightly renamed, it is no other than Jetway who probably has the best and most consistent overall AM2+ lineup this year.

Jetway calls it GPI: http://www.jetway.com.tw/jw/gpi.asp
MBs that support it: http://www.jetway.com.tw/jw/gpi.asp#

Though with so many power-saving molds available, there is still demand for extra phases to cope with the high electrical current required when a CPU run at high frequency, so as to better disperse heat and enhance voltage transfer rate (most of the manufacturers use 3~5 phases and one-phase CPU NB power for current AMD AM2+ CPU ). We might as well take the 125W CPU HD985ZXAJ4BGH-the one with utmost power consumption- as an example to illustrate CPU power transformation. When this CPU works at its highest frequency of 2500MHz, its core voltage/current of is 1.300V/80.1A. However, when CPU runs at its lowest frequency of 1250MHz, the core voltage/current of CPU is 1.050V 39.4~8.06 A. We can see that the previous power consumption is almost 12300% of the latter, but the motherboards can not fully reach this goal in consumption differentia in reality, because of voltage transfer rate.
The common one-phase PWM can realize about 85% voltage transfer rate when loaded 5~20A, with optimal transfer rate when loaded at around 13A and a drop in transfer rate after 20A. However, when running at current under 5A, PWM voltage transfer rate drops dramatically, even under 50%. Jetway utilizes G.P.I technology to enhance voltage transfer rate under low frequency and low electrical current circumstances. The green power indicator will automatically turn off when CPU workload is heavy and turn on when CPU workload is light to indicate power saving mold being activated.

Just to demystify the market-speak; Voltage Transfer Rate = Efficiency
12300% = they meant ~1230%

Check out what current/voltage uses they gave as maximum for the 9850BE they tested, in idle and load

Max. Load Stock = 104.13W
Idle = ~ 8.463W to 41.37W

They also make it clear to you the obvious - when 1-phase has 5A or lower being drawn the efficiency of the power conversion is below 50%.

Imagine we had the tools they did and I measured the 0.45v 452MHz we achieved in CnQ oc... or the 0.4v 100MHz

UPDATE
I played about with an AM2+ PSI supporting MB+9850 BE: http://www.ocxtreme.org/forumenus/showpost.php?p=52709&postcount=260

This guy played a little with ASRock PSI spec enabled boards and here are some results:

Initial MB Power Differences [exact same setup]
ASR MCP78 with old 9850 2.8G setup and HD 2600 XT CnQ idles 96W AC.
MSI 790FX with old 9850 2.8G setup and HD 2600 XT CnQ idles 118W AC.

ASR MCP78 with old 9850 2.8G setup and HD 2600 XT idles 108-110W AC.
MSI 790FX with old 9850 2.8G setup and HD 2600 XT idles 134-138W AC.

ASR MCP78 with old 9850 2.8G setup and HD 2600 XT loads 199-201W AC. (CoreDamage 5 mins)
MSI 790FX with old 9850 2.8G setup and HD 2600 XT loads 250-252W AC. (CoreDamage 5 mins)

 

[blueskynis]

(Update September 2008) List of boards supporting AM2+ PSI specification:

ASRock (Intelligent Energy Saver): http://www.asrock.com/feature/IES/Models.html (10 boards)
Jetway (Green Power Indicator): http://www.jetway.com.tw/jw/GPI.asp (8 boards, more coming soon)
MSI (DrMOS, GreenPower): DKA790GX Platinum, DKA790GX (2 boards)

For now only 3 motherboard manufacturers and 20 different models!

 

[Kei]

Damn! I've love it if ASUS would get in on that party. Those findings go perfectly with the results I've found using my system draw meter I keep plugged in at all times.

K

 

[johnnyfiive]

It doesn't matter that we can still use Phenom on older sockets mobo, because we can't use it at full-potential anyway. For all users who bought the 790FX mobo with SB600, they are stucked with a mobo that can't OC the Phenom at its best. Like, I am, an ASUS M2N32 AM2 mobo.
At first, I ignored people's advices, I bought an Phenom 9750, and an Zalman CNPS 9700NT cooler for it (total 270 usd). With that money, I could have move to Intel, I felt like they scammed me, an 215USD CPU that can't even perform on bar or better than a Q6600 (195usd).

You should research before buying. You can't blame anyone but yourself for going with AMD. AMD will always be inferior to Intel due to Intel's massive resources. Even when AMD is on top of the CPU market people will expect Intel's next offering to either dominate or perform on the same level. When AMD is behind they accept it and offer products to customers at affordable prices. That is why I stick with AMD. It's a personal thing with me now, AMD always puts products within customers price range.

When you buy a CPU for overclocking, you should research its abilities. To blame a 9750 for not being able to overclock like a Q6600 is stupid. If you want an overclockable CPU you don't buy a 1st gen Phenom, that is common sense. So to answer the OP's question, IMO, Phenom's are awesome CPU's.

 

[RevengE]

Yes the phenoms are good CPUs I have a 9850 Black edition and I
Love it dearly..paired with an asus m3a79-T deluxe motherboard both are awesome

 

[PCpraiser100]

I am impressed in Phenom 2, it did beat the i7 pack in some benchmarks, however I am waiting for AM3 now because reviewers say that the 925 and 945 will have a 5-10 percent performance advantage with the recently released CPUs. I hope there are AM3 mombos that will have both DDR2 and DDR3 slot so I can finally make a smooth upgrade with the 1333MHz RAM.