ATI Radeon HD 6000 Series ''Southern Islands'' Graphics Cards For Sale from November

[HossHuge]

Originally Posted by Zubasa

That makes the 6870 barely faster than the 5870....
Since the 5830 is actually no better than a 4890.

Whats the point in releasing a new high-end if it is only around GTX 480 speeds?

From what I've read the 5870 is about the same as a 5770 crossfire system. So, I based my prediction from that.

And from this article

In particular, this paragragh.

The SI family will offer higher performance compared to currently available ATI Radeon HD 5000 “Evergreen” line, but will hardly be considerably more advanced in terms of feature-set. It is rumoured that designers of the new GPUs concentrated mostly on improving efficiency, but not on building something completely new from scratch, which is why certain building blocks of the new Sothern Islands family will be inherited from the current Evergreen line.

So, I'm guessing it will be about 20-30% faster than a 5870 but much more efficient. Remember, it's just a guess...

[MikeX]

If they are getting these cards with 40nm, double the shaders would just be another gtx 480 power drawer.
I hope they use lower nm memory gddr5, at least this would gain little more ghz and bandwidth.
There is not much achievement here, just another gtx 480 that is about to be made by ATI.
Unless ... the architecture of the card is changed ?

[Steevo]

Originally Posted by Wile E

I don't have malware, pirated software, or incompatible software. And the drivers are still shit at stock clocks on a fresh install. These aren't user caused issues.

And ATI no longer has an advantage in IQ. They are both slightly different, but neither is better anymore. ATI is strong in IQ where nV is weak, and vice versa.

http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/HQV/HQV_2.0/

If ATI is selling millions of these cards, and only a few thousand have issues. I would call that a success on their part. Of course if you have issues you will always feel like they are doing a poor job.

I use mine for more than playing games. It also runs my 46" TV with netflix, DVD's, home movies, etc....


Nvidia has had extra plugins to make this work in the past, now at least tehy have integrated audio, but they are still lacking in image quality for content.


As far as games go I believe they are tit for tat.

[hv43082]

Ah damn it. Time to upgrade already? I've only used by 5970 for 4 months. I missed the old day when my 8800gtx was at the top for almost 2yrs. Then again games weren't as graphically intensive as now.

[the54thvoid]

The one massively important thing here is... it's a dx11 part (obviously) so if you've already taken that route, there may be little point in upgrading yet. I think this release wil make a 5 series part more attractive as the price slides down.

On the performance note - i dont think it's being designed to beat a GTX 480 and i doubt it will. It would require serious redesign (which it isn't) and a die shrink in process (which it isn't). All i know from some extensive reading about it is it's stop gap to fill the void between now and Northern Islands on 28nm. It's using some of that chips design tech (not a lot) and the rest is good old evergreen.

Remember kids, ATI gave the industry an astonishingly impressive line up last year (yes, last year) which gave us amazing performance with conservative power and noise. That was a great feat. NV came along with the GF100 half year later with a huffing and puffing powerful monster. It's hot and hungry for a reason and i think it's the most 40nm can do.

Nup, i think GTX 480 will remain the flawed king until NI comes out. But... even if SI only manages to match GTX 480 performance (especially in tesselated tasks) but more efficient than 5 series - to me thats a win.

[mdsx1950]

Originally Posted by CHAOS_KILLA

Bro, your so...... gonna get 2 HD6970's aren't you hahaha

Am I THAT predictable? LOL

Originally Posted by inferKNOX

That's a possibility, but what makes you so certain?
I'm less worried about the performance and more so about the price.

Well i'm certain because the 4xxx series -> 5xxx series was just like that.

4850=5750
4870=5770

etc.

But then again its just my opinion.

[link2009]

Originally Posted by mdsx1950

Am I THAT predictable? LOL



Well i'm certain because the 4xxx series -> 5xxx series was just like that.

4850=5750
4870=5770

etc.

But then again its just my opinion.

Read the post above yours... The 5xxx series brought forth DirectX11, so you can't compare apples to oranges. There's no point in getting a 4870 if a 5770 is more future proof and around the same price.

[HossHuge]

Originally Posted by mdsx1950

Am I THAT predictable? LOL

Dude, your system makes me want to cry for joy.

[theubersmurf]

I wonder if ATI will lower their prices down the the original MSRP for the 5xxx cards. :P

[mlee49]

Any estimates on the length of a possible 6970? 1yrd?

Seriously though are these cards going to be longer than 13"?

[theubersmurf]

Originally Posted by link2009

Read the post above yours... The 5xxx series brought forth DirectX11, so you can't compare apples to oranges. There's no point in getting a 4870 if a 5770 is more future proof and around the same price.

You kind of can atm. The feature set provided by DX11 hardware is basically negligible, as no one develops anything that makes use of DX11...At least not enough to be considered an important feature. Right now their most salient feature is still DX9 SM 3.0 performance.

[Salsoolo]

Originally Posted by mlee49

Any estimates on the length of a possible 6970? 1yrd?

Seriously though are these cards going to be longer than 13"?

i dont think so. i think the current high end ones are already out of spec.

they should work on getting these cards smaller while having excellent performance.

[TheMailMan78]

Originally Posted by mlee49

Any estimates on the length of a possible 6970? 1yrd?

Seriously though are these cards going to be longer than 13"?

I'm guessing about one Tommy Lee long.

[mdsx1950]

Originally Posted by link2009

Read the post above yours... The 5xxx series brought forth DirectX11, so you can't compare apples to oranges. There's no point in getting a 4870 if a 5770 is more future proof and around the same price.

I said its just my opinion. Anyways no one can be actually certain what the 6xxx series is going to offer. Will just have to wait and see.

[HossHuge]

Originally Posted by TheMailMan78

I'm guessing about one Tommy Lee long.

The fact that you have "What! What! in the _ _ _ _, " as your avatar while mentioning Tommy Lee, is disturbing!!

[link2009]

Originally Posted by theubersmurf

You kind of can atm. The feature set provided by DX11 hardware is basically negligible, as no one develops anything that makes use of DX11...At least not enough to be considered an important feature. Right now their most salient feature is still DX9 SM 3.0 performance.

I am just going to repeat myself and say this again: You are technically future-proofing your computer by getting a DX11 capable card. You will probably not be able to play those games at High Quality but it will sure beat a DX9 card.

[CDdude55]

The guy (eric) from motherboards.org is saying that he got an update on these cards through email saying that it will in fact be using the 28nm process.

He also has a video up: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fatQCQ9wdUI

But i really don't believe it until i see some sort of press release or article of some kind proving it. Even though he seems to be an honest person judging from all his past videos and his site. Still i'd rather have something concrete then just what one guys says.

EDIT: he has given me this link: http://www.maximumpc.com/article/new...lated_november

[Yellow&Nerdy?]

Originally Posted by CDdude55

The guy (eric) from motherboards.org is saying that he got an update on these cards through email saying that it will in fact be using the 28nm process.

He also has a video up: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fatQCQ9wdUI

But i really don't believe it until i see some sort of press release or article of some kind proving it. Even though he seems to be an honest person judging from all his past videos and his site. Still i'd rather have something concrete then just what one guys says.

Interesting, but it's total BS. The guy is pretty honest, just "prefers Nvidia", which you can see in some of his reviews. Maybe he's sources are wrong/pulling a prank. I wish it would be true, cause then I could buy a spanking new 28nm card for Christmas, which would be awesome, but impossible. Both TSMC and Globalfoundaries are entering risk production of the 28nm manufacturing process in Q4 2010.

[CDdude55]

Originally Posted by Yellow&Nerdy?

Interesting, but it's total BS. The guy is pretty honest, just "prefers Nvidia", which you can see in some of his reviews. Maybe he's sources are wrong/pulling a prank. I wish it would be true, cause then I could buy a spanking new 28nm card for Christmas, which would be awesome, but impossible. Both TSMC and Globalfoundaries are entering risk production of the 28nm manufacturing process in Q4 2010.

Good point on the Nvidia stuff, you can really get a sense sometimes of his preferences in some of his videos.

I asked for a link and he linked me to this:

http://www.maximumpc.com/article/new...lated_november

[Aleksander]

For all who want more information, i found this one:
http://www.fudzilla.com/graphics/gra...ng-in-november

[Hayder_Master]

time for 512 bit

[fullinfusion]

28nm... How small is it going to get before a new technology hits?

Any idea what the new will be?

[CDdude55]

Originally Posted by fullinfusion

28nm... How small is it going to get before a new technology hits?

Any idea what the new will be?

I guess next we will would move on to the pm process.(picometer)

[Athlonite]

Originally Posted by IceCreamBarr

I'm surprised that TSMC even started a 32nm program... fabs tend to cut the process in half every time; 28nm is half of 40nm.

yes but going from 40nm to 28nm is eminently harder to do than going from 40nm to 32nm its just not as easy as a dye shrink there's a whole lot of things that come into play

[Wile E]

Originally Posted by mdsx1950

One thing i'm certain about performance is that the 6750 will be about the same perf. as the 5850, the 6770=5870, 6650=5750, 6670=5770. And so on. Its the 6970 performance that is unpredictable

I somehow doubt 6750 will equal the 5850. The only time in recent generations that a jump that large has happened is from the 4k to the 5k series. That's not a normal jump.

Originally Posted by Zubasa

That makes the 6870 barely faster than the 5870....
Since the 5830 is actually no better than a 4890.

Whats the point in releasing a new high-end if it is only around GTX 480 speeds?

They have done worse before. 2900 -> 3870 is a prime example. The 3870 wasn't any faster. But that was the other extreme, and dead opposite of the 4k -> 5k jump I mentioned above.

I think it will be somewhere in between.

Originally Posted by Steevo

http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/HQV/HQV_2.0/

If ATI is selling millions of these cards, and only a few thousand have issues. I would call that a success on their part. Of course if you have issues you will always feel like they are doing a poor job.

I use mine for more than playing games. It also runs my 46" TV with netflix, DVD's, home movies, etc....


Nvidia has had extra plugins to make this work in the past, now at least tehy have integrated audio, but they are still lacking in image quality for content.


As far as games go I believe they are tit for tat.

The driver issues aren't small. I understand that less have issues than don't, but that still doesn't make it acceptable. I've had some sort of bug or another since 8.11, thru about 10 different ATI combimations in single, double and triple setups. I am (was) a strong ATI supporter, but the driver quality keeps going down, whereas the driver quality of my nVidia setups has actually increased. ATI has some seriously kick ass hardware out there right now, and if I came across a really killer deal, I'd still get one. (Anybody wanna trade a 4870x2 with a DD full cover for a reference 5850? lol.)

Does that mean I think ATI is a terrible company? No, it doesn't. I just feel that they have shifted too much attention to hardware, and not enough to the software to control it. I haven't written them off forever. It's all cyclical. They'll come back around to suit my needs again. But if I'm gonna pay near retail prices, I'm going nVidia the next time around until ATI gets the Catalyst team back in gear.

I actually thought you were referring to gaming quality, but I'll comment on the video quality aspect anyway. For playback, I don't use any driver enhancements for my media with either nV or ATI. I use cpu decoding and filters. I even disable all the MS decoders. Thank you ffdshow. All of my screens are calibrated, and the quality is the same.

I do see your point tho. Better for the standard user in video playback. It does make ATI a good choice for that.

Although I would still likely choose nVidia for a low powered HTPC type of rig, only because CUDA decoding via CoreAVC is capable of accelerating more advanced h.264 features that DXVA can't.

Originally Posted by hayder.master

time for 512 bit

I wouldn't mind seeing that, along with 2GB per GPU standard. The wider bus would allow the use of lower powered and slower GDDR5, yet maintain high performance.