6950 CrossFire vs single GTX 580 - your pick?

[sneekypeet]

I hope there is a PSU upgrade coming with these cards

[crazyeyesreaper]

agreed that CM psu wont cut it will probably crash and burn if you tried to run a fully loaded xfire system on it hell probably would survive the 580 and i7 since they will pull around 500w alone full load on both easily

[niemion]

Sure sure, PSU upgrade either way. This one is just a spare part from my closet.

Total system power consumption will probably be around 200w (idle), 600w (load) drawn from the wall, right? I'm thinking about a Corsair AX 750 or 850.

[cheezburger]

Originally Posted by crazyeyesreaper

in daul card configs 6950s are on part with dual 570s and dual 6970s are on par with dual 580s so grabbing 2 580s is far more expensive for comparable performance as the 2 6950s if overclocked will be only 5%-8% slower then dual 580s at a near $400 cheaper comparatively. That said depending on Resolution and CPU id say 580 as well but if on i7 and at 1920x1200 or 1080p then dual 6950s

a 6950 cf are NEVER be in same category as dual gtx 570 and neither 6970 cf can put tiny scratch on gtx 580 sli . 6970 is weaker than gtx 570 in dx9/dx10/dx11 heavy tessellation and aa/af/msaa and ONLY tight up with gtx series in super ridiculous high resolution with the benefit of ram size(back to good old day 2900xt 1gb vs 8800gts 320mb ) of cause unless you never see the benchmark from tom's hardware/anandtech/guru 3d OTHER THAN WIZARD's own bench. a 6970 is only marginally better than 5870 and 6950 is only 8% better than 6870. i really don't like the point that people like to compare a mid range camery(6970/6950) to a high end ferrari(gtx 580/570)....of cause on wizard's bench things just look a bit different from general audience...

i know some of you will bring those crappy bench that try to define how good those amd card compete to nv card but non of them are really neutralized opinion that would probably misguiding general consumer to believe these cheap ass amd card are much better. that is reason why tom's hardware banned tpu's non-neutral fanboi benchmark.

to op: unless you'll be benefit from multi gpu setup i would suggest you go for gtx 580 than go for 6950 cf.


(ops...i forgot tpu is a amd fanbase and i may get my self banned again from this post )

[Mussels]

Originally Posted by cheezburger

(ops...i forgot tpu is a amd fanbase and i may get my self banned again from this post )

no, TPU is an 'anti troll' fanbase and you'll get yourself banned for trolling.


If you wish to make an argument, do so politely without silly comments designed to offend anybody - they dont help you make your case at all, and just make you look like a child (and thus you get ignored)


and so you know, you realise toms is one of the most biased websites around... they had a few big scandals where they were paid to make intel seem faster than AMD, to the point they were the only ones showing hyperthreading to be a performance boost and not a loss in programs of that era, and they had a nice big AMD vs intel test with live webcam feeds where the intel system died and shutdown, yet its scores still kept updating to beat the AMD system even when you could see it was offline/in the BIOS?


if you want to comment about certain benchmarks being biased, at least show proof they are. so far you've just whined.

[crazyeyesreaper]

Originally Posted by cheezburger

a 6950 cf are NEVER be in same category as dual gtx 570 and neither 6970 cf can put tiny scratch on gtx 580 sli . 6970 is weaker than gtx 570 in dx9/dx10/dx11 heavy tessellation and aa/af/msaa and ONLY tight up with gtx series in super ridiculous high resolution with the benefit of ram size(back to good old day 2900xt 1gb vs 8800gts 320mb ) of cause unless you never see the benchmark from tom's hardware/anandtech/guru 3d OTHER THAN WIZARD's own bench. a 6970 is only marginally better than 5870 and 6950 is only 8% better than 6870. i really don't like the point that people like to compare a mid range camery(6970/6950) to a high end ferrari(gtx 580/570)....of cause on wizard's bench things just look a bit different from general audience...

i know some of you will bring those crappy bench that try to define how good those amd card compete to nv card but non of them are really neutralized opinion that would probably misguiding general consumer to believe these cheap ass amd card are much better. that is reason why tom's hardware banned tpu's non-neutral fanboi benchmark.

to op: unless you'll be benefit from multi gpu setup i would suggest you go for gtx 580 than go for 6950 cf.


(ops...i forgot tpu is a amd fanbase and i may get my self banned again from this post )

really cause me and red machine have identicle rigs up to date drivers and my single 6970 wastes his 580 in DX11 games just cause a review says this or that dosent make it gospel true but fact is i have 6970 xfire and fact is i match 580 sli numbers in alot of games that are DX11. another fact i paid less to do so in the end it dosent matter that much people will buy what they buy but the cold hard fact is 6950s can now be unlocked to 6970s with a simple bios flash within windows itself and in that sense $600 6850s will slaughter a 580 at $500 price point

granted this is on AMD cpus its already been established on Intel rigs the 580 in single card mode performs better

but in Alien Vs Predator Heaven Bench etc on a 965be with 1333 cl7 ram single 6970 stock vs single 580 stock i came out on top again and again. Now if someone wants to donate me an Intel rig ill test that and watch the 580 pull ahead.

but from what i remember in legit reviews andantech 6900 cards in dual card config ran neck and neck with the 580s

my review of the 6900s i posted awhile back Crazyeyesreaper 6970 series review
various DX11 performance round ups from the net




my DX11 Metro test 1920x1200 AAA 16x AF tess on DoF off

Alien vs predator maxed

Just Cause 4xAA max settings 1920x1200



If these arent enough i can grab more i mean theres alot of reviews out there i can keep grabbing bench marks but i reall dont give a shit about DX9 or DX10 performance when those games run at 200-300fps examples Unreal Engine 3 based titles and the like the fact i can now run Metro 2033 at 55fps avg 30min with all settings including Depth of Field turned on im happy if someone has 570 sli or 580 theyll get near the same performance and be just a damn happy.

Also if the forum is so AMD biased and it grinds your gears so much why not go to some other forum.

and for there record if i had the cash id buy an Intel core i7 rig right now

but fact is 580 sli might win in general by a few FPS but in no way is it worth the price 2x 6950s is $600 on newegg flash the bios you have 2x 6970s for $150 less 580 sli sits at $1000 = performance $400 less thats just a cold hard cash difference

also im gonna go out on a limb and guess the next response is that all the info ive provided in its retarded non punctuated form will be deemed biased and made up of magical fairy pixie dust made from the bones of children from Ethiopia right?

[gaximodo]

I wish I waited for gtx570/580 instead of going 5850 cf, missed so much on NV's driver when I had my 275 SLI setup. As for the op, I'd go with single 580 or 570/560 SLI. Stay away from prototype generations like the GTX4XX and 6XXX series.

[afw]

The 6950 crossfire option seems the best after this --> AMD Radeon HD 6950 can be unlocked to HD 6970

580 SLI performance for $600 ... and save more than $400 ... or you can get another 6950 and tri-fire ( and still save $100+ )

[cheezburger]

Originally Posted by crazyeyesreaper

really cause me and red machine have identicle rigs up to date drivers and my single 6970 wastes his 580 in DX11 games just cause a review says this or that dosent make it gospel true but fact is i have 6970 xfire and fact is i match 580 sli numbers in alot of games that are DX11. another fact i paid less to do so in the end it dosent matter that much people will buy what they buy but the cold hard fact is 6950s can now be unlocked to 6970s with a simple bios flash within windows itself and in that sense $600 6850s will slaughter a 580 at $500 price point

granted this is on AMD cpus its already been established on Intel rigs the 580 in single card mode performs better

but in Alien Vs Predator Heaven Bench etc on a 965be with 1333 cl7 ram single 6970 stock vs single 580 stock i came out on top again and again. Now if someone wants to donate me an Intel rig ill test that and watch the 580 pull ahead.

but from what i remember in legit reviews andantech 6900 cards in dual card config ran neck and neck with the 580s

my review of the 6900s i posted awhile back Crazyeyesreaper 6970 series review
various DX11 performance round ups from the net
http://www.legitreviews.com/images/r...1488/metro.jpg
http://www.legitreviews.com/images/reviews/1488/jc2.jpg
http://images.anandtech.com/graphs/graph4061/34635.png
http://www.legitreviews.com/images/reviews/1488/avp.jpg
my DX11 Metro test 1920x1200 AAA 16x AF tess on DoF off
http://img.techpowerup.org/101220/Me...0tess%20on.png
Alien vs predator maxed
http://img.techpowerup.org/101220/AvP.png
Just Cause 4xAA max settings 1920x1200
http://img.techpowerup.org/101220/Just%20Cause%202.png


If these arent enough i can grab more i mean theres alot of reviews out there i can keep grabbing bench marks but i reall dont give a shit about DX9 or DX10 performance when those games run at 200-300fps examples Unreal Engine 3 based titles and the like the fact i can now run Metro 2033 at 55fps avg 30min with all settings including Depth of Field turned on im happy if someone has 570 sli or 580 theyll get near the same performance and be just a damn happy.

Also if the forum is so AMD biased and it grinds your gears so much why not go to some other forum.

and for there record if i had the cash id buy an Intel core i7 rig right now

but fact is 580 sli might win in general by a few FPS but in no way is it worth the price 2x 6950s is $600 on newegg flash the bios you have 2x 6970s for $150 less 580 sli sits at $1000 = performance $400 less thats just a cold hard cash difference

also im gonna go out on a limb and guess the next response is that all the info ive provided in its retarded non punctuated form will be deemed biased and made up of magical fairy pixie dust made from the bones of children from Ethiopia right?

just cause 2 and avp are both heavily pro amd game, why dont you test game like civilization/lost planet/splinter cell/dirt 2 and vontage

plus i got different result between 6970 vs gtx 580..







even under such pro-amd bench i still dont see how 6970 beats gtx 580 and your bench setup is questionable...

[afw]

Originally Posted by cheezburger

just cause 2 and avp are both heavily pro amd game, why dont you test game like civilization/lost planet/splinter cell/dirt 2 and vontage

plus i got different result between 6970 vs gtx 580..

http://media.bestofmicro.com/R/I/273...202%201680.png

http://media.bestofmicro.com/R/J/273...202%201920.png

http://media.bestofmicro.com/R/K/273...202%202560.png

even under such pro-amd bench i still dont see how 6970 beats gtx 580 and your bench setup is questionable...

Here's what wizzard got

gtx 580 SLI - 22% faster than 5970



6950 Crossfire - 20% Faster than 5970



So I think its safe to say 6970 crossfire is similar to 580SLI performance (may differ in some games - pro nVidia/AMD) ... but here we are speaking of 19+ (games and benchmarks) tests .. so i guess they even out ...

EDIT : I forgot to mention the power consumption ...


source
GTX 580 SLI Power consumption

[Wrigleyvillain]

Originally Posted by afw

The 6950 crossfire option seems the best after this --> AMD Radeon HD 6950 can be unlocked to HD 6970

580 SLI performance for $600 ... and save more than $400 ... or you can get another 6950 and tri-fire ( and still save $100+ )

Yeah this thread question pretty much moot now

[crazyeyesreaper]

Just cause 2 ... a heavily amd biased game are you on fucking crack it makes use of Nvidia CUDA tech for the god damn water shaders damn. what a load of shit

Splinter Cell is a shitty game ubisoft didnt even support ATI gpus at launch aka 5870 performing worse at 800x600 then a damn 9800gt at 1920x1200.

Lost Planet is also an Nvidia centric game

Metro2033 is Nvidia centric what with Physx support tacked on

Alien Vs Predator oh wait wasnt this a game that Nvidias superior tessellation performance use to rape AMD gpus... oh yea thats right they all trade blows thus EQUAL footing depending on what games

theres Far Cry 2 a game Nvidia constantly dominated

http://www.overclock3d.net/reviews/g...sfire_review/7

you can swap out reviews all day they trade blows back and forth and performance is so god damn close the extra $400 price tag still makes nvidia look retarded at this point.

Eventually the 580 will drop in price and things will settle like they usually do.

For every Win for AMD theres a Win for Nvidia. Its not bias its the way the world works Nvidias TWIMTBP program ensures that users of Nvidia cards get a good gaming experience if amd wasnt so damn cheap and beefed there program up we would see the same on the other end. To be blunt tho are you gonna sit there and tell me you would pay $400 more for 5fps in the games that need it?

i look at it cash wise $600 for 6950 xfire $500-550 for the GTX 580 $1000-1100 for sli 580s performance difference 5-8% for a large chunk of change which imho is just ridiculous if a 580 was at the $420 price point that would make sense price to performance wise maybe $440 but $500-550 no way

still whats most hilarious is telling me Just Cause 2 is an AMD pro game that makes me

Metro 2033 also pro Nvidia Alien vs Predator untill the 6900 cards nvidia destoryed AMDs offerings. the fact all those games run and 2 out 3 scale well metro at 69% dof off 96% dof on AvP at 89% and just cause 2 at a pathetic 33% it again swings back an forth.

580 sli wins in Call of Prypit which is a pro amd game im not gonna cry foul over it Nvidias cards now run that game better worth $400 more fuck no 157 for the 580 sli vs 149 on the 6970s not worth a $400 price tag. I can continue all day with logic if you want

[Wrigleyvillain]

Strange eye man speaketh truth

[crazyeyesreaper]

whats worse is im obviously amd biased *sarcasm* if i had the cash id be on intel cpu running dual 6970s would the 580s win in that situation damn right they would but god damn what a giant waste of cash to get there... hell even now ill freely admit 2x 6900s on my AMD cpu is a complete friggin waste.. im pissing away 40% of the performance i paid for.... due to cpu bottleneck oh well. People will live in there own little world i just want the best performance for my dollar. and right now im kicking myself in the nuts do to the fact the 6950s are flashable to 6970s... thats $140 i wish i had right now

[fusionblu]

Would have to be two 6950s in crossfire. My reason would be this article:
http://www.techpowerup.com/137140/AM...o-HD-6970.html

[Cratzky]

Originally Posted by niemion

i7 950 @ 4GHz, Rampage III Extreme, 6GB RAM
24" monitor @ 1920x1200

Alright, looks like it's really 6950 CF for me then.

I mostly game Starcraft 2 for the moment. Do you know of any reviews comparing 6950 vs 580? What I'm really looking for is worst case scenarios, that is 2 x 200 supply battles and even 6 x 200 supply battles. Reviewers typically monitor FPS in standard games which is pretty close to worthless. Now what is worth to know is how low the FPS can drop, 20 vs 30 is a biggie.

Did you know that the 580 totally smokes any dual gpu configuration in sc2? why do you think the 5970 gets owned by a 5850 in starcraft2?

For your info: a strong single GPU configuration is _always_ better then a dual gpu configuration due to compatbility etc.
Also, you will get less performance in WoW for example using 2cards.
Power consumption will go up, heat output will go up, noise levels will go up using more then 1 card.
1 strong graphics card is always the best. Because when thats not enough anymore, u add another one .
Buying 2cards directly is pretty dumb. What do you do when u realize u cant play the game you want because it does not support multi-gpu ? what do you do when the performance isnt enough with those 2 cards? you gotta ask youself these questions.

[cheezburger]

Originally Posted by afw

EDIT : I forgot to mention the power consumption ...


source
GTX 580 SLI Power consumption

are you sure a quad fire 6950 ONLY consume 329watts in total system consumption while a single card already took 158watt? plus 158 watt is totally underrating for card like 6950...(supposedly to be a 6870's rating) and you're compare a tri sli gtx 580 to a 2 way cf 6950 and call it a win? wow......

[claylomax]

To the OP. Now that the 6950 can be unlocked to a 6970, your choice is easy http://forums.techpowerup.com/showthread.php?t=137140

[afw]

Originally Posted by cheezburger

are you sure a quad fire 6950 ONLY consume 329watts in total system consumption while a single card already took 158watt? plus 158 watt is totally underrating for card like 6950...(supposedly to be a 6870's rating) and you're compare a tri sli gtx 580 to a 2 way cf 6950 and call it a win? wow......

First of all its not quad-fire ... its cross-fire ...

Secondly about the power consumption ... Im not comparing it with a tri-sli GTX580 the second link I have posted in the previous post gives the power consumption of 2 GTX580s ... I was actually trying to point out that it takes 80W less than the 570s ...

Quoting from the source links I have given in my previous post

HD 6950 Crossfire (1st Link)

System in IDLE = 184W
System Wattage with GPU in FULL Stress = 473W
Difference (GPU load) = 289W
Add average IDLE wattage ~ 40W
Subjective obtained GPU power consumption = ~ 329 Watts

GTX 580 SLI (2nd Link)

System in IDLE = 237W
System Wattage with GPUs in FULL Stress = 719W
Difference (GPU load) = 482W
Add average IDLE wattage ~ 20W x2
Subjective obtained GPU power consumption = ~ 522 Watts

Almost 200W difference between the 2 setups

BTW Please note that if the cards are unlocked to 6970s they'd consume more power ...

Wizzards review (6950) shows similar results... with Power-control set to +20 the card consumes 182W (With slider at zero I presume it'll be lower) ... and 69xx series has a slightly different architecture IIRC ... so that may be the reason the power consumption of the 6950 is similar to 6870 ... I dont really know ...

Finally ... I'm no fanboy ... I own a GTX260 ... Both nVidia and AMD have there pros and cons ... although th 69xx series arent the cards that we expected them to be , they're still powerful at the price point ... but I still like to see them sell $300 6970s and $250 6950s ...

[sttubs]

I only look at the games I play & the resolution I run when I'm looking at benchmarks of the games vs the cards performance. It doesn't matter if one card plays every other game better or not it's what pertains to my interests that is important.

[cheezburger]

anyway i would say gtx 580 is better than dual gpu crossfire as you would have to deal with driver issue and micro-shuttering and even lower minimum frame rate than single card due to data latency between crossfire/sli bridge.

to op: unless you'd ready for more buggy gaming experience with crappy driver&micro-shuttering + bigger power supply i'm suggesting you just get a single gpu card and gtx 580 is ftw! do not confuse by those fanboi's post because multi gpu ain't very good configuration for simple gaming. 5970 and 4870x2 were all well known to have micro shuttering and since crossfire/sli are worse scaling than dual gpu card they have even more problem that you may have to spend most of your time debug the amd driver...

[erocker]

Originally Posted by cheezburger

anyway i would say gtx 580 is better than dual gpu crossfire as you would have to deal with driver issue and micro-shuttering and even lower minimum frame rate than single card due to data latency between crossfire/sli bridge.

to op: unless you'd ready for more buggy gaming experience with crappy driver&micro-shuttering + bigger power supply i'm suggesting you just get a single gpu card and gtx 580 is ftw! do not confuse by those fanboi's post because multi gpu ain't very good configuration for simple gaming. 5970 and 4870x2 were all well known to have micro shuttering and since crossfire/sli are worse scaling than dual gpu card they have even more problem that you may have to spend most of your time debug the amd driver...

Nope. 6950's in CrossFire work great. Better performance than my single GTX580

[wolf]

Originally Posted by erocker

Nope. 6950's in CrossFire work great. Better performance than my single GTX580

micro stuttering and other realtively non issues aside, a single GPU is the more reliable of the two setups. you get what you paid for first time every time, rather than potentially having to wait on drivers to take advantage of your second card. it's all if's and butt's.

the argument is great for both really, and I'd tend to agree the 6950's are the better deal this time around, but if you were to choose a GTX580 I can wholeheartedly agree with the logic behind that choice too.

[cheezburger]

Originally Posted by wolf

micro stuttering and other realtively non issues aside, a single GPU is the more reliable of the two setups. you get what you paid for first time every time, rather than potentially having to wait on drivers to take advantage of your second card. it's all if's and butt's.

the argument is great for both really, and I'd tend to agree the 6950's are the better deal this time around, but if you were to choose a GTX580 I can wholeheartedly agree with the logic behind that choice too.

agree

if you are a bench score runner that also care about the budget(even if daul 6950 did beat gtx 580 it would be close with in 10% gap but spending extra 100 bucks over gtx 580)...go for dual card setup and if you are just for gaming/CAD and do not want to spend valuable time debug the driver setting than go for gtx 580.

thus we're having 37 fanboi vote for irrational motive.....

[Fourstaff]

Probably stated already:

1. Get two 6950
2. Unlock to 6970's
3. ????
4. Profit!