Microsoft Working On Not One, But Two New Xbox Product Lines

[1Kurgan1]

I personally think with the cost lowering of memory, that we are basically going to return to the cartridge days. You can buy 16gb thumbdrives as small as a fingernail, and they can't get all scratched up. Doubt these consoles will take that route, but thats just my belief on the future of physical media.

[Trackr]

Originally Posted by RejZoR

It won't change much for PC gamers. Apart from graphics bump up we'll still get crappy, limited and buggy direct console ports of games. So we, PC gamers could hardly care about it...

Not necessarily.

Console ports exist because there is a larger user base for consoles, prompting developers to code for them first and then port it over to the PC.

The new consoles' user base will be much smaller than the PC, so developers will have to decide whether to code for the last-gen (PS3) or the new-gen (PS4)/PC.

Meaning the PC and PS4 will be equal.

Originally Posted by btarunr

Did you get your Battlefield 3 PC and Crysis 2 PC in Blu-ray?

You make a very uninformed argument.

PC games do come on DL-DVDs, but they are not played from the disk; they are installed onto the hard drive.

Not to mention, Crytek has spoken out on the extreme methods they used to compress the data so it would fit onto a DL-DVD.

If consoles still rely on plug-and-play directly from a disk, it better be Blu-ray.

[btarunr]

Originally Posted by Trackr

You make a very uninformed argument.

PC games do come on DL-DVDs, but they are not played from the disk; they are installed onto the hard drive.

So do you. Games can be shipped in multiple discs, and consoles can cache games on to local storage to overcome disc changes.

Originally Posted by Trackr

If consoles still rely on plug-and-play directly from a disk, it better be Blu-ray.

Like I said, discs or physical media in general won't be the future, but digital downloads coupled with moderately spacious local storage. For those few games that will ship in physical media, they can ship in multiple discs.

[Mussels]

i wonder if the low end line is meant to be some kind of streaming media playback device, designed around kinect/voice controls, either linking to windows 7/8 machines or the new console for media.


and i too think that DVD will hold the consoles back. they need large hard drives, and they need to install to it by *default*

[Live OR Die]

Lol 2GB of ram crytek is going to be happy.

[RejZoR]

Originally Posted by btarunr

Just that the average console port will look like Crysis 2 PC DX11 or Battlefield 3 PC DX11.

Well, what good is that for if there is a 30fps limit, retarded controls, press ENTER to start, retarded inventory system and other console nonsense? I couldn't care less about graphics, System Shock 2 is 12 years old and i still consider it's graphics as great. But then again i also consider it has great sound, awesome and complex menu and interaction system, awesome story, awesome levels, long gameplay etc etc. I can't say the same for any other game. Deus Ex Human Revolution maybe... 1 game that cought the spark in 12 years. Not too impressive...

[pentastar111]

unless this new console will support a keyboard and mouse, i'll pass.

[rpsgc]

Only 2GB of RAM? TROLOLOLO


Have they learned nothing?

[Recus]

Originally Posted by btarunr

Name one (1) PC game that ships in Blu-ray. :nutkick

None. So?

Originally Posted by btarunr

Besides, discs are obsolete. Next gen consoles will increasingly use digital download distributions. You buy a game, it gets downloaded to your console's HDD. Your internet too slow? Tough poo.

Originally Posted by btarunr

You must be one of them. Your insistence on Blu-ray shows that you game on PS3. Casual.

I call console gamers casuals though I'm one of them? Your logic is unbelievable. Go back to watch DVDs while I'll enjoy Blu-ray movies.

[NdMk2o1o]

Originally Posted by paralityk

Hah! "Told you so!" the stronger version goes exactly as I predicted about year ago!
So now, going further with predictions.
The weaker one will be ARM based, I'm telling you!
The push to ARM is strong and clearly visible, this would be ultimate test drive for next-gen where it'll be ARM-only (when they catch up with performance)

Look, it's kinect-like so they won't have to care for cross-compatibility since kinect-games create totally different experience so you wouldn't want to have same games (experience wise, titles will probably overlap on both) on two different products. Right?
+ Recent rumors of Kinect like devices for Windows 8 which will run on both arm and x86!
It all makes sense!

I'm sorry are you on drugs?

I mean I don't doubt what you're saying however saying you said this a year ago when you have 2 posts in total both from this month/this year, think about it.

P.S I told overyone here on TPU that you would come and post this 5 years ago, get the f**k in, my son!!! The oracle has spoken

[RejZoR]

Originally Posted by pentastar111

unless this new console will support a keyboard and mouse, i'll pass.

When we were selling the fat PS3, i know it worked fine with Trust wireless desktop set (mice+keyboard). But we haven't tested any games, it just worked fine in PS3 menus.
Some would not trade anything for mice and keyboard but they don't want to deal with driver updates and other PC related nonsense. I sort of understand you there...

[Nihilus]

Wow, most people here say the same damn thing. I realize it is a hardware enthusiast site, but give it a rest for Christ sake! None of us "bottom feeder" console players will want to play MW4 on a gay keyboard and mouse. Cinema 4k resolution will not be affordable until playstation 5 comes out so 1080p is the law of the land - 2GB video ram will do just fine. People here always cry about consoles holding them back, but if it wasn't for the consoles most of the game play advances would not exist. -end rant

[RejZoR]

Consoles as an entire device do. YOu just can't create things the same that are controllable with gamepad and mice+keyboard. I mean mouse brings superior control in all directions with super response and deadly precision. Keyboard offers massive number of buttons to control things. Gamepad is a blend of both and as such it doesn't perform too well. Maybe it's the best for racing as it offers analogue steering and gradual applying of gas/brakes. For FPS and FPS+RPG, it's a no go. I played few FPS games on consoles with gamepad and it's rubbish. Even when i got hang of the thing it feels so unnatural. Imagine driving a car with a bicycle steering. Or with a joystick. Sure it can be done but it just feels awkward.

[Recus]

Originally Posted by Nihilus

None of us "bottom feeder" console players will want to play MW4 on a gay keyboard and mouse.

Too much buttons?

Originally Posted by Nihilus

2GB video ram will do just fine.

2GB Ram memory.

[cheesy999]

Originally Posted by RejZoR

Consoles as an entire device do. YOu just can't create things the same that are controllable with gamepad and mice+keyboard. I mean mouse brings superior control in all directions with super response and deadly precision. Keyboard offers massive number of buttons to control things. Gamepad is a blend of both and as such it doesn't perform too well. Maybe it's the best for racing as it offers analogue steering and gradual applying of gas/brakes. For FPS and FPS+RPG, it's a no go. I played few FPS games on consoles with gamepad and it's rubbish. Even when i got hang of the thing it feels so unnatural. Imagine driving a car with a bicycle steering. Or with a joystick. Sure it can be done but it just feels awkward.

I think it's what you used too, i can play well with both Gamepad and keyboard, although i prefer the Gamepad because it's more comfortable

Mouse doesn't bring superior movement in FPS, you end up having to use the keyboard to move which is not really the best system ever thought of. So it's not completely one sided there either.

In short, it feels weird to you because your not used to it.

[NdMk2o1o]

Originally Posted by Nihilus

Wow, most people here say the same damn thing. I realize it is a hardware enthusiast site, but give it a rest for Christ sake! None of us "bottom feeder" console players will want to play MW4 on a gay keyboard and mouse. Cinema 4k resolution will not be affordable until playstation 5 comes out so 1080p is the law of the land - 2GB video ram will do just fine. People here always cry about consoles holding them back, but if it wasn't for the consoles most of the game play advances would not exist. -end rant

Seriously PC Aryan race???

Just cause one person posts something doesn't mean that is the majority's view.

There are quite a few console players on here actually though you hit the nail on the head, it's an tech hardware enthusiast forum and not a console forum otherwise you could bitch and moan about how us PC gamers are idiots and console gaming is much better.

You don't want to play MW4 on a gay KB, then perhaps you should se if they stock hetrosexual keyboards or stop being such a homophobe.

NO ONE has mentioned 4k cinema resolution so whilst you feel the need to stick up for console gamers everywhere for the odd silly remark which is fine, don't just add stuff as you like to make your rant tantrum look more justified.

A lot of the points raised are valid and whether you like it or not that won't change them. And if it wasn't for consoles most of the game advances would be miles further than they are now.

So if you wanna spit your dummy cause we're console hating go somewhere it will wash.

[Kreij]

Originally Posted by Nihilus

People here always cry about consoles holding them back, but if it wasn't for the consoles most of the game play advances would not exist.

I'm not a console hater and think everyone should game on the device of their choice, but in all honesty I can't think of a single game play advance that would not exist if there were no consoles. It's my opinion that the console advances are almost all due to the developers trying to make a game that is somewhat comparible in its scope and granduer to the PC versions and not the other way around.

Disclaimer : I could be wrong.

[1Kurgan1]

Originally Posted by Recus

http://www.speedtest.net/result/1612066898.png

He wasn't talking you you specifically there. He was saying a common complaint of digital downloads is, not everyone out there has fast internet. But eventually we will move to it regardless.

Originally Posted by Nihilus

Wow, most people here say the same damn thing. I realize it is a hardware enthusiast site, but give it a rest for Christ sake! None of us "bottom feeder" console players will want to play MW4 on a gay keyboard and mouse. Cinema 4k resolution will not be affordable until playstation 5 comes out so 1080p is the law of the land - 2GB video ram will do just fine. People here always cry about consoles holding them back, but if it wasn't for the consoles most of the game play advances would not exist. -end rant

I see console bottom feeder, then see MW and don't see bottom feeder, something is wrong with that picture. You'd rather pass on a "gay" keyboard and mouse (nice technical argument), and use auto aim analog stick crap? I think on a forum like this you will find yourself standing solo on that one, analog sticks and fps, what a joke. As far as consoles pushing advances vs PC, when the PS1 came out, it has better graphics than computers did at the time, it wasn't till after the turn of the millennium came out that things started to flip. PC's brought you FPS, without that there wouldn't be your precious console loving MW series in the first place, PC pushed the boundaries with Crysis, PC has the most realistic racer out there (iRacing), PC is the most indie friendly platform out there, and PC has the best priced gaming market (because of digital downloads). You talk innovation, but I'm sorry consoles don't bring that. I'd love to say thats the end of my rant, but I could go on with my frustrations, we'll call it here for civility.

[btarunr]

Originally Posted by Recus

None. So?

So Blu-ray doesn't even feature in the list of things the next Xbox needs. Because, you can distribute in multiple DVD9s for people to cache on the consoles and play without interruptions, or...

Originally Posted by Recus

...consumers have the bandwidth for digital downloads.

Originally Posted by Recus

I call console gamers casuals though I'm one of them?

Yes, you're the one making song and dance about Blu-ray as a game distribution medium, when BD-R cost 6 times a DVD9 to publishers. Game publishers would rather ship their game in 2 DVD9s than 1 BD-R.

Originally Posted by Recus

Your logic is unbelievable.

Nah, this is unbelievable logic:

Go back to watch DVDs while I'll enjoy Blu-ray movies

...that you bring movie distribution to a discussion about game distribution.

Oh, and

[cheesy999]

Originally Posted by btarunr

Yes, you're the one making song and dance about Blu-ray as a game distribution medium.

to be fair it is a good idea, the main reason my PS3 get a lot more hours on it then my Xbox is that it is a fantastic blu-ray player

add in to the fact that you only need a 4x speed Blu-ray to have equal speed with a 12x speed DVD (1x Blu-ray speed is roughly 3 times as fast as 1x DVD speed)

Having Blu-ray as a distribution medium is a great idea even if ignoring what he said about it

+Most people prefer having 1 Blu-ray then 2-3 DVD's, means you don't have to wait ages to play the game, and you don't need a pointlessly large hard drive

the reason PC games don't come on Blu-ray is because 95% of PC's don't have Blu-ray drives but do have massive amounts of storage space

[RejZoR]

Originally Posted by cheesy999

I think it's what you used too, i can play well with both Gamepad and keyboard, although i prefer the Gamepad because it's more comfortable

Mouse doesn't bring superior movement in FPS, you end up having to use the keyboard to move which is not really the best system ever thought of. So it's not completely one sided there either.

In short, it feels weird to you because your not used to it.

It doesn't matter how experienced you are, there is just no way gamepad can do things mice and keyboard can. The strafing, precision to make drastic changes of the crosshair position, close quarter orientation and response etc etc.

[3volvedcombat]

Whats with you guys bashing blu-ray or dvd's.

I have a ps3. I also have my computer running as well but only dvd.

Blu-ray is technically the successor of DVD9, it just is, even with way lower distribution counts, someone will eventually figure it out.

DVD's for me scratch easier then a back of my iPod, and they also seem a bit more fragile then the blu-ray cousin.

I can have blu-ray disk out and scattered about, and there scratch proof, way way way (redundant i know) less scratch proof and durable then dvd's.

I can actually watch movies at full 1080p, because I am a pixel freak, and dvd's let me down when you see the lower resolution outputs regardless.

I literally have bought tons of used Blu-rays, to look at them and tell myself there practically new. I have Blu-rays laying around like cup holders and they will work 100% of the time.

What if the standard resolution of 1080p rises to even higher values, which will probably be the case, dvd's might have a slightly harder time after that.

Cartridges for the old gaming platform were miracle tuff, but eventually they still got wear'd down where you just could not get a game to start on insertion.

Blu-ray, is small and consumes less space, way harder to tear up(personally), same overall dimensions so there are no drastic changes, and holds way more data then any dvd. It just seems logical to move on to that, where blu-ray can completely excel in every part of today's technology without fail.

But then there's digital downloads, and that is a whole different ball game.

[scaminatrix]

Just ignore Recus, he seems to think he "owns" everyone around here. I got a fiver that says he won't be around long. One more gay comment from him and he goes on my ignore list

[btarunr]

Originally Posted by cheesy999

to be fair it is a good idea, the main reason my PS3 get a lot more hours on it then my Xbox is that it is a fantastic blu-ray player

add in to the fact that you only need a 4x speed Blu-ray to have equal speed with a 12x speed DVD (1x Blu-ray speed is roughly 3 times as fast as 1x DVD speed)

Having Blu-ray as a distribution medium is a great idea even if ignoring what he said about it

+Most people prefer having 1 Blu-ray then 2-3 DVD's, means you don't have to wait ages to play the game, and you don't need a pointlessly large hard drive

the reason PC games don't come on Blu-ray is because 95% of PC's don't have Blu-ray drives but do have massive amounts of storage space

Firstly, there's no information either ways about what removable media the next xbox will use. It could be DVD9, it could be BD-R, or, Microsoft could even surprise everyone by introducing read-only flash memory media that's many times more spacious and faster than BD-R.

The way the flash memory and DRAM markets are doing these days, if Microsoft plays its "cards" well, it could even create a new flash-based media that's dirt-cheap to game publishers (even more so than BD-R).

I still think the next big thing with console games distribution will be consoles shipping with terabytes of local storage and games being distributed over the internet (like Steam and Origin have already achieved on PC, so did Xbox360 and PS3's native content distribution systems).

[Frick]

Flameflame flameflame trolltroll. Trolltroolloolol.

<rant>I don't know what's wrong with me, but I'm getting annoyed a lot more these days. People annoy me, that never happened in the olden days. That's why I'm getting angry and resorting to name calling.</rant>