Gabe Newell Calls Windows 8 a "Catastrophe"

[phanbuey]

Originally Posted by digibucc

well i think the point is that with additional development and more companies interested it doesn't have to stay that way. will it? likely for the forseeable future, but it doesn't HAVE to.

right but it's a bit like a vicious cycle - adoption = more companies investing time = less driver issues.

the fact that there are so few companies right now will keep adoption low. it will have to take a huge push, maybe even for valve to come out with thier own blackbox linux pc/console thingy using standard parts to take off.

[digibucc]

Originally Posted by phanbuey

right but it's a bit like a vicious cycle - adoption = more companies investing time = less driver issues.

the fact that there are so few companies right now will keep adoption low. it will have to take a huge push, maybe even for valve to come out with thier own blackbox linux pc/console thingy using standard parts to take off.

true

[Steevo]

Anyone can code DirectX or numerous other interfaces
Anyone can code C++ or numerous other languages.


Windows has the market share, mature diver and hardware support, some cross-platform compatibility.


I believe with all the complaints about piracy this is both an attempt to start customers using a new layer of DRM, as well a stab in the dark at making a mediocre at best PC/Console hybrid to satisfy a minor hole in the market.

What happens when you purchase one and three years later the eye candy gets reduced to eye cancer levels of AA/AF in order to run the next Crysis? PC, slap in new graphics card and you are off, new CPU. Slow load times, run SSD's, need huge storage, RAID HDD's.

We are not at the point unless you are talking about Xbox 360 or PS3 level games that a PC will still NOT be able to decimate any console or hybrid unless they are specifically running forced optimizations for it, or pre-cooking scenery, and at that, why not do it on the PC as well and have yet again more detail?


No. I do not want your green eggs and ham.

[theubersmurf]

I really don't think that the drivers will stay bad forever if Linux has substantial game distribution on it. I wouldn't be surprised if we see new Linux drivers released by AMD/invidia in the fairly near future in response to Valve's announcemnt.

[MxPhenom 216]

Originally Posted by trickson

Windows8 is more for phones than computers. Windows 8 sucks! I tried it out and man it looked like shit! Went back to windows7. IMHO, It will be some time before Micro$oft comes out with anything that will take it's place.

you tried it out? For how long, most people who are saying Windows 8 will fail have used it for barely a day. I used it for a day, hated it, but kept using it and now I like it a lot more.

[digibucc]

Originally Posted by Steevo

We are not at the point unless you are talking about Xbox 360 or PS3 level games that a PC will still NOT be able to decimate any console or hybrid unless they are specifically running forced optimizations for it, or pre-cooking scenery, and at that, why not do it on the PC as well and have yet again more detail?

not with 360 or ps3, but the next generations? very possibly. it happens for a time with every console generation. what makes it different now is the advent of cloud computing. you can bet microsoft and sony will be taking advantage of it in their new consoles, which will give those consoles a much longer lifespan at a lower price-point.

when you consider the fact that probably 80% of people with a desktop or even laptop don't do anything more than basic web browsing and media playing - a console will cover that. you will only need a desktop to do real work, which even that is getting easier on tablets, ultrabooks, and all in ones.

the computer is at the point where it doesn't have to be relegated to the nerd anymore. it doesn't have to be custom built or even that special to handle everything someone would throw at it. to me this means the desktop will go the way of commercial hardware: a small subset of users will own it but the vast majority will be using new technology instead, as they adopt of course.

Originally Posted by nvidiaintelftw

I used it for a day, hated it, but kept using it and now I like it a lot more.

i only used it for a day or two. I liked some changes, but specifically hate the metro screen. if it's really as cheap to upgrade from 7 as they are hinting, i am sure i will: however i do not think windows 8 is as big of a deal as windows 7 was over vista, or xp over 98, etc.

[phanbuey]

Originally Posted by nvidiaintelftw

you tried it out? For how long, most people who are saying Windows 8 will fail have used it for barely a day. I used it for a day, hated it, but kept using it and now I like it a lot more.

When the ribbon for microsoft office came out, people had full blown melt-downs.

Now everyone uses the ribbon and they love it. I think that this is a bit of a knee-jerk statement from Gabe. Especially given the fact that the OS is supposed to be faster and lighter than 7.

[lilhasselhoffer]

Originally Posted by phanbuey

Yeah but most games will still be made for windows, and last time i checked DX 11 was way above and beyond anything that OpenGL had, so... I do like that valve is branching out, but I dont see people switching over to linux for gaming or anything else any time soon.

What this guy doesn't mention, is that even with all of the problems with windows 8 UI (and people will always, and always have, bitch and moan about UI changes), Linux has massive driver issues with a huge variety of hardware - and the last thing anyone wants to do is to spend 4 hours on wikis trying to figure out why the OS goes into a kernel panic everytime they load up the linux version of Skyrim.

1) Most games currently being released to multiple platforms are based upon DX9. Consoles, at least current generation, don't have DX11 support.
2) The XBOX and PS3 are basically just crappy computers. They stream media, play games, and have limited internet access. PCs do all of this, and can be used for productivity. The fact that the next XBOX is going (if rumors and patent applications can be believed) to have hardware expandability kinda seems to agree with this theory.
3) Skyrim has enough problems on Windows. Console to PC changeovers are always rough, whether they be to Windows or Linux is little indication of how smooth the experience will be. Monthly and weekly patches of games proves out this point.
4) Serious? Most developers use a packaged engine, with their own graphical models, textures, and relative physics. If somebody created an Unreal engine for OpenGL there's no reason that developers couldn't utilize it. There needs to be a market for Linux games first though...

Originally Posted by phanbuey

So... sorry Gabe, I dont see a linux distro challenging windows in gaming anytime soon.

And in any case, what will happen is that 8 will come out, bomb like vista, and then 9 will come out by the end of 2013 and everyone will pretend like it never happened, just like Win ME.

Fair point. Linux might not challenge MS for average consumers in the next five years. How about ten? Fifteen? Linux is getting better, and the lack of a cost to entry is a boon in the parts (read: most) of the world that could use computers but can't afford Windows.

As far as the Windows 9 idea, I'm on that band wagon. Every other OS from MS sucks the chrome off of bumpers. I'm hoping that 9 is a worth while upgrade.

[NinkobEi]

As long as MS offers an upgrade to Windows 8 for $30 like they did with Win7, I'm all aboard. But to hell with paying full retail price for it.

[phanbuey]

Originally Posted by lilhasselhoffer

3) Skyrim has enough problems on Windows. Console to PC changeovers are always rough, whether they be to Windows or Linux is little indication of how smooth the experience will be. Monthly and weekly patches of games proves out this point.

All that proves is that there are also bugs with the game engines in the process of porting. But I'm not talking about the game engine bugs... im talking about driver issues...the interaction of the hardware with the game.

Which we all know, when a new game comes out Nvidia and AMD are racing to get the drivers down, because otherwise there are a bunch of 'my screen goes blank when I launch BF3' support tickets. That ain't a problem with the engine. THAT is where linux will fall flat on its face.

Linus Torvalds calling nVidia a bunch of a$$*** is a great indication of where linux is in relation to widespread driver support today.

At the end of the day it comes down to money. Right now, linux (on the desktop PC) = bunch of people who do this as a hobby and have day jobs. Until that changes, and valve comes out with a Steam Linux distro and dedicates a BUNCH of people to supporting it, everything will stay windows.