L4D2 Runs Faster on Linux than Windows

[tacosRcool]

who really cares after 240 fps?

[Morgoth]

if valve released sdk source for linux ill jump to linux

[Filiprino]

Originally Posted by johnnyfiive

• The only thing keeping you from Linux as your main OS is gaming? Really?
  So you're saying your fine with changing shells, writing scripts/misc code, compiling, and making your own installs for basic applications? You'd rather do that then double click an executable or drag an icon to an applications container? (OSX). My point again, the general consumer. Linux savvy people may be fine using Linux for everything, but the general user isn't. They need MS Office, Open Office & Libre Office won't cut it. They need Visual Studio, they need XCode, they can't compile code in python or c++ and have no desire to. They want to sit down, run an installer, and click play. It's the same reason why console gaming is far surpassing PC gaming... the general consumer prefers the console. Why? It's dummy proof.
• L4D2 runs faster in linux than Windows, yeah, in crappy OpenGL. How about some screenshot comparisons between the two? How about we max all the graphic features in the Linux version and Windows version.... you'll see exactly why it runs faster in Linux, because it looks like garbage in comparison due to OpenGL limitations.
  
  There is a HUGE reason why DirectX is the API developers choose to develop for. It's awesome and its native to Windows, which just happens to be THE best gaming OS.

Calm down and return to your cave, please. The future out there is not for you, man from the past.

[TheMailMan78]

Originally Posted by Filiprino

Calm down and return to your cave, please. The future out there is not for you, man from the past.

Linux is the future?

Um you apparently are blind to market trends.

[insane 360]

Originally Posted by johnnyfiive

• 
  
  Windows 7 is awesome. It's great that 3DMark 06 (06?!) scores higher in Windows XP, it should, its from 2006 whereas Windows 7 is from 2009.
  
  
• The only thing keeping you from Linux as your main OS is gaming? Really?
  So you're saying your fine with changing shells, writing scripts/misc code, compiling, and making your own installs for basic applications? You'd rather do that then double click an executable or drag an icon to an applications container? (OSX). My point again, the general consumer. Linux savvy people may be fine using Linux for everything, but the general user isn't. They need MS Office, Open Office & Libre Office won't cut it. They need Visual Studio, they need XCode, they can't compile code in python or c++ and have no desire to. They want to sit down, run an installer, and click play. It's the same reason why console gaming is far surpassing PC gaming... the general consumer prefers the console. Why? It's dummy proof.
• If you don't want a flashy GUI, want DX11+, and fast performance, you're answer is Windows 8. Like it or not, Windows 8 is where the future is for Windows. Many people hate it but really don't understand the purpose of it. It's not Windows 7, it doesn't have a Start menu, it WILL have Metro, and its Microsoft's future. Download the preview, give it a try, and in due time vendors will straggle along because they simply have to if they want to progress. Drivers will come, features will become useful, etc.
• L4D2 runs faster in linux than Windows, yeah, in crappy OpenGL. How about some screenshot comparisons between the two? How about we max all the graphic features in the Linux version and Windows version.... you'll see exactly why it runs faster in Linux, because it looks like garbage in comparison due to OpenGL limitations.
  
  There is a HUGE reason why DirectX is the API developers choose to develop for. It's awesome and its native to Windows, which just happens to be THE best gaming OS.

When Steam starts releasing more games and stats showing a significant % of Linux gamers (on Steam), only then will we really see vendor support. Nvidia will chime in and hopefully ATI will finally release a driver for Linux that doesn't seem like its from 1998. Then, and only then, will we see an increase in Linux gaming. Gaming devs follow money, pc gaming money belongs to Windows. Following that is graphics vendors, along with timely driver updates to support these new upcoming games. When Linux gets enough gaming market share, we will see some big advances. Steam is certainly the pioneer, they see a future in it. I however don't. OpenGL (even if it is a new version), is not DirectX. Game devs make most popular titles for DirectX and there is plenty of reasons why, one of them being the SDK's.

BazookaJoe: This isn't a direct bash on your post directly (or you directly), this is just my general thoughts on some of the points you brought up.

/end Thursday rant

have you used ubuntu in the last 5 years? you don't have to compile stuff, you can if you want to but their app store/repository is very easy to use, just search for what you want, either find a free one or pay for program, then click install, ubuntu does the rest. did you know that ubuntu has a GUI, its not all line command anymore

[Avelict]

I think a lot of people saw this migration coming, as slow as it is. I would gladly embrace Linux 100% if not for the lack of mainstream game support.

Sigh...have to wait, I will and just stay happy with RHEL for now.

[semantics]

Anyone else have the thought, oh well that's nice, now get it to run that well on a range of graphics cards in opengl instead of just the one you tailored it to. This is just another case of trying to hype linux because they want to use android for steam box.

[pantherx12]

@Johnny latest version of opengl supports pretty advance features, you can get the same visual fidelity as directx.

Just Direct X is standard and obviously windows owns the majority pc market to it makes sense to use direct x.


( Latest opengl supports tessellation, advance dof etc all the features dx 11 has)

[johnnyfiive]

Originally Posted by Filiprino

Calm down and return to your cave, please. The future out there is not for you, man from the past.

Originally Posted by insane 360

have you used ubuntu in the last 5 years? you don't have to compile stuff, you can if you want to but their app store/repository is very easy to use, just search for what you want, either find a free one or pay for program, then click install, ubuntu does the rest. did you know that ubuntu has a GUI, its not all line command anymore

Both of you are completely missing the point of my post.

I've used Ubuntu plenty over the passed five years and its nothing new. The new versions of gnome, kde, and the stupid Unity are nothing to write home about. None of that means I'll have an easier time playing games within Ubuntu.... correct? It's up to Steam, Nvidia, and AMD to release games and drivers that make it a smooth gaming experience. No one wants to run executables in Wine just to be able to play a game within Linux, even "fully" supported Wine'd games still take a 25%+ performance hit because its basically being emulated. If you want to play games on Linux, you want FULL OpenGL support (Like id and epic games provided with Quake series, ET, Unreal 1/2/Tournament2k3-2k4).

@ Filiprino: You must have confused my post with BazookaJoe's.
@ insane 360: I'm referring to all linux distributions in general, not just "user friendly" Ubuntu. There are many different flavors of linux that will run the Steam client (and games) the same way that Ubuntu can. Just because Ubuntu has a crap ton of software and repositories preloaded doesn't mean people are going to pick it over Arch (ESPECIALLY Arch), SuSE, Fedora, etc. Linux users like to customize and many hardcore uses don't even use Ubuntu, most hardcore users use Arch or Gentoo. So my point is still pretty valid.

Originally Posted by pantherx12

@Johnny latest version of opengl supports pretty advance features, you can get the same visual fidelity as directx.

Just Direct X is standard and obviously windows owns the majority pc market to it makes sense to use direct x.


( Latest opengl supports tessellation, advance dof etc all the features dx 11 has)

Very true. But, no Valve games support tessellation and advance DoF, unless that is something they are going to re-do purely for OSX and Linux "ports".

[TheMailMan78]

Originally Posted by johnnyfiive

Both of you are completely missing the point of my post.

@ Filiprino: You must have confused my post with BazookaJoe's.
@ insane 360: I'm referring to all linux distributions in general, not just "user friendly" Ubuntu. There are many different flavors of linux that will run the Steam client (and games) the same way that Ubuntu can. Just because Ubuntu has a crap ton of software and repositories preloaded doesn't mean people are going to pick it over Arch (ESPECIALLY Arch), SuSE, Fedora, etc. Linux users like to customize and many hardcore uses don't even use Ubuntu, most hardcore users use Arch or Gentoo. So my point is still pretty valid.

Ive been using Linux Mint this week. However I ended up uninstalling it because I honestly had no idea what I was doing and it became a security risk to the rest of my network.

[johnnyfiive]

Requote my post mailman

[TheMailMan78]

Originally Posted by johnnyfiive

Requote my post mailman

Done. I enjoyed playing with Linux but I gotta say its not for the faint hearted. Also I noticed some very elitist attitudes on the Linux forums. Honestly I don't see Linux going mainstream because the "community" is the developer and the developer doesn't seem to like noobs. I mean a lot of the programs didn't even have proper names. I had to read the description to even know what it was, then I would find out the name would change once I installed it to something else I already had installed! I'm just a burnt out artist. I don't have the time to learn Klingon and I damn sure will never have the time to learn Linux.

[johnnyfiive]

Ubuntu and Mint community forums are probably the most resourceful and kindest ones around.
Arch and Gentoo forums will basically laugh at you if you're a newb, but there are plenty of guides out there to get you in the right direction. So here is my MAIN point out of all this.

Say you install Ubuntu, and it doesn't recognize you're sound card (which is still a very common probably, even now). You can literally spend a full day trying to get your sound working. And Ubuntu users, don't you lie and say it was easy as pie every time you install Ubuntu on different computers, you're lying if you're in denial if you think its always a smooth process.

Yes, you can manipulate things and get a random driver to eventually work, but chances are it won't fully support the sound cards chipset, so you stuff in mono instead of stereo, or you have single channel audio, or 2.1 instead of 5.1 the list goes on.

Now take Windows 7 or 8. You put the disc in, less than an hour later everything is working. That is fact.

Windows = THE gaming OS.

Ubuntu/Linux in general = For hardcore computer folks who love to tinker.

That's my honest opinion and that is why I think it will be a very long time before there is a real Linux gaming movement. Steam is the pioneer in all of this, everyone else is going to keep focusing on the future of Windows and DirectX. Just put yourself in a gaming developers shoes. Are you really going to all the sudden start coding you games for OpenGL when there is tons of amazing DirectX based SDK's available for use? No. Are they really going to work with Nvidia and AMD to get specific driver updates for multi display updates and performance improvements, for OpenGL? No.

See, I have plenty of valid arguments. I'm not trying to have a "Pro Windows or go home!" mentality, I'm just purely stating the hard proven facts. I would love Linux to thrive (along with OpenGL). But that kind of thing is going to take tons of time, effort, money, and implementation. It's a lonnnnnnng road.

Edit: I still would like to see a screenshot comparison of the linux version and windows version, everything maxed.

[TheMailMan78]

Originally Posted by johnnyfiive

Ubuntu and Mint community forums are probably the most resourceful and kindest ones around.
Arch and Gentoo forums will basically laugh at you if you're a newb, but there are plenty of guides out there to get you in the right direction. So here is my MAIN point out of all this.

Say you install Ubuntu, and it doesn't recognize you're sound card (which is still a very common probably, even now). You can literally spend a full day trying to get your sound working. And Ubuntu users, don't you lie and say it was easy as pie every time you install Ubuntu on different computers, you're lying if you're in denial if you think its always a smooth process.

Yes, you can manipulate things and get a random driver to eventually work, but chances are it won't fully support the sound cards chipset, so you stuff in mono instead of stereo, or you have single channel audio, or 2.1 instead of 5.1 the list goes on.

Now take Windows 7 or 8. You put the disc in, less than an hour later everything is working. That is fact.

Windows = THE gaming OS.

Ubuntu/Linux in general = For hardcore computer folks who love to tinker.

They kindly told me to take a programing class.

[johnnyfiive]

^^^ Hah! Here is a great place to start mailman, www.codeacademy.com (great site)

[jihadjoe]

Originally Posted by Aquinus

Ubuntu doesn't restrict you to one window manager either. You don't have to use Unity.

In the same way that Windows doesn't force you to use Aero. There's always been the option of using the basic theme and classic start menu.
(assuming we are arguing about fluff)

[Widjaja]

I expected this.
Less overhead.

[james888]

Even if I stayed on windows, I am glad steam/games/etc are moving to linux, although slowly. I just like to have the option. In 5 years time, hopefully, there will be enough software, mostly games for me, to warrant a switch to linux. Certain linux distro's are already easy enough for my computer illiterate granmother could use them. Mint specifically.

[deadmansclick]

Originally Posted by semantics

Anyone else have the thought, oh well that's nice, now get it to run that well on a range of graphics cards in opengl instead of just the one you tailored it to. This is just another case of trying to hype linux because they want to use android for steam box.

they wont be doing a steam box from what ive read http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/201...wn-steam-box/1

[Chicken Patty]

Okay, enough. You want to discuss Linux or what not go for it by all means, but no need to call anybody anything. Keep it clean.

[n-ster]

Is Linux vs Windows our new Apple vs Microsoft/Google? Our old one was intel vs AMD and sometimes ATi vs NV... If you wanna debate, do it properly, not by calling names

Linux is far from the ease of use of OSX or Windows, and the mainstream isn't ready to have Linux as their main OS, and that is obvious. Guess why Apple is gaining market share? Ease of use. Do you think people will downgrade in that department for 4% faster performance? People pay a HUGE premium for the same performance for Apple products for the ease of use...

[erocker]

Thread cleaned. Heed Chicken Patty's words.

[MxPhenom 216]

Originally Posted by tacosRcool

who really cares after 240 fps?

who really cares after 60fps to be honest lol

[Ravenas]

Originally Posted by TheMailMan78

Ive been using Linux Mint this week. However I ended up uninstalling it because I honestly had no idea what I was doing and it became a security risk to the rest of my network.

Sounds like Windows 8, yet, you criticize everyone when they say this.

[n-ster]

Originally Posted by Ravenas

Sounds like Windows 8, yet, you criticize everyone when they say this.

how?