NVIDIA Kepler not fully compliant with DirectX 11.1

[Protagonist]

After a discussion on a German a website, NVIDIA confirmed that the Geforce 600 series does not fully support DirectX 11.1 aka is 100% compatible. Well, it doesn't fully support the API. The GTX 680 supports DirectX 11.1 with hardware API eature level 11.0, including all optional features.

Now that does include a number of features useful for game developers such as ...

Reply directly from NVIDIA:

Partial constant buffer updates
Logic operations in the Output Merger
16bpp rendering
UAV-only rendering
Partial clears
Large constant buffers


We did not enable four non-gaming features in Hardware in Kepler (for 11_1):

Target-Independent Rasterization (2D rendering only)
16xMSAA Rasterization (2D rendering only)
Orthogonal Line Rendering Mode
UAV in non-pixel-shader stages


So basically, NVIDIA does support 11.1 features with 11_0 feature level through the DirectX 11.1 API.

"We do not support feature level 11_1. This is a bit confusing, due to Microsoft naming. So we do support 11.1 from a feature level for gaming related features."

The competitions AMD's Radeon HD 7000 "Southern Islands" GPU series is fully compliant with DirectX 11.1 (except the rebranded products from the 6000 family).

Source: http://www.guru3d.com/news_story/nvi...ectx_11_1.html

What? I'm confused can someone with the knowledge damn down the above info, I remember asking the dx11.1 compliance question before the 600 series come out in this thread http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/sh...d.php?t=162896

[W1zzard]

Has lack of DX 10.1 ever affected you?

DX 11.1 is even more useless

[LAN_deRf_HA]

And here I was still wondering what DX 11.1 features my 580 would support since no one seems to have made an official statement about that yet either. I'm guessing not much, or only as much as the 600s.

[Protagonist]

Originally Posted by W1zzard

Has lack of DX 10.1 ever affected you?

DX 11.1 is even more useless

No, Some times its good to know you have support of something even if you don't use it (Peace of Mind) but why did they sell the products as fully compliant with DX 11.1? does this mean the 400 and 500 series have the same dx compatibility as the 600 series?

[Tatty_One]

Originally Posted by st.bone

No, Some times its good to know you have support of something even if you don't use it (Peace of Mind) but why did they sell the products as fully compliant with DX 11.1? does this mean the 400 and 500 series have the same dx compatibility as the 600 series?

Your OP already answers your question..........

"NVIDIA does support 11.1 features with 11_0 feature level through the DirectX 11.1 API"

So unless 11.1 API was around when the 4 and 5 series were origionally released, the 6 series gives you a "little" more

[Kaynar]

Well AMD cards have dx11.1 compliance but, seriously, if you see the list of additions in DX11.1 there is nothing that game production studios will ever use. DX11.1 is only gimmicks.

[BarbaricSoul]

Which is why Wizzard said what he said.

[Kaynar]

Yeh DX11.1 and 4k-resolution on AMD is just for marketing anyway.

[Protagonist]

Originally Posted by Kaynar

Well AMD cards have dx11.1 compliance but, seriously, if you see the list of additions in DX11.1 there is nothing that game production studios will ever use. DX11.1 is only gimmicks.

I don't care that much for DX11.1, for reasons already known such as gaming, for what its worth i don't think its a gimmick.

So maybe lets wait for DX12 and Shader Model 6.0

I had doubts about a full fledged DX11.1 running on Shader Model 5.0 it seems odd to me. maybe hence the reason why NV did this.

I would expect DX11.1 on shader model 5.1

So unless AMD Radeon cards have Shader Model 5.1 of which they dont, its safe to think that they did the same approach as Nvidia Geforce.

[newtekie1]

The cards support the DX11.1 features that will be used in games, that is all that matters on a gaming card.

[W1zzard]

Originally Posted by st.bone

No, Some times its good to know you have support of something even if you don't use it (Peace of Mind)

like "I could go out tonight and get laid, but I rather stay home and play WOW"

[dir_d]

Originally Posted by W1zzard

like "I could go out tonight and get laid, but I rather stay home and play WOW"

oh w1zz...

[cdawall]

Originally Posted by W1zzard

like "I could go out tonight and get laid, but I rather stay home and play WOW"

I just want to point out the OP just got trolled by w1z.

Also that DX11.1 is roughly more useless that DX10.1...

[Kreij]

There are some really nice features in DX 11.1
For instance, the ability to handle video resources in shaders.
What makes the incremental updates to DX useless is that the developers do not want to expend the resources (ie. time and money) to recode their existing engines to utilize the new APIs. If the developers aren't using it, the card manufacturers have little reason to bake it into the hardware.
This is not a failing of DX, but rather a stalled implementation of it's features due to hardware constraints across all of the platforms for which a developer has to write their code.
It makes no sense to expend the resources to develop for a 1% user base.

[ChristTheGreat]

Well, As for now, we can count easy the game that are dx11 xD The list isn't that big..

Anyway, dx11 or dx11.1, for the littles changes, they can still work on dx11 and with for other!

[GotNoRice]

I played DirectX11 games with my 2x 4870x2 setup using Feature Level 10_1 for years and it worked great. Compatibility in this regard is completely transparent to the end-user.

[Batou1986]

Originally Posted by ChristTheGreat

Well, As for now, we can count easy the game that are dx11 xD The list isn't that big..

Exactly.

If and when DX 11.1 is relevant it will be supported by all mainstream cards.
MS is to busy fumbling Windows 8 phone and pc to bother with DX 11.1, if they do something dumb like DX 11.1 Win8 exclusive I have a feeling most devs will just pass on 11.1 just like 10.1 .

[Protagonist]

Originally Posted by W1zzard

like "I could go out tonight and get laid, but I rather stay home and play WOW"

Good for you if you look at it that way.

To me it would be the other way round,..

I could stay home tonight and play WOW, but I rather go out and get laid. < Works for me (Peace Of Mind).

[qubit]

Originally Posted by Kreij

There are some really nice features in DX 11.1
For instance, the ability to handle video resources in shaders.
What makes the incremental updates to DX useless is that the developers do not want to expend the resources (ie. time and money) to recode their existing engines to utilize the new APIs. If the developers aren't using it, the card manufacturers have little reason to bake it into the hardware.
This is not a failing of DX, but rather a stalled implementation of it's features due to hardware constraints across all of the platforms for which a developer has to write their code.
It makes no sense to expend the resources to develop for a 1% user base.

Yup, classic chicken and egg situation.

[RejZoR]

That's why MS is trying to release new major DX releases together with OS releases. A bit to make it artificially look more appealing to users and to also make significant jumps together with the OS. Its the point where most users will make massive upgrades and it somehow actually makes sense.

Though, they could just as well make big DX updates like we got them with earlier DX releases (DX5, 6,7,8,9 etc). It worked just fine back then. It's just that these days developers fiddle and waste time on stuff that in the end makes no effect or is in fact the opposite of what it was designed for. For example the overrated and wrongly used tessellation. They all used it wrong and as a result we got crappy running games that didn't look any better opposed to blazing fast games that would look the same as all the others without tessellation. And there are many similar examples. They aren't using new features properly, they just use them for the sake of using them. Or they just don't even bother at all.

[Protagonist]

Originally Posted by qubit

Yup, classic chicken and egg situation.

Or recently south park s16e14, General Tsao's Chicken. Joke, maybe that's what Nvidia is.

[thunderising]

Originally Posted by W1zzard

Has lack of DX 10.1 ever affected you?

DX 11.1 is even more useless

It's like those people screaming that buy an nVidia card it's got CUDA blah blah.

Then they use it to play COD MW.

[Slizzo]

Originally Posted by st.bone

No, Some times its good to know you have support of something even if you don't use it (Peace of Mind) but why did they sell the products as fully compliant with DX 11.1? does this mean the 400 and 500 series have the same dx compatibility as the 600 series?

They didn't, they sold products advertised as being DX11 compliant.

[Tonim89]

Originally Posted by thunderising

It's like those people screaming that buy an nVidia card it's got CUDA blah blah.

Then they use it to play COD MW.

hahaha

Besides being a gaming feature, that applies to PhysX too. Since Batman AC, i never heard about any other game using it.

The only feature that really matters in Nvidia cards is 3D Vision. The rest is so usefull as a fridge in alaska.

[Slizzo]

Originally Posted by Tonim89

hahaha

Besides being a gaming feature, that applies to PhysX too. Since Batman AC, i never heard about any other game using it.

The only feature that really matters in Nvidia cards is 3D Vision. The rest is so usefull as a fridge in alaska.

Borderlands 2 used it to good effect. Planetside 2 also has an option for it but I haven't been able to enable it as of yet.