AMD's real biggest issue, The DX9 Artifacts

[BababooeyHTJ]

I don't know how this isn't getting more attention. I've been a 7950 owner for a few months now. I've noticed those frame latency issues that people are all up in arms over in one game (Stalker Clear Sky). Even then there is a work around, a framerate cap which I generally use anyways.

The issue that has been irritating the heck out of me and quite a few other people on the forums is the DX9 flicker or artifacts. This issue seems far more common and is far more irritating. There is nothing more immersion breaking than random black or white flashes on your screen.

Here is a four month old thread on Guru3d about this issue with a couple of videos. I know that I've seen this in quite a few games over the months.

[cadaveca]

Originally Posted by BababooeyHTJ

I don't know how this isn't getting more attention. I've been a 7950 owner for a few months now. I've noticed those frame latency issues that people are all up in arms over in one game (Stalker Clear Sky). Even then there is a work around, a framerate cap which I generally use anyways.

The issue that has been irritating the heck out of me and quite a few other people on the forums is the DX9 flicker or artifacts. This issue seems far more common and is far more irritating. There is nothing more immersion breaking than random black or white flashes on your screen.

Here is a four month old thread on Guru3d about this issue with a couple of videos. I know that I've seen this in quite a few games over the months.

I've noticed quite a bit of texture flicker at times as well, but I've also seen it mentioned fixed in drivers a few times for specific titles.

With AMD admitting that they don't have the driver's memory control working right, or optimally, or whatever, it becomes hard to expect a "perfect" experience, and I suspect many issues will go unresolved until that is dealt with.

[the54thvoid]

If I had two cards I was not happy with I'd trade them out and buy a different card. Seriously, have you not thought about buying a GTX680, or two GTX 660TI's or GTX 670's?

As Cadaveca says, this might be a problem that lasts, hell i know he has had years of issues with AMD over various bits and bobs.

Unless you need to use AMD cards, you could go Nvidia.

[BababooeyHTJ]

I'm not so sure that this memory rewrite is going to solve this issue. That was more in response to the frame latency issues. If that were to solve this issue you would think that we would be seeing this in DX10 and 11 titles as well just like the frame latency issue.

This apparently has something to do with the way that certain DX9 effects are rendered on GCN. I really have my doubts that the two issues are directly related.

Originally Posted by the54thvoid

If I had two cards I was not happy with I'd trade them out and buy a different card. Seriously, have you not thought about buying a GTX680, or two GTX 660TI's or GTX 670's?

As Cadaveca says, this might be a problem that lasts, hell i know he has had years of issues with AMD over various bits and bobs.

Unless you need to use AMD cards, you could go Nvidia.

I bought a GTX680 at launch and then later a pair of GTX 670s. I had issues with those too. That was on a pc that I honestly didn't have a single issue with Fermi. I'm still not sure that the vsync issue is completely fixed. I had performance issues in a few games. These artifacts in Fallout New vegas may be annoying but at least I can play it. I know that I was in the minority with the performance issues on Kepler and I am using a different pc but I'm still not willing to take the chance on a side grade. If AMD can't get this fixed in time for GK110 I'll switch.

[Widjaja]

Despite this being quite a wide spread issue, AMD have kept this pretty quiet.
I have to agree it is a serious issue especally when they continue to brag about the performance gains they are getting with each driver update which includes Skyrim.

Um....so what if the cards are getting higher fps in games.

How about your cards being image corruption free?

[Steevo]

Happens on my 5870 when the core or memory change clock rate, or when my memory overclock is too high.

Simple fix to try? Disable AMD fuel service and use afterburner or Trixx and see if it goes away.

[Wrigleyvillain]

I have not yet noticed it with my 7950 but only had a couple weeks and only DX9 played so far is an hour of Skyrim.

[cadaveca]

Originally Posted by BababooeyHTJ

This apparently has something to do with the way that certain DX9 effects are rendered on GCN. I really have my doubts that the two issues are directly related.

Considering the three "offending" titles that were fixed for the frame latency were done with per-app fixes, and the memory fix has yet to happen, I think it's MORE than likely the two are related.

After all, the differences between DirectX9 and DirectX10 mostly are centered around post-process, or processing after a frame is rendered, which uses memory.

This totally smells like a hack in place to get things working...which is the current situation with the memory control. Like the memory controller is busy, and the card renders nothing instead.

I see similar in DX10 and DX11 anyway.

Of course, you could be right, but even so, if they can't get one part of the driver working, I am loath to believe that they can get anything else working right, either. They have had at least 18 months already...or perhaps they simply fired the wrong staff, which would really suck.

[Chevalr1c]

I get artefacts in Clear Sky (HD 6670), depending on whether I use D3D 10 or 10.1. Switching from the one to the other helped me. Maybe the game you vaguely refer to stops having problems if you switch to a different version of D3D (misstakenly referred to as "DirectX" in this thread).
Also, make sure you install the latest Catalyst Application Profile (it won't hurt, even if it does not help you).

[Mathragh]

I also noticed a lot of artifacts in the period after i bought my 7950, especially in DX9 games.
These artifacts have 99% gone after the the 12.11 BETA and the most current 13.01 though, atleast in my case cannot remember the last time I saw an artifact after the new drivers(doesnt say a lot in a factual way but apparently it atleast had an effect on my experience regarding this flickering issue).

[tokyoduong]

I have also noticed some flickering with Star Craft 2 on my 7850. I think I will try updating to the newest 13.1 driver. Crossing my finger that it won't cause more problems.

[TheMailMan78]

Some titles on NVIDIA drivers also do this. BF3 for example does have a little flicker when you are at the ceiling of a map and zoom into the ground. AMD or NVIDIA seem to have this issue. I just expect it any more.

I agree.......its annoying.

[EarthDog]

I thought Cat 13.2 did fix the memory issue? At least there is a site that states so and tests it???

[cadaveca]

Originally Posted by EarthDog

I thought Cat 13.2 did fix the memory issue? At least there is a site that states so and tests it???

Nope, 13.2 contains the frame lag issue on some specific titles only. 13.1 is 12.11beta in WHQL form.

No memory management fix driver in public/private domain...yet.

Originally Posted by qubit

off topic

Smells like an off topic...

[brandonwh64]

Originally Posted by TheMailMan78

Some titles on NVIDIA drivers also do this. BF3 for example does have a little flicker when you are at the ceiling of a map and zoom into the ground. AMD or NVIDIA seem to have this issue. I just expect it any more.

I agree.......its annoying.

Yep here is an example of mine with a 560TI

[TheMailMan78]

Originally Posted by cadaveca

Not much, really.


Anyway, it is not quite as bad as portrayed. There are some issues that need to be fixed. Before they can be properly fixed, the cause must be identified first.

So, what causes texture flicker?

I really, REALLY hope you are not asking me and its a general question.

Because if you are asking me I believe its leprechauns phasing in and out of our dimension trying to steal peoples bitcoins and interwebz.

Other then that I would have no idea. I just know both NVIDIA and AMD have texture flicker.

[the54thvoid]

Originally Posted by qubit

Reading threads like this about one driver issue or another with AMD, I'm so glad I went nvidia four years ago. Their cards just work and that's what you want in a product. Seriously, I hardly ever have issues. I also get the benefit of LightBoost eliminating motion blur on LCD monitors that support it and a great 3D solution too.

I really wish AMD would improve the quality of their drivers and noisy cooling fans and give nvidia some proper competition. Oh and some competition on the other features I mentioned wouldn't hurt either.

I don't play a tonne of games but i really haven't had any annoying issues with my 7970's in crossfire. I couldn't tell you last game i noticed image corruption on but of late i've only played BF3, GW2, Dishonored.

Ah, the recent MoH release wouldn't play nice with full screen crossfire - awful issues fixed by disabling crossfire. But the g ame bored me so maybe my cards are synced with my brain and don't let me play games i don't like.

As for this

I really wish AMD would improve the quality of their drivers and noisy cooling fans and give nvidia some proper competition

I was going to trade out my 7970 for 2 x 670's but i bought another 7970 instead (and watercooled them) so in that respect AMD won that competition.

[Jack1n]

Originally Posted by brandonwh64

Yep here is an example of mine with a 560TI

Had a very similar experience with my old 4870x2,although i always thought its because i run every thing on low that it just does that to distant object to stress the card less.

[Black Panther]

Back on topic guys, no more trolling or flaming.

[erocker]

Originally Posted by qubit

I really wish AMD would improve the quality of their drivers and noisy cooling fans and give nvidia some proper competition

I wish Nvidia would be less cheap on what they put into their hardware. I must be just lucky with AMD cards, I don't have issues. The last Nvidia card I bought (GTX 580) had to be RMA'd 3 times. People are fooling themselves if they think one brand doesn't have issues.

There's always "horror" stories with computer hardware, but it's those who shout from the top of internet mountain that rue the day. Most people do not have issues.

[MxPhenom 216]

Originally Posted by TheMailMan78

Some titles on NVIDIA drivers also do this. BF3 for example does have a little flicker when you are at the ceiling of a map and zoom into the ground. AMD or NVIDIA seem to have this issue. I just expect it any more.

I agree.......its annoying.

Are you talking about the texture z-fighting if you looking at something far in the distance like a building or something?

[qubit]

Originally Posted by erocker

I wish Nvidia would be less cheap on what they put into their hardware. I must be just lucky with AMD cards, I don't have issues. The last Nvidia card I bought (GTX 580) had to be RMA'd 3 times. People are fooling themselves if they think one brand doesn't have issues.

There's always "horror" stories with computer hardware, but it's those who shout from the top of internet mountain that rue the day. Most people do not have issues.

That just proves everyone's experiences are different! Still though, the issue raised by the OP seems somewhat typical of AMD to me, especially the drivers, while nvidia indeed do have issues, but less of them.

Anyway, I'd be pissed too if I'd gotten three faulty GTX 580 cards. Which brand were they, btw?

[erocker]

Originally Posted by qubit

typical of AMD to me, especially the drivers, while nvidia indeed do have issues, but less of them.

Not to me, I don't think AMD cards have any more issues than Nvidia cards. People can testify all they want.

Cards were Evga. I've also had a GTS 450, a GTX 260 and a GTX 280 all die from hardware failure... Doesn't matter though, I stick to what works for me now.

I believe this DX9 flickering has nothing to do with Nvidia or AMD, more likely Microsoft.

[Mathragh]

Originally Posted by MxPhenom 216

Are you talking about the texture z-fighting if you looking at something far in the distance like a building or something?

Indeed the flickering seen in games like BF3 when viewing stuff at a great distance seems to be caused by different layers overlapping as a result of an insufficient depth in the rendering resolution.

Atleast thats what it looks like to me

[EarthDog]

Originally Posted by cadaveca

Nope, 13.2 contains the frame lag issue on some specific titles only. 13.1 is 12.11beta in WHQL form.

No memory management fix driver in public/private domain...yet.

http://techreport.com/review/24218/a...on-frame-times