budget computer

[moocow0463]

please help this is my first build if u need more info let me know, i need feedback advice on hardware, i know absolutley nothing about the actual thermal units/heat sinks so any info there would be great.

budget: want to keep a fairly low cost but not sacrifice too much performance

cpu uses: gaming, running supreme commander, age of conan are the 2 current games im playing / going to try

recycled parts: im going to be keeping my hard drive, my current case, possibly my motherboard (if it works with the build), keeping my fans

overclocking: only if needed

storage: 120 Gb sata

OS: XP

location: US
======================
current config
mobo: p4c800-E
processor: pent 4 2.8 duo
gfx: nivid 6800
storage: 120 gig HD
cooling: 5 fans + power unit fan+ gfx fan
=========================

ok what i want to run is 3.0+ ghz processor probly a 3.2 or will i need more to run the games i want to play?

mobo: id like to ceep my current one if its not holding my back too much for budget reasons but if i need to upgrade it i will but i want to keep it some what low cost

gfx: i was thinking a 8800 would suffice? or an something similar in ATI form

ill be keeping my power unit unless i need something more let me know what ill need for power and ill see what i can do.

cooling: i want to stay away from water cooling due to cost
memory: at a minimum i want to run 1 gig but with sup commander im probly going to be looking for more so i need room to grow

if theres anything im missing please add it on

[MRCL]

First, stay away from single core CPUs if you keep up gaming.

Secondly, if it is an older mobo, it might not support dual core, so you probably have to go for a new one. But mobos are not that expensive if you dont need high end.

8800 might be enough for you so far I can tell.

About the PSU, it depends what kind of PSU you have now installed. For example I had a 350W one, but it couldn't deal with any more upgrades, so I traded it in for a more powerful (and modular cable management is a god darn good invention).

About RAM, go with two gigs at least. Most mobos are very upgrade friendly in that way.

My opinion on this

[moocow0463]

thanks for the advice, i was hoping some one might be able to give me some insight on the mobo as stated above its a p4c800-e, if its not supporting what i want to do i will pay to upgrade it, all im really looking to do is play supreme commander and possibly some new games for the future, i have CoD 4 and despite what people say it runs fine on my current out of date setup, but if i could play it at higher setting that would be nice, keep the advice coming please wanna get the build off the ground and going in july if possible

[moocow0463]

ok after doing some searching im debating a processor...ones 184 ones 209 so the prices isnt much different they both seem pretty good, ones a quad, ones a dual, are these wise choices or should i go for something less expensive?

e6850
q6600

also what kind of mobo will i need to run with these processors
in a previous build i was going to run the DX38bt mobo but for $229 is there anything else to use? or would this also be a wise choice?

[MRCL]

Well, for you, dual core might be best choice.

I aint an expert in mobos, but they are usually labelled with the CPU compability. Also, the socket must be (LGA)775. But you better get advice from somebody who knows the jungle of mobos better than me.

[farlex85]

You will need a new mb, that won't support a proc you will want. For your purposes, I would recommend perhaps getting a e2180, or perhaps an e7200 if you can swing it and are comfertable w/ a little oc. The e7200 can get well over 3ghz w/o much trouble at all, and will come in at about $130 or so if your in the US, and has the same core as the latest and greatest stuff from intel. The 2180 is about $80, and can also get up to 3ghz, but it will take a bit more work and is slower at that speed that the e7200.

Mb just a simple p35 will do. Graphics would be 9600gt/9600gso or 3850/3870 for your best bang for buck. Best buy had the 3870 for $130 recently, I'm not sure now, and again only if your in the US. So are you in the US?

[moocow0463]

ya i just found a few cheaper ones on newegg with good reviews so heres the dilema

run dual core vs quad core (or other suggestions)

e6850
q6600

mobos:
GIGABYTE GA-EP35C-DS3R supports either ddr2 or 3 i will be using ddr2 for cost, has 6 memory slots and is only $150

ABIT IP35 Pro has ddr 2 suppor with 4 slots $179 50 mail in rebate makes it $129

or the more expensive dx38bt but it only suppors DDR3 which is going to be more expensive

and for the PSU i believe i have around 700w right now but id have to double check to make sure

[moocow0463]

thanks farlex just the advice i was needing yes im in the US, but hows the e7200 compare to the e6850 for $50 more i get 3.0ghz without overclocking compared to the 2.5...i mean my out of date processor now runs on a 2.8 but its only a pent 4.

and as for the mobo i had just found the p35 after my previous post and it looks like a good choice to me but i really dont know what im looking at i just read the reviews lol.

and as far as gpu whats the benchmark difference between the 9600gt compared to the 8800gt they are both about the same price, and i can actually get the 3850 or 3870 for even less but ive always had a nvidia card and like to keep it that way

[farlex85]

Yep newegg is the place to shop. You won't need a q6600 most likely, but if you really want quad on a budget, that would be the one to get. The e6850 is outdated and outdone by several procs in or under its price range. The e7200, like I said, has fantastic price for performance and will handle most of what you need. If you really want the 3ghz at stock, get the e8400, which is much better than the e6850 and priced almost the same.

DDR2 is the way to go if your doing budget. I'm not sure what you consider budget, but looking at the ddr3 prices there is no reason to get that now. A p35 w/ just ddr2 would be good. DDR3 is not worth the price right now, and won't be as effective until intel's next chipset. If you want to have two ati cards in the future, "crossfire", then that is why you would get an x38. Other than that p35 is the board you want.

Thats pretty wild if you have a 700w system for the stuff you got now. Your new set up will likely only require about 400-500w. What's more important is you check and see what the brand manufacturer is, and how many amps are on the 12V rail.

The 9600gt has about half the shaders of a 8800gt, yet performs nearly as well. The 8800gt is the better card though, so if you can find a good deal, get that. There is an xfx8800gt for $129 after mir on newegg, I thought that looked pretty good.

[moocow0463]

id like to go with the q6600 if i can afford it i just did a rough estimate with the

ip35 pro mobo 179.99
Q6600 185
nvidia card estimated at around 180
and heat sink at around $60

im under $600

if i need a new PSU

750w corsair is about $130

what other costs will i need to build this

thermal grease anything else?

[farlex85]

Here's a couple of the items I was talking about and some ram. Considering you say your on a budget, and the ease w/ which these procs oc, I would say the e7200 would be better for you, although the e8400 is certainly faster.

[farlex85]

Originally Posted by moocow0463

id like to go with the q6600 if i can afford it i just did a rough estimate with the

ip35 pro mobo 179.99
Q6600 185
nvidia card estimated at around 180
and heat sink at around $60

im under $600

if i need a new PSU

750w corsair is about $130

what other costs will i need to build this

thermal grease anything else?

Some mx-2 or artic silver 5 for thermal grease. You won't need 750w, but yeah corsair is good. Check out the xigamatek HDT coolers on newegg. You can get a good cooler for $30.

[moocow0463]

its saying the carts empty :S i just looked at the 8400 and it looks good too, i know a lot of games dont use the quad core processor but is there a performance loss between the dual and quad? or would the 3.0 dual out perform the 2.4 quad? how about with some overclocking in the mix?

[moocow0463]

Originally Posted by farlex85

Some mx-2 or artic silver 5 for thermal grease. You won't need 750w, but yeah corsair is good. Check out the xigamatek HDT coolers on newegg. You can get a good cooler for $30.

how much power would i need to run it? no need to over due it if i dont need to

[farlex85]

Originally Posted by moocow0463

its saying the carts empty :S i just looked at the 8400 and it looks good too, i know a lot of games dont use the quad core processor but is there a performance loss between the dual and quad? or would the 3.0 dual out perform the 2.4 quad? how about with some overclocking in the mix?

Sorry, I wasn't sure if it would work. The e8400 and e7200 are 45nm procs, and their core architecture allows them to move faster clock for clock than the 65nm procs (which is what the q6600 is). They both also use less heat and power, and oc much higher. Of course, you got the extra 2 cores on the quad. Really, in games the duals will serve you better at the moment until more games become multi-threaded, but the quad easily wins in benchmarks. A lot of people here like to use a car analogy, so I will pass it on again. The e8400 is like a ferarri, blazing speed, while the q6600 is like a big truck, it doesn't move as fast but it can get more done per clock.

My personal recommendation would be the dual for now. Intel's next gen of procs are coming soon that simply beat the pants off today's quads. And really, the advantages of a quad today are mostly limited to benchies and encoding.

[farlex85]

Originally Posted by moocow0463

how much power would i need to run it? no need to over due it if i dont need to

The 500w corsair should do ya fine w/ room to spare.

[moocow0463]

ok i just pulled my psu out and its rated at 420W supposidl its a dual rail HPC-420-302 DF is the number i pulled off of it, im wondering if this will power it or bump for the extra 80w?

[farlex85]

Ok think I found the psu. Looks like you got 18A on the 12V rail, and although I don't know about that brand, it doesn't seem to be the best. I would go w/ maybe this one .

[moocow0463]

cool thanks, im still debating on that quad core tho, with overclocking reaching 3.0 ghz probly wouldnt be out of the question, but then the dual core with clocking could probly get 3.5 or so? but i haven played or seen anyone run a quad core im wondering how much faster it would be if the 500 mhz difference would even matter?

[farlex85]

The quad will get 3ghz, it can get 3.6 or so with good oc, although the q6600s seem to vary in the amount w/ which they will oc. 3ghz shouldn't be a problem though. The e8400 can reach 4ghz fairly easily, and can get 4.5 or so under the right conditions. Like I said, the quad is great for multi-tasking and multi-threaded applications. In many applications (such as games) the dual will be faster b/c of its better speed. In instances where all 4 cores of the quad can and are used, it will be faster.

[moocow0463]

hmm ya i know what your saying its a tough choice :S but if the e8400 will perform in games thats what im lookin for

[moocow0463]

so i just used the PSU calculator in the PSU forum but im not sure if i inputed all my info right but it said a 400w PSU would support but im going to get a 500w supply
heres my list so far does it look complete?



GIGABYTE GA-EP35-DS3L LGA 775 Intel P35 ATX Intel Motherboard - Retail
mushkin 2GB 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 1066 (PC2 8500) Desktop Memory Model 991599 - Retail

XFX PVT88PYSF4 GeForce 8800 GT 512MB 256-bit GDDR3 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready SLI Supported Video Card - Retail
Intel Core 2 Duo E8400 Wolfdale 3.0GHz LGA 775 65W Dual-Core Processor Model BX80570E8400 - Retail

ePOWER ZU-550W 550W ATX12V Version 2.0 / EPS12V Power Supply - Retail


ZALMAN CNPS 7500 AlCu LED 110mm 2 Ball CPU Cooler - Retail


Arctic Silver 5 Thermal Compound - OEM