What's wrong with our forum moderator staff?

[Mussels]

following what Kreij has said here, as a thought.

I have seen people banned, and threads closed without a reason given to the public.

Perhaps when people are banned, a reason should be posted next to their name/on their profile page? Banned for: Swearing, spamming, etc

Also, i think that when threads are closed a post at the end saying why is a very good idea. I have seen this done many times and seriously, it needs to continue. Closed threads with a reason, are more informative as to what behaviour is not allowed than deleted threads are (again, a good thing with TPU that i feel must continue)

[Polaris573]

We're not going to make infractions public. Infractions are between the staff and the people who receive them. If you have a deep concern about an infraction someone received because that person is a close friend or family member then you can PM a staff member for a more detailed explanation. One time I banned someone's friend because they were sending me vulgar, abusive PMs after they received an infraction. I the received a PM from this person's friend to the effect that I was unfair to their friend and that I was basically a bad person. So I sent him a PM containing the messages I had received from his friend as well as the original infraction. The member decided the infractions I had given his friend were fair, so apparently his friend hadn't been entirely truthful. So be careful when some random member tells you they did nothing wrong. I know it's easier and more fun to believe that the staff are a group of evil people just looking for any cause to make your life miserable, and the members are all honest heroes fighting the good fight against us. However, I don't believe that has ever been the case and if it was then the infraction was reversed.

[Mussels]

Originally Posted by Polaris573

We're not going to make infractions public. Infractions are between the staff and the people who receive them. If you have a deep concern about an infraction someone received because that person is a close friend or family member then you can PM a staff member for a more detailed explanation. One time I banned someone's friend because they were sending me vulgar, abusive PMs after they received an infraction. I the received a PM from this person's friend to the effect that I was unfair to their friend and that I was basically a bad person. So I sent him a PM containing the messages I had received from his friend as well as the original infraction. The member decided the infractions I had given his friend were fair, so apparently his friend hadn't been entirely truthful. So be careful when some random member tells you they did nothing wrong. I know it's easier and more fun to believe that the staff are a group of evil people just looking for any cause to make your life miserable, and the members are all honest heroes fighting the good fight against us. However, I don't believe that has ever been the case and if it was then the infraction was reversed.

yeah but thats the point of giving some reason for it - to help reduce those people from thinking its unfair and such. Certainly some kind of balance is needed, i merely wanted to make sure mods were aware of it.

[GJSNeptune]

Balance is not needed. It's a side effect of misbehavior. The biggest group of miscreants should be spammers, not members. The forum is supposed to be a tool. General Nonsense is for (drumroll) nonsense. That's the subforum in which threads can be useless.

If you post a thread with a legitimate question, you want a legitimate answer. Someone replies, maybe answering it, maybe trying to answer it, then a second person comes along and tangents the first reply. More and more people come along and ignore the thread's original purpose, and you have a useless thread and your problem continues.

Then in the future, someone's Googling with a similar issue, comes across the thread, and realizes that it's useless.

[Mussels]

Originally Posted by GJSNeptune

Balance is not needed. It's a side effect of misbehavior. The biggest group of miscreants should be spammers, not members.

no i mean a balance between saying why people were warned/punished, and keeping it private.

An extreme version would be if a mod banned a person, and deleted all PM's and posts pertaining to it: why were they banned? people would get paranoid and start really thinking the mods were on a rampage.

Having a status of some kind would help reduce the irrational fear of the panicking masses "banned permanently" "temporary ban expires on"

things like that are worth considering by the mods and w1zz, at least.

[GJSNeptune]

Sorry. I added more to my post. (Ninja Edit master)

[Mussels]

Originally Posted by GJSNeptune

Sorry. I added more to my post. (Ninja Edit master)

so your point has moved off of what i was talking about with bans :P sorry i thought it was about that.

Yeah we do need to stay on topic a little more... there comes a point when threads are useless already and people just cave in. thats when mods move them to general nonsense. This should probably be done more often, imo.

[GJSNeptune]

Originally Posted by Mussels

Yeah we do need to stay on topic a little more... there comes a point when threads are useless already and people just cave in. thats when mods move them to general nonsense. This should probably be done more often, imo.

Only if the thread was nonsense to begin with. That a legitimate thread has to be moved later is horrendous. Legitimate threads should be able to stay where they are (given they're in the right subforum).

[Kreij]

Originally Posted by GJSNeptune

Only if the thread was nonsense to begin with. That a legitimate thread has to be moved later is horrendous. Legitimate threads should be able to stay where they are (given they're in the right subforum).

Many threads go south from their original intent.
I do not think the mods should move them to GN to let people continue off topic in the thread.
I think they should be closed to retain any useful information on the original topic.
If people want to continue talking about something that is not related to the thread then they should start another topic in GN.

Just my 2 cents.

[GJSNeptune]

Closing them still sucks for the OP. The useless posts should simply be deleted (perhaps closing the thread first) and violating members warned. I know it's a lot of work, but in most cases the OP has nothing to do with it, and deserves the answer or discussion he/she wanted in the first place.

[Kreij]

Originally Posted by GJSNeptune

Closing them still sucks for the OP. The useless posts should simply be deleted (perhaps closing the thread first) and violating members warned. I know it's a lot of work, but in most cases the OP has nothing to do with it, and deserves the answer or discussion he/she wanted in the first place.

Do you have any idea how much work that is for a forum like this?
Selectively deleting posts would be a nightmare, and would cause even more problems.

Being a mod on a popular forum is not a status symbol.
It is a daily exercise in babysitting the general user base.

There is no glory, no kudos, there is not anything.
The fact that the mods on this forum put up with all the crap that they do is a testiment to their dedication to TPU. The fact that they are still here says that in spade.

The mods at times will vent and perhaps do things that seem unfair, but they are human too.
We have to work together to reduce their workload, not increase it, by helping them to moderate the forum and tell other users when they are out of line. A handful of mods cannot possibly police a board with tens of thousands of users and hundreds of thousands of posts.

[Solaris17]

Originally Posted by Kreij

Many threads go south from their original intent.
I do not think the mods should move them to GN to let people continue off topic in the thread.
I think they should be closed to retain any useful information on the original topic.
If people want to continue talking about something that is not related to the thread then they should start another topic in GN.

Just my 2 cents.

I agree but i think along with getting closed or before that rather i think the mods should delete or prune the misinformative posts...however i know this will cause problems...you see because a basic response to that from a mod would go something like

"why should we have to do it i think thats the members resposability to stay on topic"

well you see thats just blowing smoke as was said a couple posts ago we are all human noob or ina a bad mood and as such in either one of those sistuations noob (may not know better) or bad mood(not be in the state of mind to stop) you may post crap once in awhile...and that happens so thats no excuse. and saying being a noob or in a bad mood is no excuse would berediculous because EVERYONE has done something they regret or didnt want to do weather they think about it or not...so saying it shouldnt be a mods job is imo BS because from what i remember it was my JOB.

[GJSNeptune]

You're right. We need great mods, preferably ones with experience babysitting.

[Solaris17]

what i think would help it is people using the report post button...for those of you who dont know what it does after you click it a box pops up telling you to wite what the problem is....these reports are sent directly to the mod lounge as thread #1 top of the list.

[UnkAsn93]

I've used the report button before, and mods showed up. I always wondered where and who got it, but it's a great button to use

[Polaris573]

The report post button creates a thread in the moderator forum which all of the moderators can see. Whoever gets to it first and wants to deal with the problem is the one who gets it. If necessary the problem can then be discussed just like you would with any other thread.

[Thermopylae_480]

Some of the things you guys suggest would take an army of moderators. I don't have the time or desire to read every post and every thread to decide if it needs to be closed or not. You guys have trouble handling the nine moderators we have and complain about consistency now, imagine if we had 20, 30 or more moderators?

Originally Posted by GJSNeptune

You're right. We need great mods, preferably ones with experience babysitting.

I do. I have to manage about 35 freshman in a freshman dorm insuring they abide by the rules and terms and conditions of their housing contracts; I also have to design programs and community building programs. I have to resolve conflict between roomates and patrol the halls making sure everything is ok.

[GJSNeptune]

Heh. The life of an RA? Unfortunately a lot of members here aren't that old.

I don't know what happened with/to Zek, but it must've happened during my hiatus. If I had to point out the epitome of how not to moderate, it'd be him. Hopefully it is/was due mostly to age.

[Kreij]

Originally Posted by GJSNeptune

I don't know what happened with/to Zek, but it must've happened during my hiatus. If I had to point out the epitome of how not to moderate, it'd be him. Hopefully it is/was due mostly to age.

This is one of my points, GS. If you had a problem with Zek you should take it into PM and not trash him on the open forum. It makes things look chaotic and unprofessional.

[DanTheBanjoman]

Originally Posted by Kreij

This is one of my points, GS. If you had a problem with Zek you should take it into PM and not trash him on the open forum. It makes things look chaotic and unprofessional.

Actually if he would be a bit more constructive it's exactly what this thread is for. However, if it's a personal issue, I would recommend not taking it public.

[GJSNeptune]

No, no. That's not my intention. Plus it's all in the past. I think it's more of a maturity issue than anything else.

[Kreij]

Originally Posted by DanTheBanjoman

Actually if he would be a bit more constructive it's exactly what this thread is for. However, if it's a personal issue, I would recommend not taking it public.

I agree, Dan, but claiming that someone is "the epitome of how not to moderate" only serves to create a rift between users and moderators, and is a statement that is so general in its scope that it is of no value to anyone.

@ GS : No offense my friend, just trying to show people that what they type may have huge consequenses on perceptions of other users. If you had made some specific references to things that Zek did that you did not like, then it could be discussed and perhaps resolved. But in the context that you used, it makes Zek look worthless, which was not true. He contributed to many posts and is thought of highly by many users.

[GJSNeptune]

Thought of highly in probably the wrong way. His moderator privileges definitely went to his head. It was really hard to discern him from regular members.

[imperialreign]

Originally Posted by GJSNeptune

Closing them still sucks for the OP. The useless posts should simply be deleted (perhaps closing the thread first) and violating members warned. I know it's a lot of work, but in most cases the OP has nothing to do with it, and deserves the answer or discussion he/she wanted in the first place.

although this might seem like a good idea to keep a thread as helpful and on topic as possible - mods could seriously shoot themselves in the foot if they practiced this tactic -

sure, we all get off topic at times, and threads will sometimes split and it seems like two threads are rolling along as one - but the few off topic banter posts and one-liners users love to toss out are what add character to the forum as a whole, and adds to the commradery between users as well; plus, it allows us to get a better idea of each users style, which can keep us from breaking into a flame war in heated threads (we "know" how certain people post and we can discern if they're joking around or being serious) . . . that's what makes this community, IMO, so unique in itself . . . when we all disagree, we're respectful about it - you don't see us tossing the term "n00b" left and right like a lot of other tech enthusiast sites, and we all get along with minimal flame wars and de-railed threads.

Plus, if mods started deleting senseless posts, or editing them if the thread hasn't turned into a flame war or otherwise, you would only build a sense of communism or nazism amoungst the general users. It would turn a lot of people away - why post at all if someone would edit your post or delete it if they felt it didn't contribute to the thread. It would only serve to further divide the users from the mods; and the way it is now, I view the mods as being just like the rest of us regulars, only with the authority to keep us on track - and we respect that as well; a thread gets off topic and the ask us to get on track we generally do, and if not, we all understand that the thread could be locked after 2-3 warnings, so we don't bitch and cry high-water once it is closed.

[pt]

in another forum i go, threads are temporarily closed if needed for moderation and for ppl to chill out, only if ppl go flame or do any rules violations they get banned and infracted