5870 CF or single 5970?

[Sanhime]

Too many opinions! Hard to decide! @.@

I wonder about the real world performace of 1gb vs 2gb cards. Though I don't know how Ati laces their memory with their GPUs, speaking from Nvidia experieces, 2gb vs 1gb is almost no difference. Every benchmark I has seen for the 285gtx 1gb/2gb showed almost no performance difference between (~1-3%) them. Maybe more memory is needed for tessellation? Who knows. Tessellation is not the only method of making prettier graphics out there. Lot of people made a huge deal about physx when it first came out and that people starting saying the majority of future games will use physx for the physics. That has not happen. I am not sure if I want to spend an extra $100 for a 1-3% improvement. My understanding with the 2gb memory will mainly benefit people who are playing a resolutions greater than 19x12 and/or playing with multidisplays, which is probably 1% people. Most people play at 19x12 or below and will not likely see any benefit from the extra memory. The 1gb 5870s and the 5970s are not framebuffer limited at any single screen resolution 19x12 or below

On paper, more memory is good, but as someone on this thread pointed out, there are a lot of other things going that needs to be considered in the GPU pipeline than just memory. This more window dressing than anything else.

BTW, would my CPU be a bottleneck for 5970 (with and without CF) or 5870 (with and without CF)?

[Lionheart]

Originally Posted by Sanhime

Too many opinions! Hard to decide! @.@

I wonder about the real world performace of 1gb vs 2gb cards. Though I don't know how Ati laces their memory with their GPUs, speaking from Nvidia experieces, 2gb vs 1gb is almost no difference. Every benchmark I has seen for the 285gtx 1gb/2gb showed almost no performance difference between (~1-3%) them. Maybe more memory is needed for tessellation? Who knows. Tessellation is not the only method of making prettier graphics out there. Lot of people made a huge deal about physx when it first came out and that people starting saying the majority of future games will use physx for the physics. That has not happen. I am not sure if I want to spend an extra $100 for a 1-3% improvement. My understanding with the 2gb memory will mainly benefit people who are playing a resolutions greater than 19x12 and/or playing with multidisplays, which is probably 1% people. Most people play at 19x12 or below and will not likely see any benefit from the extra memory. The 1gb 5870s and the 5970s are not framebuffer limited at any single screen resolution 19x12 or below

On paper, more memory is good, but as someone on this thread pointed out, there are a lot of other things going that needs to be considered in the GPU pipeline than just memory. This more window dressing than anything else.

BTW, would my CPU be a bottleneck for 5970 (with and with CF) or 5870 (with and without CF)?

Your CPU is fin Bru it wont bottleneck!

[n-ster]

An overclocked i7 920 and you are doubting your CPU?

It will calculate a gazillion decimals of pie before you can say pie xD

[Sanhime]

Originally Posted by n-ster

An overclocked i7 920 and you are doubting your CPU?

It will calculate a gazillion decimals of pie before you can say pie xD

Wow,l I can't believe 5970s are so rare. I cannot find one in-stock anywhere.

[n-ster]

takes about 15 mins of searching LOL

[Sanhime]

Let me rephrase that, none in-stock anywhere that is <$700. I found used ones on ebay, but I'm wary of those when the sellers say that they OCed their cards.

[douglatins]

Originally Posted by ToTTenTranz

Great, hope you're happy with your super-redundant system.

Just don't come around crying when you see a single HD5970 4GB or 2*HD5870/50 2GB surpassing your system by 200% in late 2013 games.


When graphics memory isn't enough, the performance drops down to 30 or 40%. The system waits for the textures to stream directly through the PCI-Express bus, which is 8GB/s (compared to the card's ~150GB/s, there's a huge bottleneck there).

Fixed, 2GB 5970 will rock for ages.
I got a 5970 and a 5850 for 15% more than dual 5870, and have a lot more performance, and the 5850 will go to a HTPC and the 5970 sold in the next year, and wtf is the deal on not wanting to buy a card that has been oced, at least the guy was being honest, everyone can say they didnt OC the cards, and i would rather get a OCed card from a user that takes care of them, like good airflow case, than some random console gamer that uses a crappy case

[Sanhime]

Nothing is wrong with buying a used OCed card. I was talking to the seller to see if he took care of the card. You cannot assume that someone who OCs a card mean he must be a expert and cares for the card. The guy told me he OC the card 900/1260 with temps at mid to high 60Cs. Is that for real? Would that be possible? The guy told me he only used it for eyefinitey. So cut me a little slack. I don't know much about ATI cards, last time I owned a ATI card was a Rage3D.

[douglatins]

Originally Posted by Sanhime

Nothing is wrong with buying a used OCed card. I was talking to the seller to see if he took care of the card. You cannot assume that someone who OCs a card mean he must be a expert and cares for the card. The guy told me he OC the card 900/1260 with temps at mid to high 60Cs. Is that for real? Would that be possible? The guy told me he only used it for eyefinitey. So cut me a little slack. I don't know much about ATI cards, last time I owned a ATI card was a Rage3D.

I just said in general, no disrespect , about the temps is possible it he had the fan very high up, i have mine stock and some %increase and it get up tp 70C in gaming and 90C with the fan on 30% fixed and vantage, though the card is right above a 5970

[Sanhime]

Originally Posted by douglatins

I just said in general, no disrespect , about the temps is possible it he had the fan very high up, i have mine stock and some %increase and it get up tp 70C in gaming and 90C with the fan on 30% fixed and vantage, though the card is right above a 5970

No problem

BTW, is there a reason why you have a 5970 and 5850? I didn't know you can CF two different cards? Is there a technological reason or did you not want to pony up money to buy another 5970? Or if its not worth having two 5970?

[ToTTenTranz]

Originally Posted by douglatins

Fixed, 2GB 5970 will rock for ages.

From post 49:

So having 2*HD5970 is.. well, it's the same processing-power/available-memory proportion as having a HD5870 with 256MB GDDR5. And that sounds really ridiculous.

Likewise, a HD5970 2GB has the same processing-power/available-memory ratio as a HD5870 512MB.
No matter what the 2009 benchmarks say, it is an unbalanced system.




During the past 2 years, it became "fashionable" to say that "memory amount is overrated".
Memory amount was overrated during the DX9-DX10 era.
In DX8 games, the difference between 32 and 64MB was pretty huge.
Then the shaders came and having big textures wasn't so important anymore.

Now (and I'm talking about games being developed as we speak), high-resolutions, higher quality anti-aliasing and bigger textures/geometry will be "the new black" again (on par with computation, but god knows when that'll be used in actual games).





As for a HD5970 "rocking for ages" until 2013.. well, it simply won't happen. Do you think a HD3870X2 1GB will "rock" until 2011?

[twistedneck]

I think we all realize that our hobby of having wicked fast graphics boards is expensive. I usually replace one machine per year with the latest stuff.. so thats 3yrs old max for any of my machines and usually one of those will get a video card upgrade before 3 years is up.

5970 - done after next year
2x5870 crossfire.. wont even run all options on Metro 2033 right now
gtx480 -should last a year or more, but i may never get my hands on a second card for crossifire.

Back to the thread topic, i have had better luck stability wise over clocking a single 5970, but the 5870x2 is slightly faster - even when running similar clocks on my machines.

[Lionheart]

Originally Posted by twistedneck

I think we all realize that our hobby of having wicked fast graphics boards is expensive. I usually replace one machine per year with the latest stuff.. so thats 3yrs old max for any of my machines and usually one of those will get a video card upgrade before 3 years is up.

5970 - done after next year
2x5870 crossfire.. wont even run all options on Metro 2033 right now
gtx480 -should last a year or more, but i may never get my hands on a second card for crossifire.

Back to the thread topic, i have had better luck stability wise over clocking a single 5970, but the 5870x2 is slightly faster - even when running similar clocks on my machines.

Wat do mean 2X hD5870's wont run metro 2033 all options, you mean full detail, if so that cant be right

[DrPepper]

Originally Posted by twistedneck

5970 - done after next year
2x5870 crossfire.. wont even run all options on Metro 2033 right now
gtx480 -should last a year or more, but i may never get my hands on a second card for crossifire.

The 4870X2 still has the same power as a 5870 and is faster than all other 5series cards so the 5970, unless there is a massive leap in technology will still be quite fast.

[twistedneck]

Originally Posted by CHAOS_KILLA

Wat do mean 2X hD5870's wont run metro 2033 all options, you mean full detail, if so that cant be right

AT stock clocks, there is no way to play with 4x MSAA turned on (with everythign else on max @ 1680x1050 with advanced physix). fps is fine at 30-40 but then there are big dips down to the low 20's and even teens in normal play. turning off 4x MSAA helps a lot, and then turning off advanced dof helps too. thats how i run it.

with those two opitions off , overclocked to 1000 gpu helps a lot, but even then i see ultra low fps on selected places although most of the game is 70-80fps. it totally crashes when the fps hits the uber low scene with three levels of people, exposions and stuff right after you finish manning the gun train car.

I am going to try a run tonight - would extra volts help?? 1.27 or so now @ 1000.

fyi these cards are stable in furmark at these speeds. did notice less crashing when i turned the auto fan to fixed.

[Lionheart]

Originally Posted by twistedneck

AT stock clocks, there is no way to play with 4x MSAA turned on (with everythign else on max @ 1680x1050 with advanced physix). fps is fine at 30-40 but then there are big dips down to the low 20's and even teens in normal play. turning off 4x MSAA helps a lot, and then turning off advanced dof helps too. thats how i run it.

with those two opitions off , overclocked to 1000 gpu helps a lot, but even then i see ultra low fps on selected places although most of the game is 70-80fps. it totally crashes when the fps hits the uber low scene with three levels of people, exposions and stuff right after you finish manning the gun train car.

I am going to try a run tonight - would extra volts help?? 1.27 or so now @ 1000.

fyi these cards are stable in furmark at these speeds. did notice less crashing when i turned the auto fan to fixed.

That sux to here, Im getting a second HD5870 and this game was mainly the reason for it, no biggy I'll overclock em up to your speed and see what performance I get.

I think around maybe 1.28v and see if that helps

[twistedneck]

Originally Posted by CHAOS_KILLA

That sux to here, Im getting a second HD5870 and this game was mainly the reason for it, no biggy I'll overclock em up to your speed and see what performance I get.

I think around maybe 1.28v and see if that helps

Update, on another thread I was talking about this same issue and we discovered it was advanced physX causing the one machine to crash - i think its cpu - motherboard - ram bug with the game, some people have luck with that option on in 2033, some dont..

But the 5970 sure is stable, and overclocks just as far as the 5870.

[Lionheart]

Originally Posted by twistedneck

Update, on another thread I was talking about this same issue and we discovered it was advanced physX causing the one machine to crash - i think its cpu - motherboard - ram bug with the game, some people have luck with that option on in 2033, some dont..

But the 5970 sure is stable, and overclocks just as far as the 5870.

Well I've had no issues at all with metro 2033, just lagging at full settings but thats expected, and I couldnt tell the difference with physic's on or off, it could be a bug, gonna wait for new 10.4 drivers, hopefully metro gets a patch also

[douglatins]

Originally Posted by Sanhime

No problem

BTW, is there a reason why you have a 5970 and 5850? I didn't know you can CF two different cards? Is there a technological reason or did you not want to pony up money to buy another 5970? Or if its not worth having two 5970?

Too much power heat money and unoptimal performance, i got more bang for buck with a 5850 and the 5850 will live on longer than the 5970 on other builds

[mdsx1950]

Originally Posted by ToTTenTranz

From post 49:



Likewise, a HD5970 2GB has the same processing-power/available-memory ratio as a HD5870 512MB.
No matter what the 2009 benchmarks say, it is an unbalanced system.




During the past 2 years, it became "fashionable" to say that "memory amount is overrated".
Memory amount was overrated during the DX9-DX10 era.
In DX8 games, the difference between 32 and 64MB was pretty huge.
Then the shaders came and having big textures wasn't so important anymore.

Now (and I'm talking about games being developed as we speak), high-resolutions, higher quality anti-aliasing and bigger textures/geometry will be "the new black" again (on par with computation, but god knows when that'll be used in actual games).





As for a HD5970 "rocking for ages" until 2013.. well, it simply won't happen. Do you think a HD3870X2 1GB will "rock" until 2011?

If you experienced the power of the 5970 properly.. you wouldn't be saying any of this. No offense but my 5970 and anyone elses 5970 can piss on your card. It takes two of your card to beat the 5970. So what the heck do you mean by ? :-

Likewise, a HD5970 2GB has the same processing-power/available-memory ratio as a HD5870 512MB.

Your seriously underestimating the 5970.

[ToTTenTranz]

Originally Posted by mdsx1950

If you experienced the power of the 5970 properly.. you wouldn't be saying any of this. No offense but my 5970 and anyone elses 5970 can piss on your card. It takes two of your card to beat the 5970. So what the heck do you mean by ? :-


Your seriously underestimating the 5970.

I don't "mean" anything, it's a fact. Try reading my post a bit more carefully and leave aside your graphics card' renal functions.
Maybe then you'll make sense.

[stinzza]

but if you got 2 gpu on 1 pcb with 2gb vmem.. and both gpu computes frames on availeble mem blocks.. than the frames prodused can than be as highly detaild and big in kb size for 1gb each..
1 5870 512mb does not have the same processing-power/available-memory ratio as an 5970 2gb

its like saying that there is no different between 5870 1gb and 5870 512mb.. the 5870 512mb does not have the same procsessing power as the one card will loose in performance when its starved for vmem.. the one is prosessing more power output in total frames

the processing power of 5970 2gb is 2 times as fast to produce frames then a 5870 1gb

[riddy]

I cant see any difference in 5870CF setup..the performance like using single card...sometimes it give much lower frame rates..the game that i test is crysis, Devil May Cry 4, resident Evil 5, supreme Commander 2, MW1, MW2...dont know what is the problem...this is my setup..

Lg 19 inch 1280x1024
Asus Maximus II Formula
C2D E8600 (stock speed)
4x Crucial Ballistix Tracer 1Gb 1066
2x Samsung F3 1Tb
Dell OEM 5870
Power Color 5870 (Asus bios)
Seasonic 850W

All game is on 1280x1024 (highest setting AA (max) AF (max))

any suggestion/recommendation? thanx!...

not sure about 5970....

[n-ster]

uhh, make yourself a new thread, this one is dead, I have his 5850 and he has a 5970

[riddy]

ooo..ok...sorry