Sony to get nailed for removing OtherOS feature from PS3?

[Easy Rhino]

Originally Posted by AphexDreamer

Perhaps? Some people might think that their PS3 should play PS2 games. I'd like to think most everyone knows what they are getting but I can't say that everyone does cause I don't know everyone.

But the argument here isn't really the USB ports, heck not even the lack of PS2 backwards compatibility, but its the OtherOS Feature (Linux).

This is a situation where people did buy something they didn't know would later become stripped away from them.

For many people Linux was the primary reason of owning the PS3 or if not primary a good bonus to owning the PS3 (even advertised by SONY). Feels great to buy something only to have the thing you bought it for forcefully taken away from you. Your forced to now either just use your PS3 as a Ps3 or to just use it for its Linux PowerPC and buy another PS3 to play your PS3 games you own online.

which is why i mentioned what i did. the only thing actually "taken away" from a ps3 owner is otherOS. everything else has been sold as advertised.

Originally Posted by LAN_deRf_HA

That argument would be fine if the old models were still produced, but they aren't.

huh? then you are simply complaining about something you cannot change. waste of time and immature.

[AphexDreamer]

Originally Posted by Easy Rhino

which is why i mentioned what i did. the only thing actually "taken away" from a ps3 owner is otherOS. everything else has been sold as advertised.

Yes but my point sill is that when they created the orginal PS3 product with extra features that we no longer get, get its like losing them.

So although we bought a product with 2 USB ports, it was originally designed and sold with four. So not getting the ports and backwards compatibility is in fact losing them, especially now that I have to pay Sony extra to get USB expansion ports and possible pay them extra to receive PS2 backwards compatibility (if the ever decide to implement it) which originally was standard.

[Easy Rhino]

Originally Posted by AphexDreamer

Yes but my point sill is that when they created the orginal PS3 product with extra features that we no longer get, get its like losing them.

So although we bought a product with 2 USB ports, it was originally designed and sold with four. So not getting the ports and backwards compatibility is in fact losing them, especially now that I have to pay Sony extra to get USB expansion ports and possible pay them extra to receive PS2 backwards compatibility (if the ever decide to implement it) which originally was standard.

well to me you sound like you are whining. you did not have to buy this stripped down version of the playstation. sounds to me those people should be mad at themselves rather than sony.

[AphexDreamer]

Originally Posted by Easy Rhino

well to me you sound like you are whining. you did not have to buy this stripped down version of the playstation. sounds to me those people should be mad at themselves rather than sony.

I'm not whining, I find that insulting. Is this what you resort to?

I did in fact buy the stripped down version, cause thats all that is on the market today. I have no choice, no say, only 2 USB ports and no backwards compatibility.

And no, we have no one to blame but Sony for designing, redesigning, adding and taking away features at their will and their discretion.

And if you plan to tell me to go look on ebay if I want 4 USB ports so baddly then you sir fail to see my point and I will gladly stop here. (Just in case...)

[Jstn7477]

Originally Posted by AphexDreamer

I'm not whining, I find that insulting. Is this what you resort to?

I did in fact buy the stripped down version, cause thats all that is on the market today. I have no choice, no say, only 2 USB ports and no backwards compatibility.

And no, we have no one to blame but Sony for designing, redesigning, adding and taking away features at their will and their discretion.

They did it with the PlayStation 2 in 2005. When SCPH-70000 came out, no more hard drive (which means no PS2 linux and a few games were rendered unusable), Firewire console linking and old-model multitap support. Sony's been changing its features on its consoles practically forever.

[AphexDreamer]

Originally Posted by Jstn7477

They did it with the PlayStation 2 in 2005. When SCPH-70000 came out, no more hard drive (which means no PS2 linux and a few games were rendered unusable), Firewire console linking and old-model multitap support. Sony's been changing its features on its consoles practically forever.

And I'ts safe to say they will continue to do so. To what extent would be the question?

Unless your deeply impacted with the loss of a certain feature nothings going to be said or done. Linux on the PS3 was more popular and probably higher in demand on the PS3 then it is/was for the PS2 causing it to be a bigger issue for Sony then it was taking it out on the PS2.

It was after all, the trigger than led to the current hacking of the PS3 we see today.

[Jack Doph]

I may, perhaps, be a little out of place here, but I do agree with AphexDreamer.
If you have a choice in the matter, then there's no argument.
But when a company offers you less for the same money, one starts to wonder about motives.

TBH, my own experiences with S**y aren't very good either, and that company has cost me a great deal of money on written promises they never intended to keep (back in the day when I was still a PC reseller).

I understand there's no-one forcing anyone to buy the current crop of PS3s, but you have no choice in what version you do purchase. It's called "forced consumer-purchase training".

Less features for the same money is just bad PR and, unfortunately, typical of S**y ever since the old "mr. S**y" (my apologies for forgetting his name) retired from the company.

It's true, again, no-one need buy the current version of the PS3, but when the option of certain games only comes out on the one platform, you are forced to purchase said platform with reduced features, or go without the intended pleasure/pass-time it's supposed to provide.

That is a cause for scrutiny in itself...

[n-ster]

Originally Posted by AphexDreamer

I'm not whining, I find that insulting. Is this what you resort to?

I did in fact buy the stripped down version, cause thats all that is on the market today. I have no choice, no say, only 2 USB ports and no backwards compatibility.

And no, we have no one to blame but Sony for designing, redesigning, adding and taking away features at their will and their discretion.

And if you plan to tell me to go look on ebay if I want 4 USB ports so baddly then you sir fail to see my point and I will gladly stop here. (Just in case...)

I don't think he meant it as an insult. He meant that you are complaining uselessly with no real goal. On top of that, the features that you complain are lost weren't really lost more than became unavailable. You didn't lose it, you just don't have the choice to buy that feature anymore unless you go used.

The OtherOS on the other hand is a completely different matter and is "worth" complaining about

The 2 USB ports are enough for most people and saves a bit of $$ and the PS2 emulation is a business decision. both valid reasons, true or not.


And it isn't less features for the same $$. The price went down for practically every revision. the "forced consumer" thing you talk about is true for every console. An exclusive title is the same thing.

[Jack Doph]

Originally Posted by n-ster

I don't think he meant it as an insult. He meant that you are complaining uselessly with no real goal. On top of that, the features that you complain are lost weren't really lost more than became unavailable. You didn't lose it, you just don't have the choice to buy that feature anymore unless you go used.

The OtherOS on the other hand is a completely different matter and is "worth" complaining about

The 2 USB ports are enough for most people and saves a bit of $$ and the PS2 emulation is a business decision. both valid reasons, true or not.


And it isn't less features for the same $$. The price went down for practically every revision

I agree with a lot of what you say here, for sure.
But in my neck of the woods, the price change was negligible and mostly inherent due to the exchange rate, rather than actual console price reductions :/

[AphexDreamer]

Originally Posted by n-ster

I don't think he meant it as an insult. He meant that you are complaining uselessly with no real goal. On top of that, the features that you complain are lost weren't really lost more than became unavailable. You didn't lose it, you just don't have the choice to buy that feature anymore unless you go used.

The OtherOS on the other hand is a completely different matter and is "worth" complaining about

The 2 USB ports are enough for most people and saves a bit of $$ and the PS2 emulation is a business decision. both valid reasons, true or not.

Unavailable = lost to me. It doesn't for you?

My goal here isn't to complain about the loss of the USB ports or Backwards compatibility. It is merely to state that they are in fact losses no matter how you see it and to emphasize the retrogression of the Console from its former self. Now I'm sure Sony had valid excuses to remove certain features but the doesn't change the fact they removed them. Linux on the other hand was a completely unnecessary removal.

[n-ster]

Originally Posted by Jack Doph

I agree with a lot of what you say here, for sure.
But in my neck of the woods, the price change was negligible and mostly inherent due to the exchange rate, rather than actual console price reductions :/

50 or 100$ is alot of money! and I will point out PS3 still has the most features out of all the consoles

EDIT: ^ lost is something you had that you don't have anymore. sure you had the CHOICE of buying something or another, but you didn't HAVE that thing and lost it. You only lost a choice, NOT a feature

[Jack Doph]

Originally Posted by n-ster

50 or 100$ is alot of money! and I will point out PS3 still has the most features out of all the consoles

Quite true, if that were the case.
Where I am, the PS3 was $599, with 4 games and 1 controller shortly after release.
Now it costs $599, with 4 games, 1 controller and a 'free' HDMI cable.
Hardly a price reduction :/
Yes, I'm aware the HDD changed in size, but a 320GB now, costs less than the 80GB cost back then..

[AphexDreamer]

Originally Posted by n-ster

50 or 100$ is alot of money! and I will point out PS3 still has the most features out of all the consoles

EDIT: ^ lost is something you had that you don't have anymore. sure you had the CHOICE of buying something or another, but you didn't HAVE that thing and lost it. You only lost a choice, NOT a feature

A. We have no choice.

B. These are features, removed features.

C. Lost because if you lose something it is unavailable to you.

Now maybe not necessarily lost to me, but most defiantly lost to the Ps3. However, it could be said that if it is taken from the PS3 and I own a PS3 then it was in fact taken from me not directly but indirectly through time via Sony's decisions.

[n-ster]

Sorry, I meant you lost the CHOICE of having the feature and not the feature itself. It wasn't taken from YOUR PS3, therefore you did not lose it.

[AphexDreamer]

Originally Posted by n-ster

Sorry, I meant you lost the CHOICE of having the feature and not the feature itself. It wasn't taken from YOUR PS3, therefore you did not lose it.

But it was taken from the PS3 in general, correct? And I own a PS3 therefore I lost it, cause I could have had it but don't. And it was never a choice, it was only available one point in time and then not available later. At no point in time was I offered the Choice to get a PS3 with Features A or a PS3 with Features B. They either had the ps3 with Feature A or had the PS3 with Features B.

Am I not right with that reasoning?

[Jack Doph]

Originally Posted by AphexDreamer

But it was taken from the PS3 in general, correct? And I own a PS3 therefore I lost it, cause I could have had it but don't. And it was never a choice, it was only available one point in time and then not available later.

Am I not right with that reasoning?

I understand what you're saying here, but the issue lies with what's available if you were to purchase one right now, and that purchase doesn't included the older versions' features..
Compared to the original version(s), yes you lose out.
If you buy one now, those features were never there, thus no loss in features..

[n-ster]

Originally Posted by AphexDreamer

But it was taken from the PS3 in general, correct? And I own a PS3 therefore I lost it, cause I could have had it but don't. And it was never a choice, it was only available one point in time and then not available later. At no point in time was I offered the Choice to get a PS3 with Features A or a PS3 with Features B. They either had the ps3 with Feature A or had the PS3 with Features B.

Am I not right with that reasoning?

You lost the choice to have features A, you did not lose Feature A. Get what I'm saying ? Our argument is really pointless though lol

[AphexDreamer]

Originally Posted by Jack Doph

I understand what you're saying here, but the issue lies with what's available if you were to purchase one right now, and that purchase doesn't included the older versions' features..
Compared to the original version(s), yes you lose out.
If you buy one now, those features were never there, thus no loss in features..

But they were there. The PS3 did have those features thats why if I buy one now they aren't there cause they are gone. AKA lost.

Originally Posted by n-ster

You lost the choice to have features A, you did not lose Feature A. Get what I'm saying ? Our argument is really pointless though lol

I agree lol. Entirely pointless lol

But I lost the choice and the features. Cause I don't have either

[Easy Rhino]

Originally Posted by AphexDreamer

I'm not whining, I find that insulting. Is this what you resort to?

im just calling it as i see it.

I did in fact buy the stripped down version, cause thats all that is on the market today. I have no choice, no say, only 2 USB ports and no backwards compatibility.

so? you are acting like a child stamping his foot because he can't get his way. you bought the stripped down version. you chose to pay for something you knew had less features than the older version. you made that decision. now take responsibility for it.

And no, we have no one to blame but Sony for designing, redesigning, adding and taking away features at their will and their discretion.

And if you plan to tell me to go look on ebay if I want 4 USB ports so baddly then you sir fail to see my point and I will gladly stop here. (Just in case...)

you don't have a point. you are complaining. typical consumer who thinks he deserves everything he desires. obviously there are factors beyond your own little world that impacted sony's decision to offer a stripped down version of the original ps3. get over it. they didnt come into your house and remove usb slots or the card reader. you bought a product AS ADVERTISED and complain about it like you didn't know what you were buying. unfortunately you sound like the typical dumb consumer who is always out to blame someone else because they purchased something they now regret. very sad.

[AphexDreamer]

I could give a rats ass what Sony does. I regret nothing. I like my PS3 the way it is and I'm glad sony took out linux so I can now hack my ps3. I am one happy customer. Now that thats out of the way....

You still can't neglect the fact that the PS3 had So and So Features and now it doesn't. Meaning its lost those features because it is missing those features because it no longer has those features like it originally once did. And although sony didn't physically take away my USB ports they did take away my OtherOS Feature I had when I first bought my PS3.

That is all.

[Wile E]

Originally Posted by Easy Rhino

those are if you bought a slim. i own the original 80 gig model. the only feature i lost is otherOS.

DTS output for SACD over optical.

Originally Posted by LAN_deRf_HA

That argument would be fine if the old models were still produced, but they aren't.

Originally Posted by Jack Doph

I may, perhaps, be a little out of place here, but I do agree with AphexDreamer.
If you have a choice in the matter, then there's no argument.
But when a company offers you less for the same money, one starts to wonder about motives.

TBH, my own experiences with S**y aren't very good either, and that company has cost me a great deal of money on written promises they never intended to keep (back in the day when I was still a PC reseller).

I understand there's no-one forcing anyone to buy the current crop of PS3s, but you have no choice in what version you do purchase. It's called "forced consumer-purchase training".

Less features for the same money is just bad PR and, unfortunately, typical of S**y ever since the old "mr. S**y" (my apologies for forgetting his name) retired from the company.

It's true, again, no-one need buy the current version of the PS3, but when the option of certain games only comes out on the one platform, you are forced to purchase said platform with reduced features, or go without the intended pleasure/pass-time it's supposed to provide.

That is a cause for scrutiny in itself...

The stripped down models are also considerably cheaper. As the features were removed, the price went down. Fair trade.

If they aren't cheaper in your area, I somehow doubt it's Sony to blame. It's most likely the places selling them.

If you want the features of the older model, you still have the option of buying used, so yes, you still do have a choice. Sony is not wrong for releasing a stripped down model for a lesser price, they are only wrong for removing a feature from consoles already sold to a consumer that came with it originally.

[n-ster]

Originally Posted by AphexDreamer

I could give a rats ass what Sony does. I regret nothing. I like my PS3 the way it is and I'm glad sony took out linux so I can now hack my ps3. I am one happy customer. Now that thats out of the way....

You still can't neglect the fact that the PS3 had So and So Features and now it doesn't. Meaning its lost those features because it is missing those features because it no longer has those features like it originally once did. And although sony didn't physically take away my USB ports they did take away my OtherOS Feature I had when I first bought my PS3.

That is all.

We all agreed on the OtherOS.

The PS3 in general has different features than when it 1st came out, yes. Apart from OtherOS however, a SINGLE PS3 hasn't lost any features. While PS3s did cut a few MINOR features (again I'm excluding OtherOS) from it's newer revisions, they had valid reasons and they were accompanied by a substantial price-cut. They would have kept selling the original PS3 if it were more profitable for them, but it isn't.

You have to look at it like this:
There once was PS3 1.0 with ps2 hardware emu and SACD playback
then there was PS3 1.1 with ps2 software emu and SACD play and a 100$ less expensive
etc etc

It's like Lian-li's Lancool line-up
There was once the KX2 series (ie:K62), which looked good and had sturdy construction etc etc
then came the KX3 series (ie: K63), which looked horible and had so-so construction
Yes the Lian-li Lancools lost it's looks, but nothing was TAKEN from the K63, but the K62 had better features (ie: looks and quality)

[LAN_deRf_HA]

Originally Posted by Easy Rhino

huh? then you are simply complaining about something you cannot change. waste of time and immature.

That is a mind bogglingly moronic statement. A world where people don't complain simply because they can't personally change something is a world of ignorance. And your basic point doesn't even make sense. Who says it can't be changed? A large enough number of complaints would likely lead to a change. If you love your ps3 so much that you have to defend it in an unreasonable manner then fine, but don't go around name calling because of your illogical obsession.

[n-ster]

Originally Posted by LAN_deRf_HA

That is a mind bogglingly moronic statement. A world where people don't complain simply because they can't personally change something is a world of ignorance. And your basic point doesn't even make sense. Who says it can't be changed? A large enough number of complaints would likely lead to a change. If you love your ps3 so much that you have to defend it in an unreasonable manner then fine, but don't go around name calling because of your illogical obsession.

Complaining won't magically make 2 USB ports pop into your PS3

Also, if Sony would have put the original 60GB PS3 for sale at 699$, would anyone buy it? would they make any profit?

[AphexDreamer]

Originally Posted by n-ster

We all agreed on the OtherOS.

The PS3 in general has different features than when it 1st came out, yes. Apart from OtherOS however, a SINGLE PS3 hasn't lost any features. While PS3s did cut a few MINOR features (again I'm excluding OtherOS) from it's newer revisions, they had valid reasons and they were accompanied by a substantial price-cut. They would have kept selling the original PS3 if it were more profitable for them, but it isn't.

You have to look at it like this:
There once was PS3 1.0 with ps2 hardware emu and SACD playback
then there was PS3 1.1 with ps2 software emu and SACD play and a 100$ less expensive
etc etc

It's like Lian-li's Lancool line-up
There was once the KX2 series (ie:K62), which looked good and had sturdy construction etc etc
then came the KX3 series (ie: K63), which looked horible and had so-so construction
Yes the Lian-li Lancools lost it's looks, but nothing was TAKEN from the K63, but the K62 had better features (ie: looks and quality)

Yeah I understand, I think you mean without instead of with for the PS3 1.1.

Now I'm not trying to troll and respect and understand the logic behind those stating we did not lose those features (except for Linux of course). So even though I agree that I didn't directly lose those features on my PS3 (cause I got what I paid for) the PS3 as a whole over time did (This is another fact which can not be denied).

Now with that in mind

I kind of see it like this.
If a thief (Company) takes money (Features) away from your parents (Older PS3 Models) is it not like they are taking money away from you ( Modern PS3 you Own)?

Again I don't mean to be annoying so please don't be frustrated with my persistence.