C.A.R.S. race sim

[H82LUZ73]

Originally Posted by newconroer

There hasn't been a good NASCAR game (or Indycar for that matter) since the Papyrus days (before they got bought out by Sierra). That was also the end of the Microprose/Geoff Crammond years.

I installed Grand Prix II on a legacy machine the other day. Still amazes me how much more simulation and enjoyable it is in contrast to F1 2011 or rFactor with the F1 mod.

Somethings are just classic for a reason.


As for C.A.R.S. it's got two things going against it.

A) It's based of Shift.. so..yuck toilet..
B) The damn name makes me think I'm playing some Resident Evil with a driving mod.

LOL you need to read this..http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sierra_Entertainment.As for Papyrus they got bought out by Activision and Vivendi Games which ended the best Nascar/Indy car sim maker.

[Kwod]

Originally Posted by Hybrid_theory

a large amount of FFB updates. The feel of the wheel is much improved.

The feel of the wheel is terrible to me, but I much prefer the precision and superior FFB of sims, and I was hoping that this was going to be 80% sim, but to me it's largely an arcade driving model with light and fluffy FFB.

Try a Corvette C6R from GTR Evo, a Ferrari from FVA or any car in Game Stock Car and you should see/feel a significant difference.

I own or have owned every big name racing game over the last 6 yrs, and as of b144, this is garbage, yes the GFX are epic, but I got no joy from driving any of the cars.

[KingPing]

Originally Posted by Kwod

Before anyone says, "hang on, why not give it more time"....my answer is, "for what?".
All they had to do was eliminate the sway and work a bit on the excess oversteer from Shift2, and you'd at least have a very good simcade model, but as it stands, pcars is just plain bad.
The brakes suck, completely lifeless, and the driving model is all over the place depending on the car.

So, if you're a casual racer, you might well enjoy this, but I can't imagine any sim fan rating this, and as I said, they could've had the driving model ready by now simply by fixing the S2 problems and instead of building more bad cars, just build a slow one and a fast one with good FFB and driving model.

In the WDM forums they explain why all the problems with Shift 1 & 2 weren't solved. Apparently they were aware of the problems all of you mention but since the IP is owned by EA and EA is responsible for QA for S1 & S2, there was/is nothing the devs could do to fix the problems since it was a decision EA had to make and not the developer. Releasing patches for S1 & S2 would be illegal unless strictly requested by EA.
Since the IP (cars, tracks, coding, etc) belong to EA, i don't think it would be possible to use that and refine it, you have to build all from scratch. This applies to GT legends and GTR with were also developed by SMS (actually as Blimey Games, i think) but owned by the publisher.
I have played all pCARS builds so far and i like how it's turning out.

[Kwod]

Then u must prefer arcade over sim, however, the thread title and also my perception was that this was more of a sim, but that's simply not true.....it's quite arcadey/floaty and lacks the quality of FFB, steering precision and braking feel/precision of even the worst sim on the market.

I don't mind if you prefer arcade racers, but I don't think this should be deemed a sim unless a major upgrade to the driving model and FFB occurs, and given the nature of the builds, it seems obvious to me, that SMS has absolutely no intention of making this a sim.

In fact, the handful of cars in Shift2 that did drive ok slaughter this.

[KingPing]

I like Sims, i stopped playing GT5 because it was boring to drive, too easy, and the SP is extremely boring.

You are comparing a finished game to a game that has been in development for about 6 months. Cars in Shift 2 with out any mods handled really awful, if there is an arcade racing game that game is Shift.
I'm no expert in racing sims ( i also believe that there is nothing like the real thing ) i only have Race07 with expansions, GT1,2... 4,5 (not a sim, quite far actually) but i don't think pCARS is arcady.

[Kwod]

I'm not buying this "it's a WIP", not with this game as they basically had an acceptable driving model sans the obvious problems, yet in all this time, they not only can't get even one car to feel like a sim, they output one unfinished car after another, ie, quantity over quality.

r u using a wheel?......I'm using a G27 and if you goto GTR EVO and fire up Corvette C6R, and compare it to anything in pcars, you should be able to notice a radically different driving model and precision.

Anyway, my main contention is that this isn't a sim, and at best will be a simcade like F1 2011.

[Hybrid_theory]

I can agree that the gas needs some work. I've found on some cars that I've pushed down maybe 70% and the revs are maxed. The brakes I typically don't try variations, I tend to brake fairly hard or pump the brake to slow down. Ill try the Corvette in GTR Evo and get back to you on my thoughts.

I dont want to classify this as arcade. Arcade games to me are more like NFS MW, Carbon, Blur, etc. Where the steering is binary or very close to it, especially gas and brakes.

It's kinda on its way to gran turismo I would say. Not quite a sim but close.

[Hybrid_theory]

Alright so I tried the corvette in GTR Evo. I then took the asurago x4 (or whatever its called) in pCARS. I did find the asurago cornered fairly easily at the same speeds as the corvette. But I find that GTR Evo, the grip seems to be less than real. Ive always had trouble with cornering in that game. A racing sim that I've used the most would be LFS. Which I've never had such grip issues like I have in GTR.

So I think pCARS could make the steering a bit harder to pull off, but GTR Evo level is maybe too far.

[KingPing]

Yes i'm using a wheel, and yes i drove many time the corvette C6R in GTR EVO, and i don't know which is the ultimate racing sim, i'm not saying pCARS is it, i'm saying it's not arcady. I don't know how the real C6R handles, but i know a sim will not feel like the real one, it can be close but not the same. Witch sim is the more precise or realistic?, make your choice and play that one, because the same arguments you are using can be applied to GTR EVO by some one else if it is compared to rFactor or iRacing or whatever.

[Kwod]

Originally Posted by KingPing

Yes i'm using a wheel, and yes i drove many time the corvette C6R in GTR EVO, and i don't know which is the ultimate racing sim, i'm not saying pCARS is it, i'm saying it's not arcady. I don't know how the real C6R handles, but i know a sim will not feel like the real one, it can be close but not the same. Witch sim is the more precise or realistic?, make your choice and play that one, because the same arguments you are using can be applied to GTR EVO by some one else if it is compared to rFactor or iRacing or whatever.

Yeah but you're just talking in circles now, ie, if I can't render a judgement regarding realism*, neither can you.

*I also like including FFB and steering precision, and pcars doesn't compare to the worst sim by that criteria.

[Kwod]

Originally Posted by Hybrid_theory

So I think pCARS could make the steering a bit harder to pull off, but GTR Evo level is maybe too far.

Make sure you stay away from iracing and rf2, as both of those make Evo feel like it's got traction control on.

One of the reasons I like the C6R is because of it's range of car behaviour, and that it's fast, so you approach braking zones at 260-275kph, and then have to control 600hp on exit.....IOW, no-one can fluke a hotlap in that type of car, it's always going to be driving skill that allows you to be consistently fast.

[KingPing]

Just a little update to let you know that the members at WDM decided that the game should be released as a full retail game, boxed and Steam versions will be available, maybe other digital distribution services will also be available. The price should be 45 euros but it's still being discussed.
Also a new Member category will be introduced soon, it will fill the gap between Team member (25 euro) and Senior (90 euro) it will cost 45 euro, it will have all the perks of Team member (not 100% sure on this one though) but you will have access to the full game from day one (100% sure on this one), also more revenues compared to Team member.

All of this applies to the PC version. Console version (Ps3, Xbox 360, Wii U or whatever they end up calling it) content should end up being the same as PC, but no price decided yet.

If you have any questions feel free to ask or if you are interested in the project you can become a member for free just to access the forum a see (or read) the progress.

More info and screenshots here: http://www.wmdportal.com/

[Hybrid_theory]

Originally Posted by KingPing

Just a little update to let you know that the members at WDM decided that the game should be released as a full retail game, boxed and Steam versions will be available, maybe other digital distribution services will also be available. The price should be 45 euros but it's still being discussed.
Also a new Member category will be introduced soon, it will fill the gap between Team member (25 euro) and Senior (90 euro) it will cost 45 euro, it will have all the perks of Team member (not 100% sure on this one though) but you will have access to the full game from day one (100% sure on this one), also more revenues compared to Team member.

All of this applies to the PC version. Console version (Ps3, Xbox 360, Wii U or whatever they end up calling it) content should end up being the same as PC, but no price decided yet.

If you have any questions feel free to ask or if you are interested in the project you can become a member for free just to access the forum a see (or read) the progress.

More info and screenshots here: http://www.wmdportal.com/

Im thinking of becoming a team member (up from junior). They do lots of changes each week to the FFB and tracks and such, would like to try em out. Just sucks its 1.6Gb to download each time.

[KingPing]

Originally Posted by Hybrid_theory

Im thinking of becoming a team member (up from junior). They do lots of changes each week to the FFB and tracks and such, would like to try em out. Just sucks its 1.6Gb to download each time.

Yeah, the builds download are a bit annoying, but it's exiting to test them. For example the best builds so far were 135/6, 144 and 149 and they were all released one week after the other. FFB improved a lot, the handling with wheel and Xbox controller also.