CM Storm Trigger Mechanical Gaming Keyboard

[Frederik S]

To read this review go to: http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/CM_Storm/Trigger/

[Vancha]

I figured I'll mention it: Unlike the Costar-built Quickfire Rapids, Coolermaster seems to have downgraded the OEM to iOne for the Trigger and Quickfire Pro, so don't expect the same quality as the Rapid.

[eidairaman1]

how about n-key rollover

[Frederik S]

Originally Posted by eidairaman1

how about n-key rollover

It is limited to 6 keys as described in the review.

[BumbleBee]

the QuickFire Pro has Full NKRO over PS/2 and is only $99...this one is supposed to be the step up model? weird

[Hayder_Master]

this is great review and seems this will be my next keyboard, cuz never find cherry black switches with back light keyboard.

[..'Ant'..]

Originally Posted by Hayder_Master

this is great review and seems this will be my next keyboard, cuz never find cherry black switches with back light keyboard.

Agreed!

Might by my next keyboard also.

[Sp33d Junki3]

I'm waiting for the Cherry Brown Switches for this keyboard. The n-key rollover of 6 keys is fine, which is a limit for USB. Too bad there was no PS/2 connection, which has a higher n-key rollover.

Good thing, is that every key, even the macro is mech, not like the corsair K90, which you can feel the difference between the keys.

[Frederik S]

Updated to reflect new information about the macro capabilities of the keyboard.

[evulmunk33]

first a short introduction
i work for CM for a bit over a year and am involved in some CM Storm projects
so yes, i work for cmstorm and im biased i guess :P

Originally Posted by Vancha

I figured I'll mention it: Unlike the Costar-built Quickfire Rapids, Coolermaster seems to have downgraded the OEM to iOne for the Trigger and Quickfire Pro, so don't expect the same quality as the Rapid.

sorry, but i cant comment on what vendors we work with...

what i can tell you is, my personal opinion is that costar is over-rated, and their built quality and quality control is comparable to that of other vendors.

and i dont know why iOne has such a bad name... the qPad keyboards are a rebanded reference design from iOne... its not perfect, but its a pretty good keyboard if you ask me... check out the recent qpad reviews frederik did

asus ROG is rebranding that reference design too, and there are even more companies using that design... not to mention that razer, who is by far outselling any other mechanical keyboard vendor is making them at iONE as well...

Originally Posted by BumbleBee

the QuickFire Pro has Full NKRO over PS/2 and is only $99...this one is supposed to be the step up model? weird

i know... i know... :/
the thing is this... keyboard controllers with PS2 support are dieing out, they arent being made anymore and stock is drying up... no idea why not even a single vendor sees the demand and continues making one...

and all the newer, more powerful keyboard controllers with a powerful processor like the one we use in trigger, dont support PS2... cause the chip vendors think its old and nobody wants it anymore... there is a way to get more than 6 keys roll over on USB, but those are all hacks of the USB protocol, and the ones we looked into, didnt work that well...

one of them enabled 12KRO, but the side effect of that hack is that you have key ghosting... meaning, you press ADHK and suddenly windows thinks you pressed ADHKV
its not about the hardware keyboard matrix layout, its a software thing...

i havent tried the corsair full nkro over usb thing yet, but id be surprised if it doesnt have a side effect either...

i dont know about you guys, but im using my mouse with my right hand :P
so i only have one hand with 5 fingers on the keyboard... and pushing 5 keys at the same time is quite a challenge and has a high cramp risk factor

PLUS in reality, 6KRO means you can press and hold 6 standard keys at the same time, PLUS modifier keys like left shift, left control, left alt, right control, right shift and right alt...

shift and control are used in games, so you end up with 8KRO... for 5 fingers...

and when you hold down 8 keys, so they are active all at the same time, and then push a 9nth key on Trigger, what it does is release the first key you pushed... other keyboards just ignore the 9th key.

so yeah i think this NKRO stuff is way overhyped....
but still, its what customers want, so quickfire PRO does have full NKRO, and we will try to add it to future keyboards as well if it doesnt cause weird side effects.

Originally Posted by Frederik S

Updated to reflect new information about the macro capabilities of the keyboard.

awesome, thanks!!!


BTW, what do you guys think about the video guide explaining all of triggers features?
http://event.cmstorm.com/trigger/

too fast? any suggestions are welcome! and the same for keyboards and mice, we really appreciate all feedback!

[Sp33d Junki3]

Right now I'm waiting for the MX brown version to come to Canada, then I'll be happy.
In all, has everything I need in a keyboard, including the proper red backlit.

[Vancha]

Originally Posted by evulmunk33

first a short introduction
i work for CM for a bit over a year and am involved in some CM Storm projects
so yes, i work for cmstorm and im biased i guess :P

Hello.

Originally Posted by evulmunk33

*edit* sorry, but i cant comment on what vendors we work with...

what i can tell you is, my personal opinion is that costar is over-rated, and their built quality and quality control is comparable to that of other vendors. */edit*

and i dont know why iOne has such a bad name... the qPad keyboards are a rebanded reference design from iOne... its not perfect, but its a pretty good keyboard if you ask me... asus ROG is rebranding that reference design too, and there are even more companies using that design... not to mention that razer, who is by far outselling any other mechanical keyboard vendor is making them at iONE as well...

Well obviously most of us can't judge a company based on what it's like to work with them, but on the user-end Costar seems to be the preference, for those who are aware of the distinction.

You say it yourself, QPad, Armor, Asus, ROG etc. are all iOne already. The Pro and the Trigger are now just two more iOnes in a sea of iOnes. The fact that the Rapid was TKL and made by a different OEM set it apart, people felt they were buying an uglier Filco for a cheaper price and it gave people a reason to get it over the rest of "gaming" keyboards, but the Pro/Trigger are just like all the others. The distinction rests solely on the pretty lights and software.

Lets face it, the Blackwidow isn't selling because of unrivaled quality. They're the king of adolescent chic, they came in early and they had the cheapest, most accessible keyboard with pretty lights. Come to think of it, if we put aside the aesthetics, if I had to choose between a Cherry Blue Trigger and a BW Ultimate, what are the differences?

Razer, Thermaltake, Roccat, Mionix and others are all fighting to sell to people who like their keyboards to look like toys. I have to wonder how successful a company would be if they tried to go with something a little classier (I'd mention Corsair as an example of that, but they violated their mechanical keyboards by including rubber domes. I don't suppose you're aware of how well the K60s/K90s are selling?).

Originally Posted by evulmunk33

BTW, what do you guys think about the video guide explaining all of triggers features?
http://event.cmstorm.com/trigger/

too fast? any suggestions are welcome! and the same for keyboards and mice, we really appreciate all feedback!

It was slow enough for me to read it. I wonder if it wouldn't be better if the person making the videos had a CM Storm-esque background/windows theme, along with some music perhaps? It seems a little odd having such a DIY style considering the visual noisiness of the site.

[BumbleBee]

mechanical keyboards with a 87 layout that are available in so many markets is a good thing. if you send Costar a fruit basket maybe they will make the Rapid 2 with LED and include a wrist rest?

I tried..

at least bring back the Stacker case

[evulmunk33]

Originally Posted by Vancha

Hello.
Well obviously most of us can't judge a company based on what it's like to work with them, but on the user-end Costar seems to be the preference, for those who are aware of the distinction.

personally i dont see a difference between costar and ione keyboards, and there are a couple of keyboards people think are built by costar but they arent...

Originally Posted by Vancha

You say it yourself, QPad, Armor, Asus, ROG etc. are all iOne already. The Pro and the Trigger are now just two more iOnes in a sea of iOnes. The fact that the Rapid was TKL and made by a different OEM set it apart, people felt they were buying an uglier Filco for a cheaper price and it gave people a reason to get it over the rest of "gaming" keyboards, but the Pro/Trigger are just like all the others. The distinction rests solely on the pretty lights and software.

sorry, somebody complained, i cant comment on what vendor we work with :P

hmmm i dont agree...
just because two keyboards are made at the same vendor doesnt mean they are identical... foxconn makes apple laptops and dell laptops... and we all know theres a huge difference in feel and quality... same for keyboards.

Originally Posted by Vancha

Lets face it, the Blackwidow isn't selling because of unrivaled quality. They're the king of adolescent chic, they came in early and they had the cheapest, most accessible keyboard with pretty lights. Come to think of it, if we put aside the aesthetics, if I had to choose between a Cherry Blue Trigger and a BW Ultimate, what are the differences?

you sound like you know a lot about keyboards, so im surprised you ask this... i guess you havent tried a trigger yet... try it

we are 6KRO all over the keyboard, razers BW and BWU are only 2KRO(!) on some areas of the keyboard
its not a glossy fingerprint magnet
our LED backlight doesnt flicker
we have more LED brightnes settings
we have an extra LED mode (WASD+Macro keys+arrow keys)
our LED backlight is brighter at max, and more dim at min (more flxibility for bright rooms during the day and dark rooms when gaming at night)
our keycaps are more durable (we dont use rubber coating)
it doesnt have an inch thick cable stream coming out at the back
we use a 100% standard key layout, standard key size and spacing too
our font is easier to read
our USB hub is 2.0 not 1.1
we have 2 USB ports, not one
if you use power hungry USB devices you can add a standard 5VDC jack to boost the USB hub power and LED brightness settings
we use a different steel plate which reduces noise
we use an advanced MCU that can record macros on the fly (on other keyboards its the driver/App that actually records and plays back the macros which adds delay)
we can execute macros via hardware through the MCU, OR through the driver/app, depending on what you prefer
if you execute it via the driver/app like other keyboards many apps/games block macros or they dont work properly
we have 64kb of onboard storage to save profiles on the keyboard itself
macros and keyboard remaps are stored on the keyboard itself too
we can assign mouse functions to keyboard keys and macros (left click etc)
we have much more advanced macro visualization and management than anybody else out there, roccat, razer or corsair (macro studio)
and i think theres some more i cant think of right now

Originally Posted by Vancha

Razer, Thermaltake, Roccat, Mionix and others are all fighting to sell to people who like their keyboards to look like toys. I have to wonder how successful a company would be if they tried to go with something a little classier (I'd mention Corsair as an example of that, but they violated their mechanical keyboards by including rubber domes. I don't suppose you're aware of how well the K60s/K90s are selling?).

well, barely anybody talks about corsairs stuff, so i doubt its selling well... but yes, i like their design... i think everybody does...
i personally think it looks weird to have the key switches so exposed and stick out of the metal though, not to mention that its polished alu, so for the K90 it reflects the backlight and there is a lot of backlight bleeding between the keys, which i thought was blinding and terrible... and their mice have alu bent into random shapes just for design, which ends up causing sharp edges and i cut my finger on one of them lol... but i like the idea of using alu and a more classy design in general, yeah!

Originally Posted by Vancha

It was slow enough for me to read it. I wonder if it wouldn't be better if the person making the videos had a CM Storm-esque background/windows theme, along with some music perhaps? It seems a little odd having such a DIY style considering the visual noisiness of the site.

yeah... totally agree... well this is our first attempt at this, i think for a first try this is pretty good... much better than a written manual, right?
thx for the feedback!

[evulmunk33]

Originally Posted by BumbleBee

mechanical keyboards with a 87 layout that are available in so many markets is a good thing. if you send Costar a fruit basket maybe they will make the Rapid 2 with LED and include a wrist rest?

I tried..

at least bring back the Stacker case

OMG, bumble bee talked to me!
im a huge fan! i loved your performance in the second movie!
you shouldve gotten a lot more screen time in the third one... oh well michael bay, what are you gonna do...

well, its not my call... but yeah, the QFR is really popular and i hope we continue on that success
and i hope people realize how nice our other keyboards and mice and headsets are.
im proud of our keyboards especially, we entered the market and were welcomed warmly right from the start... people noticed that we offer great price performance and are very open to feedback... things can only get better from here on!

[Vancha]

Originally Posted by evulmunk33

personally i dont see a difference between costar and ione keyboards, and there are a couple of keyboards people think are built by costar but they arent...

I believe it's the stabilizers used. People seem to prefer the feel of the Costar style.

Originally Posted by evulmunk33

hmmm i dont agree...
just because two keyboards are made at the same vendor doesnt mean they are identical... foxconn makes apple laptops and dell laptops... and we all know theres a huge difference in feel and quality... same for keyboards.

I agree merely being made by the same vendor doesn't mean they're identical, but if everyone's taking the same OEM product and just adding their own flavour?

Originally Posted by evulmunk33

you sound like you know a lot about keyboards, so im surprised you ask this... i guess you havent tried a trigger yet... try it

we are 6KRO all over the keyboard, razers BW and BWU are only 2KRO(!) on some areas of the keyboard
its not a glossy fingerprint magnet
our LED backlight doesnt flicker
we have more LED brightnes settings
we have an extra LED mode (WASD+Macro keys+arrow keys)
our LED backlight is brighter at max, and more dim at min (more flxibility for bright rooms during the day and dark rooms when gaming at night)
our keycaps are more durable (we dont use rubber coating)
it doesnt have an inch thick cable stream coming out at the back
we use a 100% standard key layout, standard key size and spacing too
our font is easier to read
our USB hub is 2.0 not 1.1
we have 2 USB ports, not one
if you use power hungry USB devices you can add a standard 5VDC jack to boost the USB hub power and LED brightness settings
we use a different steel plate which reduces noise
we use an advanced MCU that can record macros on the fly (on other keyboards its the driver/App that actually records and plays back the macros which adds delay)
we can execute macros via hardware through the MCU, OR through the driver/app, depending on what you prefer
if you execute it via the driver/app like other keyboards many apps/games block macros or they dont work properly
we have 64kb of onboard storage to save profiles on the keyboard itself
macros and keyboard remaps are stored on the keyboard itself too
we can assign mouse functions to keyboard keys and macros (left click etc)
we have much more advanced macro visualization and management than anybody else out there, roccat, razer or corsair (macro studio)
and i think theres some more i cant think of right now

So I greyed out the aesthetic and software differences, since I acknowledged they were the only distinctions in the "sea of iOnes", my point was about what separated the keyboards apart from that.

As for what's left, the standard key layout and improved 6KRO is appreciated, as is the "different steel plate" if it does what you say it does, but I'm not sure many people would consider the Trigger's cabling solution preferable and I'm also not sure how lacking a rubber coating makes a key "more durable" (though I certainly couldn't care less about it's existence). The USB hub is nice for some people too I guess. I'm really not aware of how many people actually utilize such a thing once they have it.

Originally Posted by evulmunk33

well, barely anybody talks about corsairs stuff, so i doubt its selling well... but yes, i like their design... i think everybody does...
i personally think it looks weird to have the key switches so exposed and stick out of the metal though, not to mention that its polished alu, so for the K90 it reflects the backlight and there is a lot of backlight bleeding between the keys, which i thought was blinding and terrible... and their mice have alu bent into random shapes just for design, which ends up causing sharp edges and i cut my finger on one of them lol... but i like the idea of using alu and a more classy design in general, yeah!

Yeah, I didn't mean people should copy their designs, just that they're an example of someone making slightly more dignified products. Hopefully they don't bastardize their next offering mechanically.

[Bane2087]

Just got the UK version of this keyboard and I thought I'd share some of my impressions. I previously tried the Corsair K90 which I did not like due to being non-mechanical on half the keys and the cherry reds are far too soft for me.

First impressions of the Trigger are it's pretty great. Feels like a tank and it does move about on my desk at all. Build quality is solid and all LEDs work fine unlike the Corsair which has a common problem with dead LEDs apparently - my right alt LED was dead on arrival in the K90. Initially the windows key was replaced by a function key however you can easily change this in the CM Storm software which allows 5 completely different keyboard setups alongside the default which is always available. The software is not the easiest to use however once you figure it out it's pretty powerful and allows you to remap almost any key - number keys and F keys were not remappable.

I love the key action of the black switches on this keyboard, it feels nicer than the Corsair to me and definitely is quieter in use (although not as quiet as a membrane keyboard obviously). I bottom out less and less hard due to the increased resistance of the blacks. I think I would recommend black switches to anyone coming from a rubber dome. Typing I immediately noticed an increase in accuracy and responsiveness over my old Logitech G110 and typing feels much nicer. The Trigger is also slightly smaller than the G110 in width giving me some extra horizontal desk space, though the wrist wrest makes it a bit larger in depth. I've yet to put this board through any real gaming testing I may post again when I have but I cannot see myself having any problems at all.

So far the only downer I've noticed is the backlighting does not cover the bottom of the key very well. This seems a standard problem on backlit mechanical keyboards as the leds slot in above the switch and cannot fully light the key. The backlighting is bright however and I only need to keep it on it's dimmest setting to see the regular lettering very clearly. There were no extra keycaps or a cap remover included with this version (not sure about the US or other versions).

There is no dedicated media keys but the software allows you to remap anything as a media key so no big problem there. I could not find a way to bind the macro keys to media functions sadly as they can only run macros, and I could not find a way to put a [volume up] for example into the macro - maybe this could be added in a future software/firmware update?

Overall CM have done a great job on this KB, feels solid as a rock. It's not the prettiest keyboard out there but it it's all about solid build quality and being functional. For the £100 price point in the UK I doubt you can find a better made backlit keyboard than this.

My first post here but hope this is helpful to anyone considering this board!

[evulmunk33]

Originally Posted by Vancha

I believe it's the stabilizers used. People seem to prefer the feel of the Costar style.

mhhh well every vendor offers to fine tune those, its just a matter of how much time and money you want to spend on it... i agree that the default balancers from costar are better than the ones razer uses for example... though i have to say the feeling is the same and the only difference i see is that the balancers razer uses are really cheap and break easily... but i think they upgraded those since so many spacebar balancers broke?

but if you use cherry stabilizers, like us, it doesnt really matter what vendor makes the keyboard

Originally Posted by Vancha

I agree merely being made by the same vendor doesn't mean they're identical, but if everyone's taking the same OEM product and just adding their own flavour?

true... then again, theres good sides to it as well, it results in more competition pushing for lower prices, and it improved overall availability of these OEM designs worldwide

and theres still a lot you can do with a reference design...
different painting, rubber coating, different keycaps, different keycap material, backlight, partial backlight, different backlight color, different backlight modes, different function key shortcuts, windows keys or no windows keys, windows key lock or not, what kind of cable, what kind of keyboard feet, what key balancers... what switches... wrist rest or not...
and last but not least price...

so even a reference design CAN result in very different products based on the company that OEMs it... unfortunately most OEMs just slap their brand name on it and thats it... but im just saying, you CAN differentiate with a reference design as well and really turn it into something else...

besides, you got different support, warranty and quality control at each OEM as well!
and that makes a BIG difference as well... we got phone support, livechat support, email support and forum support and offer twice the warranty than others for example...


but i dont understand your "the sea of iOne keyboards" remark
dont you know how many costar keyboards there are? and many of the are all about the same too... i dont see a difference between ione and costar in this regard at all...
most oems are very uncreative when it comes to rebranding a product... its the same in every industry i think... and i dont see any relation between companies using one fab being more creative than others...

Originally Posted by Vancha

So I greyed out the aesthetic and software differences, since I acknowledged they were the only distinctions in the "sea of iOnes", my point was about what separated the keyboards apart from that.

why did you grey those points out? you make it sound like those points are all the same for keyboards from the same vendor...
and those points make or break the deal for many people...

Originally Posted by Vancha

As for what's left, the standard key layout and improved 6KRO is appreciated, as is the "different steel plate" if it does what you say it does, but I'm not sure many people would consider the Trigger's cabling solution preferable

so far we got mixed feedback about the cable, but most like it... we listened to the feedback and are are already revising this for future keyboards
btw, another point is that we use different stabilizers, razer used to have problems with those breaking a lot, especially spacebars, in the past... not sure if they changed it or not.

our stabilizers still allow ALL keycaps to be removed, to clean the keyboard...
with the standard metal bar stabilizers most keyboards use, you cant do this... those break easily when removing them, especially if you dont know how to, and its a lot of fiddling to put them back... on trigger you just pop them out and plug them back in.

Originally Posted by Vancha

and I'm also not sure how lacking a rubber coating makes a key "more durable" (though I certainly couldn't care less about it's existence).

the rubber wears off...
didnt you read frederiks qpad reviews?
qpad changed to a different coating as well since the rubber coating razer and others use wears off after a couple of weeks.
why is rubber coating being used? to make the keys feel more smooth and give them more grip... its hard to find the right coating for this... durable but good grip...

Originally Posted by Vancha

The USB hub is nice for some people too I guess. I'm really not aware of how many people actually utilize such a thing once they have it.

yeah, thats why we provided the dc power jack, but dont bundle the PSU, cause most people dont want to pay for this as they probably wont use the hub, or are ok with the shared USB power for the hub....

Originally Posted by Vancha

Yeah, I didn't mean people should copy their designs, just that they're an example of someone making slightly more dignified products. Hopefully they don't bastardize their next offering mechanically.

im pretty sure they wont after all the bad press they got for using rubber membrane keys on their "mechanical" keyboards.

i actually think having the numpad and the cluster over the arrow keys membrane is fine, i wouldnt care... if it helps make the keyboard more affordable...
what i didnt like is that they used membrane keys with tactile feedback, while they used red switched for the rest of the keys... so those keys feel completely different...
abnd they used membrane switches for keys i use frequently, macro keys and function keys...

but the worst for me, was how they reacted to the complaints and claimed they used membrane switches ON PURPOSE because their resistance and tactile feedback is perfect for those keys, and price didnt pay a role in their decision AT ALL... :P

sorry, sounds like i couldnt convince you to try trigger and see it as a nice product
but i really appreciate your feedback! thanks

[BumbleBee]

I think Vancha has it in for you

[Vancha]

Originally Posted by BumbleBee

I think Vancha has it in for you

Once I've started arguing, I find it hard to stop...Even if it's probably the best thing for me.

Originally Posted by evulmunk33

mhhh well every vendor offers to fine tune those, its just a matter of how much time and money you want to spend on it... i agree that the default balancers from costar are better than the ones razer uses for example... though i have to say the feeling is the same and the only difference i see is that the balancers razer uses are really cheap and break easily... but i think they upgraded those since so many spacebar balancers broke?

but if you use cherry stabilizers, like us, it doesnt really matter what vendor makes the keyboard

It's funny you say that, because I seem to remember someone saying the BW uses "costar-style" stabilizers, which'd explain why you don't feel much of a difference...but still, even if you don't, there's no denying people feel a difference between costar and cherry stabilizers.

Originally Posted by evulmunk33

true... then again, theres good sides to it as well, it results in more competition pushing for lower prices, and it improved overall availability of these OEM designs worldwide

That's a good side to a point, but you were the only one providing the "other" option...You were the only one providing it at a reasonable price and you were the only one providing it in the "gaming" market. I dare say most people who decide they want a mechanical gaming keyboard have never heard of Leopold, Topre and Filco etc.

Originally Posted by evulmunk33

and theres still a lot you can do with a reference design...
different painting, rubber coating, different keycaps, different keycap material, backlight, partial backlight, different backlight color, different backlight modes, different function key shortcuts, windows keys or no windows keys, windows key lock or not, what kind of cable, what kind of keyboard feet, what key balancers... what switches... wrist rest or not...
and last but not least price...

so even a reference design CAN result in very different products based on the company that OEMs it... unfortunately most OEMs just slap their brand name on it and thats it... but im just saying, you CAN differentiate with a reference design as well and really turn it into something else...

besides, you got different support, warranty and quality control at each OEM as well!
and that makes a BIG difference as well... we got phone support, livechat support, email support and forum support and offer twice the warranty than others for example...

Again, the differences are mainly aesthetics. Okay sure, if the Trigger had dye-sublimated or double-shot keycaps it'd be somewhat impressive, but does it?

And for the rest, they could be different, but most of them either aren't, or aren't notably different.

Originally Posted by evulmunk33

but i dont understand your "the sea of iOne keyboards" remark
dont you know how many costar keyboards there are? and many of the are all about the same too... i dont see a difference between ione and costar in this regard at all...
most oems are very uncreative when it comes to rebranding a product... its the same in every industry i think... and i dont see any relation between companies using one fab being more creative than others...

Apparently I don't. I think Filco, Das and the Steelseries 6G/7G are? I'm unaware of any others and only Steelseries is really "known" in the gaming perhipherals market. Das has some presence, but nowhere near as much.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not only criticizing CM. I think there's a startling lack of creativity from most companies in the market. The fact that most companies seem to be trying to copy Razer with their own cheesy gaming logos, styling and naming only seems to confirm that (Thermaltake are especially terrible with this).

Originally Posted by evulmunk33

why did you grey those points out? you make it sound like those points are all the same for keyboards from the same vendor...
and those points make or break the deal for many people...

Because, as I had already acknowledged...

"...The fact that the Rapid was TKL and made by a different OEM set it apart, people felt they were buying an uglier Filco for a cheaper price and it gave people a reason to get it over the rest of "gaming" keyboards, but the Pro/Trigger are just like all the others. The distinction rests solely on the pretty lights and software."

They're frills. They have nothing to do with how the keyboard feels or how enjoyable it is to type on. Sure, maybe they take priority for people who don't know any better, but then they'd buy it whether it were mechanical, rubber dome or scissor switch. If you want to sell to those people, why bother with the expense of mechanical switches? You could sell them a rubber dome version at a third of the price and they'd be just as hap-...oh, right, you couldn't charge as much.

Originally Posted by evulmunk33

the rubber wears off...
didnt you read frederiks qpad reviews?
qpad changed to a different coating as well since the rubber coating razer and others use wears off after a couple of weeks.

My mistake, I thought you meant the trigger didn't have any coating, not that it had a different one.

Between you and the TPU review, that's three comparison to the QPad I've seen now. Hmm...

Originally Posted by evulmunk33

but the worst for me, was how they reacted to the complaints and claimed they used membrane switches ON PURPOSE because their resistance and tactile feedback is perfect for those keys, and price didnt pay a role in their decision AT ALL... :P

sorry, sounds like i couldnt convince you to try trigger and see it as a nice product
but i really appreciate your feedback! thanks

Not just that, one of their reps had a mini-tantrum, replying to the rubber-dome criticism with something along the lines of..."We had people asking for TKL, non-TKL, Red/Black/Blue/Brown/Green/Clear/White switches, backlit, non-backlit, macros, no macros, made with black plastic, made with white plastic, made with clear plastic, made with metal, we can't please everyone."

I felt like asking, "and who asked for rubber domes?", but the thread was long dead once I came across it.

Alas, I don't think I'll be getting a Trigger, but as I said in my PM, if I could buy a Rapid with reds and an ISO layout in the UK, I would, along with many others.

Edit: And yes, I realized you were trying to wrap it up at the end of your last post, no more long replies from me after this.

[evulmunk33]

Originally Posted by Bane2087

Just got the UK version of this keyboard and I thought I'd share some of my impressions. I previously tried the Corsair K90 which I did not like due to being non-mechanical on half the keys and the cherry reds are far too soft for me.

First impressions of the Trigger are it's pretty great. Feels like a tank and it does move about on my desk at all.

cheers m8
glad you like it

Originally Posted by Bane2087

Build quality is solid and all LEDs work fine unlike the Corsair which has a common problem with dead LEDs apparently - my right alt LED was dead on arrival in the K90.

mhhh i would have expected better qc from corsair, thats odd... maybe it was a refurbished kb from the shop? many shops put returned products straight back into their warehouse without checking it, and only check it or send it back to the manufacturer after 2 or 3 rmas. i know that newegg in the us used to do this, and i think still does it actually

Originally Posted by Bane2087

Initially the windows key was replaced by a function key however you can easily change this in the CM Storm software which allows 5 completely different keyboard setups alongside the default which is always available. The software is not the easiest to use however once you figure it out it's pretty powerful and allows you to remap almost any key - number keys and F keys were not remappable.

yeah, those are hard mapped to let you switch keyboard profiles and use multimedia functions.
i think we shouldnt have hard coded the multimedia functions to the F keys, cause we allow users to assign multimedia commands to almost ANY key, so... users can assign them however they want, and this would give everybody more freedom to assign something else to F keys... and the profile switching...

you said the AP is hard to figure out in the beginning, if you got the time, id really appreciate if you could send me a pm or email with more details, then i can forward it and we can make future apps more user friendly and intuitive...

Originally Posted by Bane2087

I love the key action of the black switches on this keyboard, it feels nicer than the Corsair to me and definitely is quieter in use (although not as quiet as a membrane keyboard obviously).

tuning the sound was REALLY hard man... glad you like it
we went through so many prototypes to tune the sound... and its so hard to figure out where sounds come from and how you can change them... great to hear it was worth the effort!

Originally Posted by Bane2087

I bottom out less and less hard due to the increased resistance of the blacks. I think I would recommend black switches to anyone coming from a rubber dome. Typing I immediately noticed an increase in accuracy and responsiveness over my old Logitech G110 and typing feels much nicer. The Trigger is also slightly smaller than the G110 in width giving me some extra horizontal desk space, though the wrist wrest makes it a bit larger in depth. I've yet to put this board through any real gaming testing I may post again when I have but I cannot see myself having any problems at all.

yeah please do! would be great to get more feedback
and have you tried brown switches?
i really like brown and clear switches, ergo clear are sooo nice...
but ive come to like red and black as well... it really depends on what you do... what kind of game you play or if youre typing mostly...
blues i never got used to and still cant stand...
and i dont know why so many people in the US like it...

Originally Posted by Bane2087

So far the only downer I've noticed is the backlighting does not cover the bottom of the key very well. This seems a standard problem on backlit mechanical keyboards as the leds slot in above the switch and cannot fully light the key. The backlighting is bright however and I only need to keep it on it's dimmest setting to see the regular lettering very clearly. There were no extra keycaps or a cap remover included with this version (not sure about the US or other versions).

oh, no cap remover?
let me check with the product manager
about the backlight, yeah... but we spent a lot of time adjusting the keycaps and LED types too, have you ever seen a razer BWU? the second row icons on their keys are invisible in the dark... ours arent lit that well, but you CAN see them... in a dark room with backlight at max they are very clear...
this was really important for our chinese version of the kb, cause on those keyboards you got 3 icons on most keys! and they are necessary when typing chinese, you have to be able to see them.

how do you like the backlight strength and spread? nice eh?
was quite tricky to tune the PCB to get the same brightness all over the keyboard, and not have it flicker at low levels like razer.
if you have a 5VDC power supply, plug it into the keyboard you get 2 additional brightness levels, its SOOO nice with max brightness... its such a nice strong deep red that the keys glow clearly even in our bright office... it looks great...

Originally Posted by Bane2087

There is no dedicated media keys but the software allows you to remap anything as a media key so no big problem there. I could not find a way to bind the macro keys to media functions sadly as they can only run macros, and I could not find a way to put a [volume up] for example into the macro - maybe this could be added in a future software/firmware update?

go to macro studio, create a new macro, then click on action and you get a drop down menu with special functions you can assign... but unfortunately multimedia functions arent included, yes... ill ask if we can add them!

Originally Posted by Bane2087

Overall CM have done a great job on this KB, feels solid as a rock. It's not the prettiest keyboard out there but it it's all about solid build quality and being functional. For the £100 price point in the UK I doubt you can find a better made backlit keyboard than this.

Originally Posted by Bane2087

My first post here but hope this is helpful to anyone considering this board!

well your feedback was very helpful to me, ill forward your feedback to our product manager, cheers again!

[evulmunk33]

Originally Posted by BumbleBee

I think Vancha has it in for you

haha, ah its all cool, no hard feelings on either side, we just disagree i think

Originally Posted by Vancha

Once I've started arguing, I find it hard to stop...Even if it's probably the best thing for me.

yeah i know... i feel the same
but hey, thats good, see it this way, you do this cause you really care and are convinced youre right and you got something important to contribute, right?
i just have to remember every now and then that something as THE truth doesnt exist and that there are many truths... and whats true for me might not be for others

Originally Posted by Vancha

It's funny you say that, because I seem to remember someone saying the BW uses "costar-style" stabilizers, which'd explain why you don't feel much of a difference...but still, even if you don't, there's no denying people feel a difference between costar and cherry stabilizers.

really? well they use thin metal balancer levers, but the way those are installed and secured to the keycap are different... the razer samples i played with used a brittle thin plastic that breaks easily, and i remember there being glue involved as well... while the costar ones used more flexible plastic and no glue.

now im confused though, you grouped keyboards according to the vendor that makes them, judging their quality based on whether they are costar or iOne made... now youre saying razer keyboards are made by iOne but have the "better costar-like balancers"?
so arent you dis-proving your own theory that the vendor that makes a keyboard defines how good it is? :P

this is exactly what i said, you can tell any vendor to use good parts... or you can tell them to use bad parts...

Originally Posted by Vancha

Again, the differences are mainly aesthetics. Okay sure, if the Trigger had dye-sublimated or double-shot keycaps it'd be somewhat impressive, but does it?

And for the rest, they could be different, but most of them either aren't, or aren't notably different.

i totally agree, but thats something id hold against the companies rebranding those reference designs without fine tuning them, not the vendor making them, dont you agree?

the rapid is BASED on a reference design, but we customized:
painting
rubber coating
keycaps
function key shortcuts
windows keys
windows key lock
cable
keyboard feet
key balancers
switches.
and last but not least price

most others out there change nothing and just put their name on it... but that doesnt mean reference designs are bad... i think for an average user the existance of reference designs are great! its much cheaper and faster to launch a product based on a reference design, so you can sell it at a lower price point... and it allows several vendors to create different products for niche customers that otherwise could never be made, because the investment for a custom design just wouldnt be worth it for the niche market one customized reference design can serve.
you dont agree with this?

i mean yeah if there would only be reference designs and nothing else that would be terrible... but im glad that there ARE some, and actually wished thered be more...

Originally Posted by Vancha

Apparently I don't. I think Filco, Das and the Steelseries 6G/7G are? I'm unaware of any others and only Steelseries is really "known" in the gaming perhipherals market. Das has some presence, but nowhere near as much.

i dont want to say this publically, cause i dont want to get another complaint
ill shoot you a pm...

Originally Posted by Vancha

Don't get me wrong, I'm not only criticizing CM. I think there's a startling lack of creativity from most companies in the market. The fact that most companies seem to be trying to copy Razer with their own cheesy gaming logos, styling and naming only seems to confirm that (Thermaltake are especially terrible with this).

yeah... people dont like the trigger style much, but at least we did something different, its not a copy of the BW, its not a copy of the G11 or G110, its not a copy of the sidewinder, its not a copy of the zeleritas etc...

Originally Posted by Vancha

Because, as I had already acknowledged...

"...The fact that the Rapid was TKL and made by a different OEM set it apart, people felt they were buying an uglier Filco for a cheaper price and it gave people a reason to get it over the rest of "gaming" keyboards, but the Pro/Trigger are just like all the others. The distinction rests solely on the pretty lights and software."

ahhh i see what youre saying... but come on, you really think most people even know who costar and ione are?
i really dont think it matters to them where we make our keyboard, as long as the price and the quality are where they want them to be...

Originally Posted by Vancha

They're frills. They have nothing to do with how the keyboard feels or how enjoyable it is to type on. Sure, maybe they take priority for people who don't know any better, but then they'd buy it whether it were mechanical, rubber dome or scissor switch. If you want to sell to those people, why bother with the expense of mechanical switches? You could sell them a rubber dome version at a third of the price and they'd be just as hap-...oh, right, you couldn't charge as much.

uhhhh you DO know that margins on rubber dome keyboards are MUCH higher than mechanical switch keyboards, right? you make it sound like we use mechanical switches because we can make more money this way... which is not true at all...

you say what matters is how it feels to type on a keyboard, i totally agree...
actually we agree on most points, the only main thing we seem to disagree on is that the words written on the wall of the factory its assembled at magically change this.
apple products are made by 3 different vendors, not only foxconn... most people dont even know this, you cant see feel or smell a difference... because with proper quality control, it doesnt matter where you manufacture a product...

Originally Posted by Vancha

Between you and the TPU review, that's three comparison to the QPad I've seen now. Hmm...

dont get what you mean...

Originally Posted by Vancha

Not just that, one of their reps had a mini-tantrum, replying to the rubber-dome criticism with something along the lines of..."We had people asking for TKL, non-TKL, Red/Black/Blue/Brown/Green/Clear/White switches, backlit, non-backlit, macros, no macros, made with black plastic, made with white plastic, made with clear plastic, made with metal, we can't please everyone."

I felt like asking, "and who asked for rubber domes?", but the thread was long dead once I came across it.

hahah, damn i missed that one...
yeah corsairs peripheral pm/fae really didnt handle the situation very well... and got way too emotional... i can understand him, if you work on a project for months, it really IS like having a baby LOL
and you are proud of it and want it to be great... and you want to defend it against people ranting and ranting online, which... well is the nature of the internet
but at some point you have to take it serious and remember "the customer is always right"

Originally Posted by Vancha

Alas, I don't think I'll be getting a Trigger, but as I said in my PM, if I could buy a Rapid with reds and an ISO layout in the UK, I would, along with many others.

Edit: And yes, I realized you were trying to wrap it up at the end of your last post, no more long replies from me after this.

whoohooo! i think everybody browsing through this thread will be relieved hahah... maybe we shouldve taken this to PMs right from the start :P

i think we scared other people away who might have posted if there wouldnt be massive posts like this

[Vancha]

Originally Posted by evulmunk33

uhhhh you DO know that margins on rubber dome keyboards are MUCH higher than mechanical switch keyboards, right? you make it sound like we use mechanical switches because we can make more money this way... which is not true at all...

Hehe, my bad. I was just being cheeky, I honestly had no idea either way.

So then the question remains, wouldn't CM profit from selling rubber-dome versions to the uninitiated, who care only for the macros and LEDs?

Originally Posted by evulmunk33

whoohooo! i think everybody browsing through this thread will be relieved hahah... maybe we shouldve taken this to PMs right from the start :P

i think we scared other people away who might have posted if there wouldnt be massive posts like this

Yeah, I tend to do that on other forums too, I need to try and not do that here.

I think this might be appreciated in the long-run though. There's a lot of details about the Pro and Trigger here which should satiate the curiosity of a certain crowd.

[evulmunk33]

Originally Posted by Vancha

Hehe, my bad. I was just being cheeky, I honestly had no idea either way.

no hard feelings
why do you think logitech and roccat dont have a mechanical keyboard?
razer does both, but they make 2-3x as much money with each rubber dome keyboard they sell than with their mechanical keyboards... its actually cool that they push mechanical... even though they make less money that way... but they know its better and it helps their brand name in the long run if they push quality over profits.

actually thats a good thing about cm too, most people dont know but like razer, its a privately held company. we dont have shareholders that push us to make more money and milk our customers like other companies, we can focus on what we think is best for us and our customers in the long run and arent under pressure to make more money NEXT MONTH ASAP MORE MOAAARRRR

Originally Posted by Vancha

So then the question remains, wouldn't CM profit from selling rubber-dome versions to the uninitiated, who care only for the macros and LEDs?

yes, i personally think a rubber dome keyboard would make perfect sense, because many people dont know or care about mechanical switches, or simply dont think its worth it... with a rubber dome keyboard you can enter a price segment you just cant service with mechanical switches.

Originally Posted by Vancha

Yeah, I tend to do that on other forums too, I need to try and not do that here.

I think this might be appreciated in the long-run though. There's a lot of details about the Pro and Trigger here which should satiate the curiosity of a certain crowd.

true... after reading this topic i dont think people will have many questions about the keyboard left ^^

[Neo Cyrus]

I was searching online for an answer of whether or not the Storm Trigger has true 6 KRO (rather than just on certain spots) and I ran into this thread. Nice to finally have an answer. I have a story for you.

Edit: I read it through now, written down things don't always come out as intended. The post sounds almost angry/hostile which is not my intention. I'm just disappointed and wanted to give some feedback.

I originally wanted:
1 - Brown switches
2 - Full NKRO
3 - Rubber(ish) keys or coating
4 - Blue back lighting
5 - Full sized keyboard with a standard layout (no mini sized backspace key, delete stuck up the arrow key or anything stupid like that)

The closest I found at the time (available here) was the Rapidfire Pro. I looked up reviews and it looked promising. I bought one, it felt well enough and the claimed NKRO was working for all 10 fingers which is great, almost nothing would require more than 8 keys at once.

But then I popped up the feet to stand it and it was uneven, I was blown away that Cooler Master would lack such basic quality checking. I checked the feet to make sure I wasn't doing something wrong or if it could be somehow fixed. I put it on different flat surfaces (various tables and desks, etc) to confirm it is on a perfectly even surface... and the keyboard was indeed off by 2mm making it wobble whenever any key near backspace was hit.

I put it in the box and in the trunk of the car this morning and later at night I took it to the store to return it. I decided I would check for a different (better?) model while I'm there since I need to return it anyway.

They open it up and it's perfectly straight, the only thing I can imagine is that the extreme heat (hot day) caused something in it to expand. The guy at the store says its construction is solid and that's not possible. Basically they said I'm lying and trying to weasel out of paying a restocking fee. Great.

I payed the restocking fee and at this point the people waiting for me were getting impatient so I was in a rush. I noticed they had the Storm Trigger in stock, the model up and I thought that's perfect, the same thing but with full backlighting, a hub and macro keys. I bought it without checking a review and raced away before those waiting for me exploded.

How foolish of me. Luckily I noticed it does not have the same features as the model below before I opened it. Let's keep things down to the basics... 6 KRO on a $130 keyboard? Really? The placement of the USB cord is absolutely absurd with nothing to prevent it from wobbling and eventually breaking. Not coming with the AC adapter is also a complete joke. Another problem is the software is needlessly large in size, almost half a GB installed. (Due using 24 bit bitmaps over PNGs? Why?) A lot of us use SSDs, we prefer not to use the space unless really necessary.

Then there are the minor things. What's the point of making the thing 18K gold plated only to change it to 14K for some? Why stop there, remove it entirely. Tests have shown it really doesn't make a real difference regardless of whether it's 10K silver or 18K gold.

Then there are the things which are purely opinion... Aesthetically I think it's hideous, but obviously I bought it because I wanted its basic features. All I wanted was NKRO, brown switches, rubberish keys and back lighting. That shouldn't be impossible to find.

If you want some honest suggestions:
1 - Don't include features that require something which you have not included (AC adapter), especially at this price point
2 - Don't miss basic features such as pressing multiple keys, for a keyboard over $100 that's severely disappointing
3 - Don't miss basic features such as the positioning of the cord, the design on the Trigger is completely unacceptable and is just asking to break
4 - 95% of people want blue lighting regardless of what the product is, you're alienating a large audience with the fire/red theme
5 - If you want to cut corners, cut the things which don't hurt the user, we won't be harmed by a lack of gold plating