6970 failing and MSI wants to...

[WhiteNoise]

give me $205 to replace it.


back story:

I started having issues with my MSI 6970 recently; blue artifacting and horizontal lines...seems to be a problem with MSI's cards according to their website. Thank god my XFX 6970 works good. MSI approved my RMA pretty damn quick too! So I sent it to them overnight and its been nearly two weeks. I received a reply last night:

We apologize for any inconvenience, but we are currently out of stock of suitable or comparable replacements for your unit(s). In this case we will need to provide you with a refund based on the market value of $205.8 Will you accept this refund?

Fuck me $205 won't come close to buying a replacement 6970. Unless I find someone selling a used one.

I called the guy up and of course he didn't answer his phone. I left him a voice mail requesting that they up the refund value as I can't buy a 6970 replacement for under $345 or to consider giving me a 7 series card even if it is not quite comparable or as powerful as a 6970. I'm willing to work with them on this but I don't know if 205 is really fair.

With tax and shipping I'd have to add another $170 to buy another 6970 which at this point and time might not be worth it. I might be better selling my XFX 6970 and putting all the money towards a 7 series card or nVidia card.

One thing is for sure though; I don't think I'd buy MSI again.

[radrok]

They should just give you a replacement based on performance, heck they should just give you a 7870 man.

Let us know how it unfolds, hope they will solve it elegantly.

[WhiteNoise]

Well they sent me another email and stated that if I want a full refund I have to send them my receipt and their RMA dept will make a decision on it.

Unfortunately I don't have a receipt for this. I have a bank transaction but it doesn't say anything other than the amount I paid.

I guess I'm SOL.

[manofthem]

If purchased online, can't you check your order history from wherever you got it and reprint the invoice? If from a store, then I see the frustration.

Here's a 6970 for sale on HardForum $200
http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?...highlight=6970

[cadaveca]

Bought from online retailer? they can email you a receipt. Actualyl, any store should have a copy they can get to you.


Bought used? WTF are you doing sending in for RMA?


Because you have Crossfire, the only acceptable option is another 6970, or full refund, IMHO. 7-series card won't be suitable to run Crossfire with 6-series!

[WhiteNoise]

Yeah from a store. Once I work this out with them and if they actually pay me I will look into my options. I might just sell my other 6970 and put all the money towards a single video card.

[cadaveca]

Keep me in mind if you sell.

[WhiteNoise]

Originally Posted by cadaveca

Because you have Crossfire, the only acceptable option is another 6970, or full refund, IMHO. 7-series card won't be suitable to run Crossfire with 6-series!

Jesus man do you think I'm retarded or something?
If they would give me a 7 series I would have sold my other 6970.

[T4C Fantasy]

Originally Posted by cadaveca

Bought from online retailer? they can email you a receipt. Actualyl, any store should have a copy they can get to you.


Bought used? WTF are you doing sending in for RMA?


Because you have Crossfire, the only acceptable option is another 6970, or full refund, IMHO. 7-series card won't be suitable to run Crossfire with 6-series!

it may not be suitable but is it possible? i currenly have soem crossfire bridges and on my mobo i have a 7 and 6 series card installed... both work on this mobo but what will happen if i use the crossfire bridge? (read pc specs)

[cadaveca]

Originally Posted by WhiteNoise

Jesus man do you think I'm retarded or something?
If they would give me a 7 series I would have sold my other 6970.

Nah, just saying that to me, those are the only options they should offer to you. $205 is just not enough. My comment has no reflection on your choice...merely on what they offered. I'd be right pissed at them right now in your shoes, jsut for not considering that it's aprt of a Crossfire pair. They should know full system config, and asked you about running Crossfire. XFX does this already, so I do expect the same from any OEM.

Originally Posted by T4C Fantasy

it may not be suitable but is it possible? i currenly have soem crossfire bridges and on my mobo i have a 7 and 6 series card installed... both work on this mobo but what will happen if i use the crossfire bridge? (read pc specs)

It's not possible. Differences in GPU core design prevent such.

[CJCerny]

There is some precendent for this kind of behavior. You auto insurer is not going to give you the money you paid for your new car if it is stolen. They are going to give you it's current value--the amount you would likely get if you sold it. There is not a lot of consistency to how a waranty does or does not have to work.

[T4C Fantasy]

Originally Posted by cadaveca

Nah, just saying that to me, those are the only options they should offer to you. $205 is just not enough. My comment has no reflection on your choice...merely on what they offered. I'd be right pissed at them right now in your shoes, jsut for not considering that it's aprt of a Crossfire pair. They should know full system config, and asked you about running Crossfire. XFX does this already, so I do expect the same from any OEM.



It's not possible. Differences in GPU core design prevent such.

so the pc wont turn on or???? the gpu shuts off? or will it work with the crossfire bridge on just not have it enabled

[cadaveca]

Originally Posted by CJCerny

There is some precendent for this kind of behavior. You auto insurer is not going to give you the money you paid for your new car if it is stolen. They are going to give you it's current value--the amount you would likely get if you sold it. There is not a lot of consistency to how a waranty does or does not have to work.

You are very right.

However, most OEM warranty policies state that they will repalce with equivalent product with similar PERFORMANCE.

He's using the card as half a pair, so the end performance is actually quite a bit faster than 6970 itself. Their faulty product ruined his perforamcne ,so it's up to them to fix it. Even an HD 7970 wouldn't give him back the perfoamance he had before the problems.


That may not be the policy, but it'd sure be nice if it was...

Originally Posted by T4C Fantasy

so the pc wont turn on or???? the gpu shuts off? or will it work with the crossfire bridge on just not have it enabled

PC will run fine, driver will not allow Crossfire to be enabled.

[FreedomEclipse]

I had a similar issue a long time ago with a 4870 from sapphire that didnt make it back from RMA.

I was offered a 5770 which wasnt acceptable as the faulty 4870 was originally part of a crossfire setup. so they offered to give me credit which was no where near enough to get me back to a similar setup. so I went out made a few calls sold my other 4870 to a friend within seconds and asked if the manager would allow me to put cash ontop of the credit for a better card which turned out to be a 5850.

Obviously the manager wouldnt have none of it until i explained that I had been running the cards in crossfire.

I fell a little short on the price of the 5850 but the manager said it was fine and let me have it anyway. I musta been at least £20 or more short of the asking price. so it was all good anyway.

but its different when you are dealing directly with the supplier and not the shop itself.

I would ask them if its possible to get money off a newer card directly from them. they will probably say no as they are the RMA department, but if they are nice about it they might direct you to someone who can help.

Logitech routinely do this and thats why they have such a huge amount of people using their products.

If your peripherals get old, contact them about a replacement and the will most likely give you money off a new one so long as you order directly from them.

Their website prices can be very over priced compared to other retailers though some times... Lick charging close to £300 for a Z5500 set back in the day when most retailers are selling for around £220.

[WhiteNoise]

The guy was unwilling to work with me without a receipt so I am stuck with the 205$ which is better than nothing but one things came out of this; I will never do business with MSI again. They lost a customer today.

When I bought this card I registered it with MSI. I eventually tossed the receipt. So my fault there but whatever. I'll take the $205 and put it towards another card.

[AsRock]

If a company said this to me

We apologize for any inconvenience, but we are currently out of stock of suitable or comparable replacements for your unit(s). In this case we will need to provide you with a refund based on the market value of $205.8 Will you accept this refund?

My response would be well get me one for that much then.

Other wise i would not except.

[lilhasselhoffer]

Originally Posted by CJCerny

There is some precendent for this kind of behavior. You auto insurer is not going to give you the money you paid for your new car if it is stolen. They are going to give you it's current value--the amount you would likely get if you sold it. There is not a lot of consistency to how a waranty does or does not have to work.

Yes, but much more of a NO!

An auto insurer takes monthly payments, and offers a service. Should your vehicle be damaged, they will cover some of the repair expenses. Auto insurance exists on top of a manufacturer's warranty or guarantee, and will not replace individual failing components.

A manufacturer's warranty, in the broadest sense, is a promise that under normal use the components will not fail. This is why an auto accident 3 days after purchasing a new vehicle is not covered by the warranty.


Now, lets consider what MSI is doing:
1) Our product failed, under normal use, within the warranty period.
2) This line of products has become obsolete, and we no longer have a stock.
3) We can either offer a repair, replacement, or refund for this product.
4) Replacement is not possible, because the consumer needs this exact model. Repairs may cost more than a quick refund. Because the card is older/used we can offer less money than would be needed to buy a new card.
5) We offer the raw cost of producing the card, making our losses zero while preventing the customer from complaining further.
6) As the customer can't prove what they paid, the customer accepts the refund because it is less of a problem than arguing it out.
7) Customer has no need to buy from us, but 3 years usually dulls the memory. We don't lose much business, and don't have to pay for a new card.


What I'd do in your position:
1) Notify the BBB about the breach of warranty. Very little will come of this, but you can always post about your experience at online retailers. Just make sure not to be a vehement jerk, so people might listen to you.
2) Refuse the refund, and demand repair service.
3) When repair service is denied, cite their legal responsibility to provide the required services. Check out Article 2 of Uniform Commercial Code (http://www.law.cornell.edu/ucc/ucc.table.html), and its variants in your state. A bit of legal bludgeoning is likely to get you a supervisor.
4) Explain to the supervisor where you are coming from. Tell them what steps you have taken, and ask them if they would like to defend themselves in small claims court.
5) If the supervisor still refuses, inform them that there will be action, and politely hang up.
6) File a claim in your local small claims court. Bring your warranty information, the e-mail trail (citing refunds were not sufficient, no repair was offered, and no replacement was possible), the pricing information for a replacement, and you shouldn't even have to defend yourself. Most of the time a lawyer is more expensive than the claim, and no representation will be sent. 20 minutes in court will win you a decision, and likely the full cost of the replacement.
7) Enjoy the fact that small claims court actually works, despite how bad the rest of the legal system is.

[fullinfusion]

Sorry to hear your issues and IMO MSI should just anti up a newer card for ya.

[WhiteNoise]

I'm all good. This is my second MSI 6970 so whatever. The first one that failed I bought used. The second one I bought new. I've learned that MSI aren't a trusted brand these days.

[n-ster]

You really should have kept the receipt, but cant they at least repair it or something? else demand for a higher value, lets say 250~275$, then sell your other 6970 and get a 670 or something

[GluteusMaximus]

I was considering buying a video card from MSI until I asked MSI to provide me with a copy of their warranty. That is when I found out that MSI does NOT have a written warranty. Check our their website or ask them for a copy and you'll see for yourself, there is NO WRITTEN WARRANTY.

As to the complaint brought by the OP of this thread...You DO have evidence that you paid for a product from MSI. Your bank record is enough to prove you made the purchase and that is enough to satisfy a court to obtain a judgment against MSI.

Personally, I got fed up with all the BS practices of hardware vendors and decided to take action against them at the first sign of trouble. I read THIS and followed that example.

Yesterday 6/1/2012 I won a lawsuit against Eastcom aka XFX because they refused to honor their warranty. I did it from my home (appearance by telephone) and loved every minute of it. Corsair tried to screw me on memory modules, I threatened to sue and got a full refund. T-Mobile tried to screw me on a phone purchase so I sent them an intent to sue letter and got a new replacement phone shipped next day air to me.

Quit playing games with those idiot tech support a-holes and start swinging your club at the company officers who will have to show up in court if you don't get the results you're after. Companies are not allowed to use lawyers in small claims cases so they have to send a representative (usually an officer of the company) to represent them. That is extremely costly to them and that individual typically knows nothing about your case or the law.

[n-ster]

hmmm, I may have to sue a few huge corps then xD

notably the bank HSBC, and especially Bell, if I can do it successfully once, I won't let myself get bullied anymore

[kiddagoat]

Where did you buy the card??? As long as it wasn't with cash, most stores should be able to look up your receipt and reprint it for you.

Microcenter and Best Buy both hold onto your transactions in their system. Microcenter even keeps track of cash transactions.

[H82LUZ73]

Originally Posted by GluteusMaximus

I was considering buying a video card from MSI until I asked MSI to provide me with a copy of their warranty. That is when I found out that MSI does NOT have a written warranty. Check our their website or ask them for a copy and you'll see for yourself, there is NO WRITTEN WARRANTY.

As to the complaint brought by the OP of this thread...You DO have evidence that you paid for a product from MSI. Your bank record is enough to prove you made the purchase and that is enough to satisfy a court to obtain a judgment against MSI.

Personally, I got fed up with all the BS practices of hardware vendors and decided to take action against them at the first sign of trouble. I read THIS and followed that example.

Yesterday 6/1/2012 I won a lawsuit against Eastcom aka XFX because they refused to honor their warranty. I did it from my home (appearance by telephone) and loved every minute of it. Corsair tried to screw me on memory modules, I threatened to sue and got a full refund. T-Mobile tried to screw me on a phone purchase so I sent them an intent to sue letter and got a new replacement phone shipped next day air to me.

Quit playing games with those idiot tech support a-holes and start swinging your club at the company officers who will have to show up in court if you don't get the results you're after. Companies are not allowed to use lawyers in small claims cases so they have to send a representative (usually an officer of the company) to represent them. That is extremely costly to them and that individual typically knows nothing about your case or the law.

I Love your style dude,I Had Palit try this with my 4870,

As for your 6970 ,next time stay away from MSI with anything,Go to a company that has a 3 year warranty and the stock to replace it.Christ 6970 cards were released in Dec 2010 i know this because i bought my first one the first week they were out,Bought my second one in Jan 2011,It is only June 2012 that is 2 1/2 years to MSI and for the other card manufactures like XFX,Sapphire....under a 3 year warranty from time of purchase.

[SonDa5]

I also think they should upgrade you to at least as HD7870 if they are not able to fix or give a replacement HD6970.

Court is a pain in the butt if you have to go that route then do it. Only go to court if there is no other way to get your warranty honored.