P4 OC question

[imperialreign]

just curious - I've read through some of the guides that are stickied, good information and all -

but, seeing as how I'm going to get into OC my P4 here soon (until I can afford a dual or quad core), what are the pitfalls of the P4 Prescotts?

I've heard some things here and there that these CPU's are fairly difficult to OC, or is that just n00b-i8h for "too lazy to deal with an Intel?"

[Kursah]

I have a P4 Prescott, it's a 630 model. 3.0, 2mb L2, 800 FSB, 775 pin. I put it in my Abit AS8-v (v-droop modded), and was able to hit 4.0, but damn was it hot as hell.

The OC potential is there if the cooling is good enough. It's now my G/F's system as I went C2D when the budget I had and prices out there were right. But I ran it at 3.6-3.7, and would still hit the lower 50's under load. I could get it to about 3.4 w/o increasing the vcore, which isn't too shabby I suppose. I have a Zalman 7700ALCu on it still, which does a pretty good job of keeping it cool.

One thing about Prescotts, they run HOT. And there's no easy way around cooling them, the higher you want to OC the better your cooling MUST be. I have heard that supposedly 478 Prescots run warmer than 775's, but I am not so sure about that.

Pretty easy to OC, just raise voltages and FSB speeds while keeping your memory divider and timings in check. Then next is temps, if those are okay, then stress and temps, if pass on both (55C is recommended highest load temp you should have).

I don't know who said OC-ing P4 Prescotts is hard, it's not, it's keeping the temps down that's hard and that's a fact. But do not set your goal high, they won't perform C2D feats of OC unless you keep them frozen or close to it.


So what is your OC goal with your chip? What are others getting out of theirs? What kind of cooling do you have? If stock, well, you may want to shoot low because as soon as you increase speed your temps will rise, as soon as you increase vcore, your temps will really start to climb, that goes for any CPU, but trust me, that stock cooler won't take it too well.

I hope this helps ya, and I hope you do not try to get high OC's from stock cooling, maybe you have some aftermarket cooling. And also remember your other components such as MB, PSU, RAM, MB Chipset, etc all play an important factor when overclocking, make sure you are prepared.

[imperialreign]

well, I've got an ASUS PW5-DH Deluxe mobo enroute, which will be my platform for now with this HT 524 (until I can afford a new proc) - I had to get away from this eMachines/Intel D101GGC board, because I have NO tweakability at all.

Anyhow, I'm picking up a Zalman 9700 this weekend. Honestly, the stock cooler on this board was quite capable - when it was still in my eMachines case. I had it where the CPU was reporting no higher than 37C under all-day-long 100% load of both the physical and logical cores; but, I agree, I wouldn't dare start OC with the stock cooler.

Right now, I'm wanting to try and beef the BUS speed a bit, 133 is really weak, IMO, and that weak BUS is straightjacketing my RAM at 266 when I know the mem that I bought is capable of higher. I'm looking to at least be able to bump the BUS to 200 and take it from there - I'm trying to rid the bottleneck on the GPU and mem for the most part.

[DrunkenMafia]

you should be able to run a 400fsb no probs man, that ram will run good at 400 or hopefully above...

Like kursah said though, the heat from these things is incredible... you 9700 should do the job just fine though, make sure you use some good thermal paste, not sure what the stuff that comes with the zalmans is any good.....

[mitsirfishi]

3.8-4ghz should be in your reach

[imperialreign]

well, nabbed a Zalman cooler today - had to go with the 9500, though. After actually seeing the massive size of the 9700, I know I wouldn't have space for it. I think you'd have to have a full tower for that beast!

some opinions, though - with raising the FSB to help clock up the RAM, would it be a worth it to get some coolers for the mem? I've heard mixed opinions in this regard - some have said that the cooling helps, others have said that it doesn't make a difference.

3.8-4ghz should be in your reach

through air cooling? I'd figure that high of a clock on a P4 would be starting to push the need for liquid, right?

[mitsirfishi]

yer should be able to do it on air cooling if i can cool a p4 550 at 4ghz on stock cooling then you should be able to cool it on air

[hat]

If your RAM has heatspreaders already on it should be fine

[imperialreign]

naw, the sticks don't - just your standard out-tha-box RAM, no performance sticks yet

[Kursah]

Originally Posted by mitsirfishi

yer should be able to do it on air cooling if i can cool a p4 550 at 4ghz on stock cooling then you should be able to cool it on air

Bet those temps were hi, and I bet that wasn't a 24/7 OC.

But 4ghz may be attainable if stability and temps are within specs.

[hat]

Originally Posted by imperialreign

naw, the sticks don't - just your standard out-tha-box RAM, no performance sticks yet

slap these on then
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16835119016

[Kursah]

Originally Posted by hat

slap these on then
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16835119016

Yeah I got a 1gb (512x2) kit of DDR 400 Mosel (for $62 back in 2006) that came with a set of those but black installed, I never took em off but my dad had a similar setup as mine but without the sinks, and that memory didn't OC worth a damn, my DDR at least in my intel setup would hit DDR 488 in comparison.

[mitsirfishi]

Originally Posted by Kursah

Bet those temps were hi, and I bet that wasn't a 24/7 OC.

But 4ghz may be attainable if stability and temps are within specs.

it was running day and night reaching 72c full loaded with orthis or when playing css or hl2

[Kursah]

72C is wayyy too hot! That'll kill a CPU in short notice, hopefully not damaging anything else in the process.

You shouldn't be pushing past 60C at max load, Orthos Small FFT's and Priority 9, and if you are pushing 70c in games, that just shows how crappy stock cooling is for OC-ing. Generally 55C should be max load temp goal when OC-ing, just to be on the safe side, hell some shoot for 50C. I go 55C, if I can't keep it below that, then I turn the OC down or get better cooling.

[imperialreign]

thanks for all the advice and 'heads-up' so far, y'all! Question; would it beneficial at all to throw a couple of fans on the N-bridge and S-bridge at all? I figure they don't get anywhere near CPU temps, but not sure on that . . .

You shouldn't be pushing past 60C at max load, Orthos Small FFT's and Priority 9, and if you are pushing 70c in games, that just shows how crappy stock cooling is for OC-ing. Generally 55C should be max load temp goal when OC-ing, just to be on the safe side, hell some shoot for 50C. I go 55C, if I can't keep it below that, then I turn the OC down or get better cooling.

<edit> just noticed that post - yeah, I'd agree no matter what the hardware. My conservative ass starts getting irked when temps start inching past 45C! I'm shooting nothing higher than 52C once I start OCing. 52 will be my cut-off . . .

[Kursah]

Well they both will OC when you OC your FSB, especially the NB. That controls your FSB, Memory, etc, and if you push the FSB too far it will need more voltage too, good cooling around it and good case airflow will make a difference in at least stability.

[imperialreign]

I kinda thought so, but wasn't entirelly sure on that. I'm thinking I might lap the NB and SB heatsinks and attach a 40mm fan to each, we'll see, though.

right now I've got case air flow at a premium, just rying to get all my ducks in order when the new mobo shows up on Tue (I was hoping it woulda been here on Fri, so I had something to play with over this 3 day holiday weekend!).

[Kursah]

Just attaching a fan will help greatly, your biggest concnern should be the NB heatsink and cooling it and the area around it. But a 40mm fan on each will do wonders, and may be all you need to do. It would be kind of a waste to lap those in my opinion as just adding some fresh interface stuff (AS5, MX-1, MX-2, etc) and a fan will make the difference you will need.

Tell me more about your case air-flow. I have a section about cooling in my guide that you may wanna take a quick read through. A lot of people think they have good cooling when in fact a nother fan or two were needed, or were set to direct airflow the wrong way creating a less than efficient cooling of the case ambient air and components inside the case. I'm sure you know the basics, but I just wanna make sure you're good to go when you decide to do this.

[imperialreign]

http://forums.techpowerup.com/showthread.php?t=38297

this is my current setup right now - all air cooled. I wasn't happy with the airflow of the stock fans, so I swapped those out for 2 120mm Evercools. Thermaltake slot cooler at the bottom most PCI slot (just to help keep air moving forward from the front of the case), and the Hiper PSU which seems to do a good job of moving some air also (120mm fan on the underside of the PSU, 80mm on the back). I did put an 80mm fan on the case panel pointed at the CPU, but after a couple of days removed it because (I think) it was disrupting airflow across the CPU cooler a little too much.

Under full 100% load of the proc, CPU and mobo temps don't climb any higher than 40C and ambient seems to top out at just under 60C.

I will say that I defi think there's room for improvement, mostly because last night I was bored, so I went ahead and installed the Zalman 9500 onto the CPU (even though it'll be swapped to the new mobo on Tue - new toy, I was impatient ), but after having the rig running constantly up to now, CPU temps don't appear any different than they were before - the stock cooler was effiecient, but I can't imagine it was THAT efficient. Seeing as how I don't care much about the fate of this P4 (it'll be swapped for a C2Dquad sometime in Dec when I can afford it), I might go ahead and lap the CPU. The zalman really doesn't need to be, it had a near-mirror finish out of the box.

I'm hoping with the new mobo that my X1950 will be moved down just a little bit; I think that long card tends to block some of the airflow up towards the CPU.

[Kursah]

Some people mod the Floppy/CD drive bays to make room for an upper intake fan that will direct more air towards the CPU cooler, I just have an open floppy slot and that made a 1-2c difference, and I run cool enough that I don't worry about it most of the time and leave my front door closed (Aspire X-Cruiser). Also, you could cut a hole in the to of your case for a 80/92mm fan for exhaust, that will create more of a suction for fresh air and keep upper case ambeint temps cooler. Aside from that it's a nice setup man!

What are you using for thermal interface between your 9500 and CPU?

[imperialreign]

as of right now, the interface is the zalman thermal compound that came with the cooler - I still have a touch left, but I thought it was a little too thick for my taste (very paste-like). When it gets swapped to the new mobo, I have some thermaltake AS5 to use instead.

I should prob just go ahead and get rid of the removable slot panels from the front of the case - the whole front trim panel is meshed for air flow . . . but, I've been looking at some way to mod the front of the case for the 2 60mm evercools I still have from my old case, but not sure how that's going to work out . . . I'm thinking I might tear down a couple of the old CDRs I have laying around to fabricate a dual-slot bracket that I can bolt the fans to

[newtekie1]

Prescotts can take a lot of heat, and I mean A LOT of heat. Keep it under 75C and you will be fine. 72C under load 24/7 is nothing to be worried about with netburst processors and I can confidently say they will run at that temperature for years without worries and I have run them for years that way.

If you are going to limit yourself to really low temperatures then don't expect high clock speeds on netburst processors. You will be lucky if the CNPS9500 can keep your 524 at 52C under load at stock speeds, forget about overclocking if that is your max.

If you are wanting to get your FSB up to 200 you will be running at 4.6GHz. It isn't going to happen on air, unless you manage to get lucky and can lower the multiplier. And it certainly isn't going to stay under 52C at that speeds, it probably won't even stay under 65C at that temperature.

I would shoot for a bus speed of about 175, that should remove the bus limitation on your CPU and RAM, and give you a decent 4GHz.

[Demos_sav]

Look at my system specs. I am running my 3060 prescott at 3825 24/7 and 4200 max on air. But these beasts generate a lot of heat. I can go over 65C at full load on 4200 but I don't want to burn it so I restart my pc.

[mitsirfishi]

Originally Posted by Kursah

72C is wayyy too hot! That'll kill a CPU in short notice, hopefully not damaging anything else in the process.

You shouldn't be pushing past 60C at max load, Orthos Small FFT's and Priority 9, and if you are pushing 70c in games, that just shows how crappy stock cooling is for OC-ing. Generally 55C should be max load temp goal when OC-ing, just to be on the safe side, hell some shoot for 50C. I go 55C, if I can't keep it below that, then I turn the OC down or get better cooling.

p4's ran naturally hot they can take the heat and it wasnt thermally throttling so it was fine, still runs fine today

[Kursah]

Well I suppose everyone has their own version of how things should be done. I just don't see running a CPU at 72C being a good idea on cooling, ambient temps or the life of a CPU. My P4 630 never went above 60C for more than a few minutes, I just won't allow it.

Trust me I know that P4's run hot, I've had a socket 423, a socket 478 and a socket 775. I just wouldn't let them run too hot, simple as that.