SATA cables: dooes the signal degrade/suffer from noise?

germs · Jun 1, 2008, 05:38 AM

Does length matter with SATA II cables? I'm about to buy some, and I cant pick what size to get. My case will be the TJ10 with 4 hard drives in it, and 1 SATA DVD drive (obviously needs a longer cable), but won't the hard drives perform better with shorter cables? Wouldn't this reduce noise (if I understand the term correctly)?

Also, should I buy from certain brands, or are they really all the same?

ktr · Jun 1, 2008, 05:42 AM

Not really. Sata is digital based, and all it does is ones and zeros (on and off). Even if the cable length increases (and signal weakens), as long as the ones and zeros still register, it makes no difference, for the data is still interpreted.

germs · Jun 1, 2008, 05:59 AM

And thus, brand means nothing as well?

ktr · Jun 1, 2008, 06:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by germs

And thus, brand means nothing as well?

Brand, as in brand (manufacture) of cable?

Black Hades · Jun 1, 2008, 06:04 AM

Technically speaking SATA cables can be as long as 180 centimeters without any problems.
The noise you speak about does not affect the signal as all sata cables are somewhat shielded (some better than others though

) If you really want the best high impedance insulation & cable length you go for this.
But I doubt you'll feel any transfer rate improvement regardless of length/insulation.

germs · Jun 1, 2008, 06:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ktr

Brand, as in brand (manufacture) of cable?

Yes, as in the company that makes it (OK Gear, ect).

I wish there was some way to see how shielded, ect the cables are on Newegg, but they don't have any ratings for those factors there.

Those Akasas would be a major obstruction to airflow in a midtower case, at 3 feet long.

smig · Jun 1, 2008, 06:18 AM

a good SATA cable, like any other cable will probably cause less problems in the future (loosen cables, bad contact...)

Black Hades · Jun 1, 2008, 06:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by germs

[...]Those Akasas would be a major obstruction to airflow in a midtower case, at 3 feet long.

they are available from 40 to 100 cm length, I thought you needed more hence the link. Srry

Edit: Even at 3 feet long it would be much easier to route and tie them down on the sides of the case, actualy improving airflow rather than having a 40cm cable dangle through the midtower case

germs · Jun 1, 2008, 06:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by smig

a good SATA cable, like any other cable will probably cause less problems in the future (loosen cables, bad contact...)

Exactly, but how can I know which ones are good?

EDIT: Also, I'm guessing it doesn't matter if I link 2 HDDs to 1 4 pin molex, correct? I see an odd number of 4 pin to 1 SATA connectors on Newegg, and that has made me wonder. I'm going to have 4 hard drives, so I probably won't have much choice either way, but it'd be nice to know, for educational purposes.

Mussels · Jun 1, 2008, 07:03 AM

2 hard drives off the one cable wont do anything bad, except double the chances of a loose plug! i find lots of the double adaptors are cheap quality, and come loose/cause problems a lot more than the ones on a PSU.

Sata is NOT shielded, but its very low voltage for signalling - 0.5v i think. Thats why SATA is less prone to interference, and can come longer.

Get as long as you want, but not too long - if they're too long you'll have to fold/bend them out of the way, and you risk breaking the wires inside them.

Hayder_Master · Jun 1, 2008, 07:04 AM

take a good sata cable and you have no problem , cuz sata cable made for solve problem of ide cable, just like the long

DaedalusHelios · Jun 1, 2008, 07:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by germs

Exactly, but how can I know which ones are good?

EDIT: Also, I'm guessing it doesn't matter if I link 2 HDDs to 1 4 pin molex, correct? I see an odd number of 4 pin to 1 SATA connectors on Newegg, and that has made me wonder. I'm going to have 4 hard drives, so I probably won't have much choice either way, but it'd be nice to know, for educational purposes.

Get them from www.monoprice.com because they come in all lengths and they are cheap when bought in bulk.

They are good quality cables and they pull from factories that supply motherboard manufacturers such as ASUS.

tkpenalty · Jun 1, 2008, 07:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mussels

2 hard drives off the one cable wont do anything bad, except double the chances of a loose plug! i find lots of the double adaptors are cheap quality, and come loose/cause problems a lot more than the ones on a PSU.

Sata is NOT shielded, but its very low voltage for signalling - 0.5v i think. Thats why SATA is less prone to interference, and can come longer.

Get as long as you want, but not too long - if they're too long you'll have to fold/bend them out of the way, and you risk breaking the wires inside them.

Um, Anything much longer than 1M is bound to have other problems, the wires can't be as long as you want! Copper isnt a perfect conductor!

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaedalusHelios

Get them from www.monoprice.com because they come in all lengths and they are cheap when bought in bulk.

They are good quality cables and they pull from factories that supply motherboard manufacturers such as ASUS.

Foxconn molex, etc, I don't really see much of a difference in quality.

germs · Jun 1, 2008, 08:11 AM

Thanks for the help and clarification guys.

DaedalusHelios · Jun 1, 2008, 08:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tkpenalty

Foxconn molex, etc, I don't really see much of a difference in quality.

Thats my point. Monoprice is the cheapest supplier.

Mussels · Jun 1, 2008, 08:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tkpenalty

Um, Anything much longer than 1M is bound to have other problems, the wires can't be as long as you want! Copper isnt a perfect conductor!

Foxconn molex, etc, I don't really see much of a difference in quality.

misinterpretation! as long as he wants... from the suppliers that sell them. i didnt mean as long as you can imaginary want!

he asked about lenghts, saying he can buy a few and was worried longer ones would have problems.

Black Hades · Jun 1, 2008, 08:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mussels

[...]
Sata is NOT shielded, but its very low voltage for signalling - 0.5v i think. Thats why SATA is less prone to interference, and can come longer.
[...]

Section through Sata cable
http://lib.store.yahoo.net/lib/fire-...a-cable-36.jpg

Also my 1.8m eSATA cable that i use with my external hdd is double shielded and as thick as a CRT's cable

True, sata uses 500 mV, less prone to have problems

Mussels · Jun 1, 2008, 08:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Black Hades

Section through Sata cable
http://lib.store.yahoo.net/lib/fire-...a-cable-36.jpg

Also my 1.8m eSATA cable that i use with my external hdd is double shielded and as thick as a CRT's cable

True, sata uses 500 mV, less prone to have problems

i've cut up regular sata cables that arent shielded, perhaps thats changed since then (these were very old cables, from my old Nforce 2 mobo)

E-sata is definately shielded - that link is for E-sata, not regular sata.

Black Hades · Jun 1, 2008, 09:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mussels

i've cut up regular sata cables that arent shielded, perhaps thats changed since then (these were very old cables, from my old Nforce 2 mobo)

E-sata is definately shielded - that link is for E-sata, not regular sata.

I've cut recently and by accident the plastic off a sata cable, it had that tin foil like layer, I presumed it's for shielding.. I dont know for sure, anyway I dont think it helps a lot unless you go over 100 cm, hence some internal sata cables (old,new?) have none.
On wikipedia it doesnt say if sata is shielded or not, that metalic layer may have another purpouse, I dont know.

Mussels · Jun 1, 2008, 09:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Black Hades

I've cut recently and by accident the plastic off a sata cable, it had that tin foil like layer, I presumed it's for shielding.. I dont know for sure, anyway I dont think it helps a lot unless you go over 100 cm, hence some internal sata cables (old,new?) have none.
On wikipedia it doesnt say if sata is shielded or not, that metalic layer may have another purpouse, I dont know.

the ones i cut up were SATA 1, not sata 2 - i have no idea if they are shielded, i assume its optional. Part of the design for sata was to use 500mv power (0.5v) so that interference was less of an issue, less voltage means less interference, meaning less shielding would be needed.

Its off topic tho, the OP merely wanted to know if length was a concern, and it isnt really.

smig · Jun 1, 2008, 11:20 AM

the tin foil is both for the ground signal and for shield.

Jun 1, 2008, 05:38 AM	#1
germs Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 123 (0.07/day) Thanks: 5 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts System Specs	SATA cables: dooes the signal degrade/suffer from noise? Does length matter with SATA II cables? I'm about to buy some, and I cant pick what size to get. My case will be the TJ10 with 4 hard drives in it, and 1 SATA DVD drive (obviously needs a longer cable), but won't the hard drives perform better with shorter cables? Wouldn't this reduce noise (if I understand the term correctly)? Also, should I buy from certain brands, or are they really all the same?

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Jun 1, 2008, 05:42 AM	#2
ktr Eligible for custom title Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Bay Area, California, USA, Earth Posts: 6,158 (2.36/day) Thanks: 0 Thanked 708 Times in 595 Posts System Specs	Not really. Sata is digital based, and all it does is ones and zeros (on and off). Even if the cable length increases (and signal weakens), as long as the ones and zeros still register, it makes no difference, for the data is still interpreted.

Jun 1, 2008, 05:59 AM	#3
germs Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 123 (0.07/day) Thanks: 5 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts System Specs	And thus, brand means nothing as well?

Jun 1, 2008, 06:04 AM	#5
Black Hades Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Ambugaton Posts: 294 (0.14/day) Thanks: 28 Thanked 32 Times in 28 Posts System Specs	Technically speaking SATA cables can be as long as 180 centimeters without any problems. The noise you speak about does not affect the signal as all sata cables are somewhat shielded (some better than others though ) If you really want the best high impedance insulation & cable length you go for this. But I doubt you'll feel any transfer rate improvement regardless of length/insulation. __________________ LastFM \| Contact via Yahoo Messenger

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Jun 1, 2008, 06:18 AM	#7
smig Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Israel Posts: 139 (0.08/day) Thanks: 3 Thanked 5 Times in 5 Posts System Specs	a good SATA cable, like any other cable will probably cause less problems in the future (loosen cables, bad contact...) __________________ FH2 developer - Forgotten Hope 2 a full BF2 modification http://forgottenhope.bf1942files.com Yahoo! widgets - Glass Clock, Sand Clock,IL Radio, Skimp - Skined Media Player Never argue with an idiot. They bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.

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Jun 1, 2008, 07:03 AM	#10
Mussels Doctor Moderator Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Bendigo, Australia (NOT THE USA) Posts: 34,559 (10.96/day) Thanks: 3,700 Thanked 8,693 Times in 6,392 Posts System Specs	2 hard drives off the one cable wont do anything bad, except double the chances of a loose plug! i find lots of the double adaptors are cheap quality, and come loose/cause problems a lot more than the ones on a PSU. Sata is NOT shielded, but its very low voltage for signalling - 0.5v i think. Thats why SATA is less prone to interference, and can come longer. Get as long as you want, but not too long - if they're too long you'll have to fold/bend them out of the way, and you risk breaking the wires inside them. __________________ Edumacational thread about PC Audio My external HDD's.5x samsung 1TB + 2x Seagate 1.5TB = 8 TB external storage 32 Bit OS vs 64 bit OS information How to get hardware accelerated H264 playback (DXVA) Netbook Owners United!

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Jun 1, 2008, 07:04 AM	#11
Hayder_Master Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: IRAQ-Baghdad Posts: 4,861 (2.61/day) Thanks: 388 Thanked 639 Times in 444 Posts System Specs	take a good sata cable and you have no problem , cuz sata cable made for solve problem of ide cable, just like the long

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Jun 1, 2008, 08:11 AM	#14
germs Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 123 (0.07/day) Thanks: 5 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts System Specs	Thanks for the help and clarification guys.

Jun 1, 2008, 11:20 AM	#21
smig Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Israel Posts: 139 (0.08/day) Thanks: 3 Thanked 5 Times in 5 Posts System Specs	the tin foil is both for the ground signal and for shield. __________________ FH2 developer - Forgotten Hope 2 a full BF2 modification http://forgottenhope.bf1942files.com Yahoo! widgets - Glass Clock, Sand Clock,IL Radio, Skimp - Skined Media Player Never argue with an idiot. They bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.

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