Phenom II AM3 Plagued with DDR3-1333 Issue

btarunr · Feb 12, 2009, 01:49 PM

Barely a week into the introduction of the DDR3-supportive AM3 socket CPUs, the processors seem to be having design flaws. This, as circulated by AMD in its revision guide document for the 10h family of processors (found here, page 80). The issue, as described by AMD, centers around the DDR3 memory sub-system. On machines with more than one PC3-10600 (1333 MHz) memory module populating a memory channel, the users may experience unreliable operation. The company does not get into the specifics of the symptoms. This issue however, does not affect systems with a module per channel (one or two modules installed in the motherboard), and only those with three to four modules installed.

The AMD K10 memory controllers on AM3-socket processor provide a 128-bit wide memory interface (with DRAM Ganged mode enabled), which amount to two 64-bit wide memory channels. On most motherboards, four DIMM slots with two slots sharing a memory channel are present. With this issue, one is not recommended to use more than one DDR3-1333 memory module per channel. AMD recommends a quick fix for the issue for systems using more than one DDR3-1333 module per memory channel: to manually specify the memory to run at 533 MHz (1066 MHz DDR), and accordingly set DRAM timings. As a little compensation, one can tighten DRAM timings with the drop in frequency. AMD will fix this issue in the next stepping (sub-version) of the CPUs. The "x-factor" with this erratum revolves around DRAM voltage, a significant factor. One might note AMD saying "the processor memory subsystem may exhibit unreliable operation over the allowable VDDIO voltage range", which leads us to think if there is a potential workaround with adjusting the DRAM voltage beyond the allowable range (read: over-volting the memory). We hope to hear more from AMD on this.

UPDATE (02/13): AMD replied to the report, saying that work is in progress toward fixing the issue. While not getting into the specifics, AMD indicated to us that apart from addressing the issue, the company is also working toward something "which will make you ‘feel cozy’ about the DDR3 support". The statement is ambiguous, and is best left uninterpreted at this point in time.

Konceptz · Feb 12, 2009, 01:58 PM

AMD is struggling to compete with intel and now they are having these problems? What happened to AMD? I remember my first PC opteron 170 @ 2.8ghz used to scream. Its like their engineering has just gave up.

DOM · Feb 12, 2009, 01:59 PM

this is going to suck for ppl that have been waiting to go to DDR3 with AMD cuz there going to want DDR3 for high frequency

Konceptz · Feb 12, 2009, 02:01 PM

this is going to suck for everybody, if AMD can't compete it will drive prices up for everybody.

DOM · Feb 12, 2009, 02:04 PM

Qx9770

your talking about prices

but im sure there on it already with a new steping

Urbklr · Feb 12, 2009, 02:06 PM

Well, guess I'm buying an Intel again until the new steppings. Was sooo excited for the 925 tooo

btarunr · Feb 12, 2009, 02:07 PM

Unless you need >4GB (2x 2GB) of memory, this issue won't affect you.

Digg please: http://digg.com/hardware/Phenom_II_A...DR3_1333_Issue

AlCabone · Feb 12, 2009, 02:16 PM

DDR3 isn't worth the price anyway, and it doesn't even have a real performance benefit (for AMD)

kid41212003 · Feb 12, 2009, 02:17 PM

Only affect who uses more than 1 module per channel, which mean this only affect people who use 3 or 4 sticks.

TheMailMan78 · Feb 12, 2009, 02:18 PM

Its amazing I have DDR3 issues just like AMD. My problem is I cant afford DDR3.

Urbklr · Feb 12, 2009, 02:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by btarunr

Unless you need >4GB (2x 2GB) of memory, this issue won't affect you.

I will soon, besides...if it doesn't work the way it's meant too...I'm not spending $230+ on it..

Konceptz · Feb 12, 2009, 02:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DOM

Qx9770

your talking about prices

but im sure there on it already with a new steping

The 9770 was handed down to me, you honestly didn't think......

phanbuey · Feb 12, 2009, 02:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheMailMan78

Its amazing I have DDR3 issues just like AMD. My problem is I cant afford DDR3.

mtosev · Feb 12, 2009, 02:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheMailMan78

Its amazing I have DDR3 issues just like AMD. My problem is I cant afford DDR3.

sell your car, house, wife, yourself JUST GET DDR3

suraswami · Feb 12, 2009, 02:49 PM

not again AMD.

Why can't you shut up, not blow your trumpet

and get back to the works to bring a real CPU? Why do you want to shoot yourself twice?

newtekie1 · Feb 12, 2009, 02:49 PM

This sucks, kind of defeats the purpose of moving to DDR3 if you have to run it at DDR2 speeds.

I'd still consider one of these, their DDR2 performance is more than enough to justify buying one to me. Though, as already stated, perhaps a simple over-volt will solve the issue.

Castiel · Feb 12, 2009, 02:50 PM

When I rebuild my next system(Damn College Funds!!

) I will be going INTEL. I am not going to wait for AMD to come out with some good hardware. There 2 years behind Intel and they need to get there work together and start putting out some good stuff. Come on they can't even put a freakin Phenom with DDR3 memory? I rather have a faster chip with DDR2.

I officially announce today I am going full Intel!!

DOM · Feb 12, 2009, 02:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Konceptz

The 9770 was handed down to me, you honestly didn't think......

can you handed it down to me

jbunch07 · Feb 12, 2009, 02:54 PM

I'm glad I didn't go ddr3, i figured that something like this might happen, DDR2 FTW!
Not that this is a huge problem for most people, but I think I'll wait till they get all the kinks worked out of it.

devguy · Feb 12, 2009, 02:55 PM

Seriously, though. How many of you are going to afford 8GB ddr3 memory? Perhaps by the time that would be a reasonable purchase (pricewise and necessity wise), one could buy 2x4GB ram modules and there is your 8GB. Also, I wouldn't be surprised if they find a way around this with bios updates for the motherboards.

If there is one thing I've learned from running two AMD machines with all DIMM slots filled, it is to not do that again. And so I certainly don't care about this.

Edit: also remember that most of the current gen Phenoms allow for DDR2 1066mhz memory modules. However, when you populate all four DIMM slots, you usually cannot keep that option and must run them at 800mhz. The solution is to up the reference clock until you get the modules back at 1066 and problem solved. I don't hear too many complaints about that. And I'm pretty sure it will be the same with Phenom II.

ShadowFold · Feb 12, 2009, 02:57 PM

Meh DDR2 is still more than fast enough. Kinda sad to see there is a problem with DDR3. I'm sure they will get a revision out like they did with the TLB 9600/9500.
And seriously, it says they are gonna fix it. How many retail DDR3 boards and CPU's are even out yet? Jump to conclusions why don't you..

Castiel · Feb 12, 2009, 02:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jbunch07

Yeah that's a good idea. let's turn this into a fanboy war.

lol, well better watch what you say, don't want a MOD to come in here and start swinging the ban stick.

Jakl · Feb 12, 2009, 03:04 PM

Why AMD!!! Why!?!?!

There are pushed back again

uber_cookie · Feb 12, 2009, 03:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jbunch07

Yeah that's a good idea. let's turn this into a fanboy war.

actually i am fan of AMD but this is turning into joke now

they should of scraped phenom architecture and start again

Just hope they can cope with the loss...

xfire · Feb 12, 2009, 03:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Castiel

lol, well better watch what you say, don't want a MOD to come in here and start swinging the ban stick.

Yes ban the use of the word Intel.(evil intel)
The proccy the must not be named.

Feb 12, 2009, 01:49 PM	#1
btarunr Editor & Senior Moderator Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Hyderabad, India Posts: 14,983 (7.30/day) Thanks: 788 Thanked 12,902 Times in 5,651 Posts System Specs	Phenom II AM3 Plagued with DDR3-1333 Issue Barely a week into the introduction of the DDR3-supportive AM3 socket CPUs, the processors seem to be having design flaws. This, as circulated by AMD in its revision guide document for the 10h family of processors (found here, page 80). The issue, as described by AMD, centers around the DDR3 memory sub-system. On machines with more than one PC3-10600 (1333 MHz) memory module populating a memory channel, the users may experience unreliable operation. The company does not get into the specifics of the symptoms. This issue however, does not affect systems with a module per channel (one or two modules installed in the motherboard), and only those with three to four modules installed. The AMD K10 memory controllers on AM3-socket processor provide a 128-bit wide memory interface (with DRAM Ganged mode enabled), which amount to two 64-bit wide memory channels. On most motherboards, four DIMM slots with two slots sharing a memory channel are present. With this issue, one is not recommended to use more than one DDR3-1333 memory module per channel. AMD recommends a quick fix for the issue for systems using more than one DDR3-1333 module per memory channel: to manually specify the memory to run at 533 MHz (1066 MHz DDR), and accordingly set DRAM timings. As a little compensation, one can tighten DRAM timings with the drop in frequency. AMD will fix this issue in the next stepping (sub-version) of the CPUs. The "x-factor" with this erratum revolves around DRAM voltage, a significant factor. One might note AMD saying "the processor memory subsystem may exhibit unreliable operation over the allowable VDDIO voltage range", which leads us to think if there is a potential workaround with adjusting the DRAM voltage beyond the allowable range (read: over-volting the memory). We hope to hear more from AMD on this. UPDATE (02/13): AMD replied to the report, saying that work is in progress toward fixing the issue. While not getting into the specifics, AMD indicated to us that apart from addressing the issue, the company is also working toward something "which will make you ‘feel cozy’ about the DDR3 support". The statement is ambiguous, and is best left uninterpreted at this point in time. Last edited by btarunr; Feb 13, 2009 at 11:33 AM.

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Feb 12, 2009, 01:58 PM	#2
Konceptz Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Richmond,VA Posts: 148 (0.09/day) Thanks: 3 Thanked 19 Times in 15 Posts System Specs	AMD is struggling to compete with intel and now they are having these problems? What happened to AMD? I remember my first PC opteron 170 @ 2.8ghz used to scream. Its like their engineering has just gave up. __________________ CPU-Z validation sig pics temporarily blocked

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Feb 12, 2009, 01:59 PM	#3
DOM Eligible for custom title Join Date: May 2006 Location: TX, USA Posts: 6,472 (2.54/day) Thanks: 292 Thanked 791 Times in 707 Posts System Specs	this is going to suck for ppl that have been waiting to go to DDR3 with AMD cuz there going to want DDR3 for high frequency __________________

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Feb 12, 2009, 02:01 PM	#4
Konceptz Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Richmond,VA Posts: 148 (0.09/day) Thanks: 3 Thanked 19 Times in 15 Posts System Specs	this is going to suck for everybody, if AMD can't compete it will drive prices up for everybody. __________________ CPU-Z validation sig pics temporarily blocked

Feb 12, 2009, 02:04 PM	#5
DOM Eligible for custom title Join Date: May 2006 Location: TX, USA Posts: 6,472 (2.54/day) Thanks: 292 Thanked 791 Times in 707 Posts System Specs	Qx9770 your talking about prices but im sure there on it already with a new steping __________________

Feb 12, 2009, 02:06 PM	#6
Urbklr Join Date: May 2007 Location: Truro, NS Canada Posts: 1,864 (0.85/day) Thanks: 139 Thanked 245 Times in 214 Posts System Specs	Well, guess I'm buying an Intel again until the new steppings. Was sooo excited for the 925 tooo __________________

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Feb 12, 2009, 02:07 PM	#7
btarunr Editor & Senior Moderator Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Hyderabad, India Posts: 14,983 (7.30/day) Thanks: 788 Thanked 12,902 Times in 5,651 Posts System Specs	Unless you need >4GB (2x 2GB) of memory, this issue won't affect you. Digg please: http://digg.com/hardware/Phenom_II_A...DR3_1333_Issue __________________ Gadgets, Phones, Tablets, Cameras, TVs, HiFi...NextPowerUp Last edited by btarunr; Feb 12, 2009 at 06:32 PM.

Feb 12, 2009, 02:16 PM	#8
AlCabone Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Europe Posts: 78 (0.04/day) Thanks: 0 Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts	DDR3 isn't worth the price anyway, and it doesn't even have a real performance benefit (for AMD)

Feb 12, 2009, 02:17 PM	#9
kid41212003 Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: California Posts: 2,558 (1.43/day) Thanks: 312 Thanked 533 Times in 435 Posts System Specs	Only affect who uses more than 1 module per channel, which mean this only affect people who use 3 or 4 sticks. __________________

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Feb 12, 2009, 02:18 PM	#10
TheMailMan78 Banstick Dummy Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Crystal River, FL Posts: 15,109 (6.93/day) Thanks: 1,337 Thanked 6,829 Times in 3,739 Posts System Specs	Its amazing I have DDR3 issues just like AMD. My problem is I cant afford DDR3.

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Feb 12, 2009, 02:49 PM	#15
suraswami Eligible for custom title Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Irvine, CA Posts: 5,142 (1.73/day) Thanks: 851 Thanked 601 Times in 532 Posts System Specs	not again AMD. Why can't you shut up, not blow your trumpet and get back to the works to bring a real CPU? Why do you want to shoot yourself twice? __________________ 2 Servers Multiple VMs including WHS on VM, capacity 3.5 TB HDD Family Machine - W7 Ultimate 64bit, ECS 780G, Phenom II X3 720BE @ 3.1Ghz- 1.38V, 4GB DDR2 800 ram, Sapphire 4670 512MB, 600W Ultra X pro, Xigmatek HDT-S1283 "Oh please, the only thing more resilient than an Indian is a cockroach. Not even nukes can stop their immune systems" - TheMailMan78

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Feb 12, 2009, 02:49 PM	#16
newtekie1 Semi-Retired Folder Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Indiana Posts: 17,751 (6.48/day) Thanks: 780 Thanked 5,115 Times in 3,706 Posts System Specs	This sucks, kind of defeats the purpose of moving to DDR3 if you have to run it at DDR2 speeds. I'd still consider one of these, their DDR2 performance is more than enough to justify buying one to me. Though, as already stated, perhaps a simple over-volt will solve the issue. __________________ Rig1: System Specs. Rig2: A8-5600K@4.4GHz / AsRock FM2A75 Pro4 / 8GB Corsair DDR3-1600 9-9-9-24 / HD7560D / Samsung DVD-Burner / 1.5TB WD Green + 3x3TB WD RED in RAID5 Rig3: Athlon X2 4200+ / M4A79 Deluxe / 4GB G.Skill Pi DDR2-800 4-4-4-12 / GT430 / Sony DVD-Burner / 500GB WD Rig4: Phenom II x6 1605T @ 3.6GHz / Asus M5A99X Evo / 8GB PNY DDR3-1600 9-9-9 / GTX470 & GTX470 / Samsung DVD-Burner / 1.5TB Seagate

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Feb 12, 2009, 02:50 PM	#17
Castiel Join Date: May 2008 Location: Grapevine,TX/ Tyler,TX Posts: 2,447 (1.33/day) Thanks: 297 Thanked 307 Times in 247 Posts System Specs	When I rebuild my next system(Damn College Funds!!) I will be going INTEL. I am not going to wait for AMD to come out with some good hardware. There 2 years behind Intel and they need to get there work together and start putting out some good stuff. Come on they can't even put a freakin Phenom with DDR3 memory? I rather have a faster chip with DDR2. I officially announce today I am going full Intel!!

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Feb 12, 2009, 02:54 PM	#19
jbunch07 Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Chattanooga,TN Posts: 3,738 (1.95/day) Thanks: 499 Thanked 621 Times in 474 Posts System Specs	I'm glad I didn't go ddr3, i figured that something like this might happen, DDR2 FTW! Not that this is a huge problem for most people, but I think I'll wait till they get all the kinks worked out of it.

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Feb 12, 2009, 02:55 PM	#20
devguy Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: SoCal Posts: 1,198 (0.52/day) Thanks: 49 Thanked 171 Times in 133 Posts System Specs	Seriously, though. How many of you are going to afford 8GB ddr3 memory? Perhaps by the time that would be a reasonable purchase (pricewise and necessity wise), one could buy 2x4GB ram modules and there is your 8GB. Also, I wouldn't be surprised if they find a way around this with bios updates for the motherboards. If there is one thing I've learned from running two AMD machines with all DIMM slots filled, it is to not do that again. And so I certainly don't care about this. Edit: also remember that most of the current gen Phenoms allow for DDR2 1066mhz memory modules. However, when you populate all four DIMM slots, you usually cannot keep that option and must run them at 800mhz. The solution is to up the reference clock until you get the modules back at 1066 and problem solved. I don't hear too many complaints about that. And I'm pretty sure it will be the same with Phenom II. __________________ CPU-Z validation sig pics temporarily blocked

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Feb 12, 2009, 02:57 PM	#21
ShadowFold Eligible for custom title Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Omaha, NE Posts: 12,855 (6.50/day) Thanks: 1,381 Thanked 1,681 Times in 1,498 Posts System Specs	Meh DDR2 is still more than fast enough. Kinda sad to see there is a problem with DDR3. I'm sure they will get a revision out like they did with the TLB 9600/9500. And seriously, it says they are gonna fix it. How many retail DDR3 boards and CPU's are even out yet? Jump to conclusions why don't you..

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Feb 12, 2009, 03:04 PM	#23
Jakl Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Home Posts: 384 (0.23/day) Thanks: 60 Thanked 57 Times in 56 Posts System Specs	Why AMD!!! Why!?!?! There are pushed back again

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