Lets talk about: Sound.

[Studabaker]

I found the Realtek audio console to have no band-driven Equalizer, just letting me pick from pre-sets. Am I missing something?

[Tau]

Originally Posted by Ketxxx

With the recent invasion of chav-like people in the forums killing braincells all over the place with their "innits" and "mas", this is my attempt at rejuvinating intelligent thought to some degree. I also decided to make this thread as discussions on speakers, soundcards, equalizer settings, etc, is somewhat.... lacking. Call this thread general advice for those thinking their speakers aren't sounding as good as they could and people looking for advice on a new soundcard or set of speakers if you will.

With that said, I'll kick things off with my impressions of my current setup.

Speakers: Logitech X540s 5.1 70RMS watts
Speaker Special Features: Desk hub for headphones, "Matrix" mode
Soundcard: Asus Xonar DX 7.1
Audio Obsession Level: Extreme Audiophile

Firstly lets talk about the speakers a little, granted they are not THE most powerful speakers you can buy, but the quality IS there, and thats what matters - good sound quality. As far as midrange speakers go these are good, accuracy across all frequencies is very accurate, and you can even crank these puppies up to full volume with no distortion (assuming you have a good soundcard). These speakers even have a sweet hub you can plug headphones in to save bending over or generally having a wire in the way. The speakers also have a very interesting "Matrix" mode. This mode effectively balances sound channels across all speakers, and it sounds bloody fantastic. Unlike other speakers that tend to rely on walls for acoustic reverberation the X540s do not and have a habit of being deceptively loud. Often I have found myself cranking the volume to "just" 40-50% thinking its not too loud, only to venture downstairs to do something and finding myself able to hear the speakers throughout the whole house clearly with a healthy "boom" from the Subwoofer. The only speakers worth upgrading to from the X540s would be the Logitech Z5500s.

Now heres where things get more complicated as we arrive to the soundcard and its software, configuring it for optimum sound quality. The approach I like to take when setting up for the best possible listening experience is when using the Equalizer, adjust each frequency at a time, moving one slider up and down if needed to get a feel for how it effects the genre of music you listen to. While doing this be sure that nothing sounds distorted across the frequency you are adjusting before moving on. Often you will probably find yourself saving a few different equalizer settings and comparing them all, tweaking the best sounding setting so its "perfect". It goes without saying, but also make sure your soundcard drivers and software are the most up to date available. Often new sound drivers and software will have extra features, bugfixes, tweaks for lower CPU utilisation, and even internal driver tweaks improving audio quality just that little bit more. If your privvy to the option, its also worth experimenting with any LFE Crossover Frequency option you may have, it will help "tune" your speakers in even further than just the Equalizer alone. That about covers me and general advice I have to give, below is a screenshot of my "perfect" Equalizer settings that may help people with the same speakers I have, but such settings are very subjective.

Originally Posted by Ra97oR

Extreme Audiophiles? Have the term Audiophiles been downgraded from player of proper Hi-Fi costing well over £10,000 to users of weeny 2.1 costing £50.

I will not consider myself as a Audiophiles at all, owning a top of the range computer speaker doesn't make me looks any better in proper Audiophiles' eyes. xD

^^

Personally Ket if your an "extreame" audiophile and running that setup you have not heard a true "extreame" audiophile setup.

I would consider myself somewhat of an audiophile, though not one thats willing to spend 10K+ on my setup (though close to it lol.)

That Xonar card is awsome though hands down the best consumer card on the market by far.

My PC setup is simple, a modded Audigy 4, older JVC amp that I love to bits, a Behringer EQ, and a set of HD500's. Next upgrade for the PC setup will be a newer NAD, or Technics amp, a set of K701's and some Monitors for speakers (tired of just headphones on this computer, sometimes i would like speakers)

[Mussels]

Originally Posted by Studabaker

I found the Realtek audio console to have no band-driven Equalizer, just letting me pick from pre-sets. Am I missing something?

if you use the modded x-fi ones, you can get an EQ

and i kind of agree... X-540's are great speakers (my secondaries) but holy hell are they nowhere near as good as my Z5500's, and my z5500's dont come near pro-level equipment (which admittedly, costs a shitload)

[Studabaker]

Originally Posted by Mussels

if you use the modded x-fi ones, you can get an EQ

and i kind of agree... X-540's are great speakers (my secondaries) but holy hell are they nowhere near as good as my Z5500's, and my z5500's dont come near pro-level equipment (which admittedly, costs a shitload)

I thought the Creative software didn't work, slash had a 30-day limit, slash didn't work in Vista specifically.

As far as the X-540s, people (like me) buy them because they cost 1/3 of the Z5500s, which of course deliver about as many times as much power, also.

[Mussels]

Originally Posted by Studabaker

I thought the Creative software didn't work, slash had a 30-day limit, slash didn't work in Vista specifically.

As far as the X-540s, people (like me) buy them because they cost 1/3 of the Z5500s, which of course deliver about as many times as much power, also.

kets mod works in XP, daniel_K's mod works in vista. You can buy keys now via the program, the links are valid now.

[Studabaker]

Originally Posted by Mussels

kets mod works in XP, daniel_K's mod works in vista. You can buy keys now via the program, the links are valid now.

Don't they charge $30? For that much I can just get another Audigy SE and run the X-Fi drivers & apps on it like I'm doing now.

[Mussels]

Originally Posted by Studabaker

Don't they charge $30? For that much I can just get another Audigy SE and run the X-Fi drivers & apps on it like I'm doing now.

true. we cant discuss piracy here on TPU, but lets just say i triple booted and ran three copies of vista on here at once, and the key worked on all three simultaneously without problems. the keys dont seem to mind sharing a little, If you get my hint.

[Tatty_One]

Soundcard: Xifi Elite Pro Retail (with I/O console), £70 from PC World!

Speakers: Videologic ZX-R550 5.1 (6 years old and still fantastic!)

Sony DTRDG-820 7.1 HDMI DD/DTS/DTS-ES AV amplifier

http://www.froogle.hughesdirect.co.u...STRDG820-BLACK

Speakers: TANGENT FP-500 5.0 Plus yamaha 150W Sub

I interchange systems between gaming and DVD/BlueRay.

Edit: Forgot to add................

Headphones: Creative Fatal1ty Gamer headset.

[Studabaker]

Originally Posted by Mussels

true. we cant discuss piracy here on TPU, but lets just say i triple booted and ran three copies of vista on here at once, and the key worked on all three simultaneously without problems. the keys dont seem to mind sharing a little, If you get my hint.

hint gotten

[Ketxxx]

My X540s ain't the best, but they do a decent job. Audiophiles aren't so much about how much is spent on their sound setups, thats addicts. Audiophiles are the people who understand what instruments are supposed to sound like and spend hours tweaking their sound setup to get as accurate as possible representation of what those instruments sound like in real life on their setup without the music sounding flat.

[WarEagleAU]

Wow, Wile E, I didnt know you played instruments, that is bad ass man.

My setup is a set of old Creative Sound Works 5.1 speakers. They sound pretty good, but my woofer seems to be over powered, of course, that could be because of how I got the eq on my x fi fatal1ty set up

[selway89]

A note id like to make for X-Fi users. The crystalizer is a dynamic eq setting. However it reduces the sound stage by quite allot, making difference between frequences smaller. I have noticed hiddeous distortion with this setting and use mine without any surround or crystalizer settings.
Sounds amazing.

Some pics of my setup:
My system at uni:

[Ketxxx]

Only thing the crystalizer is good for is low quality MP3s. On the note of instruments, I used to play drums at school and classic guitar, great way of venting frustration

[alexp999]

Missions speakers ftw!

[HeadlessChicken]

Originally Posted by WarEagleAU

Wow, Wile E, I didnt know you played instruments, that is bad ass man.

My setup is a set of old Creative Sound Works 5.1 speakers. They sound pretty good, but my woofer seems to be over powered, of course, that could be because of how I got the eq on my x fi fatal1ty set up

there should be a knob on back of the sub u can use to tweak the bass

[selway89]

Originally Posted by alexp999

Missions speakers ftw!

You should hear my dads old 781s best iv heard.


781 speakers back at home:

[Ketxxx]

haha I'll be like that when I'm old not because I'll need all that power... just because I'll be deaf after years of abusing my ears

[Tatty_One]

Originally Posted by selway89

A note id like to make for X-Fi users. The crystalizer is a dynamic eq setting. However it reduces the sound stage by quite allot, making difference between frequences smaller. I have noticed hiddeous distortion with this setting and use mine without any surround or crystalizer settings.
Sounds amazing.

Some pics of my setup:
My system at uni:
http://img95.imageshack.us/img95/5639/snb10055.th.jpghttp://img144.imageshack.us/img144/6058/snb10056.th.jpghttp://img144.imageshack.us/img144/6735/snb10057.th.jpghttp://img527.imageshack.us/img527/3281/snb10058.th.jpghttp://img527.imageshack.us/img527/1861/snb10059.th.jpg

Yes, I tried Crystaliser when I first got my Elite pro which was my first Xifi card and didnt like it personally so dont use it now.

[tigger]

I love mission speakers,but i got my 4x mordaunt 901's for £100,great little speakers.

[imperialreign]

Originally Posted by selway89

A note id like to make for X-Fi users. The crystalizer is a dynamic eq setting. However it reduces the sound stage by quite allot, making difference between frequences smaller. I have noticed hiddeous distortion with this setting and use mine without any surround or crystalizer settings.
Sounds amazing.

Crystallizer is actually an oddly implimented loudness/signal processing effect, not an EQ setting.

http://ixbtlabs.com/articles2/multim...-fi-part2.html

as per how it's used - it's a double-edged sword. Very poor quality audio (e.g. .mp3 @ 128kbps or less) will sound 10x worse with the crystallizer, as certain portions of the frequency range are amplified . . . usually the same portion of the band where the artifacts and distortion will lie after such compression.

High quality audio (e.g. .wma @ lossless) will see no benefit from Crystallizer - actually, quite the contrary, the effect hurts high-quality audio . . . masking certain portions of the band.

The only worthwhile purpose of the Crystallizer feature that I've been able to deduce - gaming. Most game audio is a decent middle-of-the-line audio compression, usually using .wav or .ogg formats (WAV being an "uncompressed" format), at 44.1kHz. In-game, the audio system will play sounds at various levels of playback, and "position" sound based upon their relation to the actor, as well as applying environmental filters, occlusion filters, reverb effects, etc. The amount of filters placed over a track can sometimes mask certain frequency ranges that the player should be able to hear (usually high frequencies) - Crystallizer is capable of strengthening these portion of the range, as it's applied individually to each file for playback - giving gunshots, for example, a very crisp sound . . . even if their source is far enough away from the player that it's still muted, it can bring out the high frequencies that still enable the player to vaguely discern those sounds.

Otherwise, I find the Crystallizer feature to be absolutely horrible for general entertainment playback . . . perhaps, in regards to my audio collection, is due from the vast quantities of lossless, uncompressed audio I have. If I rip a CD, it goes down in either .wma lossless or .wav.








As to audio specs and general hardware, etc. feel free to check out my guide: http://forums.techpowerup.com/showthread.php?t=64921







As to audio equipment I *currently* have:

X-Fi Fatal1ty PCI (2)
X-Fi Titanium Fatal1ty
X-Fi Elite Pro

Harmon/Kardon Soundsticks II
Razer HP-1 5.1 headset

I've also hound countless 5.1 setups that I seem to destroy sooner or later


My personal setup, though consists of:

4 vintage Pioneer CS-99A 5-way units:


full wood enclosure, and they stand about mid-thigh from the ground. These are 80W units, but sound like much more powerful units - excellent lows and mids, with a very balanced high range. These bad boys will rattle the drywall right out of your home . . .


vintage JVC 4-channel stereo reciever - looks similar to this:


although mine has a black finish to it with chrome trim around it



and a vintage JVC amplifier that lokos similar to this:


again, though, black finish instead of the polished aluminum. The two I have are a matching set.



I'll just say that my personal setup, if set to a volume level of "3" will get the cops called - it's LOUD . . . very LOUD. I can easily run my computer into the reciever as well, but I tend to prefer my headset most of the time.

[selway89]

imperialreign.... Thanks for the info, I had read some stuff on it a while ago and from what I understood at the time its a glorified eq. But as you say its odly implemented. Eitherway with mp3 or Flac that I have etc I find it horrible and reduces sound stage considerably.

And those are some big bass drivers on those Pioneers!


tigger... thats a steal for that price, 4 of them for 100!! Mordaunts look fantastic but never had chance to have a listen to some.

[silkstone]

Speakers: SBS A200
Headphones: Philips SHM1800
Soundcard: Onboard Realtek
Audio Obsession level: I don;t belong in this thread

I've used various different soundcards from high-end (at-the-time) Audigy to low USB soundcards and i have noticed 0 difference, the exeption being laptop sound which has sounded tinny to say the least even with external (good) speakers. I always try to buy semi decent speakers as that is where i believe all the benifits come from. The speakers i have now are low end, but more than adequate unless they are set too loud. I tend to listen to music over headphones anyway as my computer is in a shared room

[Ketxxx]

I heard much better audio when using the Crystalizer on my MP3s, but their high-ish quality rips anyway, 192.

[imperialreign]

Originally Posted by selway89

imperialreign.... Thanks for the info, I had read some stuff on it a while ago and from what I understood at the time its a glorified eq. But as you say its odly implemented. Eitherway with mp3 or Flac that I have etc I find it horrible and reduces sound stage considerably.

And those are some big bass drivers on those Pioneers!

not a prob.

and, yeah, these units are HUGE . . . I like that pic, the coffee mug gives a decent representation as to their size . . .

I guess you could classify them as "bookshelf" speakers, but they're way too big to be on anything but the floor . . . besides, they weigh a good 65lbs each. Very hard to move around.


Personally - I prefer older equipment over today's over-engineered stuff. Sure, modern speaker construction is a lot better, with better materials involved . . . but typically don't have the same "warmth" older equipment is capable of . . . nor the sheer power

[Ketxxx]

I have some decent wood made speakers I could switch for the plastic shell ones my X540s have. The only thing that kinda puts me off is the fact the center wood speaker don't have any way to fix it to the top of my panel, where the actual X540 speakers do.. hrmm..