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AMD announces Thunderbolt competitor named AMD DockPort!

Discussion in 'General Hardware' started by theo2021, Feb 17, 2014.

  1. theo2021

    theo2021

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    Intel's Thunderbolt is going to have a good competitor , AMD has great plans about their new DockPort!
    They claim that it will be low cost and with many features. It is based on USB 3.0 unlike Intel's but both embed the DP standar, here is a video!

    Can AMD follow the big Thunderbolt bandwidth and they variety of devices connected by a single port?
    Only time will tell , i don't believe that usb 3.0 bandwidth can handle so many devices!
     
  2. 15th Warlock

    15th Warlock

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    How about the latency when using USB? It's not like TB is very popular anyways, at least not mainstream yet...
     
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  3. theo2021

    theo2021

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    True TB is very good for RAID confs , with USB 3.0 this may be a problem.
     
  4. thebluebumblebee

    thebluebumblebee

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    The adaptation of Thunderbolt has been much slower than I expected. A search of Newegg for (Intel) motherboards with TB only shows 11, that are all more than $189, and they are all "gaming" boards. Is Intel charging too much? Thunderbolt should be all over the workstation and even some of the business class motherboards, but it's not. The first thing that AMD mentions is cost. Intel is smarting right now because they underestimated the smartphone/tablet market and even had to mothball a fab that was being built down in Arizona. Would not surprise me if they tried to charge too much for TB.

    This will hurt the industry, as split competing standards always do.
     
    Last edited: Feb 17, 2014
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  5. james888

    james888

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    Intel is charging too much. If dockport is cheap and better than most everything... it might take off faster.
     
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  6. Steevo

    Steevo

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    Thunderbolt is meh. Who uses remote attached RAID? I would prefer DisplayPort adoption with USB 3 integration with 4K 60hz before we worry about making more standard unused ports and overpriced devices with almost no real market. Thunderbolt reminds me of a product with no market, Intel is convinced they can and will create one even if it takes them forever. Its like Firewire, I used Firewire 400 for one thing, a hard drive to backup to, and once USB3 came out the new one was USB 3.
     
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  7. thebluebumblebee

    thebluebumblebee

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    If we look at where PC's are going, the NUC for example, a single simple connection between "modules" makes sense. But has Intel put TB on the NUC? I haven't seen it. This idea of "daisy chaining" will not go away.:laugh:
     
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  8. lilhasselhoffer

    lilhasselhoffer

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    Divorce yourself from ThunderBolt for just a moment, and look at this move in the big picture.

    AMD is introducing APUs like mad. Their future seems to be built on them, and not the traditional CPU.
    AMD has a huge amount of cash, based upon being the graphics solution for all three current generation consoles.
    AMD has introduced a high speed connection that seems to be more flexible than competitors, with higher speeds, and theoretically a huge bandwidth.

    Anyone else seeing where AMD is headed? Anyone?

    I see a beautiful experiment. Assuming the cost is low, it can beat out TB easily. Assuming the bandwidth is high enough, it can compete with the flexibility of USB (3.0 yes, but also the venerable 2.0). Assuming that the cost isn't astronomical people will integrate it into boards as more than a gimick, and it can find an honest consumer niche.

    Now, that was a lot of assuming. I'm hoping that AMD can actually do any of this. They're integrating audio processors into their video cards, video cards into their CPUs, and introducing a lot of new software. Call me wary, but I'd like it if AMD could focus on one or two things, and nail them down before introducing their next big thing. Call me a cynic, but TressFX is a joke. It was touted as a great new feature, and has fallen short of any real impact. This connector could theoretically remove HDMI, DP, DVI, and VGA ports from future graphics cards. I'd love only having 2 or 3 connectors on my GPU, and not having to worry about active or passive adapters. At the same time, AMD will have to prove they can actually do this effectively before I bite.
     
  9. Steevo

    Steevo

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    They are headed back to where they were when they sold their mobile division but with a huge IP infusion from their aquisition of ATI and from the patents they share with Intel and ARM now?

    I have no doubt AMD will be around for a long time, they are finally getting around to where they needed to be years ago, and their changes have caused pain for some in the company. I hope they continue to grow, and my opinion is they should open a IP ASIC company to buy more dies, and cross license all the tech they get out of it.
     
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  10. Mussels

    Mussels Moderprator Staff Member

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    this could be really good as a generic modular graphics output and 'add on' device.


    get a cheap netbook/APU and simpy add on the extra hardware/HDMI/DVI/DP/audio/gigaE/wifi/etc with an upgradeable, future proof docking port? sign me up

    all they need is the ability to add external graphics with this and they've got themselves a winner
     
  11. The Von Matrices

    The Von Matrices

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    The only problem is that Dockport in its current implementation can't do that. Dockport is much less flexible in implementation than Thunderbolt. A good diagram of its implementation is available at TI's website.

    Thunderbolt 2 uses two 10Gb/s channels bonded into a 20Gb/s link. Dockport uses four 5.4Gb/s Displayport 1.2 lanes. If you are using USB 3.0 with Dockport, you have to allocate two lanes to USB 3.0. That means that you only get 10.8Gb/s for display which, after overhead, is enough to drive one 2560x1600 monitor (or two 1920x1200 monitors through MST) @ 24bit/60Hz.

    If you want to drive a single 4K display (or two 2560x1600 displays through MST) @ 24bit/60Hz, you need to use all four Dockport lanes. In this case you can't use USB 3.0 on Dockport; it reverts to the USB 2.0 integrated into the Displayport standard. With Thunderbolt 2, a 4K display still leaves about 3Gb/s on the link, which is enough to support the devices you would typically connect to a dock (gigabit ethernet, hard drives, audio, USB flash drives, etc.).

    I am not a fan of Thunderbolt's pricing, but with high resolution displays coming onto the market, the current version of Dockport seems like it will be obsolete before it reaches the market. To me Dockport just doesn't make sense unless it can integrate Displayport 1.3, which is supposed to again double Displayport bandwidth. This would allow USB 3.0 (or 3.1) plus 4K displays at the same time.
     
    Last edited: Feb 18, 2014
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  12. xenocide

    xenocide

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    I would say that is hardly true. Last earnings call weren't AMD still in the Red? Or barely in the Black--mostly from selling off their main site if I remember. Profit margins on the APU's for consoles are razor thin, that's why Nvidia abandoned that market. I'd be amazed if AMD made more than a couple dollars per console, and a good amount of any profit is probably still covering R&D costs.
     
  13. Vario

    Vario

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  14. refillable

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    Honestly That's a pretty good ad. I believe the main reason why TB hasn't been a standard is that Intel way over exclusive and over price it. I hope AMD could promote and sell it as they would with their APUs. By the way I rarely come across an AMD powered tablet, Or was I not up to date with the tablet world? Please Help.
    Yeah he was hired on 2012 and it seems like AMD now focuses on HSA and Mantle even with this guy in charge. We didn't even hear rumors about the successor of the 2012 Processor, The Vishera and it's more than 5y.o AM3 Socket.
    Well I believe this came from the declining PC market and I also believe that consoles were also pretty much declining. I'm afraid AMD won't have a quick enough time to do R&D on mobiles.
     
  15. theoneandonlymrk

    theoneandonlymrk

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    So Amd need to reclaim R+d capital from Ip that they already had developed for their own apu's, for use in console Soc's, hmmn jaguer cores check, imc check, onion and garlic check, no... several years before intel touted the same ,Amd were diversifying their IP and trying to get there IP in Soc's for other companies hence ALL their present and recent designs have been extremely modular with less and less contention points each generation, Its not all drop in IP but it is getting very close to it , the console venders also added their own personal (or licensed IP) into each SOC and these allow functionality that i have no doubt Amd now have access to via licence too

    dockport is much better and more importantly much much cheaper then thunderbolt to implement for Oem's ,intel would have a winner if they had not overpriced the silicon, amd realised this kind of thing is perfect for cheap consumer goods pads setop boxs laptops.

    Unfurtunately intel has assured you only see their version in things that need it much less(macbooks and enthusiast lapptops and motherboards) due to ridiculous pricing and it really is just that simple.
     
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  16. erixx

    erixx

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    DorkPort? Sounds funny and makes sense ;)
     
  17. eidairaman1

    eidairaman1

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    it will most likely go the way of the dodo,like how ieee1394 did
     
  18. Steevo

    Steevo

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    Which is why they need to stop trying to force individual incompatible ideas and move forward with display port. We already have PCIe 3.0 to the GPU, and have audio, DMA, and many other functions available on it. Thunderbolt is just generic displayport with PCIe added, which doesn't make sense when the cost of adding PCIe and the TB hardware and software license is crazy compared to already open and well adopted displayport and USB 3.0


    Move DisplayPort forward one generation and AMD, Intel, and Nvidia can implement it easily, except Intel still makes MEH graphics and of course want to create something proprietary for their own bullshit "brand".
     
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  19. eidairaman1

    eidairaman1

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    Apple did the same with IEEE1394 and that died off got replaced by USB3.0
     

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