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Console Porting is killing PC Gaming PQ.

Discussion in 'Games' started by nt300, Oct 26, 2012.

?

Have Games Stagnated, and who would you blame?

  1. Weak Spec Consoles (Age Old Hardware)

    26 vote(s)
    21.3%
  2. Lazy Game Developers (Cheap Console Ports)

    53 vote(s)
    43.4%
  3. Both AMD & NVIDIA (Messed up Drivers)

    2 vote(s)
    1.6%
  4. All of the Above

    22 vote(s)
    18.0%
  5. None of the Above

    19 vote(s)
    15.6%
  1. MatTheCat New Member

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    But I did read other peoples posts. I read this one for example:

    So, there exists the gesture of keyboard and mouse support on a paltry three titles...and then there is the question of how well it works. Having a game engine respond to gamepad input is a very different thing from having it responding ot mouse input at up to 5000 dpi. I know this from many bad experiences with poor console ports.

    Having consoles with keyboard/mouse support as it is done on PC, is going to create a very uneven playing field across its user base. I can see a lot of resistance to this ever coming to true fruition from many quarters. Console producers and big developers alike prefer a homogenous user base.
  2. xenocide

    xenocide

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    Two of which just recently came to be. Dust 541 as far as I know just entered beta, and I never heard if CSGO launched on Consoles when it did on PC. UT3 has been around for ages, but from what I heard it's garbage anyway.
  3. Rei86 New Member

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    So now that it does support it, the resolutions of speed of your keyboard/mouse reaction is the issue. What's next? The PS3 can't play HD-DVD like your PC is gonna be called into question?

    Once again I'll make this clear.

    Sony. Allows. Developers. To. Program. Keyboard. And. Mouse. Support. IF. They. Want. Too.

    Done since it feels like all I'm doing is this :banghead:
  4. MatTheCat New Member

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    You are banging your head because you are trying to portray a picture that has no place in reality.

    You arguing as if Mouse/keyboard in console games is old hat....like its all the rage....but it barely even fkn exists and I bet that it is a horrible experience to boot.

    Therefore, the M/K support in consoles is, as things stand, totally fkn irrelevant. Yet you are making out like it all been done before, works great, etc etc.
  5. eidairaman1

    eidairaman1

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    yall read what the PS4 will have and who knows what the WiiU has.
  6. Rei86 New Member

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    After this post your idea of supporting a keyboard and mouse was an impossibility and just of this world

    "A Console with Keyboard and Mouse support? NO WAI that'll EVER HAPPEN!"
    :rolleyes:

    But now you know that the PS3 does support it, your answer is

    :banghead:

    Since your so thick here it is again.

    Done beating this dead horse :shadedshu
  7. lyndonguitar

    lyndonguitar I play games

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    I selected Weak Spec Consoles. its not about the "Lazy Developers" I know there are some really lazy console to pc developers like Rockstar or the one who made Dark Souls(worst port all-time) but most are really just limited to the Console lead platform modern games have.

    We know for a fact that Consoles are the top dog right now in the gaming world and the leading platform, not that its better, but its applicable for everyone, you don't need 1000$ PCs, you don't need tech knowledge.. just buy the console, buy a game, play. easy as pie.

    So we could solve that by releasing new consoles, graphics/performance/gameplay would go up, again the Console as the lead platform, but with better specs = means better experience on PC too. The problem would be back again after five years.

    The ultimate solution to this is "Release Consoles more often"
  8. Rei86 New Member

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    I actually have to defend Dark Souls.

    From Software didn't have too but they took it upon themselves to port the game. It was their 1st ever PC port and was only done so because the fan petition. That should mean something as a developer was willing to work on a product WITH ZERO knowledge that they would get anything in return just because the fans asked for it.

    Time constants to push out the release is one reason for the poor optimization and most likely the reason we got 720 vs 1080. But the fact that major issues that the console version had where fixed shows that FS did try.
    Could they have fixed that at least the resolution issue? They should have but are you a coder and know the time/work it takes in porting a game?

    The 30 fps issue is a limitation with the engine. The physics runs at 30 fps and the network runs at 30 fps. So, if you the user saw more than 30 fps you would see glitched out physics and network lag. The whole game was built around it.
  9. KainXS

    KainXS

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    I have to agree with that they need to release consoles more often instead of milking them for all they are worth, if a console game out every 4 years I would buy it, if it was worth it.
  10. Mussels

    Mussels Moderprator Staff Member

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    what they NEED to do, is release new consoles that play the old games, just with smoother FPS/higher res/AA.


    obviously the shortcuts they make designing games to run at set FPS and such screw with this, but thats what people would want. fire up the old classics looking better than ever with the new controllers (or the old ones, even) and bam, happy consumers.
  11. MxPhenom 216

    MxPhenom 216 Corsair Fanboy

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    God we hear this shit all the time. It really can be blamed on lazy developers and dictatorship publishers.
    Kwod says thanks.
  12. Rei86 New Member

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    So you want more Apple products?
  13. lyndonguitar

    lyndonguitar I play games

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    apple products release every year with medium to little upgrade at all.

    Four years is a balanced span, especially if it has backwards compatibility all the way to the first console as Mussels said.

    It will just be a Streamlined Gaming PC that releases every four years for all intents and purposes.
  14. xenocide

    xenocide

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    Uhhhh, explain to me how Rockstar has made lazy ports? The GTAIV port was excellent. I think the problem with that game especially was that people seem to think "Optimized" means it runs super smooth super easily, but "Optimized" really means it makes full use of the available hardware--which GTAIV did. The only problem was that there were a lot of settings to fiddle with because it was a proper PC port, and some of the more inconspicuous ones had huge impacts on performance. If GTAIV were a poor port, it wouldn't have hundreds of PC-exclusive options or a very impressive mod kit. If anything, Rockstar is one of the best companies when it comes to PC ports.

    The only other companies that have done nearly as much work in recent years was Gearbox with Borderlands 2, and the company that made Sleeping Dogs, which I heard was an amazing port thanks to Square-Enix pushing developers to hire a whole team to handle PC Ports.

    This is currently the longest generation of consoles to date. I think on average it was 4-5 years, and we're currently closing in on the 8th year of this generation, and Sony and MS haven't even announced their new systems. In addition to that, they have already stated they support the 7+ year console cycle.
  15. Rei86 New Member

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    We're on a five year cycle.

    The only reason why this generation is running long is because MS fked it all up since they jumped the gun (had to beat Sony) and we hit a economical rut.
  16. lyndonguitar

    lyndonguitar I play games

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    Hmm I might be mistaken when I said Rockstar and From Software was lazy as an example but my main point is "its not about the Lazy Developers" so I kinda agree with you here

    Exactly
  17. lilhasselhoffer

    lilhasselhoffer

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    I think there are two or three fundamental points that have been argued recently.
    1) Consoles need to be released more often.
    2) PC gaming is not supported as much as consoles.
    3) Mouse and keyboard support differ from gamepad input so substantially that it isn't funny.


    There's a laundry list of responses here, but I'll touch on my favorites.
    1) Consoles released more frequently would have to start making compromises. Less GPU integration, less code optimization, and looser security. A console with all of these things is a PC. The difference is my $500 PC can be upgraded with a new GPU once it gets old. My $500 console needs to be replaced, and my entire game library might be worthless upon replacement.

    Additionally, developers like consoles because they aren't prone to change. Remove this, and the developer looks back to PCs.

    Licensing fees are high. You pay MS, Sony, and Nintendo to certify games. Imagine certifications when you have three generations of hardware in the wild for each brand. You might as well not develop anything, between expanded coding costs and testing.


    2) Do you really think Steam is "less supportive" than Sony and MS? I have to say that AAA titles do prefer consoles. Truly innovative and non-formulaic games reside on the PC. We can argue until blue in the face, but it's the objective truth.


    3) Yes, it's difficult. No, it's not impossible. Saying that the mouse cannot be nerfed, or have the input automatically scaled to match the input rate of a gamepad is giving up before even trying to solve the problem.
  18. xenocide

    xenocide

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    It's definitely not a five year cycle, and Sony plans on supporting the PS3 through at least 2014. They have been saying since 2006 when the PS3 launched in NA that they had planned on it lasting for 10 whole years--twice as long as previous console cycles.

    Microsoft expected Kinect would buy them some time but it hasn't seen the adoption they wanted, and people are starting to tire of no versions of games on old hardware. When this generation of consoles came out Sony was the company to beat considering how insanely successful the PS2 was, so you can't fault them for wanting to get the console they threw together at the last minute out before them and try and snag as many potential buyers as possible. Here's what Microsoft thinks of this console cycle:

    Check out this article. Skip to Steve Peterson's portion. 30% drop in Console sales (both Software and Hardware) year over year for the past 4 years. This long console cycle shit is bad business. Sure, they are still doing fine since their consoles are now ridiculously cheap to manufacture and software sales (especially first party games) are doing great, but as a whole, consumers are bored of their dated consoles at this point. I haven't played a game on my PS3 in almost 6 months, I've only seen a single person on it playing the new FIFA every so often in that same time frame. My friends and I used to get games at launch and play online (mostly MW2 and FIFA games) but now we never bother mentioning it because nobody wants to shell out $60 for something we'll play for a weekend then ignore.

    Square-Enix hates this long console cycle.
    Ubisoft hates this long console cycle.
  19. Rei86 New Member

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    Its been a Five year cycle for very long time. Nintendo is following the path and is launching the Wii U this year.

    The only reason why Sony isn't launching is because they're waiting for MS and MS is waiting for Sony. However we all know the talks in the back is happening with a new console announcement happening probably in 2013 E3.

    Playstation Launch date fall 1994
    Playstation 2 fall 2000
    Playstation 3 fall 2006

    SNES 1991
    N64 1996
    Gamecube 2001
    Wii 2006
    Wii U 2012

    I don't know what you're talking about, the Kinect is a huge seller.

    And yes I agree with what MS was thinking. Being the first out the door with a reasonable price allowed them into as many homes, but still doesn't change the fact that jumping the gun is the reason why we're still waiting.
  20. xenocide

    xenocide

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    Even Nintendo held out for an extra year, but with Wii hardware sales plummeting they rushed to get the Wii U out a little earlier than they intended, otherwise I guarantee it would have been announced about the time the PS4 and X720 will be. I don't know that either company is really waiting that much, like I said, Sony stated they wanted the PS3 to be around for 10 years, and have been saying it since launch, Microsoft never really comments on these things, but they seem to think they can squeeze more out of the 360, so I don't expect an announcement from them until 2013.

    I was talking about Kinect's ability to breath new life into the system--which it failed to do. Microsoft expected it to be wildly popular, so much so that when it was announced at E3 2009 it was the centerpiece of Microsoft's presentation. They have sold a lot of Kinect units, but the major problem is that the games for it are still mediocre at best. The only ones bringing in money are Just Dance and Dance Central--the prior being pivitol to the Wii's software sales. You could probably buy a Wii and every Just Dance game for the price of an Xbox 360 with a Kinect.
  21. Rei86 New Member

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    Which is sad because no console accessory has been successful in the way of getting developers to make something worthwhile.

    Playstation 2 HDD anyone?
    32X?
    The Power Glove?
  22. j924 New Member

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    Sucks. I remember when developers started dropping LAN support from their games. LAN parties were a big thing 10 yrs ago & way fun, hell I even remember when ppl would hook up a few vanilla Xboxes & play Halo, now nobody does that any more. Everything is online now.
  23. lyndonguitar

    lyndonguitar I play games

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    Kinect??? Move?
  24. xenocide

    xenocide

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    Kinect actually did sell pretty well, but the problem now is that making games for it is pretty difficult since you can only use body motion for controls. With no buttons it's near impossible to make anything complex, hence why you have a bunch of dancing games and simplistic sports games... as well as some about petting furry fuzzy wuzzy animals.

    The Move on the other hand did terribly, and Sony's book reader thing probably won't do wonderfully. I think the only real successful accessories in terms of sales have been the Kinect and maybe the Wii Fit Board thing. There was also the NES light gun, but there really has never been anything that recieved a ton of support from everyone.
  25. eidairaman1

    eidairaman1

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    Old Console Emulation is done best by a Desktop LMAO.

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