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Do have to buy all 4 sticks of RAM in the same package to get quad-channel?

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Heres the situation.

I've been tasked by a local accounting company to build a VM server.

They have multiple accountants out at customer's locations.

Right now each person has a desktop at the central office, and a laptop used solely to remote into their desktop at the office.

They spent most of their time at customer's locations doing accounting work, but they use their laptop to remote into their desktop at the office and do all their work on the desktop in the office.

They have to do this because the accounting software they use to do tax returns and such resides on the server in the office, they also store all the excel spreadsheets and word document work on the server at the office as well, they don't want any customer financial data stored on the laptops for security reasons.

So the laptops are only used as a portal to connect to their desktops.

However, they spend almost no time actually at the central office on their desktops.

When I came in to take over the IT work for this company I told them this is a very inefficient way to do things.

They basically have a bunch of desktops around the office that are sitting there running when they don't need them, a VM server running multiple VMs that each person logs into would be a much better option.

That way, even when they are at the central office sitting at their desk, they still remote into their VM using the laptop.

They also plan to expand hiring a new accountant about every 6 months.

I know it is a long explanation for a short question, sorry.

Anyway, the basic build I'm doing for them will be:

Intel i7 5820k
AsRock x99 Extreme4
32GB RAM
3x480GB SSD RAID5

The important thing is expandability as they add more people.

Each VM I want to have 120GB of SSD space and 4GB of RAM.

Right now they have 4 accountants, but by the end of this year they want to have 6, and by the end of next year 8, then 10 the year after that, and so on.

They want to have about 20-25 people in the end using this machine, so 20-25 VMs.

I know I can add SSDs as needed, so no problem there.

I know the processor is a little under-powered for 20+ VMs with only 12 threads, but they don't want to spend $1,000 on a 10-core Xeon right now.

My hope is that by the time they need more than 12-threads, that broadwell-e Xeons will be out, and I can pick up a used 10-core haswell-e on ebay for cheaper than $1,000.

Or who knows, the 12-threads and high clock speed of the i7 might be enough, they are just largely doing data entry into a program, the program does a little number crunching but nothing crazy, but if the CPU isn't up to the task, we'll address that issue when needed.

I might even do a conservative overclock on the i7 to 4.0ghz, hoping that might help when the number of VMs gets higher.

But with RAM, I want to be able to go up to 128GB in the end.

So I want to start with 32GB but only two sticks.

Then when needed add another 2 sticks to bump up to 64GB next year.

But the question is, when I add those two sticks to the two sticks already in the server next year will Quad-Channel work?

I'm hoping to buy the same brand and model of RAM so everything should match.

TL;DR I want to start with 2 16GB sticks then add 2 16GB sticks later and finally 4 more 16GB sticks laterer.

Will quad-channel work when I add the extra RAM?
 
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VM server for company YES. YES, YES (buy four sticks in a single package)
You DO NOT WANT problems that will be traced back to your choice of goods.
and you will not have time to f'around with settings...

NOW, if this was your "hobby" computer... Go ahead, minor problems are what make hobbies interesting.

And it is for accounting. DO EVERYTHING BY THE BOOK. Even if it IS more expensive.
YOU will be called in the middle of the night to fix a problem that you wished you did not do.

Accounting will want it to work 24/7 without a doubt, if it does not prepare for endless nightmares of servicing.

Edit: made it clearer as to what my "Yes" was referring to.
 
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Should he go with ECC-RAM?

That aside I 'd go to the bean counters and explain in very simple terms, that buying half of the RAM now and the other half later, could potentially result in higher costs, because they might not work together. Nowdays the probability for that is much lower (bean counters dont have to know that) as in DDR2-times. Especially the downtime can become "expensive" while you try to figure out, why the system won't work. Setting it up right from the start is overall less expensive.

Stick with Crucial (micron) 2133MHz CL15 standard RAM or something similar - something like that has much less trouble potential than some fancy stuff.
 
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Ya, the bean counter will say yes... But they will not accept blame for your actions, if you do so.
They will blame you.

The saying (now quaint) " nobody ever got fired for buying IBM" is applicable... Not that you should buy IBM (they are probably trying to save money by not going the tried and true route.) but because, back-in-the-day IBM was trusted (EXPENSIVE)


BTW, DDR4 RAM is real cheap now so 64GB will not be that expensive (it should only get more expensive... IMO plus you are going to use not Overclocked RAM but standard ie 2133DDR4
 
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What about Intel Xeon E5 2630 v3 8C/16T or Xeon E5 2630 v4 10C/20T . Both are 85W TDP .
 
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You want a server for this kind of usage especially as it's business critical, that said it doesn't really sound like you have much experience in such a setup and I really wouldn't advise you to take it on as your first time cause it could go horribly horribly wrong.

You'd need at least one dedicated physical core per user, a server infrastructure, a vm infrastructure, high speed enterprise nas, gigabit connections to and from everything, ecc ram etc and the list goes on, by no means something you should be thinking of doing just because you know it would work better than what they're currently doing. It will but to do it right you're looking at mega bucks anything from 10k upwards to do it right I'd say
 
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@NdMk2o1o beat me....

Do you want to do hardware support or IT? If you build this server, it will be your hardware to support. If ANYTHING goes wrong, YOU will have to figure it out. If anything goes wrong with their software, they will assume that it's your hardware.
Thoughts:
It's hard to convince a customer to spend the money to move from something that works to something better/more efficient and that will last longer.
DON'T build a server - buy or lease one. (the other benefit here is that server companies offer financing.
Accountants are, in my experience, spend thrifts, but they will cough up the money to do the job right, you just have to talk their language and put the numbers down on paper to show them the 2 roads ahead of them, one with how they're doing it and one with what you're proposing.
Overclocking and accounting software should NEVER be mentioned together in the same conversation.

You need to be willing to walk away from this customer if they're not willing to do it right. The customers that want to do it as cheaply as possible eat up your time.
 
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Overclocking means heat . Heat and server - bad thing ! Also all parts must be reliable so they could run 24/7 .
 
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Yeah, I wouldn't build a gaming computer sans-videocards to use as a VM host. This type of application calls for enterprise hardware.
 
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An RDS server may be a better option as you wouldn't need as much grunt as a dedicated VM for every user and it sounds like RDS/terminal services would service their needs adequately but again if you have no experience in such a setup it's not something you should undertake, and as mentioned, overclocking in a business environment like this is a big no no! which is why you shouldn't take this on if you need people to point that out, bluntly speaking. I would say a decent quad core chip and 8/16GB RAM in an RDS environment would me more than sufficient for them even with more users.
 

cadaveca

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TL;DR I want to start with 2 16GB sticks then add 2 16GB sticks later and finally 4 more 16GB sticks laterer.

Will quad-channel work when I add the extra RAM?
Every single ram manufacturer will tell you, if you want quad channel, buy quad channel, and to not mix kits, especially if you are not buying them at the same time. Can you get it to work? Most times, yes. But sometimes, the kits you'll find in the future will not be the same as the kits you buy now, whether due to them changing the actual memory chips on the sticks, or different binning, or whatever....

So buy the full quad kit now, and install it now. It'll save you headaches in the future.

As to the rest of it; I'm no IT guy. I don't administer servers; just build'em from time to time. @MxPhenom 216 worked at Microsoft build and deploying servers, and there are other guys (in this thread even) that do these things on a regular basis, so listen to what they have to say, I guess! :p
 

MxPhenom 216

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So, I am going to give some insight on 2 specific experiences I have had with memory of 4 sticks.

For my current system, since the 2 stick kit of 8GB was so damn cheap, cheaper then the quad stick kit, I bought 2 kits. @cadaveca informed me that it might not work 100%, at least not XMP since XMP does not work with 2 seperate kits, but being that I have a Z87 board, I was able to get it working with some tweaking of manually memory timings and voltages (system agent voltage being the main one).

Now I just did the same thing for a rig I build my sister, but it has a B150 board which has zero ability of doing manually settings outside of XMP. This turned out to be a problem. When the system is booted up after not having the PSU switched on, itll go through 3-4 boot loops (retraining the memory) and then itll boot up fine. This does not happen as often when the PSU is left on, but system off, as the memory and board is able to hold onto the settings with power still flowing through the system.

Would I go through the risk in either case? Not with a non overclocking and tweaking unlock board (non Z type), but maybe if the pricing between the 2 stick it and buying 2 of them is cheaper than the 4. Otherwise, id just get 4, I also recommend everyone now to just get the 4 stick kit. Unless they get the 8GB x 2 for 16gb.

OP, with that system, just do quad channel right away. Kind of defeats the purpose of having that platform if you don't. Being a VM host apparently. should also have at least 64gb of ram.

Also why aren't you doing a Xeon chip build with EEC memory? Its a server...for a company.

I deployed new servers for almost 2 years at microsoft an 90% of them for VMhosts. memory and core count is key.

Honestly the company should be going through dell or HP.
 
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YOU will be called in the middle of the night to fix a problem that you wished you did not do.

Considering they only work 9-5, I doubt that.

that said it doesn't really sound like you have much experience in such a setup and I really wouldn't advise you to take it on as your first time cause it could go horribly horribly wrong.

I have experience doing it, just not on the 2011 socket.

high speed enterprise nas

Why the fuck would I need that when they already have a dedicated application and data server?

gigabit connections to and from everything

That isn't exactly hard, and already in place.

ecc ram etc

I don't really see ECC being necessary since the desktops don't have ecc, why does the server hosting the workstation need it?

Do you want to do hardware support or IT?

Both, it is specifically what they pay me for.
 

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Ease up folks and stay civil. Help the OP or move along.
 

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I don't really see ECC being necessary since the desktops don't have ecc, why does the server hosting the workstation need it?


Well, that would depend on how mission critical you think the data on it the would be.
Here are some reads that explain it.
Advantages of ECC Memory
And, a really long paper on the subject, written by Dept. of Computer Science, Bianca Schroeder (University of Toronto) and two people from Google, Eduardo Pinheiro and Wolf-Dietrich Weber.
They provide a good case for ECC memory in server designs
.

However, imo, you do need to look at your other factors... cost, can the [company/you/other IT people] handle any down time/data loss, your data backup plan, is it a truly mission critical server, etc.
And, I, myself, definitely, would not be overclocking anything... get what you need to do the job correctly; and, if the company has any policies/guidelines, they should be followed.
 
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Considering they only work 9-5, I doubt that.



I have experience doing it, just not on the 2011 socket.



Why the fuck would I need that when they already have a dedicated application and data server?



That isn't exactly hard, and already in place.



I don't really see ECC being necessary since the desktops don't have ecc, why does the server hosting the workstation need it?



Both, it is specifically what they pay me for.

Running a physical desktop and multiple virtual desktops are not even remotely the same hence you need server hardware ecc ram etc...

Because running multiple instances of operating systems requires huge data transfer overheads.. Don't really like your tone of voice so good luck with this as you obviously have no idea what you're doing.....
 
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