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Domestic vs. Import

Discussion in 'General Nonsense' started by TheMailMan78, Jul 29, 2008.

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  1. TheMailMan78

    TheMailMan78 Big Member

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    Im starting this thread to settle/debate facts about the two. Please keep your fan-boy comments to a minimum and come with facts. Ill start with what I like to call the Import Killer :rockout:

    Also feel free to trash Mustangs. I wouldnt want one of the greatest American classics to be forgotten/defended :toast:
     
    Gilletter says thanks.
  2. flashstar New Member

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    Mustangs were never designed to be muscle cars. A real muscle car is a 1969 Camaro with 350 hp.

    I personally don't care what car you get, as long as it's the best car for the price. I would never buy American just because it's American. If an American car is better than a competing import, I'd buy it. If the import was better, I'd buy that. As long as the controls are in English, it's fine for me.
     
  3. DonInKansas

    DonInKansas

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    Damn....I thought this was going to be a thread about beer.

    *Walks off saddened*
     
  4. candle_86 New Member

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    71 Boss 402 Mustangs stop a Camaro hands down. As for Muscle neither are considered muscle cars, they are pony cars.

    A Muscle car would be a 65 GTO, 69 Charger, 70 Cuda, 69 Roadrunner, 67 Chevy SS. These are muscle cars. As for the argument, Domestic anyday, i like to know my car is back with 100yrs of tradition, and also to know i don't have to go to the manufacture to get parts because the parts arn't sold over here. I would turn down a free import simply for these reasons, im American, ill drive American Cars, and the rest of the world can have the ricers
     
  5. flashstar New Member

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    The Camaro Z28 was a muscle car.
     
  6. Katanai

    Katanai

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    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=etvaHh244Ok

    Here the new Mustang beaten around the track by a real life Mustang. [​IMG]

    :roll:

    It's just goes to show you that using suspension developed in the 1930's on the back axle of a 2008 "sports" car is not a good idea.

    I have to agree that the new Vette is awesome. I've always liked them but I never liked those headlights. Now it's perfect, it handles decently too. :respect:
     
    Last edited: Jul 29, 2008
  7. TheMailMan78

    TheMailMan78 Big Member

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    Yeah thats an unbiased video. :shadedshu

    First off thats a V6. Not a V8. So right off the bat hes a liar. Its a vert also. Iv seen that show before and that guy is so full of hot air.
     
  8. WhiteLotus

    WhiteLotus

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    me too

    :ohwell:
     
  9. Katanai

    Katanai

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    So yeah, a V6 Muscle car shouldn't be able to beat a horse around the track? It's like 200 something HP VS 1 HP. :roll: That should be kinda straight forward but not if it's using Tractor suspension...
     
  10. TheMailMan78

    TheMailMan78 Big Member

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    Of course he wouldn't have lied about the time or anything. Considering he already lied about the engine and car. I can show you a video where a Mustang beats a Busa. Doesn't make it real.
     
  11. Katanai

    Katanai

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    Well I've seen the exact same car driven around a small oval inclined track on TV in a car show. The driver almost died and said he refuses to drive that car again. I guess he was lying too and the accident was just a stunt no? That car is supposed to be a sport car of some sort no? Why the hell doesn't it have independent rear suspension then? Even a 10k Hyunday or whatever has that. Why does this 40k car or whatever it costs lack such a feature? I think that only tractors and trucks still use leaf spring suspension but not all of them...
     
  12. MadCow New Member

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    Well corvettes have leaf springs in the back, and those handle fine. The problem with independent suspension on the back is that it costs money, I remember reading that Ford could've done it, but it would've added close to $4k to the price of the car because of R&D and all that stuff.

    But honestly, who cares? People buy mustangs to look good and go pretty fast in a straight line. Complaining about its rear suspension is like complaining about economy cars for not having leather seats.
     
  13. candle_86 New Member

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    the V6 models do not have any preformance parts on them, no racing suspension no nothing. Ive been in one, they top out at around 125 with govenor and it takes about a minute to get there. Ive also been in a GT thats designed for racing from the groud up, its a much faster car, and the new Shelby GT500 is even better than the GT. No a stock V6 mustang will not corner worth a damn, its designed for ladies and people that want a mustang to drive around, but no purpose of driving it faster than the speed limit or cornering it.

    So the fact a horse could beat it on a tight oval i can belive because a tight oval means keep that car under 20mph, take it a real track and say the same thing
     
  14. Katanai

    Katanai

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    Dude I've just told you that cars that cost under 10K have that and you're telling me it would have cost 4000$. Do you really believe that crap? It's not like it's rocket science man. It's an industry standard by now in all good cars. And it's not like you are presenting it man. Roads do have curves, even in America and if the rear end snaps and you crash and die then it's not that funny or meaningless anymore now is it? It's not like I'm asking why a 70HP car doesn't have it. In some cases the new Mustang can have more than 400HP no? How you gonna handle that if the rear end skips like it's on ice? I never liked companies that go cheap on some parts and then people die because of it. That's almost murder imo...
     
  15. candle_86 New Member

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    agreed, most American Cars that are designed for speed are also designed to go in a straight line, the reason is Drag racing is very popular over here, thanks to fact we have lots of straight open roads, where track racing is popular in Europe and Japan it is not in America, Drag is where its at. Also indepentand rear suspension for a muscle car seems a waste honestly, ive seen a few ricers with American Engines under the hood, i go to the street races here in Ft. Worth, and ive seen a few civics runnings American V6's, and ive also seen some with IRS break because they put to much torque onto the stock IRS and tear the whole rearend up. IRS is great i suppose for Tracks with turns, but in a straight line id much rather know I can have all the torque i want on that rear axle.
     
  16. candle_86 New Member

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    Yes for American Auto Makers it would, its a total redesign of the base chasis for most of there cars. Each manufacture uses the same chasis for cars of similar diminsions, what thats asking them to do is stop production and redisn sevral cars just for the Sports cars, and as i said in America it doesnt matter one bit, as Drag is where its at.

    Also find me an article where a rear axle snapped in half under one of these cars. Its not an industry standard in America, as for our roads, come to America and get on the little out of the way roads where alot of the racing happens, and you will find out very quickly it tends to be 1/4 mile drags.
     
  17. Katanai

    Katanai

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    Here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3GfS3M3UZr0&feature=related

    This driver was going in a straight line on a drag strip of some sorts. Then he tried to brake. Watch the rear of the car and tell me that 4000$ or whatever wouldn't have been worth it. The video is called stupid driver though, because that's the way you Americans think. It must be his fault, one of our corporations can never be wrong...
     
  18. candle_86 New Member

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    no it wouldn't have happened period if he hadn't known how to drive, from the looks of it he hit the E-Brake and held it causing a loss of control, he tried to drive it like an import. You don't use the E-Brake on a rear wheel drive car to bring it to a stop, you press the break pedal down in the car


    if you look at it, he didnt have control when he turned, he was swarving already, and his E-Brake didnt help
     
  19. Katanai

    Katanai

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    Well yeah but the point I wanted to make with that video is that once the tail is gone sliding you are fucked. There's no stopping it. If he would have been on an mountain road with a big drop on the left he would be dead. Or on a normal 2 lane road he would have been killed by oncoming traffic. Was it his fault it happened? Yeah! Could Ford have done something to make that situation less life threatening? Hell yeah!
     
  20. TheMailMan78

    TheMailMan78 Big Member

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    Well if your guy in the video wasn't lying why did he say it was a V8 when he was clearly driving a V6? As for the guy who refuses to drive a Mustang because he lost control then thats just pilot error. I can show you someone flipping a Vett, Viper and an M3 so I guess those are crap cars too by your video standards.

    As for the solid rear axle thats an easy answer. The Mustang is a Muscle car. Not really a sports car designed for cornering. Its a 1/4 mile monster and you dont need IRS for that. Plus its a LOT cheaper. It could have easily been done however. It is built off of the XJ platform after all. The bottom line is the Mustang GT is a cheap fast car new or used. With some cheap extra bolt ons you can hang with cars that are twice its original cost in the arena of the 1/4 mile.

    A small example of what Im talking about is the fact you cant spend 200 bucks (+tune) on a simple intake and gain close to 40hp at the wheels and thats on a brand new 08. If you pick up an old 89 or 90 LX for a few grand (if that) and bolt on maybe 4k you'll have a 900hp+ car for about 10 grand if that. The Mustang is a quick car by default but has been designed for the enthusiast for years now. They give you a VAST amount of options to modify it and in the end its a car just for you. Imports are getting there. Especially the Japs but the fact they are imported give them a huge disadvantage as far as modifying them here in the States.

    In the end imports and domestic "sports" cars are designed for two VERY different demographs. I think they both have there pros and cons but to trash one brand or make because you think the drivers are "show offs" or "Posers" you need to think WHY they think they are driving something fast. Maybe just MAYBE they are and because they dont have a fancy logo on the hood doesnt make them any less of a car. Check this link out. Its food for thought. Wards 10 Best

    Notice the Ford 4.6? Thats the engine thats in your dreaded Mustang. :toast:
     
  21. flclisgreat

    flclisgreat New Member

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    well here in america where not sissy's, if we drive like a tard and wreck, its our own fault and was a deserved punishment.
     
  22. Katanai

    Katanai

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    Straight line speed doesn't mean squat to me. I always liked and watched Formula 1 not Nascar like maybe you have. I was impressed by the cornering speed those cars have. Anybody and his momma can go fast in a straight line. Even the cars themselves can do that with no driver intervention so where's the skill in that??? You gotta face some facts: In real life driving you'll spend at least something like 20% of the time taking corners. That might not sound much to you but those moments are the most dangerous ones. That's when you need your car to be reliable and always perform the same not surprise you with something stupid like this one does. And yeah sometimes even going in a straight line you are forced to take a turn when let's say a kid jumps in front of your car. Would you really want to be in that situation in a new Mustang like the one in the second video I've posted? You think you would be man enough then to handle it?
     
  23. candle_86 New Member

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    not true, take a 16yr old just got his license, and then throw in one of the best drag racers, both with the same car setup the same way, i promise that the drag racer will win. There alot more to it than going straight, you have to know when to shift, at what RPM your car needs to shift to retain the most power ect. It also has to stay in a striaght line, there is always graident on the roads, maybe a little lean, and that can throw it into the side, you must also be very steady and minute with any adjustments you make. Im glad you like Formula 1, i like NASCAR and Drag racing. You have your likes, i have mine, and and for what i like the American V8 Muscle icons of the late 60's early 70's are some of the greatest cars ever made
     
  24. Katanai

    Katanai

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    Yeah I understand your point. But should I start explaining how much more than that it takes to be a REAL racing driver? Remember that most races start with a drag line but then the corners come and another straight line and other corners and other cars too. That's what I admire. The ability to do so many things at once. I can't argue with your last point though. The Shelby Cobra is one of my favorite cars ever as is the 60's Corvette. But my all time favorite has to be this one:

    [​IMG]

    :respect::respect::respect::respect::respect::respect::respect::respect::respect::respect:

    Ironically it has the exact same problem as the new Mustang. Only worse. :laugh:
    It was never beaten by a horse tho...
     
  25. Snipermonkey2

    Snipermonkey2

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