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e6600 vs x2 3800+ system price comparison

Discussion in 'General Hardware' started by AshenSugar, Nov 26, 2006.

  1. AshenSugar

    AshenSugar New Member

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    this is something i posted on pcper replying to a guys thred about choosing between am2 and e6x00 for GAMING.

    this to me is a good example of why going amd is cheaper for the same GAMING perf.

    add to this the fact that am2 will be happy with even cheap ddr2 533 and you save even more, from my personal exp core2 prefer HIGH speed ram, 800-1066 they dont do as well with ram at lower clocks and in some cases the boards act weird if you try and use 533 or 667 ram in them(asus and msi and intel boards i have personaly seen act very odd with anything below 800 rated ram)

    add to that the fact that am2 boards will accept/run am3 chips and you got a far more future proof gaming system when you go with am2 vs 775(intel software fuses chips to force people to buy a new board, 775 has 3-4 versions already)
  2. .:{KC}:.

    .:{KC}:. New Member

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    AMD all the way ! I almost bought a e6400 rig today just this mornin, Really glad i talked myself outta it.
  3. ChaoticBlankness

    ChaoticBlankness New Member

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    WTF is wrong with you...? The e6600 and e6400 murders the 3800+, and I'm an AMD guy!
    Last edited: Nov 26, 2006
  4. AshenSugar

    AshenSugar New Member

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    yeah when i got this rig i had considered core2 but with the way intel changes sockets/socket specs i desided fuk that, i mean honestly who wants to buy a new board every time a new chip/core comes out?
  5. AshenSugar

    AshenSugar New Member

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    but price for price in the gaming world your better off with a better video card then buying the more expenvice cpu, and in a year when intel brings out a new core, well you get the honour of buying a new motherboard to use it even if you spent 350+ on the best motherboard made.

    and when amd brings out their new chips(dubed k8l by intel) am2 users can just slap one in and keep going.

    "K8L > Conroe" as your sig says ;)
  6. DOM

    DOM

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    K8L is that the 4 core one i dont know that much about amd
  7. beachbum86

    beachbum86 New Member

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    Oh no, last time i listed this a dude showed up at
    LMAO

    Core 2 Duo pwns all AMD CPU's to date.

    A (lightly) OC'ed e6300 out mucsles an FX-62 in both gaming and audio/video stuffs....

    An E6400 just this at stock speed..if OC'ed FX-62 is left in the dust.

    So the E6300 @ $180.00 or FX-62 @ 800.00 (of corse your thinking of the 3800..but you know what im saying)

    http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=2802&p=4

    lol and your even thinking of the E6600..which just flat out PWNS any AMD cpu !!
    Last edited: Nov 26, 2006
  8. AshenSugar

    AshenSugar New Member

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    k8l is quad core but its also going to have dual core versions, its along the same lines as the move to core2, alot of changes to the design to improve perf.

    beachbum86: you can get fx-62 perf out of a 3800+ with decent cooling(18bucks) and for gaming core2 vs x2(current x2) really dosnt matter as the only cards that arent GPU limmited are the sli 8800gtx cards that run like 600-700bucks per card, even an x1950xtx or 7950gx2 is the bottleneck in current game systems.

    and with amd you get assured future chips, with intel, well they like to SOFTWARE FUSE chips to FORCE you to buy a new board.(core2 chips are software fused to not work on older boards)

    and stock e6300 is SLOWER in most tests then a far cheaper overclocked x2 3600+ or x2 3800+, sure it can overclock but you need a decent board to overclock, again they are more expencive, so 180+120(min i have seen for a truely decent clocking core2 board) or 150+80.

    personaly i stick with what i know will have future support, and thats not 775/intel, am2=years of new chips that work in current boards :) (all am3 chips will be backword compatable with am2 boards!!!!)

    check this out b4 you tout the e6300 as being the better choice.

    http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/cpu/display/athlon64-x2-3600.html
    x2 3600+ runs $130bucks USD(hard to find in the states, gotta use froogle), x2 3800+(65watt or normal) is $150USD and easly clock up to 5000+ perf(or higher)

    http://forums.techpowerup.com/showthread.php?t=20773
    2nd to the last post on that page has all the NUMBERS of an e6300, vs an x2 3600+, x2 3800+, x2 5000+, pentoim-d 915.
    for the $ the 3600+ is the best value(same chip as the 3800+ just 1/2 the l2 cache per core)
  9. beachbum86

    beachbum86 New Member

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    Oh no, last time i listed this a dude showed up at
    Ok first off...the 3600 was oced to 2.6ghz as the C2D was bone stock at 1.86ghz.

    Second, the C2D OC's to 3.0ghz with stock cooling and no special motherboard.

    Third the C2D has 2mb L2 Cache as the 3600 has only 2x256 and the 3800 @ 2x512

    Fourth lets keep the site you like for referance...but flip the tables. Lets OC the E6300 and see what happens :rockout:

    http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/cpu/display/core2duo-e6300.html
    Last edited: Nov 26, 2006
  10. magibeg

    magibeg

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    Well heres the thing, when you get a core2 instead your also futureproofing your system. I know it was geared towards gaming and such but i'ld be willing to bet the intel system would be better than the amd system in everything. I think something else you'ld have to take into account would be which system would you need to upgrade sooner to play the latest games?
  11. beachbum86

    beachbum86 New Member

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    Oh no, last time i listed this a dude showed up at
    hehe, the board im getting has 3x PCI-express slots and Supports C2D,Extreme and Quad core...i wont need an upgrade for 3 or more years. And this upgrading thing is rubbish, I have a buddy with an Athlon XP that plays F.E.A.R and other games out just fine..on high res with his 6800 ultra.
  12. DOM

    DOM

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    also i read some where dont remmber where but intel are going to become 1066 pin and im sure amd are also going to change to so your never going to have something thats good for long there just going to get better and better so buy what you want your only going to live once well thats my opinion :toast:
  13. AshenSugar

    AshenSugar New Member

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    http://enthusiast.hardocp.com/article.html?art=MTEwOCwxLCxoZW50aHVzaWFzdA==
    pretty much any cpu you get today will do the job, so why spend more then you need to when ur gonna be gpu limmited anyway?

    and by the time i "need" a new cpu i will have replaced the video card 1-2 times since its the bottleneck in any current system.
  14. AshenSugar

    AshenSugar New Member

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    2.6 out of a 3600 is cake, on forums i have yet to see anybody who didnt get 2.8-3.2 unless they had a board limmit(cheap crappy via based boards are the worst)

    price for price for gaming amd wins, your better off buying a better video card then buying a more expencive cpu.

    also your wrong about the need for a decent board, i have setup 6 core2 systems, 2 on decent boards($120+) and 4 on various cheap 60-80$ boards, the lower end boards sucked, couldnt clock worth a damn, thankfully those system where being made to run as tivo type units encoding video on the fly(3 where for a buddy and his family to use as MPC units) one is made for monotoring 26 video camras at a buisness i work for, their specialized system used for that died(quad xeon space heater) and we replaced it with the core2 e6600 combo deal we could get at frys, it records 8camms in real time(hardware h264 encoding) and time laps the rest(1 fraim every like 15-20sec or some crap) the core2 was easly able to do the job of the xeon system and takes up alot less space, this is one use where core2 is def better then amd, well till k8l or 4x4 are ready for prime anyway.

    for gaming tho, really your better off getting a cheaper chip/board and better video card then spending alot on a cpu, and well the stuff i listed will give you a better gaming rig then going core2 will as long as you put the $ you save into getting a better video card.

    video card trumps cpu in gaming and will for the forseeable future.
  15. beachbum86

    beachbum86 New Member

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    Oh no, last time i listed this a dude showed up at
    lol-


    The C2D CPU's give the biggest bang for your buck..meaning they beat out the AM2's clock per clock. Its simple. the E6300 is only 40 bux more than the 3800+ but yet it can be easily compared to the FX-62 in performance. Where dont you see the value in that?
  16. AshenSugar

    AshenSugar New Member

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    amd's optiron server and 4x4 line are socketF over1k pins, but desktop cpu's are going to remain 940/939 pin count, am3 chips will work in am2 boards, they will just have 1 less pin so that u cant put an am2 chip in an am3 board.
    and 3-5 years of new cpu's will work in current amd boards, intel cant/wont do that, they rely on selling chipsets and boards to much(hence the need for a new board when you got c2d even if you had a 350$ board running a pentium-d the board only being months old.

    yeah c2d is faster but for GAMES it dosnt matter, that 40bucks is better spent on a better gpu!!!!!
  17. beachbum86

    beachbum86 New Member

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    Oh no, last time i listed this a dude showed up at
    lol find me a Video card where only 40 bux is the difference... that actualy warrents the 40 bux. :laugh:

    and how do you know it will be 3-5 years for these chips? remember s754-939..LMAO shortest in history!! :roll:

    and the CPU is one of the most important components..why skimp. The C2D will do better in BOTH gaming and Graphic/Vidoe/Audio use..

    And i think the INTEL dudes are pretty smart people, there might be a method/reason for all the socket/chip set changes...maybe progress?? Looks to be working to me :)
  18. DOM

    DOM

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    beachbum, you know what im talking about, right? cuz they need to come up with new stuff to make a better cpu but if thats whats amd's going to do like he says there never going to get ahead
  19. trt740

    trt740

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    I would buy an AMD chip if you have DDR

    Its if you have existing ddr not ddr2 I would buy a 939 motherboard and chip. I priced a new core dual system and including 2 gigs of ddr2 its like 600.00 dollars not including the video card. If you have ddr you can buy a 939 board for say 66.00 that overclocks like crazy. Then you can buy a 4200 for 180.00 dollars or a Opteron 170.00 for near the same price. Then take the difference and buy a monster video card. If you don't have ddr and need ddr2 then buy all means buy a core dual. The AM2 chips are not worth buying if your going to buy a AM2 system forget it and get the new intel chip e6300 etc. The AM2 chips hardly outperform the 939 socket AMD chips. Thats how I feel but no matter what you buy at really high end graphics none of the three chips listed here are really mutch faster than the other unless you buy a 900.00 intel chip. Maybe in a year or so but buy then AMD and Intel will have new chips out anyway. Shoot we haven't even used the potential of the Pent D Dual cores or the AMD 64 x2 low end chips yet so why bother with a system that won't make a difference. Hardly any games use more than one core!!!
  20. AshenSugar

    AshenSugar New Member

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    nope, same chipsets, hell i compared 2 intel boards one c2d ready the other pre-c2d, the ONLY diffrance was the bios chip used, the newer board had one that had more space on it for flash swap the chips and the old board would work with c2d chips, and the newer board wouldnt, other then the chip and a silkscreend board number diffrance the boards where the same, but one couldnt run the c2d chip due to bios chip being diffrent.

    the specs of the socket where not really changed, they just forced you to upgrade so they could sell more boards/chipsets not because progress, unless u mean them making progress filling their pockets :p

    as to gpu, couldnt you ask for something more challenging?

    http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16814161043
    240bucks 1950pro iceq
    12 pipes
    36 shader units
    256mb
    http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16814103025
    280bucks x1950xt
    16 pipes
    48shaders
    256mb

    the perf diffrance is quite worth the extra$ your spend, check the reviews.

    i could list more examples but this ones plenty, the x1950pro(same deal as the x1900gt just without the chance to get an unlockable one) vs the x1950xt is quite a perf diffrance really, bouth are good cards, but honestly if it was up to me i would grab the xt anyday as its gonna give the best price/perf/longevity.

    also not that 40bucks is just a start, compare ddr2 533/667 vs ddr2 1066(what c2d chips run best with) 2gb is minimum for new systems specly gaming systems, 1gb just dosnt cut it anymore, amd chips dont need/take advantage of ddr2 beyond 800, hell you dont see a benchmark/game perf diffrance between good 533 memory and 800 and 1066 with am2 chips, the only diffrance you will see is in your pocket book :p


    my ocz ram was a good deal, clocks nicely, has been tested to well over 800clocks and i found that its best to get lowest latancy possable vs highest clocks possable when using amd.
    intel wants/needs higher bandwith as latancy is alwase gonna be worse on an intel system due to chipset based memory controler vs cpu based.
  21. AshenSugar

    AshenSugar New Member

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    if its less then 2gb hes better off just going ddr2 as ddr2 is cheaper for a good kit dumping $ into ddr1 would be stupid if you dont already have a good 939 rig.
  22. beachbum86

    beachbum86 New Member

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    Oh no, last time i listed this a dude showed up at
    If no progress then why does C2D pwn AM2 in every test? Why would a C2D that is sub $200 be comparable to a AM2 that is sub $800?

    This is what im talking about, for such a small price difference the C2D is a much better choice for your ENTIRE PC..not just gaming..

    doesnt matter what DDR2 you put in a C2D rig..the CPU will still outperform an AM2 with matching ram.

    Intel is more effecient IPC wise (Instructions per clock cyle) and that is where it KILLS AMD, even if AMD supported 1066 or 1333, it would still not be enough to catch up "Overall"


    Check out the PI times, there is very little reason NOT to go C2D. If you have money for a new seystem and you want the best..get C2D, If you want to sacrifice performance for 40bux..go AM2.
  23. AshenSugar

    AshenSugar New Member

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    ok u dont get what i was saying, amd dosnt need to support 1066 or 1333 or up, their chips by design dont need the extra bandwith they do better with lower latancys then more bandwith.

    pi means nothing for everyday use or game perf, its not relevent to most hardcore gamers.

    and in gaming ur better off spending the extra 40bux on video card then on cpu, i know you think cpu=all but it dosnt, trust me, putting a high end c2d cpu in a system with slow video card its like putting a v8 in a geo metro, sure it may give you bragging rights, but its not gonna be very practical, and the v8 isnt gonna make up for the fact that its still a geo metro.

    your not gonna feel the diffrance between an x2 3800+ and a e6600 in everday use unless yoru everday use is video encoding or rendering with 3dstudio max, and i really dought anybody whos building for video editing or building a real rendering box is gonna be going with reccomendations of people of tpu forums, they are more likely to check on doom9(video) and 3dsmax forums since thats gonna give them the most valid oppenions.
    tho for rendering they would also prefer a 3dlabs video card to ati/nvidia in most cases ;)

    and your take things out of context,i quoted somebody saying
    , clearly the progress comments i made are dirrected at the fact that he implys that they forced the board upgrade to force "progress" when the reality is that the only reasion intel forced the board upgrade was to line their pockets by forcing people to buy new boards.

    oh and what are you gonna say when k8l comes out and is faster/as fast as c2d but cheaper?
    how bought when those of us who went am2 on the cheap and spent that "40bux" on a better video card are slaping in k8l chips and out performing your c2d system and its inferior video card?

    you gotta look ahead, i know you think looking ahead is all about grabing what appears to be the best on the market reguardless of price, and thats a valid point of view,
    many of us also hold the just as valid point of view that looking ahead also means buying whats the best price for what we want to do now AND can be upgraded later FOR SURE at a reasonable price.

    eather cpu you get is gonna game the same with reasonable video cards.

    by reasonable i mean cards that aren 600bucks each, x1900/1950xt or 7950gtx cards are a good example of the cards im talkin about, cf and sli are not things the avrage gamer is gonna use in my not so limmited exp, sure they are kool but whos gonna spend that kinda scrach on video cards that will be out dated in 6-12 months?

    blah im tired, i hate dealing with computers built by AFI systems(local computer "firm" that sucks worse then packbell did for quility)
  24. beachbum86

    beachbum86 New Member

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    Oh no, last time i listed this a dude showed up at
    lol Your thinking about this too much..

    This thread is about CPU's...not Graphix cards.

    and for todays games...almost any sub 200-250 dollar video card will do the trick just fine.

    In my opinion...you cant realy compare the C2D's and the AM2's right now..because the C2D's are in a class all there own, AM2 is only good if you have like a 100 dollar limit on a cpu or you alrady have an AM2 board and just want to upgrade that.

    For a new system build, C2D is just a smarter choice.


    -edit-
    And how can you base your claims on K8L being so great/cheap when there are no tests done yet or prices out yet??

    If it is Better then great...There will always be something better, this is just how the PC world works.
    Last edited: Nov 26, 2006
  25. AshenSugar

    AshenSugar New Member

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    im basing my assumptions on the fact that amd hasnt failed to beet intel in the same class of chips since athlon came out.

    p3 was slower then athlon
    p4 was slower then athlon
    p4 was slower then athlon socketA
    p4 was slower then athlon xp
    p4 was slower then athlon64
    pd was slower then athlon64 x2(when it finely hit market)

    c2d dosnt have an amd answer yet, but thats not a huge issue for amd currently at least in the retail market, costom build market intels got the faster chip for now, and infact im happy for intel they finly learned from their mistake, moved away from nutburst, but they still are making misstakes, forcing board upgrades being the main one that keeps me from buying intel.

    and when amd finnely gets the k8l chips out on the retail market i have no dought that they will match/beet c2q(quad) and c2d, then likely intel will bring out something new to counter it, hopefully not something as stupid as a simple clock boost like they kept trying to do with nutburst.

    blah, i hate waiting for systems to do low level formats(have to zero the drive to remove some security crap AFI put on the drives, takes so damn long >.<

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