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First Radeon HD 5870 Performance Figures Surface

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I think there are a lot of people who just love to have the newest hardware,specially if its really good too.I think it will do ati no harm releasing these 5800 cards at this time.
 
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Nvidia came first, that's why they are successful in my opinion, ATIs market share increases every year if they keep up bringing out high performance cards at lower prices then eventually the market share of both companies will level out.

Again just my opinion.
 

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Ummm, nVidia releases enthusiast cards ahead of their mainstream offerings as well. Both operate on that business model.

Not only that, but how is releasing like this in any way detrimental to ATI's sales? Whoever has the fastest card gets the most market exposure. So even if they don't sell a bunch, it sells a lot more of their mainstream cards. It's marketing, with the sale of a few high end cards in the meantime. No sense in holding the card back if you have it, especially if it trounces your market competitor's current offerings in performance.

This launch is in no way different than the G80 launch. The G80 sure as hell didn't hurt nVidia, but it did put a serious dent in ATI sales because NV's top end cards stole all of ATI's thunder.

I'm sorry, but I'm gonna have to side with bta on this. I feel you are just flat out mistaken.

when was the last time nvidia hard launched one card in their upcoming lineup prior to ati doing so? to my knowldege nvidia has always launched several cards at a time when they hard launch.
 

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when was the last time nvidia hard launched one card in their upcoming lineup prior to ati doing so? to my knowldege nvidia has always launched several cards at a time when they hard launch.

Not really. 8800GT and G80 are the most recent examples. Both times, they only released 1 or 2 models, just like ATI is releasing a 5850 and 5870. The lower lines cam much later.
 
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Ati are reportedly* coming out with a few entry level cards at the same time as the 5870 and 5850.

550 etc perfect for HTPC and main stream computer users.


* Not confirmed at the moment but judging from the 4 series cards I imagine they will.

*edit* my typos are getting worse and worse I'm now writing completely different words from what I intend : /
 
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if amd releases a larger lineup of cards before nvidia and if the top cards are that significantly more powerful (we will wait to see w1zzards review) than the current nvidia top card then i will say i was wrong. but at this point nvidia is in no rush to launch their lineup. nvidia will not lose anything from amd launching first and amd wont gain much in launching first. as i said in my first post about the subject, we enthusiasts make up a terribly small portion of the consumer base. our buying habits do not mimick those of the usual consumer and hardly generate enough revenue to brag about being first.
 

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if amd releases a larger lineup of cards before nvidia and if the top cards are that significantly more powerful (we will wait to see w1zzards review) than the current nvidia top card then i will say i was wrong. but at this point nvidia is in no rush to launch their lineup. nvidia will not lose anything from amd launching first and amd wont gain much in launching first. as i said in my first post about the subject, we enthusiasts make up a terribly small portion of the consumer base. our buying habits do not mimick those of the usual consumer and hardly generate enough revenue to brag about being first.

But that's where you are wrong. Our buying habits strongly influence the market. That's why both generally release their top end first. If ATI trounces all over the current cards, it will make it look like NV is at a disadvantage (whether perceived or real) and it will negatively affect their sales of all their lines. The company with the fastest card always makes the most headlines, and therefore get free market exposure.
 
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Searching for ATI Radeon HD5870 pulls 3,210,000 from google, I'd say there is some impact from enthusiast cards.
 

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But that's where you are wrong. Our buying habits strongly influence the market. That's why both generally release their top end first. If ATI trounces all over the current cards, it will make it look like NV is at a disadvantage (whether perceived or real) and it will negatively affect their sales of all their lines. The company with the fastest card always makes the most headlines, and therefore get free market exposure.

i have a hard time buying that considering both companies are worth billions of dollars. there is a lot more going on than just "sell to enthusiasts, they will buy anything." considering a top of the line card costs $500 you would need 1 million sales of that card to generate a half billion dollars. that is about half of amd's quartly revenue and they also sell CPUs and motherboard chipsets...
 

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i have a hard time buying that considering both companies are worth billions of dollars. there is a lot more going on than just "sell to enthusiasts, they will buy anything." considering a top of the line card costs $500 you would need 1 million sales of that card to generate a half billion dollars. that is about half of amd's quartly revenue and they also sell CPUs and motherboard chipsets...

Again, you are missing the point. They don't need to sell a lot of the cards. It is advertisment for them, and against NV if the performance is better. People see the headlines of the 5870 being faster and having more features than NV, then they check out the card. If they see the price and decide it's too high, they are likely to check out what else ATI has to offer. In the meantime, AMD will still sell a few high end cards. So it's in no way any kind of loss for them.

Again, we aren't making this up. It's been proven. That's why both manufacturers spend so much time attacking the top end.
 

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Whats important here is momentum...... ATi have this meomentum currently ...... irrespective of whether you have a preference for card vendor/manufacturer..... card sales normally are measured over a 1 year life span these days, purely because within a year each side will bring out faster hardware even if it does not imply improved architecture, most buyers concentrate on value for money and speed, not transistor count, fabrication process or even supported IQ...... generally, in the last 3 years or so, the company that gets first to a new market or performance point maintains improved market share ahead of it's rival for the first or just maybe the 2nd quarter dependant on it's competitors release but in the world we live in.... the majority of sales DON'T come in the first 3 months of a cards release, yes the "enthusisats" tend to buy the new superfast architecture then but 80% of the sales accrue 6 - 12 months after the initial launch, so as we all are painfully aware...... over the forthcoming year, who wins the battle will be decided by the performance and price of NVidia's offerings as opposed to some degree by ATi's earlier offerings if that makes sense.
 

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Whats important here is momentum...... ATi have this meomentum currently ...... irrespective of whether you have a preference for card vendor/manufacturer..... card sales normally are measured over a 1 year life span these days, purely because within a year each side will bring out faster hardware even if it does not imply improved architecture, most buyers concentrate on value for money and speed, not transistor count, fabrication process or even supported IQ...... generally, in the last 3 years or so, the company that gets first to a new market or performance point maintains improved market share ahead of it's rival for the first or just maybe the 2nd quarter dependant on it's competitors release but in the world we live in.... the majority of sales DON'T come in the first 3 months of a cards release, yes the "enthusisats" tend to buy the new superfast architecture then but 80% of the sales accrue 6 - 12 months after the initial launch, so as we all are painfully aware...... over the forthcoming year, who wins the battle will be decided by the performance and price of NVidia's offerings as opposed to some degree by ATi's earlier offerings if that makes sense.

That's what I've been saying. It makes sense. :D
 
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Look the funny side

Now nvidia thinks FPS and resolution is not all , indeed I do agree with the FPS part, but wonder how green products always had FPS the best but the other stuff was a bit weak.

About the resolution I do not agree , cause Eyefinity is what it is , it's something never done before and nvidia is just jealous. Things like game developing studios , workstations could also seriously benefit from such features.

I do think that eyefinity is strictly for entusiast side when it comes to gaming , which is known it's not as large as mainstream, but innovation is good anyways. Plus the Samsung preparing the super thin edges LCDs just for this feature , cause there's a new market that's surely going to rise.
 

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Look the funny side

Now nvidia thinks FPS and resolution is not all , indeed I do agree with the FPS part, but wonder how green products always had FPS the best but the other stuff was a bit weak.

About the resolution I do not agree , cause Eyefinity is what it is , it's something never done before and nvidia is just jealous. Things like game developing studios , workstations could also seriously benefit from such features.

I do think that eyefinity is strictly for entusiast side when it comes to gaming , which is known it's not as large as mainstream, but innovation is good anyways. Plus the Samsung preparing the super thin edges LCDs just for this feature , cause there's a new market that's surely going to rise.

I don't know how Eyefinity actually works but it doesn't natively run the games at those high resolutions. It probably creates a profile in which you specify at what resolution you want your game rendered and it upconverts to your 6 monitors total resolution. Then this profile appears in the game with the "fake" resolution as the name, just as I can create any resolutions that I want for my CRT and they will appear in the game too.

If the cards had the ability (aka shader power + texturing power + rasterization) to play any game at 5000x3000 or whatever, the performance figures shown in these thread would be absolutely fake, it would be running them at 1000 fps!!
 
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That's true , it would seriously need to be a massive GPU to run at those resolutions.

I am just curious for one thing , and was almost right on , how games do not need to support a specific resolution?

Or are games like Crysis so advanced they do not need this game-tide support so whatever your GPU can view , it will work?

Well I hope so.
 

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That's true , it would seriously need to be a massive GPU to run at those resolutions.

I am just curious for one thing , and was almost right on , how games do not need to support a specific resolution?

Or are games like Crysis so advanced they do not need this game-tide support so whatever your GPU can view , it will work?

Well I hope so.

games tend to render internally at one aspect ratio, and then crop to fit.
for example, BF2 was 4:3, and they cut the vertical view down to make it widescreen.

they dont have an "internal" resolution limit, most modern games simply allow any resolution that windows sees fit (the 3D aspect will be able to scale almost perfectly, although UI/HUD elements may stretch slightly)

the ATI xenos chip in the 360 has the ability to render at one resolution, and upscale to another - say a game could be 720P, but the screen can be at its native resolution of 1440x900, for example - who cares if its not rendered at maximum resolution - its a great alternative to lowering the resolution when your performance is lacking, as its better than running an LCD at non-native resolutions
 
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