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HD 4870X2 Beats GeForce GTX 280

Megasty

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DarkMatter

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A weak dollar is one thing but the cost of living in Europe as a whole is ridiculous when compared to the US. Not too long ago, I lived in the UK - in a nice 4 room apt. In the states, that translated over to a 20 room house :rolleyes: The rent in the apt costed about the same as the Ultra. I'm in a much better financial position now but I still can't imagine blowing that much cash on a graphics card. Even right now, that stuff costs twice as much in the UK as the US which is just plain wrong :shadedshu

The card is relatively cheaper than its predecessors, but not by much & that's only one online store. I know that extra cash you're paying is going to all the tariffs being placed on Asian products but at some point you have to say its just excessive :rolleyes:

We're are going totally off-topic. :mad:

The cost of living in Europe is ridiculous indeed, but I have to say that UK AFAIK is well above the average and we could say UK is not Euro Zone. BUT when it comes to hardware or electronics prices are not excesive taking into account the average salaries. Yes we have to exclude Portugal, Greece, Eastern Europe countries and yeah Spain, as they are below the average, while prices are the same (I am from Basque Country an "economically independent" region that is above EU average, though). So it's dificult in those countries to pay as much money, but not on others and not by the average. Last time I checked average yearly salary for the EU was 34.000 euros, while at the same time in US was $32.000, in Finland was 47.000 euros and Germany 42.000 BTW. Those salaries are mitigated by the cost of living as a whole, but that means they can buy less houses, eat less, drink less and drive less, BUT they can buy hardware easily, which was my point. Hardware is "cheap", living is expensive. The prices for an apartment in Spain is also ridiculous thanks to the housing bubble derived from the establishment of the euro and the rounding of prices. Happened the same on pretty much everything but things were getting better until the global crysis. Basically 1 euro = 166 pesetas (spanish currency before euro), but most bussineses did 1 euro = 100 peseta so you can see the difference. Important to note that the same didn't happen in the salaries, of course.

In the end things are not a lot better in Spain than in Portugal, in comparison to most countries in the EU, even though they are percentually (as to say) better. In my post I was talking about EU in general as prices are set for the entire EU with slight differences and are calculated with the average purchaser in mind. As I said in France hardware is the more expensive in the world! And that shop is particularly expensive, look at other prices. If previous generations of cards are going to be any indicator, that is, Nvidia didn't change their pricing policy this time around, 582 euros in that shop from France means the card would not cost more than $600 in US and 550 euros in Spain, probably even cheaper in Germany. With the possibility of one vendor selling the card well below that mark, as this is something that happens a lot in Europe and is probably related to the fact that 582 euros = 900 dollar. i.e. when I bought my card for 200 euros, the average was above 250 and the next cheaper card I could ind was 230...

EDIT: :roll: Haha! I was watching TV and they have started talking about the crisis and in the same moment they mentioned it I just realised I had written crysis in this post. Just another fact of the ubiquitous presence of Crysis.
 
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Megasty

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Isnt the GTX 280 the 9800 GTX a single core GFX.. if yes why compare it to a dual core GFX?
 

Megasty

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Old news. Moreover the fact that the RV770 Cores arent running AA through shaders means that AA wont have such an impact on perf. That bit of info they have there isn't garbage.

lol, when I said garb I was referring to info. The links extends to a bit of info that the 4870x2 won't use the bandwidth sucking PLX chip which is possibly the best thing ATi could do for this thing. As for the AFR, I'll believe it when I don't see it :p
 
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well nvidia will come up with a faster card a few months after the GTX280 just like the 8800GTX smack ULTRA THEN THE XXX VERSION, nvidia wont lose the fight.
 

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Isnt the GTX 280 the 9800 GTX a single core GFX.. if yes why compare it to a dual core GFX?

Exactly.

when compared to nvidia dual core they lose.

all they have is a price argument.
 
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considering 99% of gamers pruchase a card based on price/performance it's actually the ONLY argument that makes sense. $500 for a 4870x2 and $600 for a GTX280 means that if the dual out performs it the GTX280's price/performance ratio is in the negatives.

so you and your 1% go ahead and buy it lol.
 

Darkmag

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Isnt the GTX 280 the 9800 GTX a single core GFX.. if yes why compare it to a dual core GFX?

<VENT>
CUASE IT DOESN`T F***ING MATTER, GEEZUZ F***ING F**K. Im serious getting tired of this kind of mindless thinking. ATI/AMD is trying a DIFFERENT approach, stop throwing these sissy fits of ignorance. You'd be singing a different tune if it was nVidia doing it​
</VENT>

On a less serious note, none of us really know which of the 2 card is faster, hoping ATI/AMD but until any real benchmark hopefully gaming related are released, its all speculation
 
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considering 99% of gamers pruchase a card based on price/performance

Eeuhm, 99% of the gamers don't know **** about GPU's. They tink that 9500GT > 8800GT. We look at the price/performance but for every cranky geek on this forum there are 99 "normal" gamers who really don't know anything about GPU's.

I think that out of that 1%, 5% buys the fastest thing out there every generation, no mather what the price, 25% sticks with a specific brand ( Nvidia or ATI ) and upgrades once every 1-2 years and the rest looks at the price/performance ratio.
 

Megasty

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Eeuhm, 99% of the gamers don't know **** about GPU's. They tink that 9500GT > 8800GT. We look at the price/performance but for every cranky geek on this forum there are 99 "normal" gamers who really don't know anything about GPU's.

I think that out of that 1%, 5% buys the fastest thing out there every generation, no mather what the price, 25% sticks with a specific brand ( Nvidia or ATI ) and upgrades once every 1-2 years and the rest looks at the price/performance ratio.

Just thank the heavens for sites like this one. I see ppl coming here all the time asking what card they should buy. Its always the PP winner being suggested. As long as ppl are still asking then our say won't be in vain. But really if the card didn't do it then why is all these goofy sites saying that it does. Would the same be said if the NV was beating the ATi. These 2 comps been fighting each other forever & if one ever got on stop they wouldn't be their for long. It was true x1900 v. 7900 & its true for the 8800 v. 3800. History will repeat itself forever until a 3rd ringer comes in & break this BS up. But I'm not holding my breath :(
 
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GTX 280 will probably have higher minimum frame rates and won't suffer from the micro stutter like multi-GPU setups.


And that, to real gamers, would undermine any potential top end FPS. As always 150fps means squat when you enter a battle scene and hitch and stutter and your card tanks leaving you with 20fps.

There's nothing on the market right now, and probably not for a while, that even needs the performance these cards are supposedly going to offer.
 

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as we have seen over the past year or so, nvidia does not fight a losing battle.

they have stayed very competitive in almost every segment (price/performance), alot of people here are very quick to assume that this time round theyre just going to play it dumb...i dont think so boys.

"they're starting with their top performer for the time being, knowing that ATI's 4870x2 is still a ways away.

Meaning if you want the best performing card on the market out of both camps current next gens, you'll have to have a ton of disposable income, or be patient enough to wait until the 70x2 rolls out.

If the 4870x2 comes out and nVidia still tromps it, price will stay up; if the 70x2 is performing equal or better, nVidia will lower their prices to compete."

i think thats fairly accurate, theyll get it out first, and make a heap of sales (price/performance aside, it will be king of the hill, i dont think anybodies saying a 4870 will be faster) then when X2 comes along, theyll see how she fares against them, and price her accordingly. all marketing decisions.
 
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see therin lies the problem, the gtx280 is too expensive to produce, meaning that if nvidia lowers the price of the gtx280, they lose most of their profit margin (which at the moment is really slim) ati is in a much better position to lower the cost of their chip as it is cheaper to produce. so nvidia can lower the price on the gtx280, but only by a little bit. while ati can go even lower. see it's not that we're counting nidia out, it's that were being realistic based on the specs provided. the gtx280 is monster chip and because of that it will always sell at a monster chip price. (8800 ultra anyone?)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130346

over a year after its debut and still 500$. the gtx280 will be the same, it's too expensive to produce. if anything nvidia can be competitive with a half memory version of the gtx260. but the gtx280 will always be a monster card. it'll have the performance sure, but enoguh to beat a dual card? dunno. most of us seem to think not. but hey it happens the 7800 series didn't compete well with the x1800xt, so nvidia launched a 512mb monster in reply in limited quantities. it turned out to be a pre-release version of the 7900gtx. and thats more likely to happen here. if the gtx280 is struggling, nvidia will simply bump up the launch of it's revision (which fuad says is already taped out) the revision will have a smaller die and could easily be lowered in price while increasing performance from the gtx280.


nvidia lately hasn't been know for lowering prices when theirs is too expensive per performance, they simply launch a revision that has a better price/performance ratio.
 

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HD4870 30-50%>9800GTX, HD4850 25-50%>8800GT thus (minus marketing) HD4850 ~10% faster than 9800GTX & HD4870 ~30%>9800GTX.




Source: w0mbat @ b3d
 

EastCoasthandle

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Source
3D 06 1280x1024

GTX 280 - 14700

Card is running @ 605 core /1110 mem /1300 shader speeds.

QX9650 C0 @ 3100mhz
eVGA 790i ultra
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649.00 USD MSRP sounds about right may even go as high as 700.00 first
week or so.

Taken with just a pinch of salt.
 
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He's a very reliable guy...
 

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TooFast

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Nvidia is in trouble this time. ati is taking a much better approach towards gamers.
 
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I'll believe which card is faster than the other on the official release day, perhaps preferably after a bit more mature drivers. Speculation always makes my head spin. And just 3DMark scores never did and never will do it for me. As for manufacturers benchmarks, sometimes I've found them a bit optimistic.
 

Darren

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Jansku07,
LOL. The benchmark is obviously fake. I have evidence too.

Look at the first picture the 9800 GTX (green bar) performs the same as the 8800 GT (green bar) in the second picture.:roll::roll::roll::roll::roll::roll::roll:


Hope you're kidding with that one...

Scroll up to post #117 and look at the two charts yourself and tell me if iam kidding.
 
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zanex

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Jansku07,
LOL. The benchmark is obviously fake. I have evidence too.

Look at the first picture the 9800 GTX (green bar) performs the same as the 8800 GT (green bar) in the second picture.:roll::roll::roll::roll::roll::roll::roll:

Hope you're kidding with that one...
 
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Jansku07,
LOL. The benchmark is obviously fake. I have evidence too.

Look at the first picture the 9800 GTX (green bar) performs the same as the 8800 GT (green bar) in the second picture.:roll::roll::roll::roll::roll::roll::roll:

Those are actually comparison graphs, so the nvidia comparisons are set to 1 across the board on each bench. The nvidia cards aren't comparable in that graph. Those seem reasonable enough, but we shall just have to wait and see.......
 

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Well, i found and posted this (with a few modifications) on another thread: dunno if it fits in this one but, since were talking about how good / bad a 4850 is, then ...



Source (translated with google): www.publish.it168.com but originally found @ PCDig@ (Portuguese site).

Check the source (publish.it168): it's worth it!

There's also VANTAGE results as well, in the other pages of the source!




Personally, i would like to see a comparison of both 3D06 and Vantage results @ higher settings with a 9800GX2 as i believe this card (4850) is lower @ lower resolutions but higher @ higher resolutions.
 
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