Discussion in 'News' started by btarunr, Oct 18, 2011.
sure wish you could get these with out the IGP save watts and money!
I personally avoided Gigabyte this time when picking out the stuff for my SB build that I just ordered today. They seem to be the only one clinging on to legacy BIOS, and I don't want some crappy BIOS with tons of hacks just to make it comparable to UEFI when I could buy a $99 ASRock board with real UEFI. My AMD E-350 board is stuck with BIOS and has the dumb 3TB hack you mentioned.
Gigabyte has lost my trust with their inability to embrace UEFI, dying $150 Z68 boards and tricky marketing (which they always get busted for something concerning PCIe lane counts or Gen3 compatibility). I think my GA-E350N-USB3 is the last board I will use from them.
That would be nice.
These lower TDP will sell very well. Many companies now have Environmental Policies, incl. ISO 14001 http://www.quality.co.uk/iso14000.htm and carbon offset payments, and emissions targets. TDP really is becoming a "decision factor" in corporate and enterprise spend whereas with s775 this wasnt even on the radar yet.
Even though companies will have quite adequate existing PCs, their environmental policies will get them to invest in 22nm CPUs. Intel needs to match equally sparsam chipsets and not do "An Atom" on their chipset.
I think in the next 18 months we will see hybrid mobile/desktop systems. Basically a corpoate desktop running on a mobile ULV platform
You did not read my post.
of course its going to be a 3.5inch screen.
Its called inter-connectivity to other devices such as LCD's and panels(17-30" lcd/ledhdtv ect..) in the future and its very possible, huge market is available if its utilized.
Nice try though
**EDIT**As in, PSP size and portability on the go.
When @ home or work you dock it, connect it, sync it to a large monitor. ARM processors are progressing at great speed. The reason being, is that every single company that is in the market using ARM processor's are STRIVING to beat the competition in all ways, especially with smart phone's, tablets, and PDA's.
Samsung with there NEXUS phones.
Apple with there Iphone's. There already dual core, and perform a lot of task reasonably well.
Add in the rest of the market and its a competition fiesta !!
Its like having 4-6 different Intel's and AMD's striving to beat one another in speed, usability, and diversity when it comes to hardware. Where there's competition there is ALWAYS improvement.
its already been done with the Atrix 4G... http://www.motorola.com/Consumers/U...ries/Docking-Stations/Atrix-Laptop-Dock-US-EN I admit the webtop app is a bit slow and limited but with arm cores at 1.5ghz and up to 4 of them that should solve the problem as far as speed goes. (atrix has a dual core 1ghz) i have the phone and its nice, don't have the dock yet as i though it a bit slow... i think its a limit of the app honestly. there is a dock that can use a monitor and keyboard rather than the lapdock thing as well.
I'm hoping this will drop the price of the 2500k/2600k when the cpu's come out in early 2012 since that will probably be my next upgrade along with a 560ti.
If only X79 was released later, but come out as IB-E I want to buy high end but NOT be already behind in technology
Thank you good sir, +1
that and windows 8 supporting arm. would be cool to put win8 on my atrix haha
guess we still need to know how large is that "large eeprom size" means, seems mine has:
waiting for me8L details >_>
You just pointed out the problem. When they start upscaling, it becomes sluggish. Sure, with a Quad-Core ARM chip it could be viable, but that won't be commercially viable for about 2 years. Even then, it will only be good for basic purposes. You won't see anyone playing any graphically intensive games on one of those, or running any advanced software. ARM chips are impressive because the environment is so limited. They take a handful of tasks and do them excellently. Try and take even a Quad-Core ARM chip, and do what most people can easily do with their i5-2500k's, and it will grind to a halt.
Intel is a threat to ARM, not the other way around. Intel is taking mobile more and more seriously and they have a pretty fat manufacturing process advantage. All they need to do is decide to design mobile chips for flat out competition instead of this shit they do with Atom. Netbooks could be notably more powerful but Intel holds back the performance to keep things segregated. They run the market from top to bottom and they're very stubborn with their pricing schemes.
Yes, its a shame. We are sitting on quads for some time now, if i am correct, since Jan2007. Intel then released quad in performance segment for reasonable price (not just extreme) despite that there were almost none apps that could utilize 4 cores. It should do the same now. My guess is this is because lack of competition - if amd fx chips would have turned out better, there would be hexa ivy on horizon. If intel released hexa now, my guess is it would be so future proof, that it cripple its (intels) future sales.
Socket 2011. IB-E.
Irritable Bowl Economics.
EDIT: Ok.. one unlocked IBE (IBS?) chip prognosticated to come in at under $600. Cant tell the difference between it and the $1000 version of the same chip though :S
My understanding is that every HD2000 and HD3000 Intel GPU counts in that percentage. What percentage of 2400/2500/2500K/2600/2600K owners use the on-die graphics?
You might also argue that gamers upgrade components and systems on a much more regular basis than non-gamers - so things aren't quite that black and white...
While a large percentage of those would be for the budget box/OEM/office ws, many tend to be snapped up by gamers also - IGP chipset boards tend to be much cheaper than full-fat enthusiast chipsets mobo's, they also offer a suitable backup if you're between graphics upgrades, and offer a fallback position if you're graphics get fubar.
Those "unsuitable" graphics cards still contribute to a sizeable proportion of Stream users
True...but then, a sizeable percentage of people either have both (laptop + desktop) or a gaming capable laptop.
Sixteen billion dollars in PC gaming revenue might not be everyones idea of big money (forecast to reach $23bn by 2014), but it isn't chump change either. I would also certainly expect AMD's Gaming Evolved and Nvidia's TWIMTBP game dev programs to keep pushing system requirements higher to keep GPU sales ticking over (another $13.8bn to add into the equation)
Intel just released their Q3 financials...$3.5bn profit from a record $14.2bn revenue for the quarter probably says that they aren't in any immediate danger of having to subsist off ramen noodles and pizza slices.
Three thoughts on that one...
1.Yup, That's why Dell and HP still sell.
2. AMD are well and truly f%<$@! in that case
3. Pro markets (server/ws/hpc) and diversification
Cool...might come about if if you think ARM can oust x86 in any reasonable timeframe. That's one helluva '"if".
Socket 2011 = SB-E (Sandy Bridge-E) not IB-E at this stage.
Pricing supposedly starts at $294* (quad BCLK OC only) then <$600 (hex unlocked), $1k (extreme). Same pricing as Intel usually adopt for enthusiast chips (see Core i7 920, 940/950, 965XE/975XE for X58 for example)
Faster clock speed, Xtreme vs only "unlocked", more Cache (15M I think). The 1000$ one is to replace the 1000$ 990X, the 600$ one is to replace the i7 970/980X. I believe it may go lower, to 550$ or something, only time will tell
I was not trying to make a point about exactly how much gaming PCs are there. I was just refuting his claim that the mayority of people are gamers which is completely false. The mayority of people use their PC for web surfing, mailing, watch videos (mainly youtube) and a small proportion of them for the occasional gaming that includes web games, Facebook games and Pop Cap games. And guess what, many people buy their Popcap games in Steam. In fact, due to new games being console ports I find myself playing those games and some old games (classics) more time than new ones too, and I have a Sandy B and GTX460... not every Steam user is playing the latest AAA game. In fact I think CS 1.6 and CSS are still the most played games. You don't need a high-end GPU for those, not even 5 year old high-end GPU.
Now I'm confused. Are you trying to prove my point or what? If a sizable proportion of Steam users have unsuitable graphics (won't play the latest games, that's what I meant). Isn't it logical that they do not have the latest CPU either? More than 20% of people still use single core CPUs on Steam. The point is, even amongst gamers, not everyone needs a high end CPU. Cortex A15 is going to be a lot faster than the single core CPU that 20% os Steam users are still using. You can count on that, so is or is not ARM going to be enough for them along with the mayority of people who just do websurfing?
And still it only accounts for a 20% of the market being generous.
At no point did I say Intel would fall apart or disapear. But I'm pretty sure that the days of being a $3.5bn profit company are going to be gone really soon. If you don't believe that, just wait.
Not that I like any of what I'm saying. I'm an enthusiast and want high-end PCs and AAA games built for them. But I'm just being realistic and recognizing that the grand maority of people just don't want or need anything close to what I want, and come 2015 they would rather buy a $20 device with the power of a current Fusion chip, than paying hundreds of dollars for something they don't need. And that's going to happen if not by 2015, by 2020, no matter how much we QQ about that. It remains to be seen if the high-end desktop CPU and GPU markets could survive or not anyway. The gaming market IS growing so while a niche market it can still be big enough, a profitable one, and with lots of competition too.
This is nice and all, but i still cant see reason why it must be arm arch inside those simple internet browsing/word processing devices. I believe amd, intel or both of them will tune their low power x86 cores (bobcat/atom/whatever) soon enough (they are not so miserable at the moment afterall). Of course arm designs are better now, they have been paying attention to this LP market way longer then intel/amd, they arch are optimized for it (created with those LP ideas in mind). I really doubt intel will give up its market share without tough fight. Time will tell.
I think it's a "must" right now as it's the only way to go for those ultra low power devices. But yeah, x86 and ARM are getting closer and closer each other and I for one would like x86 on those small things as well. Windows Everywhere, with the software, everwhere indeed..
no upgrading for me xd
there is no need for that in the first place 2600k ftw xd
No one's saying it will be ARM necessarily that will dominate (although the odds are on their side as I'll explain shortly), but it's the ARM camp that will enter it first (I mean they are 100% pushing there already) and it's ARM camp that will improve it a lot faster at least in the first few years. The reason is Intel or AMD are not interested in these devices becoming more powerful.
Think about it, every device that is powerful enough for average joe will replace one of their desktop CPUs. Even if such a device has an Intel/AMD CPU, that CPU is going to be tiny and cheap (if they want a chance to compete with ARM devices at least), so no matter how you look at it, the mayority of their market shifted from an ASP of $150 per CPU + $100 mobo, to average of $25 per SoC. The company they are today is gone either way, no way to mantain their several dozen billion revenue. So Intel is going to fight the trend, the adoption of such devices as much as they can. The reason (all this is only my opinion obviously) is this, following the example prices from above:
- If the device is powered by an Intel SoC. They lost 1 desktop consumer (-$250) for one SoC consumer (+$25), that is, they lost $225 (compared to current market) and contributed to such devices becoming better, by simply being competitive. (because if the device uses Intel is safe to assume it is better than ARM)
- If device is ARM, they lost $250, but there's not as much competition as ARM is the only one really pushing for faster chips. Yeah, there's many people producing ARM based chips, but only one designing them and moving the tech forward. Big difference compared to 2 big companies/conglomerates fighting each other in designs and production.
The logical steps for Intel are clear for the first few years. Fight back sure, by creating SoCs, but do not compete entirely, do not create the kind of killer SoC that would take the crown yes, and the market share, but at the price of demostrating that those devices are (more) powerful. Use other methods to enter the market rather than using superior tech. This means that for a few years they will bleed desktop CPU market and will not gain too much market share on portable devices, but it's better than contributing to the trend and make the shift happen overnight. More years selling the $250 solution, even losing market, is better than being king in a less profitable (per sale) market, and everybody knows (even Intel), that they would not be king either, only another name in a long list of SoC manufacturers.
Like I said that's my opinion.
So, which BS TDP scale is it this time intel
For competition I can see an 8-core Ivy Bridge with HT. AMD already claimed to be the first to release an 8-Core desktop CPU. Anyhow, Ivybridge will have a hard time taking on Piledriver when released
my asus p8p67 ws revo just had its bios update which enables 22mn ib chips!!! also said pci-e 3.0 as well.........i was kinda happy about that
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