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My overclock: Comments from the experienced w/ DualCore AMD Athlon64 x2 CPU users...

Discussion in 'Overclocking & Cooling' started by Alec§taar, Jul 18, 2006.

  1. Alec§taar New Member

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    See subject-line/title above, first, & please - DO comment if you think you have some ways for me to do this better (given the CPU-z 1.35 data I am about to output here next):

    I now have overclocked my CPU (@ last/finally) & use a CoolerMaster Heatsink/fan/phasechange heatpipe combination cooler...

    It's doing the job alright, even o/c'd to the utmost possible "max" I could pull off here, so far!

    Runs around 40C - 45C iirc, under moderate loads, & during a 90F temp ambient heatwave we're having this week (HOT AS HECK!).

    (AMD Athlon64 x2 4800+, reading @ 2592.5mhz (up from stock 2400mhz) via CPU-z 1.35)

    I also had to 'drop' my RAM back to DDR-333 levels, rather than DDR-400, & still may have to try to "tighten" the timings on it, which I dislike but needs doing - hassle is, if I "push" too hard, it locks up the machine & I have to go "defaults" again & redo it all...

    I am SURE most of you know what I am talking about here (the hassle involved).

    (That memory "slowdown" & "loosening of timings" IS the only part of o/c'ing I don't like, but it IS optimization to-the-max, in that I had to "PULL" from one area (memory) to gain in another (cpu))

    For gaming? It makes ABSOLUTE sense though... o/c the vidcard, & the CPU, and you gain more than speeding up memory (imo @ least!).

    Anyhow/anyways - the data!

    The RAM timings I use (per CPU-z 1.35) are currently:

    CPU:

    Core Speed: 2592.5 (fluctuates +/- .2)
    Multiplier: 12x
    HTT: 216 MHz

    Memory:

    Frequency = 172.8
    FSB: DRAM = CPU/15
    CAS# Latency = 3.0 clocks
    RAS# to CAS# Dleay = 4 clocks
    RAS# Precharge = 3 clocks
    Cycle Time (Tras) = 6 clocks
    Bank Cycle Time (Trc) = 11 clocks
    Command Rate = 2T
    DRAM Idle Timer = 16 clocks

    &

    SPD:

    Frequency = 200mhz
    CAS# Latency = 2.0
    RAS# to CAS# = 3
    RAS# Precharge = 2
    Tras = 6

    The air-cooled + phasechange setup I have here (on both CPU & Vidcard) seem to do the job well... even o/c'd on both, as far as I could go @ this point & running stable!

    So, given that data? Can ANY of you point-out, via YOUR experience w/ this CPU family, anything I ought to shoot for, especially in the area of memory timings "tightening"...?

    THANKS!

    APK

    P.S.=> LOL, what blows me away is, you can combine a variety of permutations/possibles, because of multiplier & clockrate combinations for the memory AND the CPU! I have no idea if I hit the "BEST" one is all...

    Above all - Thanks for info. & input here fellas, you're my resource on this now! apk
    Last edited: Jul 18, 2006
  2. Ketxxx

    Ketxxx Heedless Psychic

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    for a DC thats pretty good, you wont see many "normal" X2 CPUs going beyond 2.6GHz. If you had a DC opty on the other hand....they are tending to do 2.8GHz+

    on the other hand your ram seems pretty crappy and its deffinately crippling what you can do. Mushkin have some nice cheap (and decent) DDR500, so if your looking to replace your ram deffinately give the DDR500 a look ;)
  3. Alec§taar New Member

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    Thanks man, especially considering it's holding STABLE in a "heatwave" the U.S. is experiencing this week (all across nation 48 states over 90 F temp)....

    It was a PAIN bigtime, finding the RIGHT combination for the CPU stuff... I will be back w/ the multipliers & rates I used in my BIOS on my next post!

    (I figure you guys might need it, to advise me on those damn RAM timings! My bad for NOT outputting it here imo!)

    It's Corsair Matched Pair (2x256mb RAM sticks) "basic/value" type memory (nothing special in other words, std. DDR-400)...

    :)

    * So, that said? Let me get back to you shortly w/ my BIOS data settings on CPU clockrate & multipliers, etc. et al!

    APK

    P.S.=> Do my games run faster? I would say "YES, absolutely" & for the "optimization push/pull" from memory to CPU done in o/c'ing a rig for gaming (this may even help my F@H times as well possibly, I don't know). Between this, & "Coolbits.reg" o/c'ing my vidcard (GeForce 7900 GTX OC, also phasechange + air cooled), definitely faster gaming!

    (Anyhow - I think w/ your guys' help, maybe even faster - because you all have experience here!)

    Yes, it is "unique per system" to a good extent due to diff. parts we use, but cannot hurt to ask you guys imo, you ARE the "voices of experience" & all that... brb w/ more data (CPU-BIOS wise)... apk
    Last edited: Jul 18, 2006
  4. Ketxxx

    Ketxxx Heedless Psychic

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    see me edited post ;) your ram is deffinately crippling you. Probably the biggest performance gain you can have with memory isnt out and out speed or the lowest possible primary timings, but the best possible secondary timings which have a part in memory write. If you can crack past 3GB\s you should notice quite a substantial perf boost, especially in loading times for games.
  5. Alec§taar New Member

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    No doubt, I believe it... I'd bet the RAM you suggest wouldn't possibly require "stepping down" the DDR-400 to DDR-333 rates!

    Aha, so... I'd STILL have to "step it down" from DDR-400 (or, in this case DDR-500?) rates, to DDR-333 then?

    * Thanks for info. (learning as I go)!

    Sounds good!

    (I'll eventually buy that RAM then most likely, but until then? I have to "make do" & get this to it's "BEST" settings if possible)

    BRB, with CPU + BIOS multipliers & rates...

    APK
  6. Alec§taar New Member

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    CPU DATA from CPU-z (if you need BIOS stuff, let me know)

    See subject-line/title above first (thanks) & comment (FULL DATA ARRAY FROM CPU-z 1.35, all consolidated here now in 1 post via edit):

    CPU:

    Core Speed: 2592.5 (fluctuates +/- .2)
    Multiplier: 12x
    HTT: 216 MHz

    Memory:

    Frequency = 172.8
    FSB: DRAM = CPU/15
    CAS# Latency = 3.0 clocks
    RAS# to CAS# Dleay = 4 clocks
    RAS# Precharge = 3 clocks
    Cycle Time (Tras) = 6 clocks
    Bank Cycle Time (Trc) = 11 clocks
    Command Rate = 2T
    DRAM Idle Timer = 16 clocks

    &

    SPD:

    Frequency = 200mhz
    CAS# Latency = 2.0
    RAS# to CAS# = 3
    RAS# Precharge = 2
    Tras = 6

    :)

    * Sufficient?

    (If needed on your guys end for commentary, that is)

    APK

    P.S.=> Again, if you NEED more data (say, from my BIOS)? Do let me know... gracias & thanks for the comments + assist here! apk
    Last edited: Jul 18, 2006
  7. Ketxxx

    Ketxxx Heedless Psychic

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    Nope not in the slightest. To crack 3GB\s write speeds you need to be able to run a 1:1 ratio, 1T command rate enabled, and the lowest possible set of secondary timings, for example something like 2-2-2-3. Remember, I'm not talking about CAS- TRCD- TRRD- TRAS timings there ;)

    ed- if you can get me a A64 tweaker screenie and tell me what bios options you have on your board i can start suggesting some timings u can try ;)
  8. Alec§taar New Member

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    WoW... that sounds AWESOME actually!

    (To NOT have to "step it down" from DDR500/400 type rates, down to DDR-333 as I had to)

    Ah... now THAT is the data I wanted to see!

    :)

    * Heh, as far as hardware? It appears I could use better, more o/c'able RAM!

    As far as "fiddling" w/ the RAM timings I do have now though, anyone o/c an Athlon 64 x2 (of any variety) w/ diff. ones & achieve results that REALLY rock, that I might be able to apply?

    Same w/ CPU stuff too! Thanks...

    EDIT PART: What is "A64 tweaker"?

    APK

    P.S.=> That CPU data help any? NOTE - I edited ALL posts w/ the data in them, so they show it all from CPU-z 1.35 (CPU data, & memory stuff too).

    Comments are appreciated, as you guys ARE the "voices-of-experience" in THIS area, & my teachers now... apk
    Last edited: Jul 18, 2006
  9. Ketxxx

    Ketxxx Heedless Psychic

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    Erm, in all honesty, no, not really. Thats why I asked for the A64 tweaker screenie :p
  10. Alec§taar New Member

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    What is "A64 tweaker"?

    :)

    * A software of somekind? If so, where to obtain??

    (Download URL???)

    THANKS!

    APK
  11. KJY9

    KJY9 New Member

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    That will help him the most from where he's at right now.
    When I was running my 4400+, going from 2t to 1t jumped my mem benches immensely.
    ;)
  12. Ketxxx

    Ketxxx Heedless Psychic

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    linky for A64 tweaker, never leave home without it ;) :D
  13. Alec§taar New Member

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    OK, I see the "1T" suggestion & know where it is in my BIOS

    See subject-line/title above, first, & another question from last page:

    1.) This "1T" command-rate thing - can this RAM I use "pull it off"?

    (EDITED OUT QUESTION ON "A64 Tweaker", got it now (Thanks Ketxxx) & see what you mean, brb w/ screenshot of its data)

    I ask, because again, if I screw up? It tends to "lock up my rig" @ bootup & I have to redo it all again, lol... you've all probably BEEN there & know how THAT can be... a pain!

    * Thanks (learning as I go here)!

    APK
  14. Alec§taar New Member

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    A64 Tweaker software screenshot data requested by Ketxxx

    See subject-line/title above, & this photograph/screenshot:

    [​IMG]

    :)

    * Above all, thanks for the suggestions/help/pointers guys!

    APK
  15. Ketxxx

    Ketxxx Heedless Psychic

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    Right ok lets start with tref latency, start by adjusting that to 3120 15.6us, or as A64 simply displays it as, 200MHz 15.6us.

    As for a full set of timings, I'll list them in the order A64 does. 3-16-16-4-4-8-3-3-2-3.

    Also try adjusting the idle cycle limit to 0 or 256, turn dynamic idle cycle counter off. Disable 2T command rate, but leave this till last.

    Adjusting the async latency to 8ns should also help. Lastly you might want to try a weak instead of normal drive strength. A bit generic I know, but I'm a Mushy tech I dunno how corsair\adata spd program their modules :p

    Also dont make ALL these changes at the same time, start with just the async latency and if thats all good, then start by tweaking the other timings.
  16. Alec§taar New Member

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    Wild!

    (You certainly DO "know your stuff" in this area!)

    QUESTION:

    Does the "A64 Tweaker" program write these values to BIOS or something, out of the Win32 GUI RPL3/Ring3 mode of operation?

    * Thanks for info.!

    APK
  17. Alec§taar New Member

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    Excellent, & I will proceed in the manner/order you describe!

    See subject-line/title above, & screenshot below:

    [​IMG]

    :)

    * Gracias above all else... I learned a "new thing" today!

    APK

    P.S.=> Again, I will apply them in the SPECIFIC order you suggest!

    Once more though - A QUESTION:

    Does this apply the DIRECTLY from Ring3/RPL3/UserMode Win32 GUI operation directly to my BIOS?

    Also, does it also require a "reboot" (I imagine it may)... apk
  18. Ketxxx

    Ketxxx Heedless Psychic

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    No reboot needed, A64 tweaker seems to interact directly with the bios, but the settings are not applied in the boards bios. you need to save the config and have it load with a64 tweaker at windows boot. let me know how the settings go, and if all is stable with a 1:1 ratio, then we can start work on tweaking the timings.
  19. Alec§taar New Member

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    Aha, so... this is like AMD/ASUS "overclocking" tools then!

    (Software "emulation" basically, interacting w/ drivers for AMD, & possibly "re-parameterizing them": Has to be this way, imo!)

    QUESTION: That all said - If it works stable, may I apply them IN THE BIOS instead, once they prove "stable" & all that?

    Ah, got ya/will do... so far, I applied them ALL, but haven't "saved the config" yet & did the "apply @ bootup" yet!

    Aha, ok... now, on the 1:1 ratio part - what setting is THAT one on the screenshots I put out?

    (Haven't saved the 2T to 1T yet either, waiting on that)

    APK

    P.S.=> Waiting on results of questions prior to save, apply @ bootup, & reboot so these all take @ next Windows login/system bootup! apk
  20. Ketxxx

    Ketxxx Heedless Psychic

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    MEMCLK frequency ;) change that to 200, and adjust the tref to 200 15.6us at the same time.
  21. Alec§taar New Member

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    Got it, saved to .a64 file...

    :)

    * If this works-out stable, once more: Can I apply it DIRECTLY to the BIOS, instead of using this AMD/NForce drivers reparameterization software (that's my guess as to HOW it works & all that)...

    APK

    P.S.=> AND, if NOT stable? Safemode reboot can help me "undo" this, correct?? TIA! apk
  22. bbriand New Member

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    Yeah dropping my Command Timings from 2T to 1T doubled a lot of my memory scores. Its worth trying :)

    Bill
  23. Ketxxx

    Ketxxx Heedless Psychic

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    You should be able to apply as many settings as the BIOS has available without issues yeah.
  24. Ketxxx

    Ketxxx Heedless Psychic

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    Technically speaking, your not "dropping" when going to 1T, your increasing ;)
  25. Alec§taar New Member

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    Well, got the 2T to 1T (increase/decrease, lol, whatever) going & working so far

    See subject-line/title above:

    So far, the 2T to 1T works, which is good (from what you guys say)!

    Something wasn't though & "locked me up" once the HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE startup area 'fired'... no biggie, because a "SAFE MODE" bootup got me past it to undo it there (by using the A64 Tweaker tool menu option to remove startup settings).

    NOTE - You can't use F8 bootup "Last Known Good Configuration" to undo it either, something to be aware of, if it hangs you up etc.!

    The 2T to 1T is NOW COMMITTED TO MY BIOS memory settings! It works...

    :)

    It's going to be a BIT of "Trial & Error" but nice part is, if you don't do them @ the BIOS LEVEL first? You can "prototype" here first, & use what does work by eventually committing it to the BIOS when you find the right mix!

    (Imo @ least, this is HOW I am going to pursue this, using A64 Tweaker as a "prototyping tool" more-or-less!)

    APK

    P.S.=> Thanks for the info., because of this, I can do this @ will, & not "Wipe out my BIOS" having to reset it to DEFAULTS all over again, & losing what little I gained o/c'ing thusfar on the CPU end, & can 're-engineer' my memory timings now too, w/out "undoing" all else whilst I experiment! apk

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