New headphones, should I get an AMP?

[Zen_]

I think i'm gonna get the MK2 next week when I get paid

It's a pretty good deal for what you get...you can read about it on head-fi too.

You can use it as a USB device or via coaxial digital input...analog outs are always on if you want to use as an amp and DAC for something else at the same time as well.

 

[erixx]

http://www.headphone.com/learning-center/why-do-i-need-a-headphone-amp.php

Thanks, but 1) that is a Sellers web... haha and 2) when I read "Generally speaking, the system is only as good as its weakest link. If you have well recorded music stored on your iPod"

...I don't have a fakking ipod, it is called an Music Player, etc., and I just stop reading... And I don't have weak links: good soundcard and good headphones, excuse me!

Taking them seriously for a sec, they say "as good as the weakest link" so ... How can a 4-wires and 4-condensers (or whatever) amplifier improve sound from a high end soundcard? As far as 'amplifying' okay, but 'improving' ????

I suppose I have to try it, but never saw a bloody soul using them.... Must be 'tiger oil' that cures brain cancer....

 

[Kursah]

Well you need to read about opamps and headphone amplifiers. Many use opamps as sound modifiers or sound fatteners depending on what they want. I use the HP amp in my Auzen Forte which drives my headphones much easier than my old X-Fi Xtreme Music (which I loved using, and drove headphones quite well). It also had better DAC's and a decent opamp that is replaceable so I can tune the wound to my liking. But I've yet to find a need to because for my media and gaming experience, the Forte kicks ass, sounds are crisp and clear, bass is deep and powerful, and my D2000's kick ass. I almost got into the external amps, which would surely blow my internal amp away...but I don't need it seeing as I tend to go for easier to drive headphones. If I went with something that needed an amp to sound right, then I'd have an external amp for it...but that's getting too hardcore and rich for my blood.

I think it depends on what the buyer expects, wants, is willing to pay for and will truly use it for. I don't really see a need for most TPU-ers to go with a dedicated headphone amp. But a good hp amp will bring out a fuller sound, not just a louder sound sooner...tube amps, solid state amps, hybrid amps, all have different sounds, tune-ability and uses. You'll see more on head-fi the more dedicated music crowd that loves to pick apart and analyze sound will go the more hardcore route, while the gamers will find the better bang for the buck hardware that still makes a HUGE difference over any onboard solution period. But for most that already have a decent sound card, an amp is probably not necessary...hell for most that buy headsets, they don't see how a set of headphones could be better till they actually buy a pair, or they're disappointed because onboard audio can't drive them for anything and claim they sound like shit...that's where an amp (sometimes an amp/dac combo) can also come in handy.

 

[Frederik S]

I think a good quality soundcard will be fine for the 780s. They are not the most power hungry cans out there so anything with a half decent output stage will do them justice. A upper end Xonar or Auzentech has both the DAC and amplifier to make them sound very good.

Cheers,
Fred

 

[mab1376]

Found this interesting:

The HFI-780 was created to be one of the all-around best headphones ever made. Now fully modified by Audiolineout to maximize the full potential of these wonderful headphones. The modification consists of internal dampening and structural vibration control. Removal of the diode board and one final transducer mod that greatly improves the dynamics. Then, we re-cable the headphone directly to each cup using our new Ohno Continuous Cast copper (OCC) that is extruded in a special high luster LUX-FEP teflon jacket. This jacket is more durable, and has a smaller foot print and better dielectric than the stiffer PE jacket. The cable is 5 feet long and terminated with a gold Switchcraft mini plug.

http://www.aloaudio.com/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=2_12&products_id=445

 

[mab1376]

Claro Halo XT, if you're fine with PCI. HT | OMEGA Claro Halo XT PCI Interface Sound Card ...

or Auzentech Bravura. It's second-best, but half the price and PCI-E.

http://store.auzentech.com/auzen-x-fi-bravura-71-p95.aspx

what really gives the HTOmega the edge over the Auzentech? the c-media processor?

I think a good quality soundcard will be fine for the 780s. They are not the most power hungry cans out there so anything with a half decent output stage will do them justice. A upper end Xonar or Auzentech has both the DAC and amplifier to make them sound very good.

Cheers,
Fred

Yeah these are loud on my XtremeMusic, I was running through my Z-5500 and getting some strange volume fluctuations, but they are 100 times better directly to the card. Also as I type this I'm listing to some KMFDM after letting them burn-in all day while I was at work. It's utter beauty what a good burn-in does for these cans. I'm also using this nifty Winamp Plug-in that gives me hardware acceleration by forcing the output through OpenAL.

 

[btarunr]

what really gives the HTOmega the edge over the Auzentech? the c-media processor?

Better OPAMPs and branched DACs. Like I said, the chipset is irrelevant today.

Yeah these are loud on my XtremeMusic, I was running through my Z-5500 and getting some strange volume fluctuations, but they are 100 times better directly to the card. Also as I type this I'm listing to some KMFDM after letting them burn-in all day while I was at work. It's utter beauty what a good burn-in does for these cans. I'm also using this nifty Winamp Plug-in that gives me hardware acceleration by forcing the output through OpenAL.

Again, hardware acceleration isn't going to make it sound better, it's a CPU-offload feature, your i7-930 has plenty of idle number-crunching hamsters. Quite on the contrary, hardware-accelerated audio sounds worse. Just to demonstrate, listen to music (over OpenAL, if you want to), in the "Game Mode" and "Entertainment Mode". In game mode, the CA20K2 is processing audio, in Entertainment, the CPU is. You will find "Entertainment Mode" to give out better music audio quality.

To me it comes across that you're more of an audiophile, and so CPU-processed audio over good quality DAC and OPAMPs should be a better choice.

 

[mab1376]

Better OPAMPs and branched DACs. Like I said, the chipset is irrelevant today.





Again, hardware acceleration isn't going to make it sound better, it's a CPU-offload feature, your i7-930 has plenty of idle number-crunching hamsters. Quite on the contrary, hardware-accelerated audio sounds worse. Just to demonstrate, listen to music (over OpenAL, if you want to), in the "Game Mode" and "Entertainment Mode". In game mode, the CA20K2 is processing audio, in Entertainment, the CPU is. You will find "Entertainment Mode" to give out better music audio quality.

To me it comes across that you're more of an audiophile, and so CPU-processed audio over good quality DAC and OPAMPs should be a better choice.

OK I've been playing with all sorts of settings, and it seems the best quality comes from the least amount of plugins and effects.

Again, thanks for all the info.

I'm probably gonna go with the Auzentech just because it will give me nice sound with a cheaper price.

I was trying to maybe just try a new audio processor to see if it would give a different sound, but if its irrelevant i won't bother and I'll get a nice new card.

i did some research and i found the auzentech is better for headphone enthusiasts as it has it own dedicated opamp and dac just for the headphones

asus

DACs Burr Brown PCM1792A

NJM2114D OPAMP channels
LM4562NA OPAMP final stage

TI6120A2 AMP

Auzentech

Headphone DAC AK4396
Headphone OPAMP LME49720NA

speaker DAC CS4382A
Speaker OPAMP JRC5532s (front rear)
JRC4580s (center sub)

 

[mab1376]

of course.

indeed.

 

[qubit]

I just picked up a pair of Ultrasone HFI780's and i was wondering if anyone had any suggestions on AMP's. If they're necessary, do i need one with a sound card, etc.

I've got this sound card and the sound is awesome - really awesome.

Also, it can drive headphones directly very well, so I don't understand why you want to use a headphone amp? If anything, putting something else there will degrade the sound slightly, as we are in the analog domain here.

 

[BumbleBee]

I would buy the headphone amp because it's not stationary like a sound card. you can connect it to Blu-ray, Receiver, iPhone, iPad, iPod, etc.

 

[CJCerny]

Recommend you start on the low end and then work your way up. Just because you have $200 doesn't mean you have to have to spend it all. Try a $30 Xonar DG sound card. It has a low end headphone amp built in and might just make you happy.

 

[FreedomEclipse]

Recommend you start on the low end and then work your way up. Just because you have $200 doesn't mean you have to have to spend it all. Try a $30 Xonar DG sound card. It has a low end headphone amp built in and might just make you happy.

IMO - from many of the reviews that ive read while lurking online, most would put the DG just above builtin audio.

but its the OPs choice anyway.

 

[mab1376]

I'm getting the Auzuntech Bravura and a HiFiman EF2 for my record player, ipod/ipad and laptop.

 

[BumbleBee]

isn't that USB only? USB will only sample 16-bit 48Khz.

 

[mab1376]

isn't that USB only? USB will only sample 16-bit 48Khz.

it also has RCA input.

 

[TheMonkey]

Another Option

If you haven't purchased already you may also consider the Maverick Audio D1 (DAC/Preamp)

http://www.mav-audio.com/base/product/tube_magic_d1

Owned for over 2 years now, and recently purchased an A1 which has been fantastic as well and includes tube amping of your Headphones if you prefer that to the D1's SS headamping..

The D1 includes SPDIF/COAX/RCA/USB inputs, maybe a bit more versatile..

EDIT: Found this on a forum, someone who has owned both and compares the two...

Originally Posted by *********
I had a Maverick before and as DAC's the EF2 and the Maverick are very similar. The Solid state headphone out of the Mav is more powerful than the EF2 and better for cans higher than 100 ohms ( Senns, Beyers). But as all of my cans are low impedence the EF2 is my AMP of choice since I like Tubes. I did try the Tube pre out of the Maverick into both the EF2 and my RA1. but still feel that the sig of the EF2 alone is better from Headphone out. I will refrain from comparing the EF and the Compass as they are to disssimilar. At the *** meet on ***. I'll have The Maverick,Zero, and Compass all there side by side for *** to A/B/C...

 

[mab1376]

If you haven't purchased already you may also consider the Maverick Audio D1 (DAC/Preamp)

http://www.mav-audio.com/base/product/tube_magic_d1

Owned for over 2 years now, and recently purchased an A1 which has also been fantastic as well and includes tube amping of your Headphones if you prefer that to the D1's SS headamping..

The D1 includes SPDIF/COAX/RCA/USB inputs, maybe a bit more versatile..

EDIT: Found this on a forum, someone who has owned both and compares the two...

Originally Posted by *********
I had a Maverick before and as DAC's the EF2 and the Maverick are very similar. The Solid state headphone out of the Mav is more powerful than the EF2 and better for cans higher than 100 ohms ( Senns, Beyers). But as all of my cans are low impedence the EF2 is my AMP of choice since I like Tubes. I did try the Tube pre out of the Maverick into both the EF2 and my RA1. but still feel that the sig of the EF2 alone is better from Headphone out. I will refrain from comparing the EF and the Compass as they are to disssimilar. At the *** meet on ***. I'll have The Maverick,Zero, and Compass all there side by side for *** to A/B/C...

thats definitely a contender for my first dac/amp purchase. its a beautiful piece of hardware too.