Not sure whether to keep my new GTX 780 Ti or not

[qubit]

My gut is telling me to return it, but my heart wants to keep it, so I hope you good people can help me decide what to do with it.

In January 2014 I bought an MSI GTX 780 Ti Gaming off the back of TPU's review and it's a fantastic card, just like in that review. Performed really well then and still great now, especially the low noise performance.

This model is of course discontinued now, but a few days ago I saw Scan selling brand new ones for £340 including shipping, which is a good price. It's a one-time deal and I figured a performance boost via SLI would be nice, so I snapped it up. Now I've had it a few days, I've been thinking about it and I'm not sure whether I should keep or return it, though. I'm still within the no-questions-asked return period, so it wouldn't be a problem.



Pros
- Significantly better framerate performance, 50-80% usually. Valuable for both 2K and 4K video modes (have a 2K monitor right now, but will get 4K in time) and for 3D Vision, which I have and still use sometimes
- Still quiet, even with two cards, especially if not being pushed really hard
- I like having them in my rig and playing around with SLI in different scenarios

Cons
- Inevitable SLI issues at times. Usually solvable, but not with Unreal Tournament 2004, see below*
- Top card runs predictably hot, causing the fans to spin up a lot and make significant noise depending on the game or stress test, although not irritating. Complete stability with Furmark although GPU at 90c (didn't keep it running like that though)
- SLI performance improvement not always very great, or nothing at all. I think there's significant CPU bottlenecking from my 2700K at times eg CPU hog Far Cry 4, which is holding back the performance improvements that two of these cards are capable of

Open questions / uncertainty
- How much will the cheaper GTX version of the Titan X cost? I don't want it to top £500, but I suspect it will, knowing NVIDIA
- How soon will it be released?
- DX12 offers big framerate improvements, but this card doesn't support it. How soon until we see some games use it? Likely 6-12 months I think
- Do these current top end Maxwell cards really support it fully anyway despite the hype? Standard not even finalized yet
- Should I just skip Maxwell and wait until NVIDIA's next gen Pascal top end GTX is released and therefore stay with this card?

So you see, with all this spinning around in my head, especially the uncertainties, I'm not sure what to do!

Relevant system specs
Intel i7-2700K (not currently overclocked due to lingering slight stability issues at times)
Asus P8Z68-V PRO/GEN3 mobo
Corsair 16GB RAM
Windows 7
See specs in my profile for complete system details


*UT2004: very heavy microstutter in SLI mode prevents smooth animation, making it look very rough and unplayable, even though the game is rendering at 120 or 144Hz with no dropped frames according to Fraps. Fiddled with lots of driver settings, but I can't make it go away other than single card mode. Annoyingly, SLI used to work perfectly with UT2004 using older graphics cards and older drivers (GTX 580 SLI and GTX 590 in SLI mode). Will try again with the GTX 590 using the latest drivers and see if it works properly.

However, GTX 780 Ti SLI works perfectly well with ancient games Unreal Tournament from 1999 and Half-Life from 1998 as well as various modern games, so it's odd how it so royally screws up on UT2004.

Game still works with hardly any dropped frames with quality maxed out and with one card though, so not a major problem. It's just that it's my favourite game of all time and I still play it quite a lot so I would prefer it to work properly. That operative word is hardly. I'd like the framerate to never drop from its 120 or 144fps vsync locked target, which SLI would deliver.

 

[Cheeseball]

I'm going to assume that the GTX 980 is worth way more than that 780 Ti @ £340 (this is like $505 from the top of my head).

GTX 970?

 

[qubit]

Yes, a 980 starts at around £430 for the very cheapest one and I'd have to buy two of them. Remember, the 980 offers only slightly better framerate than the 780 Ti, so buying one would be no good.

I'm not getting a 970 on principle due to that memorygate scandal, plus I don't like buying a cut down GPU.

 

[the54thvoid]

I had a 780ti Classified hydrocopper (still do). When I saw a 2nd 780ti Classy (fan) on Ebay, I gambled. I bought a HC waterblock from EVGA and now have two watercooled 780ti's hurtling along at 1150 stock. I have no need to overclock.

I will upgrade but not until well into Summer when we see how good the 390X is. My problem is the Vram at 1440p. If you're gaming at 1080p, I think you ought to keep them. 780ti's (sli) at 1100Mhz beat a Titan X hands down*. Power draw is higher but performance is good. The GK110 is a very capable gfx core, better clock for clock than GM204 (although GK110 cant match the 980's clocks).

*Edit: Checking Hexus OC review on 3DMark - their OC gfx score (Titan at 1400Mhz) on ultra is 4542 - my sli cards at 1200Mhz get 5517. That's 21% faster (Titan at 1.4GHz, Classy's at 1.2Ghz)

GM200 is the logical successor to GK110 in terms of specs and heirarchy (bearing in mind GK110 is Titan Black and 780ti). But at >£850 for a Titan X which I'd then have to watercool - it's not worth it at all.

Keep it, enjoy it, sell them both in Summer, or be a good boy and join me in donating to TPU when you upgrade.

 

[qubit]

@the54thvoid Keep it - that's what I like to hear. It will certainly be a while until I upgrade to a 4K monitor as the kind of 4K monitor I'm looking for doesn't exist yet. I'm talking about 120Hz refresh, strobing backlight and support for FreeSync or G-Sync at a 28" size, but no larger due to space limitations and price. I'll want a system that can drive it at a near-solid 120fps in many games like my current system does today and that's gonna take a while to show up and for prices to come down.

Please don't forget to vote!

 

[the54thvoid]

@the54thvoid Keep it - that's what I like to hear. It will certainly be a while until I upgrade to a 4K monitor as the kind of 4K monitor I'm looking for doesn't exist yet. I'm talking about 120Hz refresh, strobing backlight and support for FreeSync or G-Sync at a 28" size, but no larger due to space limitations and price. I'll want a system that can drive it at a near-solid 120fps in many games like my current system does today and that's gonna take a while to show up and for prices to come down.

Please don't forget to vote!

Looooooooooooong wait.

 

[Vlada011]

You can keep GTX780Ti and start to save money immediately. Maybe 2-3 interesting games will show up before GM200 6GB.
Than you can sell GTX780Ti and upgrade on real high end card. GTX980 is little trick by NVIDIA, same as GTX780Ti, good performance but memory is limitation or will be limitation soon. And if someone ask me what you want 10% stronger card now or 60% stronger card for 4 months I will say 60% stronger off course. I would say that even with on board graphic card not with card strong almost or same as GTX980.
Avoid first series in generation. I always do that. That's power consumption and optimization, high performance are second generation. NVIDIA will replace price GM200 6GB will cost 100$ more or same as GTX980. Maybe little more only because more video memory. That's double bigger difference than GTX780Ti vs GTX780 and worth waiting.
Anyway if you upgrade on GTX980 I promise you when GM200 6GB show up you will change minds and figure out that GTX980 is nothing special. You will see that immediately after replace but when GM200 6GB show up you will see mistakes. Even if you sell GTX780Ti for 300 than GM200 6GB will cost you little more than GTX970.

 

[qubit]

Looooooooooooong wait.

Yeah, it is. If Skylake promises to be the performance monster that everyone hopes it will be, I'll finally have an excuse to upgrade from my trusty Sandy Bridge and have ample horsepower to drive my graphics cards.

 

[Vlada011]

I will never buy processor with thermal paste and Internal graphic inside with 4 cores any more.
My carrier with 4 core processor is over. Because when I bought 3770K In 2012 I thought on 2015 and he is good and now even if people told me buy 3570K.
Even now I can sell for 200e because model OC nice and I have buyers. I planed that during 2012, on same way I think now what will happen with 4 core processor in end of 2018 or performance of DDR3 at the end of 2018 iF I choose Z97. And I don't want to invest 200-250e total less than Xtreme. 5820K is much better choice, 6 cores, DDR4, USB 3.1 what new can show up in next 2-3 years. Even he is so strong and give better results than 4960X, and he cost 1000$ before few months, even L3 Cache is same, 5820K is excellent chance and best option for single or dual graphics. I would upgrade and earlier only I thought black motherboard will show up but I lose patience and I will buy normal R5E. One day If Black version show up and I find buyers for my and lose is less than 100-120e I will upgrade on black with Internal USB 3.1, if not I will order USB 3.1 A Type card.

 

[rtwjunkie]

Keep it! The way I game, I also see no reason to upgrade until the consumer GM200 comes out...and I only have a single card!! I'm going to wait till it's been out 6 months, so about this time next year.

*of course, if you feel the need to unload it, I would gladly bear the burden of taking it off your hands, LOL!

Seriously, keep it and enjoy your top-tier Keplers for a little while longer.

 

[Toothless]

I will never buy processor with thermal paste and Internal graphic inside with 4 cores any more.
My carrier with 4 core processor is over. Because when I bought 3770K In 2012 I thought on 2015 and he is good and now even if people told me buy 3570K.
Even now I can sell for 200e because model OC nice and I have buyers. I planed that during 2012, on same way I think now what will happen with 4 core processor in end of 2018 or performance of DDR3 at the end of 2018 iF I choose Z97. And I don't want to invest 200-250e total less than Xtreme. 5820K is much better choice, 6 cores, DDR4, USB 3.1 what new can show up in next 2-3 years. Even he is so strong and give better results than 4960X, and he cost 1000$ before few months, even L3 Cache is same, 5820K is excellent chance and best option for single or dual graphics. I would upgrade and earlier only I thought black motherboard will show up but I lose patience and I will buy normal R5E. One day If Black version show up and I find buyers for my and lose is less than 100-120e I will upgrade on black with Internal USB 3.1, if not I will order USB 3.1 A Type card.

wat

 

[Caring1]

I would upgrade and earlier only I thought black motherboard will show up but I lose patience and I will buy normal R5E. One day If Black version show up and I find buyers for my and lose is less than 100-120e I will upgrade on black with Internal USB 3.1, if not I will order USB 3.1 A Type card.

Hopefully they will release a black edition like they did with the R4E, that was a nice looking board.

p.s. keep the 780Ti, they are still a great value card.

 

[qubit]

Ok, so the Yes votes are clearly winning!

Please keep them coming, whichever way you vote and if you'd like to write a word or two, that would be great.

I'm still not completely decided, but it's helping. Seems like my initial instinct to snap up a bargain may have been right after all.

 

[Countryside]

Foreal keep it 780ti is a relic and someday you can retire it to hall of fame where grandpa 9800GTX will be waiting

 

[Vlada011]

You can cross on GTX980, but only if that can't influence on upgrade from GTX980 to GM200 6GB.
But if you can choose one of them... Nostradamus promise you big remorse 7 day after GM200 6GB show up.
That will be card 10% stronger than TITAN X reference model. That mean difference can go up to 50-60% from reference GTX980 for some faster model.
What... some faster GTX980 models, non reference are more expensive now than possible price for GM200 6GB.
GTX780Ti is not card for future, that's obvious, but same is with GTX980. For next 2 years graphic card can't be less than 6-8GB Video Memory. 6GB is minimum and only for 1080p-1440p.
At the end of year could be launched game where highest texture need 4.5-5GB Video Memory on 1440p.
First rule: Always Premium Chip, Second rule: Never Crippled Chip, Third rule: Never ever NVIDIA before and AMD show own face. 3GB is example why first rule should be followed,
GTX780 >GTX780Ti for same money and GTX970 difference from GTX980 is reason for second rule, R9-290X faster but cheaper than TITAN is reason why third rule must be respected.
4th rule never ever fall on hype and reasons why is crossing from premium chip from one generation on mini chip from next generation good. First generations are GTX480 heat, GTX680 locked voltage, 970-980 problems. Premium chips are 580, 780Ti, GM200 6GB.
Follow that and you will be happy.

 

[d1nky]

ATM best and only gsync 4k monitor is the acer XB280, the sweet spot for that is 40+ fps. 780ti in sli is just about there, depending on the games and settings.

question is, when do you want the 4k upgrade and what games will be mostly played?

 

[st2000]

just keep SLI and be happy cause you can feel real difference(not 10-15%) only crossing up to 2-3 generations of videocards
wait till 980TI or 390x and compare them not at start but in 2-3 months after release(cause of drivers and user expirience)
also ubi with her ACunity showed that bad optimising can put to its knees any card(your card should be redundantly powerfull to run it at max settings - for example, mine old 550TI was ok at medium settings and lagged a lot at low settings)
as for dx12 - remember story with dx11, new games will be availble with both variants and it's not obvious that dx12 support in game will be realized so good as shown in tests)
for example, amd has mantle(now vulcan, dx12 analog) - i havent heard that your card gets 1000% boost in fps using mantle - only 20% in certain games with low performance cpu, sometimes you cant reach even 5-7% in overall performance
so just dont be a marketing victim - relax and enjoy your gaming withought thought of 10% increased performance that can upside down you gamnig expirience

 

[qubit]

Well, that's an overwhelming Yes response - I'm keeping it!

Thanks everyone.

 

[EarthDog]

First, what is '2k' monitor? I take it you are talking some form of 2560x1440/1600? Never heard that referred to as 2k...

Anyway, I'd keep what you have until you see the AMD card and the 980ti in a couple of months.

My motto, particularly for your res, is single card anyway...so I would say see what is best of those cards, sell the 780s at that time. When you jump to 4k, you won't want 3gb cards anyway... but no need to jump at nothing now.

 

[qubit]

2K is 1080p or Full HD. It's odd and inconsistent how different terms are being used to specify the different resolutions everywhere, not just on TPU, so I just kept them the same for consistency here. A 4K monitor could also be specified as 2160p and one sometimes sees this too.

Yeah, a lot of the source of my angst were those unknowns I listed, but people's calls for me to keep it have really helped, with the Yes vote really running away with it. Anyway, I can sell what I have later on. Also, I can just wait for the top end Pascal GTX in a year or so which looks like it's gonna be a really wickedly good upgrade from the bits and pieces I've heard about it, so my current arrangement will tide me over nicely until then.

Finally, people often say that a single 780 Ti or 980 etc is perfectly fine for 2K, but that depends on a few things. If your monitor runs at 120Hz (strobed) or 144Hz like my one and you want to maintain that framerate as much as possible in the latest games with details maxed or set to high, then there can never be enough horsepower, so having two cards for a 2K resolution makes perfect sense in that scenario. Heck, even the CPU can be the bottleneck, like with Far Cry 4 for me, so more graphics power won't help there without more CPU power to go with it.

Another scenario might be someone with a 2K 60Hz monitor who doesn't play very demanding games, in which case a single top end card will maintain that 60Hz framerate perfectly well.

 

[EarthDog]

Sorry, I know this is off topic...

2k is not 1080p. Well, technically it is, however it's not 1920x1080 either. So to allude to 2k as being 1920x1080 would be incorrect. 1080p is synonymous with 1920x1080(full hd) and not the rarely seen 2048x1080 res which is actually the 2k you mention. 4k is marketing for 3840x2160 usually , though there are more '4k' res's than that...


Something to read:
http://www.streamingmedia.com/Articles/Editorial/What-Is-.../What-is-2K-and-4K-Video-88297.aspx

 

[newconroer]

My initial thoughts are :

• You speak specifically of older generation games. Why then NEED for SLI?
• 120-144hz/3d Vision isn't going to happen consistently on games at ultra settings. And 4k will be worse.
• One 780TI is sufficient for UT2004, why not disable SLI when playing it?
• If your frame rate is good and you still experience stutter, then it may be frame latency. Run some tests...
• I wouldn't call £340 a 'good deal' or a 'bargain' considering you have yet to indicate why you actually required it.
• Why on Earth did you buy it new?

 

[qubit]

@EarthDog 2K is just shorthand for a horizontal screen resolution of about 2000 pixels, same as 4K is shorthand for about 4000 pixels. I didn't invent the term and have seen it in lots of articles and forum posts over time and don't see it as incorrect to use it. The article makes the shorthand point too - "These new monitors use just one of several 2K and 4K resolutions that consumers and content producers will face over the next few years." Yeah, I could have said 1080p and 4K, but that just looks inconsistent and a bit silly to me, hence 2K and 4K. That was an interesting article, thanks.

@newconroer To answer your points in sequence:
- I want to improve graphics performance across the board, especially for the latest games. It just so happens that I still play UT2004 which is over a decade old, but this current driver doesn't work with in SLI, which is annoying - btw I got round to trying my GTX 590 which did the exact same thing, but which used to work before, so there must be something up with the driver
- That 120/144fps is my target, regardless of resolution. Having more horsepower helps to reduce the frame drops across the board
- I did disable SLI, as I mentioned, but I'd rather not have to. Even though that game is over a decade old, you'd be surprised how much horsepower it still requires when aiming for a very high fps (120/144) the action really gets going and the settings maxed out. There are still times when the framerate drops below this for a few moments even with a 780 Ti and I want to prevent this as far as possible
- It's a good deal for that particular model of card and its higher performance in both framerate and noise. I think you can see from the above points here why I bought it? Yeah, sure I could spend over 2 grand on a couple of Titan Xs and get better performance, but that would be ridiculous, lol. Don't even have that kind of money, either
- Why buy hardware used? I generally don't buy second hand stuff as I want the piece of mind of it working properly along with a warranty should it go wrong later. Used stuff will have a shorter lifetime by definition and an unknown history eg overclocking/volting abuse. Finally, private trades have a significantly higher overall chance of going wrong due to dishonest sellers, which I don't like to expose myself to

EDIT

Re UT2004 horsepower: simply installing a single 780 Ti in the second PCI-E slot gets me many more framedrops and is quite noticeable. It's more pronounced than the difference in benchmarks would have you believe, too. You can see how Intel's LGA 2011 platform with a full 16 lanes for both slots does actually make a significant difference here. Having that slower slot does reduce the benefit of SLI/CrossFire, but one can't fix that problem without spending serious money which I'm not prepared to do.

 

[micropage7]

i think you (at this time) keep it
it has enough power to challenge today cards
and i dont think other card will problem free on UT2004

if talk about handling some good cards not good at something and like that
i think if you wanna replace your current card just wait for more

 

[AsRock]

Yes, a 980 starts at around £430 for the very cheapest one and I'd have to buy two of them. Remember, the 980 offers only slightly better framerate than the 780 Ti, so buying one would be no good.

I'm not getting a 970 on principle due to that memorygate scandal, plus I don't like buying a cut down GPU.

So lets give them more money lol.


Got games to play ?, If no get rid of it and do the waiting game for a price drop on some thing you like how ever if yes keep it it's not as it's that bad of a card in the 1st place and it's not as if you have a 4K monitor yet anyways which i must add G Sync and FreeSync are still teething so let the ones who have the money to burn to make the tech better.