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Nvidia accuses Ati of cheating in some games....

Discussion in 'Graphics Cards' started by Kaiser Kraus, Sep 16, 2010.

  1. Super XP

    Super XP

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    It's been a proven fact NVIDIA's been cheating on game benchmarks for some time now.
    What's new, this is why we should take benchmark scores with a grain of salt.
    True gaming performance in real time is what we should be looking at.
  2. newtekie1

    newtekie1 Semi-Retired Folder

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    There is no fault because they did nothing wrong, no one is at fault for nVidia buying Ageia and turning their graphics cards into PPUs(other than maybe Ageia for going bankrupt).

    The only person using the word fanboy is you.:rolleyes: In fact I said nothing personal about you, I simply rebutted your argument. Your quickness to argu about something that has nothing to do with the topic, and your extremely defensive behavior certainly say something about you though...but I'll leave others to make their own decisions...

    Don't get your panties in a bunch just because I pointed out how idiotic it is to call the Vantage/PhysX situation "cheating".

    If you are going to make an argument defending ATi, and that argument is going to be examples of nVidia cheating in similar fashion, use actual examples of nVidia cheating and not idiotic political BS that was obviously nothing more than side effect of nVidia implementing value added features in their products that certain people wanted to blow out of proportion to make nVidia look bad.
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  3. erocker

    erocker Super Moderator Staff Member

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    Well, this thread is certainly going nowhere fast. If any of you are taking brands of hardware personally and getting your feelings hurt, perhaps you need to reassess your priorities in life. Anyone who actually read the article can clearly come to the conclusion that both companies "cheat". Cheating in this case is a relative term and more has to do with optimizations without sacrificing image quality. If any of you want to comment on the article, perhaps you should give that website a visit and make your posts heard there because immature bickering and fighting isn't going to be tolerated on this website.

    Stay on topic.

    Post in a civil and friendly manner.

    If you can't do either, don't post.

    Thanks.
    Last edited: Sep 16, 2010
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  4. Easy Rhino

    Easy Rhino Linux Advocate

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    oh noes trolling on tpu! run for the hills everyone!
  5. AthlonX2

    AthlonX2 HyperVtX™

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    i love you easyrhino

    MEOW MEOW IN DA HOUSE DA BG TO THE END FROM DAY 2 I WAS THE MASTERMIND I PUT IT ALL TOGETHER MEOW MEOW
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  6. SNiiPE_DoGG New Member

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    of course nvidia is attacking ATI/AMD with any kind of wild accusations it can. Just look at valves hardware survey where %87 of dx11 hardware is AMD and you will know exactly why.
  7. hat

    hat Maximum Overclocker

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    You telling me to "get over it" made it seem like I was butthurt about Nvidia cheating in Vantage, at least to me. This is certianly not the case, as I really don't care at all; I was just pointing it out to make the same point you've made: both companies cheat. As you can see, quite a few members agree with me, saying they were about to say the same thing I did, that being nv's cheating in Vantage. As for the personal remarks; however, I too will leave others to make thier own decisions.
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  8. AthlonX2

    AthlonX2 HyperVtX™

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    Intel is cheating because they have hyperthreading
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  9. Easy Rhino

    Easy Rhino Linux Advocate

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    this brings up a lot of good points.
  10. AthlonX2

    AthlonX2 HyperVtX™

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    this thread is just full of nvidia vs ati fanbois
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  11. Easy Rhino

    Easy Rhino Linux Advocate

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    yea, people should settle down.
  12. Mussels

    Mussels Moderprator Staff Member

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    everyone god damn cheats.

    every time a driver comes out with performance gains, read it as "we got X% faster by CHEATING AND LOWERING QUALITY"


    unless it fecks up like the quality in that far cry 1 example, who cares?
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  13. Easy Rhino

    Easy Rhino Linux Advocate

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    agreed!
  14. pantherx12

    pantherx12 New Member

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    I think it's more of an issue of phsyx being included in a GRAPHICS bench mark in the first place.

    In order for it to be an accurate benchmark it needs to be a fair playing field for all graphics cards.

    Otherwise what's the point of it? Bench marks are used to establish comparisons : /
  15. Tatty_One

    Tatty_One Senior Moderator Staff Member

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    Agreed but the comment was simply that it is not NVidia's fault, it's Futuremarks fault, just lot's of people like to blame one side in a one sided argument :D
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  16. Bjorn_Of_Iceland

    Bjorn_Of_Iceland

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    ho hum. I bet 4 - 5 years from now, once again, some random post will spring out ranting about driver level manipulation etc.
  17. pantherx12

    pantherx12 New Member

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    Aye I would also say this one was more futuremark issue, not nvidias.
  18. Benetanegia

    Benetanegia New Member

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    3DMark has never been a graphics benchmark. It is a PC GAMING benchmark, so all aspects of PC gaming are taken into account.

    Also in reality, their intention has never been to create an application to compare different brands or different graphics cards for that matter (as they have expressed multiple times). The purpose, at least if we have to believe what Futuremark always said about 3DMark, is to create a representation of the typical workload on future games so that you know if your card is prepared. It's in that sense they included PhysX. PhysX may dissapear, but PhysX can represent the workload of any future HW accelerated physics engine and it's there where the industry is moving (be it accelerated on a discrete GPU or in Fusion-like CPUs). Their 3D engine has never been good for that matter and they never claimed it to be good tbh, but it's a way to represent the workload and performance of future games.

    I don't necessarily agree with all of the above, but that's what 3DMark is suposed to be. I was a big "hater" of 3DMark up until Vantage, because it never really represented what future games had to offer. It was typical that only 6 months after a certain 3DMark was released, most games vastly surpased it both in performance and in technical/graphical quality. It was generally bad optimiced and lacked the creativity and geniality that game developers had when creating their game engines. Engine creators or geniuses knew much better how to take advantage of the good and bad in DirectX. 3DMark has always been a bad representation of what future games would be... So why did I change my mind with Vantage? Well, I changed my mind because it's very badly optimized, it lacks creativity and geniality and does a very very bad use of the available tools present in DirectX, resulting in mediocre graphics and poor performance from HW that should perform much better... EXACTLY LIKE THE GAMES OF TADAY! :shadedshu
  19. btarunr

    btarunr Editor & Senior Moderator Staff Member

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    That site will be in deep shit for leaking the reviewers guide.

    FYI, both AMD and NV bitch about each other in their respective reviewers' guides. This is nothing out of the ordinary.
  20. W1zzard

    W1zzard Administrator Staff Member

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    actually that's not always correct.

    what they do is look at the shader code of the game and optimize the algorithms/instructions/flow of instructions to better fit their architecture. this goes into the driver which recognizes the game's original shader code and replaces it on the fly.

    sometimes this may come with a loss in image quality, sometimes visible.
  21. Animalpak

    Animalpak

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    fanboysim disease strike again
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  22. newtekie1

    newtekie1 Semi-Retired Folder

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    I wasn't telling you to get over it, that part of my post was directed at everyone, not just you. Sorry if it came off directed at you.

    Exactly, and that is exactly why they included a GPU score and a CPU score seperately along with the total, and all 3 scores are displayed on the results. And PhysX doesn't help the GPU score one bit, it affects the CPU score. If you are comparing graphics cards, IMO, you should always use the GPU score and not the total.
    Last edited: Sep 16, 2010
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  23. Widjaja

    Widjaja

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    I did see difference in image quailty in GRID between my brothers 8800GTX and my HD4850 with same settings in game but when he bought his GTX280 the comparison was the same.

    All changes from card to card.

    I say if the games run good and look good then don't complain.
  24. HossHuge

    HossHuge

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    It's just like every relationship sometimes you fight and some times you work together. They are fighting now but a few years ago they worked together on price fixing remember?

    http://www.shacknews.com/onearticle.x/54969
  25. nt300

    nt300

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    Shouldnt the title read ATI accuses Nvidia of cheating in games? I mean nv been cheating in benchmarks for a long time now :cool:

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