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PCI-Express 3.0 Hits Backwards Compatibility Roadblock, Delayed

Discussion in 'News' started by btarunr, Aug 5, 2009.

  1. btarunr

    btarunr Editor & Senior Moderator Staff Member

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    PCI-SIG (Special Interest Group), the organisation responsible for development of PCI specifications announced that generation 3 PCI-Express (PCI-E 3.0), is off its target launch time from late-2009 to Q2 2010. Although work on the bus is almost finished, there seems to be problems with implementing backwards-compatibility with older generations of PCI-E. Assuming PCI-E 3.0 is standardised in Q2 2010, one can expect implementing products (motherboards and expansion cards supporting PCI-E 3.0) only by a year later.

    PCI-E 3.0 packs features that overcome the bottlenecks of PCI-E 2.0, such as the removal of the 8P/10b encoding scheme that added at least 20% data overhead for the 5 GT/s PCI-E 2.0, reducing it to 4 GT/s effective. At 8 GT/s the new bus will have effectively twice the bandwidth.

    Source: TechConnect Magazine
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 6, 2009
  2. h3llb3nd4

    h3llb3nd4 New Member

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    :ohwell:
    we'll get new cards by then
     
  3. CDdude55

    CDdude55 Crazy 4 TPU!!!

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    2.0 still hasn't been used to its fullest. Meh, i'll stick with 1.0/1.1
     
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  4. douglatins

    douglatins

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    I would like to see how many headroom a PCI2.0 GTX295 has.
     
  5. CDdude55

    CDdude55 Crazy 4 TPU!!!

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    A good amount, but i doubt you will see much to any of a performance difference going from 1.0/1.1 GTX 295 to 2.0 GTX 295.

    The card still doesn't use 2.0 to its fullest advantage just yet.
     
  6. TheLaughingMan

    TheLaughingMan

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    Science, fixing problems that don't really affect people.

    I do have one question. Will the PCIe 3.0 improved multiple GPU card setup performance scaling? Or is that still a software implementation issue?
     
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  7. DanTheBanjoman Señor Moderator

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    You want them to start a several year project once the standard is required? It needs to be done before we need it, it's how progress works.
     
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  8. a_ump

    a_ump

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    So when are they ever going to up the power provided to video cards through the slot? i kno that PCI-E 2.0 is spec'd to be able to provide 150watts, but for some reason that i can only assume about, they haven't implemented it with that yet.... That is honestly the only improvement i think PCI-E needs is to be able to provide it's specifications....not 75watts.
     
  9. DanTheBanjoman Señor Moderator

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    When they think the ATX connector could use some additional wires for the extra current.
     
  10. CDdude55

    CDdude55 Crazy 4 TPU!!!

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    Them starting to work on a new project isn't the problem, but considering PC's/video cards aren't in dire need of a PCI-E upgrade, it's almost pointless releasing it that early(its was going to come out late 2009:eek:). But as said thats how progress works.
     
  11. btarunr

    btarunr Editor & Senior Moderator Staff Member

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    A PCI-E 2.0 x16 slot provides 75W (65W 12V, 10W 3.3V), as did older standards. The amount of power a slot provides doesn't change between generations. All that changes are the specifications of the connectors.
     
  12. Flyordie

    Flyordie New Member

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    False, sorta...
    8x PCIe 2.0 is bottlenecking the HD3870X2's... So PCIe 1.1 x16 is surely at its peak usage with a GTX295.
     
  13. AsRock

    AsRock TPU addict

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    Don't look like it will it's not as if going from 1.0\1.1 to 2.0 did any thing noticeable. So why the heck should this. Maybe it does if a computer analyzes the data but to us sweet f all

    I just turned in to you TheLaughingMan HA.... My guess any thing REAL special will not happen with PCI-e they will have to bring a totally new slot because thats how money is made.. I guess if it stoped being backward compatible there be a chance but that would only worry people at upgrading time.
     
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  14. jaydeejohn New Member

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  15. CDdude55

    CDdude55 Crazy 4 TPU!!!

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    Well of course, a half speed slot is going to do that to a dual GPU card.

    2.0 still has that extra bandwidth left that hasn't been taken advantage of yet, and i don't see how 3.0 would be solving that problem.(adding more bandwidth and a few extra features isn't worth it if the actual cards aren't taking advantage.)

    I'll move to 2.0/3.0 when i see a big difference.
     
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  16. Flyordie

    Flyordie New Member

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    Looks like AMD is implementing its final revision to the HT over PCIe idea. The ATI/AMD Chipsets themselves support it but they want to get it into the standard so they can use it over all future chipsets from all companies.

    -8x PCIe 2.0 provides the same bandwidth as PCIe x16 1.x
    I do not see the point in your post...
    The idea is improvement.. You don't see the world traveling with horses and buggies still do you? (Besides the Omish, no pun intended).. Improvement and planning for the future is what it is all about... (and money... )
     
  17. CDdude55

    CDdude55 Crazy 4 TPU!!!

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    The point of my post is that theres really no point in releasing a 3.0 when 2.0 is still fresh for the pickin.
    Well ya, but when you compare a Car to something like using a horse and buggie you can see a significant difference between the two, seeing the huge advantages of a Car justifies why you should have one.
     
  18. Flyordie

    Flyordie New Member

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    Ok, lets go smaller scale...

    1985 Toyota Supra vs 1986 Toyota Supra
    Same thing, same engine with maybe a minor change in injection amount... but why is it a "New Design"? If the car was released in 1985.. it should remain a "1985 Toyota Supra in 1986...
     
  19. CDdude55

    CDdude55 Crazy 4 TPU!!!

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    So then what the point of going with the '86, if theres only minor changes.
     
  20. Flyordie

    Flyordie New Member

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    The small change... the 1mpg better fuel economy... the new radio...||

    minor tweaks that will be used by future cards... (and current cards such as the ATI HD2/3/4 cards.. using HT over PCIe (wait for it... wait for it... oh yeah... using 2 HT Lanes to do internal crossfire = WIN.)
     
  21. hat

    hat Maximum Overclocker

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    PCI-E 3.0 would be nice for SLI/Xfire on boards that don't do the full x16x/16x
     
    Crunching for Team TPU
  22. CDdude55

    CDdude55 Crazy 4 TPU!!!

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    But, im not saying we shouldn't go with the new slot at all. We really need to wait for the cards to truly utilize the slots. Having a new slot with more bandwidth and slightly new features every year or two isn't helping if we still have card finely chugging on an older slot.

    Im not saying they aren't going to be useful in the future, but as of now there really isn't a big reason to go crazy about it.
     
  23. Flyordie

    Flyordie New Member

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    What if the card already has the features? ;-)
     
  24. CDdude55

    CDdude55 Crazy 4 TPU!!!

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    Then alls good, no need for a new slot.
     
  25. Flyordie

    Flyordie New Member

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    umm... but the feature isn't being used yet because the SLOT doesn't support it. ... so how is that good?
     

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