1. Welcome to TechPowerUp Forums, Guest! Please check out our forum guidelines for info related to our community.

Take-Two Suing over Duke Nukem Forever

Discussion in 'Games' started by Kreij, May 15, 2009.

  1. Kreij

    Kreij Senior Monkey Moderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2007
    Messages:
    13,881 (5.11/day)
    Thanks Received:
    5,615
    Location:
    Cheeseland (Wisconsin, USA)
    As if the poor title didn't have enough bad press being vaporware for so long ...

    source : gamesindustry.biz
  2. i nEeD HeLp New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2008
    Messages:
    210 (0.10/day)
    Thanks Received:
    4
    Location:
    ontario, canada
    did they start making the game in 1997?
  3. FordGT90Concept

    FordGT90Concept "I go fast!1!11!1!"

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2008
    Messages:
    13,318 (6.34/day)
    Thanks Received:
    3,343
    Location:
    IA, USA
    I don't blame them. Take-Two was expecting a product that was never delivered. From Take-Two's perspective, Apogee was running a scam.
    Crunching for Team TPU
  4. W1zzard

    W1zzard Administrator Staff Member

    Joined:
    May 14, 2004
    Messages:
    14,632 (3.94/day)
    Thanks Received:
    11,363
    "paid USD 12 million for the publishing rights"

    so whats wrong? unless the contract said "game has to be done in x years" they got what they paid for, the publishing rights. are they even allowed to reveal that number? all contracts i know consider that confidential information
  5. JATownes

    JATownes

    Joined:
    Nov 9, 2008
    Messages:
    1,824 (0.88/day)
    Thanks Received:
    433
    Agreed. If you invest in a product that never gets completed, you can't sue. That is the risk in investing. I own stock in AMD, can I sue if their stock doesn't rise?? No. Investing is a risk. About confidentiality, I agree, but I guess the other party to the contract is no longer a valid entity so all confidentiality is off?? IDK just a guess.

    Edit: I think I have read 3-4 threads just today about tech companies filing suits against each other. This is stupid. Get back to making me sick hardware!!!
  6. ownage

    ownage New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2006
    Messages:
    84 (0.03/day)
    Thanks Received:
    5
    12 Million is enough reason to give it a shot.
  7. RevengE

    RevengE

    Joined:
    Dec 31, 2008
    Messages:
    2,661 (1.32/day)
    Thanks Received:
    211
    Location:
    Ohio
    I don't see how they can sue them anywise. They closed down shop, I doubt they have alot of money left over.
  8. Kreij

    Kreij Senior Monkey Moderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2007
    Messages:
    13,881 (5.11/day)
    Thanks Received:
    5,615
    Location:
    Cheeseland (Wisconsin, USA)
    You are correct W1zz, that Take-Two simply secured the publishing rights for DNF for $12M, which I assume was paid to Apogee.
    However, I am sure that for their money, Take-Two assumed there would eventually be a product to publish. With the demise of 3D Realms (3D Realms is/was a division of Apogee) the likelyhood of the product ever being released drops considerably. If no DNF is forthcoming, then Apogee is in breach of the contract.
    It seems to me that Take-Two would have a very strong case in US courts (Apogee is based in Texas). Just because a specific date or time is not mentioned in the contract, there are usually laws defining "reasonable expectations" when dealing with contracts.
    I think that Take-Two has been more than generous with the amount of time they've give Apogee to produce a product for them to publish.
    Take-Two has the right to sue Apogee/3D Realms for not only the $12M, but also 12 years worth of interest on the money. Whether they win or not, is up to the courts.
  9. CDdude55

    CDdude55 Crazy 4 TPU!!!

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2007
    Messages:
    8,179 (3.20/day)
    Thanks Received:
    1,277
    Location:
    Virginia
    Take two just needs to finish it up and get it out the door.
  10. KieranD

    KieranD

    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2007
    Messages:
    8,003 (3.17/day)
    Thanks Received:
    813
    Location:
    Glasgow, Scotland
    they apparently want the source code to be handed over to them too so they can finish the game

    but that means they'd be able to do whatever they liked to it

    i dont care as long as its polished up im sure like by easter 2010 it could be finished and have stuff added to it even if they got it started now they could finish it by Christmas maybe January February

    the physics parts interest me
  11. FordGT90Concept

    FordGT90Concept "I go fast!1!11!1!"

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2008
    Messages:
    13,318 (6.34/day)
    Thanks Received:
    3,343
    Location:
    IA, USA
    Publishing rights means there's something already available to publish; however, Apogee never sent them what they needed to publish it so the contract didn't go through. Take-Two is not only out their 12 million that they advanced, they're also out all profit they were expecting.

    Even if Take-Two wins, they can only get as much as what's left over from the remains of 3D Realms. Something is better than nothing however. If you want Duke Nukem Forever to come out one day, you should hope Take-Two wins. 12+ million would go a long ways on DNF's development.
    Crunching for Team TPU
  12. Kreij

    Kreij Senior Monkey Moderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2007
    Messages:
    13,881 (5.11/day)
    Thanks Received:
    5,615
    Location:
    Cheeseland (Wisconsin, USA)
    It depends. As the parent comany, Apogee (who is still in existance) may be liable for the debt incurred by 3D Realms, especially if they were a party listed in the contract.

    Also, FordGT, if Take-Two wins and gets their 12+ million they will no longer retain the publishing rights and Apogee/3D Realms will be 12+ million poorer and will almost certainly cancel the project completely.

    I think the only way we will ever see DNF is if Apogee can fend off Take-Two for awhile longer and get the game into the hands of another developer who can finish it.
  13. FordGT90Concept

    FordGT90Concept "I go fast!1!11!1!"

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2008
    Messages:
    13,318 (6.34/day)
    Thanks Received:
    3,343
    Location:
    IA, USA
    Apogee will probably settle out of court with Take-Two. My guess is Apogee will throw everything DNF (and some money) at Take-Two so Take-Two can finish it.

    Apogee would have to pay the interest and some extra becaue a finish product wasn't placed in their hands as agreed upon but Take-Two won't be needing all 12 million back that way.
    Crunching for Team TPU
  14. Triprift

    Triprift

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2007
    Messages:
    7,185 (2.99/day)
    Thanks Received:
    915
    Location:
    Adelaide Australia
    DNF= Did not finish.
  15. Kreij

    Kreij Senior Monkey Moderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2007
    Messages:
    13,881 (5.11/day)
    Thanks Received:
    5,615
    Location:
    Cheeseland (Wisconsin, USA)
    100 monkeys typing random characters on keyboards could have come up with a completed version of DNF by now. :D

    Anyway, I do hope it gets released some day (preferrably in my lifetime) as I was looking forward to playing it.
  16. Triprift

    Triprift

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2007
    Messages:
    7,185 (2.99/day)
    Thanks Received:
    915
    Location:
    Adelaide Australia
    With take 2 i think you got a better chance than with 3d realms seriously what were they doing for 12 years giving each other piggyback rides.
  17. Kreij

    Kreij Senior Monkey Moderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2007
    Messages:
    13,881 (5.11/day)
    Thanks Received:
    5,615
    Location:
    Cheeseland (Wisconsin, USA)
    From the way I understand it, they had to keep starting over and redo their graphics engines because the technology was passing them by faster than they could complete the game.
    Seems kind of odd that all the other studios manage to get product out in a reasonable timeframe. Even the companies whose release date mottos are "When It's Done" don't take that long.
  18. Triprift

    Triprift

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2007
    Messages:
    7,185 (2.99/day)
    Thanks Received:
    915
    Location:
    Adelaide Australia
    Im actually glad in a way it wasnt realesed years ago because with the amount of times they changes the engine i always thought it would be a big disapointment.
  19. FordGT90Concept

    FordGT90Concept "I go fast!1!11!1!"

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2008
    Messages:
    13,318 (6.34/day)
    Thanks Received:
    3,343
    Location:
    IA, USA
    They need to understand that pretty graphics only encompasses about 10% of the market. It's better to release a game with 5 year old graphics than not release the game at all (from a business and customer satisfaction standpoint). Vaporware makes no one happy.
    Crunching for Team TPU
  20. TrainingDummy

    TrainingDummy

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2007
    Messages:
    411 (0.16/day)
    Thanks Received:
    47
    Location:
    Oakland, CA
    According to Scott Miller (co-founder of 3D Realms) 3D Realms self-funded 99.999% of the game, and says Take-Two never gave them the $12million <link>

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guest)

Share This Page